Califan007 The Constipated Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 4 hours ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: Nor, to add, has the fact that next to nobody has mentioned the Hopkins missed field goal the start of the 4th quarter that puts us up 3 scores and who knows how big a win that then rolls into? If you wanted to go that route, you could also include the fumble by AP on the 2 yard line that could have realistically ended up a TD, and then Thompson's dropped pass on the goalline (well, the DB/LB/whatever got his hand in there as well) that also should have been a TD. Would have been 21-3 instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddub52 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 12 hours ago, MariusVT said: And probably would have lost in overtime if they had kicked the extra point instead of going for the win. So glad they went for two. NO ONE in that stadium wanted it to go to overtime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 3 hours ago, Califan007 said: If you wanted to go that route, you could also include the fumble by AP on the 2 yard line that could have realistically ended up a TD, and then Thompson's dropped pass on the goalline (well, the DB/LB/whatever got his hand in there as well) that also should have been a TD. Would have been 21-3 instead. Not just that, the holding call on Norman in the end zone that extended their drive (i think it was third down), the drop by McLaurin that coulda been a TD. We can always do this and it's kinda fun to think about how 'close' we are, we actually won the game so yeah we could have lost but it's not a clear thing as that. Plus we're we playing prevent against Fitz? It seemed like our rush was gone except for that bad snap. That's also a factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Yep, you guys are right. We're close!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakedtater1 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 5 hours ago, ddub52 said: So glad they went for two. NO ONE in that stadium wanted it to go to overtime Haha that's what i was saying to the ol man..you gotta be ****ting me there gonna take this **** show to ot lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 13 hours ago, Califan007 said: This shouldn't be overlooked. Callahan has zero problems regularly feeding AP the ball...in contrast, Gruden made him a healthy scratch to start the season and took a jab at him about activating him if they call 35 runs from the I-formation. He also took every opportunity he could to pull him. How many times a game did we see Thompson or Smallwood running the ball up the middle? Maybe he was trying to fool defenses, but Chris Thompson is not who you want on third and short. Still, it felt like we'd see AP get one carry a series. It didn't matter if he ran for two, six, or eight. It almost like the obligatory,"See! I played him. That's over with. Now, I can do what I want." treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Interesting add on: https://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/offensive-holding?year=2019&view=week After the first two weeks, offensive holding penalties have slowed league wide. It's also important to note that the full "starting" offensive line (I put starting in quotes because Trent Williams is still on this roster for some unknown reason) was in tact for this game. And combine all of this with "Miami". I don't have a lot of faith in the premise the OP is laying forward. I'm willing to give it a shot... but... San Francisco is a real test. If the team were to commit zero penalties and run the ball for 150+ against the Niners, now we have some oil to cook with. 33 minutes ago, Burgold said: He also took every opportunity he could to pull him. How many times a game did we see Thompson or Smallwood running the ball up the middle? Maybe he was trying to fool defenses, but Chris Thompson is not who you want on third and short. Still, it felt like we'd see AP get one carry a series. To be fair, Thompson went out fairly early in this game. We may have seen him a bit more. Coincidentally, Thompson not being involved is one of my worries with this "new" run focus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 I dunno. If Thompson went out I suspect Gruden would have given all his carries to Smallwood. It's not really important anymore. It's done. It's just perplexing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probos Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 16 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Clearly for entirely different reasons. Those fans are accepting that this team is going nowheresville, so why not try to acquire an elite player at the top of the draft? Preferably selected by someone else without influence by Dan or Bruce. The other side is that they are actually building on something here even if they are losing. That’s just crap to me. Especially on the heels of the mockery of pro football we watched yesterday. The end of that thought,...is the key. I keep hearing so many people saying the Skins need to tank,...get the highest or #1 pick, etc. If Bruce is still here that means Dan's current mindset is intact (which really hasn't changed much from 20 years ago), so why would I, or anyone else be excited about having a top 3 pick in next years draft? It's akin to giving a Lamborghini Huracan to a confirmed alcoholic/drug addict moron. "Here ya go buddy -- I know you'll get the best out of it, drive it right and take care of it!