Update - 3/11/21 - America Rescue Plan Bill is signed!

[Cooked Crack]

Seems like a great time to nickel and dime Americans!

[The 12th Commandment]

There actually is some sense to that.  I am retired and till they try to steal my pension back my income isn't changing.  I'd much rather it went to people who really need it.  I don't known that they have sufficient means to determine, and I would worry bout that, but in theory they should target better.  I'll take it if they twist my arm tho, no doubt.

Edited July 9, 2020 by KAOSkins

[dfitzo53]

I think it's probably best just to distribute it as widely as possible. Income alone isn't a good determiner if financial situation when you factor in things like local cost of living, student loans, etc.

 

Also, I think the economic impact of the virus is only just beginning. My wife's hours just got cut because nursing home admissions are down and likely will be for the foreseeable future.

 

Edit: meant widely, phone corrected to wisely.

Edited July 9, 2020 by dfitzo53

[Llevron]

13 minutes ago, KAOSkins said:

There actually is some sense to that.  I am retired and till they try to steal my pension back my income isn't changing.  I'd much rather it went to people who really need it.  I don't known that they have sufficient means to determine, and I would worry bout that, but in theory they should target better.  I'll take it if they twist my arm tho, no doubt.

 

me too. I dont need it. Hell I am making more because of COVID to be honest. But I wont say no to free money. Matter of fact I got more than both of my parent combined and they are both out of work. Thats kinda ****ed. 

[goskins10]

1 hour ago, Cooked Crack said:

 

GOP stimulus. 

 

Seems like a great time to nickel and dime Americans!

 

So lets pay off the poor now that votes are looking scarce. This is typical republican bull****.

 

If you do a stimulus and you really want to impact the economy, remove the means testing and give everyone a check. Make it a true UBI. But instead they want to sound fiscally responsible after raising the debt more than $6.5T in just 3.5 yrs (Debt was going to be at least $5T even without the first stimulus) but pander to the poor to buy their vote. Total scumbag move.

 

They don't care about a single person but themselves. Just desperate for votes. Where are all the debt hawks that were crying during the Obama administration? 

 

 

[China]

After lobbying, Catholic Church won $1.4B in virus aid

 

The U.S. Roman Catholic Church used a special and unprecedented exemption from federal rules to amass at least $1.4 billion in taxpayer-backed coronavirus aid. In totaling the church’s haul, The Associated Press also found that tens of millions of dollars went to dioceses whose financial stress was due not simply to the pandemic, but also to recent payouts to victims of clergy sex abuse. The Paycheck Protection Program the church tapped was intended to help small businesses and nonprofits pay workers amid a cratering economy. The church was able to maximize its take after lobbying for an exemption that gave all religious groups preferential treatment. That helped make the Catholic Church among the biggest winners in the U.S. government’s pandemic relief efforts.

[China]

Town prints own currency to boost coronavirus relief

 

The blue-cheese salad dressing, butter, ground turkey, cans of grain-free dog food, and new toothbrush came to $24.97.

 

Laurie Mahlenbrei handed the cashier a slice of wood marked $25 and walked out with her items in plastic grocery bags.

 

It was one of the first transactions involving an effort in the small city of Tenino, Washington, to help residents and local merchants alike get through the economic fallout of the pandemic.

 

Decades after it created a similar program during the Great Depression, the city is dipping into its emergency accounts to give people in need up to $300 per month in wooden currency to spend in town.

 

Just about every business in town, from the gas station and auto-body shop to Don Juan's Mexican Kitchen, is accepting the wooden scrip.

 

The currency is about the thickness, size, and flexibility of an index card and printed on the same 1890s-era press once printed the Depression currency and the local newspaper. It can't be used for alcohol, tobacco, or marijuana.

 

The businesses can redeem the scrip for real dollars at City Hall or sell them on the side. Some merchants said they've been offered three times the face value from coin collectors around the country.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[Cooked Crack]

 

 

GOP really trying hard to lose this November.

Edited July 20, 2020 by Cooked Crack

[Renegade7]

 

Dems need to be careful with any "wait until we have power" approaches, push back even if GOP won't bend because giving up, too, won't look different because it's for different reasons.

 

That approach may fly under the radar for the Cops Bill that just died, but not this, not states unable to make ends meet and folks going hungry.

[Cooked Crack]

 

[Cooked Crack]

 

 

 

[redskinss]

this is one of the times where I agree with the Republicans.

yes there are people out there who need the extra assistance but there are also tens of thousands who are squatting on their unemployment using any excuse they can to not go back to work.

in normal conditions when an employer called their employee back if said employee refused to go back to work that person's unemployment would be terminated. 

with covid they waived those restrictions and you didn't have to go back to work if you were sick or felt threatened by the disease. 

