BBC: China pneumonia outbreak: COVID-19 Global Pandemic

[TradeTheBeal!]

Just to put the CDC/5 days deal in context…

 

If you’re following the other guidance of the CDC, vaxxed/boosted/masked/social distance/etc, then 5 days without symptoms is almost certainly fine for some semblance of engaging in life.  Youre not gonna be a patient zero for an outbreak.

 

If you’re not following any of the CDC guidance, unvaxxed/masks are tyranny/karaoke Wednesdays then it doesn’t make any difference what the CDC says and it never has.  

[PeterMP]

1 hour ago, Sticksboi05 said:

 

They said they have data and presented none - not exactly going to build up confidence.

 

The chorus of public health experts saying this change in policy is unsubstantiated speaks for itself.

 

 

 

 

 

There's lot's of data out there.  And the one post is extremely misleading.

 

The CDC is talking about post-onset of symptoms.  I don't think there are any known cases where people are shedding infective virus more than 9 days post the unset of infection.

 

"However, there is large variation, and many studies did not take into account that shedding may have started several days before individuals received their first positive test result. Therefore, in many people nucleic acid  fragments may be detectable for 3 weeks or more. Most people infected with SARS-CoV-2 are infectious for 4–8 days and no studies have cultured viable virus beyond day 9 of illness."

 

https://www.dovepress.com/recalibrating-sars-cov-2-antigen-rapid-lateral-flow-test-relative-sens-peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-CLEP

 

As stated, people can be infective before they have symptoms (especially unvaccinated people).  And I guess there might be people if you add those days in that you get you to 12 days.  But to my knowledge, there isn't a single documented case of somebody getting symptoms and then being contagious 12 days later.  And the CDC is talking about days post-the onset of symptoms.

 

(For vaccinated people, symptoms tend to start earlier and so they don't have (as much of) a phase where they are contagious but asymptomatic and they tend to be infectious for less time total.)

Edited December 29, 2021 by PeterMP

[TheGreatBuzz]

1 hour ago, purbeast said:

It's pretty unreal how hard it is to get a covid test right now.

Yea, Biden has been saying for a year how important easy access to testing was.  So why are we having this issue?  It’s like they are actively trying to shoot themselves in the foot.

Edited December 29, 2021 by TheGreatBuzz

[purbeast]

4 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Yea, Biden has been saying for a year how important easy access to testing was.  So why are we having this issue?  It’s like they are actively trying to shoot themselves in the foot.

i literally just drove to 4 spots.

 

1 of them is only taking online appointments and there is no way to make one online.

 

1 of them accepts walkins but you have to pay out of pocket, but even that line was booked and they weren't taking any right now.  She said to come back in an hour or two and see if they have less people.

 

The other 2 were the same company at 2 different locations, and I could tell the lines were longer than they were yesterday.  The parking lots were full and people were just sitting in the cars.  Considering I went there yesterday, i know all those people registered and are just waiting to be called.

 

I am going to call my PCP and see if he has any leads but I may also go back to that other one around 3pm and see if I can get in.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

My son was really congested yesterday, and woke up this morning with a deep cough, still very stuffed up.  He was fully vaccinated as of the first week of August, not eligible for booster yet.

 

The wait time for any urgent care facility anywhere around us is 4+ hours, same with being able to get a covid test.  

[Captain Wiggles]

Just now, TheGreatBuzz said:

So why are we having this issue?  

 

Holiday rush. Every American is seemingly trying to get tested at the same time. In some instances multiple times. 

 

I looked into getting tested before Xmas. Problem here seemed to be time. Not enough appointments available. There were plenty available the day after. Where I was traveling to in SW VA had plenty of appointments on Christmas eve until 2pm.

 

 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

14 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Yea, Biden has been saying for a year how important easy access to testing was.  So why are we having this issue?  It’s like they are actively trying to shoot themselves in the foot.

It was easy to get a test a month ago then omicron happened 

[TradeTheBeal!]

Yeah, it’s a demand issue.  The country is doing about 1.1M tests per day for the last week.  Gonna take a minute to build up additional capacity.

