A New Start! (the Reboot) The Front Office, Ownership, & Coaching Staff Thread

[woodpecker]

6 minutes ago, evmiii said:

Two things that force Dan to sell the team:

 

1.  A complete sponsor revolt.  If the other owners or NFLPA feel any pain from Dan’s issues they will turn on him.  Otherwise he slides through paying some hefty fines.  
 

2.  Conviction of criminal charges.  If they can prove fraud, maybe a couple lies to Congress, etc. 

 

That said, what do we really expect to change with a new owner?  Change of management/coaches?  Maybe get out of the headlines? Not be the butt of NFL jokes?  These may all be positive things but do any of them change the output between the lines?

Changing owners could most certainly be a positive thing for the organization moving forward, but it would have little short term impact on the product on the field.  Don’t fool yourselves into believing anyone that could afford to buy the franchise will automatically be better (Billionaires all seem to be a bit eclectic, politically motivated, and uniquely ambitious).  I have always hated the saying “it can’t get any worse” because in my experience it almost always can.

 

I will be extremely surprised if this gets Dan.  If it does it’s going to drag the organization through some serious mud, but it would be a good first step in the organizational healing process.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not about winning anymore. He’s gotta go...period. Winning with dignity will NEVER occur with him. Without him, regardless of record, there is at least hope for both.

[Voice_of_Reason]

I'm not going back pages and pages to look but has anybody summarized Howard Gutman's analysis on Sheehan's podcast yesterday?  It was really insightful.  

 

If nobody has, I can a little later.

[justice98]

How does Snyder owning the FedEx land potentially impact a new stadium there if he were to no longer be owner?  Does that inherently take the FedEx land out of play?  I'd been hearing how that seemed like one of the leading spots.  

 

And if his ownership is in limbo, does that just stop everything in its tracks?  Is he really.gonna push for a stadium while he's figuring out exit strategies, if it gets to that.

[evmiii]

It’s always been about winning.  The organization has been an embarrassment since he bought the team and I am completely ready to move a different direction.  but this is not about dignity.

 

This is millionaires playing for a team owned by billionaires with the sole purpose of winning (money is a side effect of winning).  This is entertainment and the players and owners understand and acknowledge this. 

 

I don’t really care how we win or who owns the team when we win, I just want to win,
 

 

19 minutes ago, woodpecker said:

Not about anymore. He’s gotta go...period. Winning with dignity will NEVER occur with him. Without him, regardless of record, there is at least hope for both.

 

[Ball Security]

9 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Just how much revenue did Dan hide and is it really a huge difference in the yearly salary cap?

 

40% of ticket sales goes into that pool, divided among the teams.

 

The Commies ticket sales have been declining for years.

 

Was the money Dan kept really a huge amount that drastically affects the salary cap.

 

It would probably have to be something over 10 million ; to really impact the salary cap.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

5 hours ago, KDawg said:

Just as an aside... If Snyder keeps the team this isn't going to help us attract free agents moving forward. This makes things worse. 

 

He has to go for this franchise to find meaningful success. That's been the case for awhile, but in recent years it's worse.

 

And despite my involvement in draft strategy and game threads... that's more because I love football. I have actually cared a hell of a lot less about wins/losses the last few years while more and more comes out about the kind of human Snyder is. I don't see that getting better with him here.

So, literally the only way that can get better if he stays is if he finds a way to settle all of these issues, and literally just disappears from the news cycle.  

 

The problem with that is I don't believe the local media would ever let that happen.  Even if he came out and literally said, "Yeah, it was all my fault.  The workplace misconduct, the financial impropriety, overruling football people, the way the organization has been run, all me.  So I'm settling with everybody, to the tunes of millions of dollars, to attempt to make everything that has happened right. I've worked it out with Lisa Banks and her clients.  I've worked it out with the other owners.  I've worked it out with the NFL PA.  I have fired everybody who has aided me in creating this toxic culture.  Jason and Ron are running the organization.  I'm going to go live on my yacht in the med, and I'm going to tell Ron to forget my phone number. And Jason too.  I'm out."