I think before any extensions are granted we need to ensure that all precautions are taken against people who will take advantage of it.

[Renegade7]

On 7/9/2020 at 10:26 AM, Llevron said:

 

me too. I dont need it. Hell I am making more because of COVID to be honest. But I wont say no to free money. Matter of fact I got more than both of my parent combined and they are both out of work. Thats kinda ****ed. 

 

Similar boat as you situation wise, I just know my Dad's unemployment renewal got delayed because of the state needing to get its ducks in a row and the rental company hit him up like "everything is back to normal now, what gives?"

 

Absolutely if the choice is giving everyone that "might" need a check one vs making sure unemployement system doesn't fall apart, have to pick B everytime.  Ask Oklahoma.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/a-very-dark-feeling-hundreds-camp-out-in-oklahoma-unemployment-lines/2020/07/20/44d59cb6-c77a-11ea-a99f-3bbdffb1af38_story.html

 

Let's put it this way, if they do let the $600 extra fall off, which looks immiment at this rate, unemployment insurance and social welfare programs have to take priority over stimulus checks.  Those programs are already in danger of running out, GOP playing games on helping the individual states, third of US museums talking about probably not going to make it.

 

I don't want another check at the expense of everything falling apart around me.  Scrap the checks and keep our government functioning best it can until the new administration can come in and negotiate like adults.

[The Evil Genius]

14 minutes ago, redskinss said:

this is one of the times where I agree with the Republicans.

yes there are people out there who need the extra assistance but there are also tens of thousands who are squatting on their unemployment using any excuse they can to not go back to work.

in normal conditions when an employer called their employee back if said employee refused to go back to work that person's unemployment would be terminated. 

with covid they waived those restrictions and you didn't have to go back to work if you were sick or felt threatened by the disease. 

I think before any extensions are granted we need to ensure that all precautions are taken against people who will take advantage of it.

 

There is a concept that paying some people to stay away from the workplace is beneficial in flattening the covid-19 curve. 

Edited July 22, 2020 by The Evil Genius

[tshile]

24 minutes ago, redskinss said:

this is one of the times where I agree with the Republicans.

yes there are people out there who need the extra assistance but there are also tens of thousands who are squatting on their unemployment using any excuse they can to not go back to work.

Do you have anything to back this up because all real data suggests the idea that people are opting to collect unemployment over going back to work is utter nonsense. 
 

not to mention you wouldn’t qualify for unemployment if your job was offered back and you refused. 
 

and even if what you suggest were true, the economy is in dire straights, the people receiving this money are generally living paycheck to paycheck so the money they get is spent, and the damage averted by them having more money to spend is worth more than whatever the perceived savings is on not extending this. 
 

in short I find it hard to believe what you say is true, and even if we were to pretend it is true the idea is still bad and doesn’t make sense. 

[88Comrade2000]

I say no to any more stimulus.  How long do you get unemployment?  I was on for 2 years when Obama took over. He signed legislation to make it longer than usual among of time and then extended.  I'd just do that.

 

If Biden wins, he should immediately form his team and then have a plan for congress to take up; even before he's in office.  Congress usually comes that first Monday of January. So, by the time Joe takes the oath; congress will have something for him to address the situation. correctly.

 

 

[Captain Wiggles]

18 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

I say no to any more stimulus.  How long do you get unemployment?  I was on for 2 years when Obama took over. He signed legislation to make it longer than usual among of time and then extended.  I'd just do that.

 

 

Self employed folks like myself no get unemployment. Not a good time to be in the music or landlording game. 🤦‍♂️

 

I'm fortunate atm but end of the year will prolly be a different story. Unless the city n county wanna waive my taxes for 2020.

 

 

 

 

[NoCalMike]

Odd I don't see anywhere in the negotiations a tax hike on the top 1% which should have happened immediately before the original stimulus.  You know, the ones who become significantly more wealthy in the last few months.

[EmirOfShmo]

3 minutes ago, clietas said:

Self employed folks like myself no get unemployment. Not a good time to be in the music or landlording game. 🤦‍♂️

 

I'm fortunate atm but end of the year will prolly be a different story. Unless the city n county wanna waive my taxes for 2020.

 

You do if you're in Virginia, plus you're eligible for the weekly $600 Fed PUA. I thought this applied to all states to cover the 'Gig Workers'?

 

I disagree the PUA should be discontinued. We're already seeing rollbacks of openings across many states. I'm not proposing a continued $600/wk. There needs to be a comprehensive plan to support people & not piss away money on companies that are going to fail because people aren't spending money they don't have. Rinse & repeat. 