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 52 minutes ago, Probos said: The end of that thought,...is the key. I keep hearing so many people saying the Skins need to tank,...get the highest or #1 pick, etc. If Bruce is still here that means Dan's current mindset is intact (which really hasn't changed much from 20 years ago), so why would I, or anyone else be excited about having a top 3 pick in next years draft? It's akin to giving a Lamborghini Huracan to a confirmed alcoholic/drug addict moron. "Here ya go buddy -- I know you'll get the best out of it, drive it right and take care of it!" Because, quite frankly, just because the front office stinks it doesn't mean that they are completely terrible all the time. 1st round picks under Snyder: 1999- Champ Bailey 2000 - LaVar Arrington/Chris Samuels 2001 - Rod Gardner (wah wah) 2002 - Patrick Ramsey (lamb to the slaughter of a brutal OL) 2004 - Sean Taylor 2005 - Carlos Rogers/Jason Campbell 2007 - Laron Landry 2009 - Brian Orakpo 2010 - Trent Williams 2011 - Ryan Kerrigan 2012 - RG3 2015 - Brandon Scherff 2016 - Josh Doctson 2017 - Jonathan Allen 2018 - Daron Payne 2019 - Dwayne Haskins/Montez Sweat There are some absolute flops on that list, but also a good mix of very good players for the team. Only top 5 picks: Scherff, Griffin, Samuels, Arrington, Taylor, Williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 16 minutes ago, Probos said: The end of that thought,...is the key. I keep hearing so many people saying the Skins need to tank,...get the highest or #1 pick, etc. If Bruce is still here that means Dan's current mindset is intact (which really hasn't changed much from 20 years ago), so why would I, or anyone else be excited about having a top 3 pick in next years draft? It's akin to giving a Lamborghini Huracan to a confirmed alcoholic/drug addict moron. "Here ya go buddy -- I know you'll get the best out of it, drive it right and take care of it!" I get the point but we'd have to believe that Kyle Smith stinks at his job to blow a top 3 pick. He I think is the best thing we got cooking. Heck even Vinny couldn't blow high draft picks -- its pretty hard to do. Yeah you got some busts in the high end of the draft but the odds are much greater in your favor. For me its not that I think that's what everyone should think. People can think whatever floats their boat. We are all fans with minds of our own. For me, I want a top pick to either get an elite player or even better trade down for a bounty of draft picks. In my view the only thing this FO does well is have Kyle Smith pick players in the draft. So for me it's doubling down on what this team does best. the more young talented employees you got the more likely you can override (to use your analogy) the two drunkard and delusional dudes at the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 16 minutes ago, KDawg said: Only top 5 picks: Scherff, Griffin, Samuels, Arrington, Taylor Trent, too. Arguably Trent, Samuels, Taylor are the three best players in Dan's tenure. What would our division rivals be without Elliot, Barkley, Wentz? All top 5 picks. At the end of the 2015 season, I went to Dallas and saw the last game that year where we beat Dallas and helped them secure a top 5 pick. A friend of mine is a big cowboys fan and said thank you Redskins for that win because he wanted that high pick. Dallas has pretty much surpassed us consistently ever since. They added a stud RB to a loaded O line. Yeah its not the be all and end all but an elite player added to a team with talent can make a big difference. Like I've been saying we will see a walking example of that this Sunday with SF who added Bosa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakedtater1 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 22 hours ago, BoycottEuphemisticFans said: this game does not warrant any "deep dive" retrospective. it should not be discussed, it should not be remembered and we are all worse for having it witnessed it. nothing good came of it in any way shape or form. a meaningless preseason game between two bottom dwelling, helpless teams. This is wrong on so many levels..let's start by I'm sorry my disgusting stupid ass homerism gets in the way..but as head of the "we'll go down swinging for our favorite team" committee..you play to win the game..of course something good came out of it..you go down there and tell those ****in players who just busted there asses doing there job that they signed up for, that "nothing good came from this"..have more respect for the game and the players yall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertbeagle85 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Can we close this thread after the 49ers game? 2 hours ago, bakedtater1 said: This is wrong on so many levels..let's start by I'm sorry my disgusting stupid ass homerism gets in the way..but as head of the "we'll go down swinging for our favorite team" committee..you play to win the game..of course something good came out of it..you go down there and tell those ****in players who just busted there asses doing there job that they signed up for, that "nothing good came from this"..have more respect for the game and the players yall So does this opinion still hold up if we go 1-15, because I'm going to have to agree. That game meant nothing and this weekend will show everyone why it meant nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudpig Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 8 hours ago, SkinsFTW said: Yep, you guys are right. We're close!