 

(Mind you, the chances of him doing this are less than having Peyton List and Mary Mouser over for a naked hot tub session with me at my house. Not very likely.) 

 

Even if he did that, the cycle of negativity towards him would not end.  The Post, the critics, the Sheehan's and Lovero's of the world, they would never let the story die.  Ever.  It's so ingrained in them, ousting him is the only solution which is palatable.  

 

I get that he has brought almost all of it on himself.  I totally get that. But he has people out to get him also.  As Gutman said with Sheehan, the House Oversight committee had a clear path to do their job, and instead, they made it abundantly clear that they just have a vendetta against Dan Snyder.  

 

So, I agree with you.  I think the only way this ever gets better for the team is if he sells.  With him here, it will never end.  

 

The best case is he just gives up and sells because he's tired of all of this.  

 

The worst case is some of this is true, most of it isn't really true or can be explained away, and he is able to stick around for YEARS with this dark cloud hanging over the franchise basically for the rest of his life.

 

As a side note, at some point, you have to think the other owners would just get so tired of this nonsense they would send someone to Dan and say, "Look, it's never going to improve.  You've owned the team for 30 years.  There is literally no path to success here.  Whether it's your fault or not is irrelevant.  You've just got to get out.  We don't want to force you to, but we will if we have to.  Instead, we'd like you to sell on your own accord, and we'll make sure you get every consideration and every benefit of doing that."

 

 

[srtman04]

9 minutes ago, evmiii said:

I don’t really care how we win or who owns the team when we win, I just want to win,
 

 

 

Winning without any dignity or strong moral foundation is an empty suit.....

[Voice_of_Reason]

15 minutes ago, justice98 said:

How does Snyder owning the FedEx land potentially impact a new stadium there if he were to no longer be owner?  Does that inherently take the FedEx land out of play?  I'd been hearing how that seemed like one of the leading spots.  

 

And if his ownership is in limbo, does that just stop everything in its tracks?  Is he really.gonna push for a stadium while he's figuring out exit strategies, if it gets to that.

I'd assume he would sell the land and the stadium along with the team.  Just like when he bought the team, he also bought the land and the stadium.  And Command Headquarters (whatever that's called these days.) My assumption having seen none of the legal docs is if he sold, he would have to sell all assets which are related to the team, including the franchise rights, stadium, land, HQ, any other retail space the team might own, everything. 

 

If ownership is in limbo, it absolutely puts everything with the stadium on pause.  If Dan is out, it wouldn't be unreasonable to think Jason Wright would be out too, and he's been doing a lot of the Stadium stuff. A new owner would want their own person, most likely.

 

So, it would pause things.  If there is a new owner, my assumption is they would have an opinion as to what they wanted from the new stadium, where they wanted it, and what they wanted out of it.  Which might be different than Dan.  So it would take things back a few steps for sure.  

[evmiii]

5 minutes ago, srtman04 said:

 

Winning without any dignity or strong moral foundation is an empty suit.....

Are we talking about football or life.  I am a firm believer in honesty, integrity, and dignity in my life.  I strive to uphold a strong moral foundation in all that I do and I live my life dedicated to an unwavering faith in my Lord and Savior.  I watch football for entertainment, not for values or morals.  I believe we would all be in trouble if our morale foundation was based on the principles of the NFL where winning trumps all.

[srtman04]

27 minutes ago, evmiii said:

Are we talking about football or life.  I am a firm believer in honesty, integrity, and dignity in my life.  I strive to uphold a strong moral foundation in all that I do and I live my life dedicated to an unwavering faith in my Lord and Savior.  I watch football for entertainment, not for values or morals.  I believe we would all be in trouble if our morale foundation was based on the principles of the NFL where winning trumps all.

 

We are talking about Dan Synder and how he lacks those things which is clear at this point. This has a direct impact to the product on the field, which also impacts our entertainment value as well.   

[CommanderInTheRye]

1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I'm not going back pages and pages to look but has anybody summarized Howard Gutman's analysis on Sheehan's podcast yesterday?  It was really insightful.  

 

If nobody has, I can a little later.