 

This isn't just hitting families making <$40k. My friend's job as a Food & Beverage manager at a major chain hotel ($90k + bonus) isn't returning in August or possibly even September. It may not come back at all. Retrain at 55+ for a career he's been in since he was 15? Sure. 

 

The graph below is from the the group reporting 32% late payments on rent & mortgages for July. I was surprised to see the numbers for those making >$50k. 

 

https://www.apartmentlist.com/research/july-housing-payments

 

 

[skinsmarydu]

20 minutes ago, EmirOfShmo said:

 My friend's job as a Food & Beverage manager at a major chain hotel ($90k + bonus) isn't returning in August or possibly even September. It may not come back at all. Retrain at 55+ for a career he's been in since he was 15? Sure.

 

I'm 54, and done a few other things in life, but it's primarily been food/bev. Hotels are in a bad spot right now, and only 4-5 star restaurant/catering managers make that kind of money. Maybe he could try to "slide sideways" to a different sector? 

[redskinss]

1 hour ago, tshile said:

Do you have anything to back this up because all real data suggests the idea that people are opting to collect unemployment over going back to work is utter nonsense. 
 

not to mention you wouldn’t qualify for unemployment if your job was offered back and you refused. 

cant say as I have any real data, but I know several people who are currently exercising that option. 

I covered the second part of your reply in my post, i said that as long as that applies then it won't be a problem. 

i was on unemployment for a few weeks at the beginning of this crisis and i benefited from the extra money, I'm not saying I didn't like it or that its being abused by everyone but I guarantee many are.

 

there are a lot of people who were making minimum wage and working part time who were probably making 2 to 300 dollars a week, now they're making regular unemployment plus 600 a week, why on earth would they put themselves in danger and go back to work while also taking a pay cut?

most wouldn't, it just doesn't make sense, and again if they are cut off unemployment then, the problem is solved but there's still a ton of confusion going on with unemployment and who's eligible and I'd bet my left arm there's rampant abuse.

[tshile]

37 minutes ago, redskinss said:

cant say as I have any real data, but I know several people who are currently exercising that option. 

And that’s fine but you said tens of thousands 

 

I realize people abuse it. People abuse everything. It’s always about what’s the actual cost and what’s the actual gain. 
 

Those people live paycheck to paycheck and spend that money. And that drives the economy. An economy that’s suffering; an economy all of us benefit from, moreso the higher you climb in the socioeconomics. 
 

and the cost isn’t just what does the bill cost. If we don’t do it then the cost also includes the economic damage. Economic damage that could easily wind up putting me out of a job - a tax payer. 
 

it doesn’t make sense to not support them. It’s cutting off your nose to spite your face. 
 

it’s kind of like reopening too soon. You did something at first cause you knew it was the right thing, and it was helping make things better, but then you got bored and quit caring (or taking seriously) what the right thing is and do now we’re worse off than when we shut down and the future is very uncertain. 

 

Our economy is very much still in trouble. 

Edited July 22, 2020 by tshile

[skinsmarydu]

I got this from here, thanks to whoever...

Thought it was fitting. 

[techboy]

1 hour ago, redskinss said:

cant say as I have any real data, but I know several people who are currently exercising that option. 

 

So what? One of the biggest mistakes we make in this country, policy wise, is to worry too much about "fairness" and not enough about what actually works. Sure, some people are almost certainly abusing this program. People abuse every program. People abuse Social Security. Should we dump the elderly onto the streets to prevent a little grifting?

 

This kind of thinking hurts a lot of people, and from a cold hearted policy perspective, often wastes a lot of money. 

 

A classic example of this is homelessness. Malcolm Gladwell talked about Million Dollar Murray. The short version is that he (and other high incidence cases) cost his city so much money that it would have been cheaper to give him an apartment and a case manager, but can't do that! Someone might choose not to work and get a crappy apartment for free!

 

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5223068

 

[tshile]

8 minutes ago, techboy said:

One of the biggest mistakes we make in this country, policy wise, is to worry too much about "fairness" and not enough about what actually works.

Yup. 
 

you start caring about fairness and you wind up delaying the help, you wind up with people who need help not getting it because of a paperwork mistake or a corner case that doesn’t check enough boxes even though it should, you wind up spending money just to make sure the process is fair, and you wind up hampering the impact of the help because of all those things. 
 

and people still abuse it to some extent. 
 

and the economy suffers. 

 

all in the name of “fairness”. 
 

we’re not talking about normal policy here. We’re talking about how to respond to a crisis. And time is an enemy in a crisis. 
 

it costs more and helps less to worry about fairness.