Rookie QB or Veteran QB for "Next Season"??? (I didn't bump this, but I ended up being wrong anyway....)

[Thinking Skins]

11 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Good stuff....If Kyle Allen really is a PUP candidate I say we just move on from him, sign Heinicke, a veteran and draft one of these kids to groom. 

Obviously that's if we don't get one of the big fish in a trade.

Well, I don't see the difficulty of signing him and PUP him. It gives 8+ weeks to evaluate him for free. He knows the offense and it improved under him, so it gives some consistency. The PUP is like a hidden roster spot for a 3rd string QB. We could really have 4 QBs on the roster and if Heinicke goes down and our FA we bring in looks bad, we could activate Allen and keep it moving without being forced to play the rookie too early. 

[Skinsinparadise]

A third of the teams in the NFL have inquired aboiut Stafford according to Ian, that seems like hyperbole

 

Edited January 27, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

39 minutes ago, RWJ said:

You nailed it, SIP.    He fits Turner's O.  Don't you think?  Curious, nothing on Trusk?

 

Trask is injured so he won't play.

 

I don't see anything about Mac that is tailor made for Turner's offense.   Scott seems to like mobilty which Mac doesn't have.  But I'd gather they can make it work.

 

I am sort of agnostic on Mac but I am more open minded on him versus some others.  There is a real vocal group who don't like him.  There is a vocal group that really do like him.

 

I am somewhat in between, I can't make up my mind.  I want to watch Saturday's game and see if that tips the balance for me.

Edited January 27, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Darrell Green Fan]

I'm pretty excited to read the reports that a deal could be done before the Super Bowl. I just want this resolved so it does not fester until spring.  I can't imagine the Rams being able to absorb the cap hit by dealing Goff and then being able to sign any of the top QBs being discussed. Indy's pick is a bit lower than ours and of course the Mayhew connection can't be ignored.  

 

I'm calling it today just for the Hell of it. With so many teams making offers I see Stafford to Washington for (gulp) this year's first and 2nd, then some later round picks exchanged as well.  

[kingdaddy]

36 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

Well, I don't see the difficulty of signing him and PUP him. It gives 8+ weeks to evaluate him for free. He knows the offense and it improved under him, so it gives some consistency. The PUP is like a hidden roster spot for a 3rd string QB. We could really have 4 QBs on the roster and if Heinicke goes down and our FA we bring in looks bad, we could activate Allen and keep it moving without being forced to play the rookie too early. 

Except it wouldn't be for free. I agree with everything else you say though. Would we want to have 4 QB's under contract? What about Montez? Do we really need that many QB's? 

[Est.1974]

28 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

A third of the teams in the NFL have inquired aboiut Stafford according to Ian, that seems like hyperbole

I think that is quite plausible, 10 or so team, easy. I’d suggest it would be that, and more, for Watson. 
 

Lions must think they are in a strong position to net a nice haul. A first and third seems low to me right now.

[TheGoodBits]

41 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

A lot of it is just hype IMO. Part of that is, as @Skinsinparadisenoted, people see some Lamar Jackson in him and whenever a draft prospect draws a bunch of comparisons to current hot NFL QBs, it pretty much automatically raises their stock, even if artificially. 

 

I do like Lance but I don't see him as being in the same category as Lawrence, Wilson, and Fields. I also worry about the way he runs...he does things like run into A gaps and then try to bulldoze through linebackers. That may work in the MVFC, and it's entertaining to watch, but in the NFL he's going to be in for a rude awakening if he keeps trying that.

Fields and Lance are in the same general category for me. Wouldn’t want them with a top 10 pick if you needed a day 1 starter, but could justify drafting them in the 10-32 range if you had a veteran QB. Newman may creep into the backend of that range too... Lot of talent with all of them but I’d be really nervous about projecting success. Better if you can give them time to be really comfortable with what is needed to be successful at the NFL level before they are tossed into the fire. 

 

Lawrence and Wilson are hands down the best QBs in the class (Wilson is better imo) and there’s a really big gap between them and the next tier. 

[HigSkin]

Sheehan thinks the decision on Stafford will come this week per his sources.  Also had Scott Van Pelt on and there are glowing opinions about Stafford that include his play and the person.  Van Pelt said he's the perfect teammate and you do everything you can as a team to go get him.  He too thinks he likely goes to Colts.  So yea, it might be some kind of draft capital as you say.