 

 

Speaking for myself, I always enjoy your detailed reports even if I don't neccesarily agree with a specific argument.

 

That said, please summarize Mr Gutman's discourse yesterday on Sheehans podcast.

 

I enthusiastically look forward to reading it.

[Wildbunny]

56 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

(Mind you, the chances of him doing this are less than having Peyton List and Mary Mouser over for a naked hot tub session with me at my house. Not very likely.) 

Hey! Don't forget to give me a call ol' buddy when that happens!

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, Wildbunny said:

Hey! Don't forget to give me a call ol' buddy when that happens!

There is literally (used correctly) no way I would ever call you if that happened, because there is no way I would ever share.  I'm a selfish SOB. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, CommanderInTheRye said:

 

 

Speaking for myself, I always enjoy your detailed reports even if I don't neccesarily agree with a specific argument.

 

That said, please summarize Mr Gutman's discourse yesterday on Sheehans podcast.

 

I enthusiastically look forward to reading it.

Ok, here goes, and I'm going to keep this somewhat short and sweet: @Skinsinparadise if I screwed something up, let me know.

 

Sheehan asked him to opine on the 2 different allegations separately: 1) The converted ticket deposits to revenue 2) the hiding of revenue from the NFL by booking it under a different event.

 

For item 1:

- Basically this might be unethical, but it's nowhere near illegal. 

- In fact, Gutman said that he had exactly the same thing happen to him with the Kennedy Center.  They took a deposit, canceled the season, and when he called to have it applied to his next season, they said, "oh, since you didn't ask for it back, we just took it as a donation.  Thanks!"  

- This is a fairly common business practice, and the laws are all over the map as to how a company has to disclose if the deposit is going to be forfeit.

- This is very different than a rental deposit, where the laws are clear.

- Finally, he said that the House Oversight committee completely showed their hand that there is no actual legislative agenda behind this inquiry, but it's a witch hunt to get after Snyder, for whatever reason.  They had a golden opportunity to subpoena every other team, and every other league, to determine what the actual policy was, and address it with law.  But Gutman said they clearly don't actually care about that, they just care about getting Snyder. (He also said, he wants Snyder out also, but it seems like the investigation is without legislative purpose.  Both statements I agree with.)

 

For item 2:

- This one has more teeth.  

- He gave the example of the issue: The list price of a ticket is $44.  But the ticket office does a great job and sells the ticket at $55, and throws in a hotdog or something.  What the team is accused of doing is telling the NFL about the $44, but hiding the $11 and putting it against a different event so it's not shared.

- IF it is true that the team willfully held revenue back so it would not be distributed

- And IF this isn't a "normal practice" (ie: it's widely accepted that other NFL teams do this)

- And IF Snyder knew about it or directed it

- THEN it's a problem.

- If any of those things is not true, it's nothing.

- And he said the second set of books came from the fact Jason Friedman wanted to make DAMN SURE he got credit for selling the $55 ticket, and got bonus/compensated on that amount, and the other sales folks who sold the other events didn't get to benefit from the money they moved around.  Is that TRULY a second set of books?  Eh, that's questionable.  But Gutman said based on reading the letter, that's where it came from.

 

Gutman also said that there's something in there that Beth Wilkinson knew about these things, and he assumes if Wilkinson knew about them, she would have informed Goodell.  Who did nothing about them at the time. 

 

Personally, I am not sure if there is anything to this or not.  The only hope I have is it just pushes the other owners to understand Dan has a target on his back, and this noise is never going to end.  The Media hates him, he apparently now has congressional democrats as an enemy, the fans are in revolt (though, some of that is spurred on by media coverage), there is just never going to get better for him.  So, he should just get out.

 

Btw, I heard some of the Florio stuff, I think he's sabre rattling and trying to talk something into existence that isn't there.  Which is what I think he was trying to do at the SB pregame show.  He HATES HATES HATES Snyder, and he's going to go after him every single chance he gets, damn the torpedoes and damn the truth.  

[Die Hard]

2 hours ago, srtman04 said:

 

Winning without any dignity or strong moral foundation is an empty suit.....