[Captain Wiggles]

Just do the home test. 🤪

 

[Fergasun]

We didn't realize it at the time, but our society is not setup to handle a global pandemic like COVID.  Panic, blame, denial, apathy.  The wealthy taking advantage to increase wealth.  Other political actors acting against public health interest because apparantly there is a large constituency of people who don't care if 1M people die of COVID.  Most people just wanting to close their eyes and wish society back to pre COVID.   

 

I think that the 5 day isolationn period is not backed up by science.  Why are we doing this?  Business reasons.  This is only going to spread COVID more and harm more people.  Other people's bad behavior (ignoring all isolation precautions) shouldn't make everyone feel like we all should be ignoring isolation. 

[Sticksboi05]

2 hours ago, PeterMP said:

 

There's lot's of data out there.  And the one post is extremely misleading.

 

The CDC is talking about post-onset of symptoms.  I don't think there are any known cases where people are shedding infective virus more than 9 days post the unset of infection.

 

"However, there is large variation, and many studies did not take into account that shedding may have started several days before individuals received their first positive test result. Therefore, in many people nucleic acid  fragments may be detectable for 3 weeks or more. Most people infected with SARS-CoV-2 are infectious for 4–8 days and no studies have cultured viable virus beyond day 9 of illness."

 

https://www.dovepress.com/recalibrating-sars-cov-2-antigen-rapid-lateral-flow-test-relative-sens-peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-CLEP

 

As stated, people can be infective before they have symptoms (especially unvaccinated people).  And I guess there might be people if you add those days in that you get you to 12 days.  But to my knowledge, there isn't a single documented case of somebody getting symptoms and then being contagious 12 days later.  And the CDC is talking about days post-the onset of symptoms.

 

(For vaccinated people, symptoms tend to start earlier and so they don't have (as much of) a phase where they are contagious but asymptomatic and they tend to be infectious for less time total.)

 

As I said in the vaccine thread, the CDC is likely going off the fact that most people test positive after they have started their infectious period, which is typically a day or two before symptoms start to about 3-5 days after depending on your immune response (changed a bit by vaccination and Omicron). However, that is not everyone and you will undoubtedly still have people going outside while contagious following this guidance. We also have less data on the infection kinetics of Omicron though I think that will be a bigger issue at the beginning of the infectious period vs. affecting the end.

 

The argument to eliminate the steadfast 10 day rule has been strong for a while, but the CDC should have at the very least said recommend you get a negative rapid test before you re-enter society. It is better to be safe than sorry and it only takes one oops to trigger outbreaks. It would also encourage people to make more use of rapid tests.

 

That paper is from March 2021 - if the CDC is going to gain public trust they should present the recent data they are working with, and then say, here's why the change, not just allude to it.

[tshile]

It is fun watching people play the “when you trust the cdc and when not to” game. 

5 hours ago, TryTheBeal! said:

 

If you’re following the other guidance of the CDC, vaxxed/boosted/masked/social distance/etc, then 5 days without symptoms is almost certainly fine for some semblance of engaging in life.  Youre not gonna be a patient zero for an outbreak.

Especially if you include that you’re supposed to return to life *wearing a mask*
 

 

[TheDoyler23]

17 minutes ago, tshile said:

It is fun watching people play the “when you trust the cdc and when not to” game. 

Agreed. This isn’t March 2020 when the conservative thought was “well maybe we have to kill off grandma to save the economy.” 

[bearrock]

21 minutes ago, tshile said:

It is fun watching people play the “when you trust the cdc and when not to” game. 

 

I'm still holding out for when CDC announces that having Daniel Snyder own the WFT is bad for DMV residents' emotional well being.

[kfrankie]

My good friend's has three boys ages 6, 9, and 11.  All three contracted Covid in the past 3 days  (26th, 27th, 28th), or at least their symptoms started.   Each had a roughly 24 hours of mild congestion, and low grade fever (~100), and generally tired, and they are each like new now, no symptoms. None were vaccinated.