 

12 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

I'm pretty excited to read the reports that a deal could be done before the Super Bowl. I just want this resolved so it does not fester until spring.  I can't imagine the Rams being able to absorb the cap hit by dealing Goff and then being able to sign any of the top QBs being discussed. Indy's pick is a bit lower than ours and of course the Mayhew connection can't be ignored.  

 

I'm calling it today just for the Hell of it. With so many teams making offers I see Stafford to Washington for (gulp) this year's first and 2nd, then some later round picks exchanged as well.  

 

Edited January 27, 2021 by HigSkin

[Est.1974]

12 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

I'm calling it today just for the Hell of it. With so many teams making offers I see Stafford to Washington for (gulp) this year's first and 2nd, then some later round picks exchanged as well.  

Yep I’ve got to the point of thinking it’s a 1+2 for Stafford plus change. Dare I say, someone really could go in more. Keep this years 2 and just dump two first rounders on the table.

[TheGoodBits]

7 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

I think that is quite plausible, 10 or so team, easy. I’d suggest it would be that, and more, for Watson. 
 

Lions must think they are in a strong position to net a nice haul. A first and third seems low to me right now.

Supply and demand. We’re gonna hate the cost if we land him.
 

Either two 1s or something more immediately impactful for the Lions... 19, Payne, and a 3rd rounder this year. 
 

I’d still do that trade, fwiw. 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

Sheehan thinks the decision on Stafford will come this week per his sources.  Also had Scott Van Pelt on and there are glowing opinions about Stafford that include his play and the person.  Van Pelt said he's the perfect teammate and you do everything you can as a team to go get him.  He too thinks he likely goes to Colts.  So yea, it might be some kind of draft capital as you say.

 

 

On Sheehan's podcast, Cooley said he'd go as far as two #1's for Stafford.  He's a fan of his and talked up about how hard it is to find a QB of his caliber and he doesn't believe if you don't have a QB you wait until the time is right.  And his opinion the time is always right if you don't have the QB.  He/Sheehan think they are instantly the division favorite if they land Stafford.

 

I've been one of the biggest cheerleaders for Stafford here but I balk some at two firsts for him.  I'd do a first and 2nd without hesitating. 

Edited January 27, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Est.1974]

1 minute ago, skinsfan_1215 said:

Supply and demand. We’re gonna hate the cost if we land him.
 

Either two 1s or something more immediately impactful for the Lions... 19, Payne, and a 3rd rounder this year. 
 

I’d still do that trade, fwiw. 

Just posted very similar at the same time as you. No player trade for me, but yes I think if we do get Stafford there will be a mini ES meltdown...for a short period of time....

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

On Sheehan's podcast, Cooley said he'd go as far as two #1's for Stafford.  He's a fan of his and talked up about how hard it is to find a QB of his caliber and he doesn't believe if you don't have a QB you wait until the time is right.  And his opinion the time is always right if you don't have the QB.  He/Sheehan think they are instantly the division favorite if they land Stafford.

 

I've been one of the biggest cheerleaders for Stafford here but I balk some at two firsts for him.  I'd do a first and 2nd without hesitating. 

 

Yeah two 1sts for Stafford would be a bit tough to swallow...but then again if we decided to move up in the draft for our guy, we'd likely have to give up the same (or even more, depending on how high we have to go), so to me it's a bit of a wash. On one hand the vet is older and has a bigger contract, on the other we know he can play at a high level in the NFL...draft pick is still a crapshoot for the most part. 

[TheGoodBits]

3 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Just posted very similar at the same time as you. No player trade for me, but yes I think if we do get Stafford there will be a mini ES meltdown...for a short period of time....

Just thinking with giving up a DL, we’re getting Ioanidis back next year and you’re talking three high level players rotating in 2 slots. Giving one of them up to save our 1st next year wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world (and I think Payne would be the demand if I’m the Lions, based on his age and performance). 

[Darrell Green Fan]

If they do pull of this trade heads will explode at the price. LOL at posters who believed originally that it may not include the 19th pick.

 

I hate to sound ignorant but how do these trade talks go?  I mean does Mayhew (or whomever it is) hear from Detroit "we got a high first and 2 seconds on the table right now" and just believe him? Do offers come documented so they can be shared to confirm offers? I honestly don't know how these conversations go. 

Edited January 27, 2021 by Darrell Green Fan

[BC-Redskins]

I don’t want to lose any of the DL and I’m sure Ron will add LBers making this defence elite..

 

in over 20 yrs as a fan, so badly want us to find that special QB as sick of seeing every other team find them...