When you live in a culture that values success at any cost, this is the end result unfortunately.

 

Western culture values winners. Even if you cheat, Americans are very forgiving (love second chances) and forgetful (just have to get through a few new cycles or generations (Ozark reference). So it’s worth the short-term pain.

[Darrell Green Fan]

 

Remember that report during the Super Bowl where it was said that for the first time there is active discussion among the owners on what to do with Snyder?  Well that was then, I have to think with all this other news since that time the conversation got more interesting.  

[Voice_of_Reason]

43 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

Remember that report during the Super Bowl where it was said that for the first time there is active discussion among the owners on what to do with Snyder?  Well that was then, I have to think with all this other news since that time the conversation got more interesting.  

That was Florio and I’d bet anything he made it up and was trying to speak it into existence. 
 

That theory is based on the fact we’ve heard nothing since then by anybody else to corroborate the story.  

[Burgundy Yoda]

6 hours ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

Well I'm in a strange place. I had committed to switching to the Ravens, I'm following their draft reports and getting familiar with their roster.  I have purposely avoided any Washington draft talk.  Now with this latest revelation I have no idea which team's draft to follow.  Is it possible that they kick out Dan before the draft?  No that's not possible.  But I feel more positive with each day which seems to bring yet another report, all bad for Little Danny.  

There is nothing set in stone for this team yet, I'd still say follow the Ravens until Dan is gone if you think you'll be able to do it. 

[Die Hard]

15 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

There is nothing set in stone for this team yet, I'd still say follow the Ravens until Dan is gone if you think you'll be able to do it. 

Ravens have their own drama right now with their franchise QB contract extension.

 

But that’s still 10000x better than this dumpster fire.

 

Get out. As fast as you can. And don’t look back.

[Dissident2]

2 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

Ravens have their own drama right now with their franchise QB contract extension.

 

But that’s still 10000x better than this dumpster fire.

 

Get out. As fast as you can. And don’t look back.

 

Drama with a franchise QB contract extension. Oh, how I long for drama with a franchise QB contract extension. 

 

 

 

[profusion]

The NFL's inaction on what is now a ridiculously long list of Snyder's sleazy doings bespeaks arrogance. They think you and I will just keep consuming their entertainment product no matter what they do.

 

I, for one, am ready to prove them wrong. At this point, I'm just monitoring the situation to see if they dump the SOB.

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

2 hours ago, Die Hard said:

When you live in a culture that values success at any cost, this is the end result unfortunately.

 

Western culture values winners. Even if you cheat, Americans are very forgiving (love second chances) and forgetful (just have to get through a few new cycles or generations (Ozark reference). So it’s worth the short-term pain.

For me, sports have never been about winning... It's seeing other people lose that brings me pleasure. That's why I don't mind cheating. I don't care if I didn't actually accomplish anything. As long as I deprived someone else of happiness, I feel good about it.

 

 

Edited April 14, 2022 by Sacks 'n' Stuff

[NewCliche21]

2 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

I've always been of the mindset that's it's not about winning... It's seeing other people lose that brings me pleasure. That's why I don't mind cheating. I don't care if I didn't actually accomplish anything. As long as I deprived someone else of happiness, I feel good about it.

 

Tell me middle school really sucked for you without telling me that middle school really sucked for you.

[Die Hard]

5 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

I've always been of the mindset that's it's not about winning... It's seeing other people lose that brings me pleasure. That's why I don't mind cheating. I don't care if I didn't actually accomplish anything. As long as I deprived someone else of happiness, I feel good about it.

Amen brother! I like to sabotage anyone that’s invested in anything…. and take them down with me.

 

Their pain is my sustenance!

2 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

 

Edited April 14, 2022 by Die Hard

[CommanderCarson]

It’s appearing more and more like it’s a ploy to get Snyder out, I would be shocked if anything truly comes of this. 

They just need to go win, just put a good product on the field consistently for multiple years with a few fun playoff runs and this stuff will go away and Washington will be a great place to play again. That’s all there is to it. It’s the only thing that will make this never ending dark cloud go away.