 

His wife started having symptoms yesterday, and she's still "moderately congested" as of now but better.  He has not had symptoms.  Both are fully vaccinated with boosters.  It sounds to me like they all caught the Omicron strain, so the 24 hours recovery period is good news.  Anecdotal of course though.

[skinsmarydu]

 As it turns out, none of my store managers are vaxxed (I feel #bamboozled) and two of them are out with Covid symptoms.  I texted my area sup last night in a small panic, he called me right back & we had a talk.  This morning, we had no managers in the building, so I texted him that we were going to need big time help for lunch...I don't have the code to the safe and 3 supply trucks were on the way, he said, "So am I, and I've trusted you for 20 years.  Do your thing."   

I then took over delegating what needed to be done to get open...I follow the philosophy of "put your aces in their places" and we got open on time.  We did have 2 trainees who were both experienced & FABULOUS and really stepped up, they were both VERY heavily praised at shift's end.  He trained them both, and they were both happy when they left, thank <your deity here>.

Tomorrow is my last shift of the week, we close early NYE and are closed NYD, always closed on Sundays and I always have Mondays off.  I'm really concerned about what's going to happen next week.  One manager lives in a hotel and has no car, so even if she were to find a test, she can't use Uber or Marta to get it.  The other can't find a test anywhere.   

I don't mind another quarantine weekend, but damn...the fun is stripped away because I don't know what the f is gonna happen Tuesday.   

[LD0506]

44 minutes ago, skinsmarydu said:

I don't mind another quarantine weekend, but damn...the fun is stripped away because I don't know what the f is gonna happen Tuesday.  

 

You're gonna step up and deal with it, that's what the A listers do

Trust yourself

[purbeast]

Welp I tested positive tonight.  Took an AG and PCR test and AG results were positive.  I get the PCR results tomorrow and expect the same.  We're going to try and get AG tests for the rest of my fam tomorrow but it's going to be tough as **** because all of this crap is a huge cluster**** trying to get tested right now.

[tshile]

Good luck

[purbeast]

6 hours ago, Sticksboi05 said:

The argument to eliminate the steadfast 10 day rule has been strong for a while, but the CDC should have at the very least said recommend you get a negative rapid test before you re-enter society. It is better to be safe than sorry and it only takes one oops to trigger outbreaks. It would also encourage people to make more use of rapid tests.

Well getting rapid tests right now is a huge problem.  I literally have driven to 8 different testing sights the past 2 days and ended up waiting by myself for 2.5 hours just to get my test done, and I was lucky, because they were taking 10 walkins at the time, and I was the 10th person.  There were people behind me who did not get tested.  And while I was waiting, tons and tons of people walked in and right out because they were looking for a test and no more walkins were being taken.

[skinsmarydu]

I stayed out of work for more than a year.  Triple vaxxed.

Still scared as ****.

Edited December 30, 2021 by skinsmarydu

[TheGreatBuzz]

8 hours ago, clietas said:

 

Holiday rush. Every American is seemingly trying to get tested at the same time. In some instances multiple times. 

 

I looked into getting tested before Xmas. Problem here seemed to be time. Not enough appointments available. There were plenty available the day after. Where I was traveling to in SW VA had plenty of appointments on Christmas eve until 2pm.

 

 

 

*this isn’t directed at just you but to address the “holiday rush” idea in general.

 

I’m pretty sure we have known the holidays were coming for a couple years now.  They seem to occur around the same time every year.  There is no excuse for not being ready for the testing demand.  This is a big failure on the part of this administration.  *That is said while also noting that this probably wouldn’t need to be as necessary if all the ass hats just got their shot a while ago.  But we have seen this coming for a while.  And they weren’t ready.  This is a failure I put at their feet.

[skinsmarydu]

The whole restaurant is in a complete panic. My phone is blowing the **** up. 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

I don’t get being in a panic. If you are vaxed you are good. A runny nose and a scratchy throat…

[skinsmarydu]

Two more people left work tonight feeling symptoms.  

We're kind of in a walkout now until the building gets professionally cleaned because we don't know where it came from & until the stupid unvaxxed idiots can stay quarantined long enough.  I'm pushing for the full 10 days. 

****in idiots.