 

hopeful we get Matt as rate him as that QB that if he was on a good team he could be special !!

 

bracing myself that we end up with a low cost Vet and taking a punt on someone in the draft..

[HigSkin]

Fun fact:

 

There has only been 8 players traded for 2 first round picks in the history of the NFL.

 

Joey Galloway to Dallas

Keyshawn Johnson to Tampa

Jalen Ramsey to LA

Jay Cutler to Bears

Jamal Adams to Seattle

Ricky Williams to Miami

Laremy Tunsil to Houston

Khalil Mack to Bears

 

[KDawg]

46 minutes ago, skinsfan_1215 said:

Fields and Lance are in the same general category for me. Wouldn’t want them with a top 10 pick if you needed a day 1 starter, but could justify drafting them in the 10-32 range if you had a veteran QB. Newman may creep into the backend of that range too... Lot of talent with all of them but I’d be really nervous about projecting success. Better if you can give them time to be really comfortable with what is needed to be successful at the NFL level before they are tossed into the fire. 

 

Lawrence and Wilson are hands down the best QBs in the class (Wilson is better imo) and there’s a really big gap between them and the next tier. 

 

I don't see the Lamar Jackson comparisons for Lance. I see Josh Allen. Lance is much better as a prospect as a thrower, but needs refinement in his reads and touch. Jackson wasn't a great thrower in college or the NFL, though he has improved significantly to the point where his throws are a threat now.

 

Big bodied guys who can run and throw. Have accuracy issues in college. Strong and athletic. 

 

It's funny how different we all are. I see Fields as a potential top QB in the class. I think Lawrence may edge him as a prospect but I think Fields ceiling is higher than Lawrence's to be quite honest. I don't think Lance has near the floor of Fields but a similar ceiling.

 

And I have all three of them ahead of Wilson. Though I do like Wilson if he were in another draft class as a potential QB 1 or 2, I think he's Pro Ready QB3 and overall QB4 when factoring in ceiling. 

Edited January 27, 2021 by KDawg

[HigSkin]

I heard Lurch say the same thing.  Who knows. Could just be smoke or a plan B if they can't get Stafford.

 

 

Edited January 27, 2021 by HigSkin

[Conn]

Not interested in Carr whatsoever. Much more interested in Stafford if that’s the route we go. 

[Andre The Giant]

2 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

Not interested in Carr whatsoever. Much more interested in Stafford if that’s the route we go. 

 

FWIW, Carr played for Del Rio in Oakland.

[Koolblue13]

4 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

I heard Lurch say the same thing.  Who knows...

 

 

Raiders lookingfor Kyle Smith and us looking at Carr. Interesting. I assume they've been talking.

 

I'm definitely on the Carr price is right bandwagon.

[KDawg]

I think we need to go after Stafford. If that breaks down and we don't want in on the crazy sweepstakes (IE: Watson) and we don't think Dak gets free or is affordable I don't mind going after Carr assuming the price is where Carr's price should be. At MOST a second and that's overpaying I think. I'd give them a third. Gruden has indicated that he likes him but he'd prefer Mariota be his guy at times, so they lose some leverage there.

 

Carr + Heinicke + Allen (IR) + Rookie is a really good QB room.

[HigSkin]

This appears to be where things are headed with Stafford.

 

 

[mistertim]

9 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

I don't see the Lamar Jackson comparisons for Lance. I see Josh Allen. Lance is much better as a prospect as a thrower, but needs refinement in his reads and touch. Jackson wasn't a great thrower in college or the NFL, though he has improved significantly to the point where his throws are a threat now.

 

Big bodied guys who can run and throw. Have accuracy issues in college. Strong and athletic. 

 

It's funny how different we all are. I see Fields as a potential top QB in the class. I think Lawrence may edge him as a prospect but I think Fields ceiling is higher than Lawrence's to be quite honest. I don't think Lance has near the floor of Fields but a similar ceiling.

 

And I have all three of them ahead of Wilson. Though I do like Wilson if he were in another draft class as a potential QB 1 or 2, I think he's Pro Ready QB3 and overall QB4 when factoring in ceiling. 

 

I still like Fields as well...I have him and Wilson as pretty much tied for my QB2. Though I think his super inconsistent last 3 games may have dinged his stock a bit. That being said, Wilson struggled a little bit against a really good defense as well in Coastal Carolina, so I don't think it's necessarily fair for Fields to be dinged too hard on that aspect (though his game against Northwestern was really pretty fugly when compared to Wilson's game vs CC).