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 13 hours ago, Califan007 said: Confused here...isn't winning and "almost" losing both winning? lol...Sharp is literally saying "Committing to the run game did not allow the Skins to win, it allowed them to win ugly." Okaaay...but it still allowed them to win, right? And is he saying the Skins should not have committed to the run game so that they could have won in a purty fashion? lol... You left out the part where the near-loss was against the winless, tanking team that lost all its prior games by at least 20. The point is, committing to the run is not a winning long-term strategy in today's league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 15, 2019 Author Share Posted October 15, 2019 25 minutes ago, desertbeagle85 said: ..... So does this opinion still hold up if we go 1-15, because I'm going to have to agree. That game meant nothing and this weekend will show everyone why it meant nothing. 2 I'm probably going to regret asking, but pray tell how, if it plays out that way, losing to a more talented team, who are settled in year three of a HC's system/ GM's rebuild philosophy, as opposed to a two week HC (here) and OC calling his second-ever pro-game, would somehow validate your assertion of the Miami game meaning nothing? Not least when they'll be 9 more games of football to play after that. Curious minds and all that. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertbeagle85 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 21 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: I'm probably going to regret asking, but pray tell how, if it plays out that way, losing to a more talented team, who are settled in year three of a HC's system/ GM's rebuild philosophy, as opposed to a two week HC (here) and OC calling his second-ever pro-game, would somehow validate your assertion of the Miami game meaning nothing? Not least when they'll be 9 more games of football to play after that. Curious minds and all that. Hail. Are you calling the Dolphins a more talented team? If so you might want to put down the pipe my friend. The dolphins traded away any talent they had before that game was ever played. You also act like this coaching staff is new and also not running the same system that was ran before Jay left. A system that has been the same for 5 years mind you. So yes the Miami game was nothing and for anyone to think it was something, boggles my mind. SF is going to absolutely destroy this team, because they're a real team. The Dolphins are not a real team and they're not trying to be this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 24 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: I'm probably going to regret asking, but pray tell how, if it plays out that way, losing to a more talented team, who are settled in year three of a HC's system/ GM's rebuild philosophy, as opposed to a two week HC (here) and OC calling his second-ever pro-game, would somehow validate your assertion of the Miami game meaning nothing? Not least when they'll be 9 more games of football to play after that. Curious minds and all that. Hail. I really appreciate your optimism. It's nice to see, even if I can't fathom how you are so positive about a lot of this stuff... But I'm curious... at this point it seems like no matter what happens, you're going to declare the season a rousing success under Callahan. Which means you have some pretty inherent bias against Gruden that is shading your judgement a little. I think it's good what you bring to the table. If for nothing else, it's refreshing to see someone go against the grain. But it just seems like you're going to excuse anything and everything and ignore a lot of the factors that go in to this stuff except interim HC and rookie playcaller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 8 minutes ago, KDawg said: I really appreciate your optimism. It's nice to see, even if I can't fathom how you are so positive about a lot of this stuff... But I'm curious... at this point it seems like no matter what happens, you're going to declare the season a rousing success under Callahan. Which means you have some pretty inherent bias against Gruden that is shading your judgement a little. I think it's good what you bring to the table. If for nothing else, it's refreshing to see someone go against the grain. But it just seems like you're going to excuse anything and everything and ignore a lot of the factors that go in to this stuff except interim HC and rookie playcaller For the record, I'm not trying to pull KDawg into my argument, but this post is a good launching point. I agree with all of the above except the bolded part though because I actually find it rather hypocritical that a guy who admittedly went radio silent and gave up on the team as a result of his own personal feelings about Jay Gruden, has the audacity to come out of hiding to applaud the efforts of Bill Callahan and call folks who don't share his optimism 'negative nellies'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 15, 2019 Author Share Posted October 15, 2019 8 minutes ago, desertbeagle85 said: Are you calling the Dolphins a more talented team? If so you might want to put down the pipe my friend. The dolphins traded away any talent they had before that game was ever played. You also act like this coaching staff is new and also not running the same system that was ran before Jay left. A system that has been the same for 5 years mind you. So yes the Miami game was nothing and for anyone to think it was something, boggles my mind. SF is going to absolutely destroy this team, because they're a real team. The Dolphins are not a real team and they're not trying to be this year. Something apparently got totally lost in translation there. Everything in my post referred to how settled and more talented the 49ers are compared to ourselves and if we lost, it would validate your view that the Miami game meant nothing? If the games mean nothing why even play them? 3 minutes ago, KDawg said: I really appreciate your optimism. It's nice to see, even if I can't fathom how you are so positive about a lot of this stuff... But I'm curious... at this point it seems like no matter what happens, you're going to declare the season a rousing success under Callahan. Which means you have some pretty inherent bias against Gruden that is shading your judgement a little. I think it's good what you bring to the table. If for nothing else, it's refreshing to see someone go against the grain. But it just seems like you're going to excuse anything and everything and ignore a lot of the factors that go in to this stuff except interim HC and rookie playcaller 3 Where in the World did you get that from my question there? Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertbeagle85 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Just now, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: Something apparently got totally lost in translation there. Everything in my post referred to how settled and more talented the 49ers are compared to ourselves and if we lost, it would validate your view that the Miami game meant nothing? If the games mean nothing why even play them? Where in the World did you get that from my question there? Hail. Okay yeah i saw it wrong my fault. Either way the Miami game still means nothing. It might have meant more if they beat up on the worst team in the NFL. The thing is they should have lost that game and they didn't because the Dolphins handed the Skins the win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 1 minute ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: Where in the World did you get that from my question there? Hail. It's not your question there. It's the whole thread, man. You point to running the ball more with AP, but don't acknowledge situations dictate things. You point to better discipline, but don't take into account holding penalties are down and a poor team. You give Callahan credit for the better discipline, but you ignore the new OL coach there and missed Callahan's own comments in his presser that they have a better OL coach now. I get having a horse in the race. But it just really seems like you hate Jay Gruden. I don't think its unreasonable to say, "yup! We ran the ball more, and won a football game. Let's see what happens the next few weeks to see if Callahan does better". But above, you seem to be saying even if the team goes 1-15 its okay because interim HC and new OC as long as we, very subjectively, see an improvement in discipline. What would quantify that improvement in an objective way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 15, 2019 Author Share Posted October 15, 2019 11 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: For the record, I'm not trying to pull KDawg into my argument, but this post is a good launching point. I agree with all of the above except the bolded part though because I actually find it rather hypocritical that a guy who admittedly went radio silent and gave up on the team as a result of his own personal feelings about Jay Gruden, has the audacity to come out of hiding to applaud the efforts of Bill Callahan and call folks who don't share his optimism 'negative nellies'. Please, feel free to point out when and where I've been calling anyone a such. 6 minutes ago, KDawg said: It's not your question there. It's the whole thread, man. You point to running the ball more with AP, but don't acknowledge situations dictate things. You point to better discipline, but don't take into account holding penalties are down and a poor team. You give Callahan credit for the better discipline, but you ignore the new OL coach there and missed Callahan's own comments in his presser that they have a better OL coach now. I get having a horse in the race. But it just really seems like you hate Jay Gruden. I don't think its unreasonable to say, "yup! We ran the ball more, and won a football game. Let's see what happens the next few weeks to see if Callahan does better". But above, you seem to be saying even if the team goes 1-15 its okay because interim HC and new OC as long as we, very subjectively, see an improvement in discipline. What would quantify that improvement in an objective way? 3 It's acknowledged in the bloody OP. Jesus Coach if you're gonna' flat out ignore **** and just infer things that aren't there to suit (which was never your style), what's the point in any discussion here? Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: Jesus Coach if you're gonna' flat out ignore **** and just infer things that aren't there to suit (which was never your style), what's the point in any discussion here? Hail. Get upset if ya want, but I'm not the only one that doesn't understand where you're coming from here. Your OP say things, but your replies seem to say something different. I'm just trying to point this stuff out so I can get a clear view on your position, because it seems like you're moving the target (and you may not be) with each argument. Could be completely a misunderstanding on my end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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