FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[HTTRDynasty]

But don't misconstrue my position.  I think Rivera would be overjoyed if Haskins turned out to be a franchise QB.  But he's covering his bases.

[Xameil]

2 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

 

When he has the veil of an excuse that the game is already out of hand - yes.  It's pretty obvious.  Occam's razor, folks.

Devils Advoate here....We went ahead when down by 10...why would 11 be out of reach?

If #17 doesn't get called for a sketchy PI call...things may have been different.

[Burgundy Yoda]

Can someone tell me where to find Dwayne on this? I can't seem to locate our franchise QB. 

 

 

[HTTRDynasty]

1 minute ago, Xameil said:

Devils Advoate here....We went ahead when down by 10...why would 11 be out of reach?

If #17 doesn't get called for a sketchy PI call...things may have been different.

 

I mean, that supports my point, which is that he's giving up in the 4th quarter with the game still in reach.

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

You are definitely misunderstanding here.  I was referring to him giving lip service to the fans and reporters as it relates to timeouts.  He can't outright say he's willing to tank for a high draft pick, so he's giving lip service by saying the reason for not calling the timeouts is mainly due to a host of other factors.  And those other factors may even be true, but it's clear to me what the primary reason is.

 

OK I thought this line was pretty blunt on your end but if you are reffering below to timeouts, OK, but if you reread that line you could see how easily someone can be confused because you are directly referring to Haskins.

 

" I think benching him this season would be a mistake, and I truly believe Rivera knows that and is just giving lip service to the fans and reporters."

 

, 

[Xameil]

Just now, HTTRDynasty said:

 

I mean, that supports my point, which is that he's giving up in the 4th quarter with the game still in reach.

Ummm...ok? Don't know how I proved a point unless your point was Rivera thought the refs were against us...which I wasn't saying...at least I don't think I was....

[PartyPosse]

This whole timeout thing is so blown out of proportion from fans convinced they know better or concoct wild conspiracy theories. 

 

Ron is trying to build a team. He's trying to instill a level of competitiveness and cohesion that doesn't happen overnight. He wants the team to play for 60 minutes despite how the otherside is doing. Ron knows more about football, about the team he's coaching than all of us put together. He's there, on the sidelines, talking to everyone, coaches and players. 

 

I trust him more than all of you put together. Nothing personal. That's why we're all sitting at home typing on a board and he's out there being a lightning rod for criticism. 

[Skinsinparadise]

new PFF sum scores are out for the season thus far

 

 

@Alcoholic Zebra at least by PFF standards Christian is improving.  i recall you pushed that narrative some in the off season, that point is trending better

[GOATFrerotte]

3 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

This whole timeout thing is so blown out of proportion from fans convinced they know better or concoct wild conspiracy theories. 

 

Ron is trying to build a team. He's trying to instill a level of competitiveness and cohesion that doesn't happen overnight. He wants the team to play for 60 minutes despite how the otherside is doing. Ron knows more about football, about the team he's coaching than all of us put together. He's there, on the sidelines, talking to everyone, coaches and players. 

 

I trust him more than all of you put together. Nothing personal. That's why we're all sitting at home typing on a board and he's out there being a lightning rod for criticism. 

 

After what's gone down the last 30 years we are more than within our rights to question the decision making of our coaches. You act like they are always right and always know better. That's clearly not the case given our history. 

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, httr2020dynasty said:

 

After what's gone down the last 30 years we are more than within our rights to question the decision making of our coaches. You act like they are always right and always know better. That's clearly not the case given our history. 

Again, absolutely hilarious how fast some have turned on Ron Rivera. 

 

You can criticize him all you want. You have that right just as I have the right to shake my head in disbelief at your impatience and arrogance. 

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said:

Yeah, I’m not buying the injury excuse - at all. 

 

I take him at his word.  And I think the unspoken message here is that he's got carte blanche for the season and is feeling no pressure from upper management right now.  He's looking at very specific signals from the team and doesn't care about the outcomes of the games, and that he won't seriously compete until next season.

 

It's uncomfortable to see the "trust the process" mentality in the NFL.  But perhaps it's actually a positive sign that the ownership is fully behind Ron.

[mojo]

Kyle Allen

In his first five games he started, all of which were wins, he threw 9 touchdown passes with zero interceptions. He was the first quarterback in NFL history to be 5–0 in their first five games started without throwing an interception.^[38] 

 

 

[PartyPosse]

Just now, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I take him at his word.  And I think the unspoken message here is that he's got carte blanche for the season and is feeling no pressure from upper management right now.  He's looking at very specific signals from the team and doesn't care about the outcomes of the games, and that he won't seriously compete until next season.

 

It's uncomfortable to see the "trust the process" mentality in the NFL.  But perhaps it's actually a positive sign that the ownership is fully behind Ron.

I think honestly the organization is fine with it, it's just the fans that dissect every little thing and lose their minds at every corner. I highly doubt there's any dissension in the lockerroom even though people around these parts have convinced themselves there is. 

[HTTRDynasty]

9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

OK I thought this line was pretty blunt on your end but if you are reffering below to timeouts, OK, but if you reread that line you could see how easily someone can be confused because you are directly referring to Haskins.

 

" I think benching him this season would be a mistake, and I truly believe Rivera knows that and is just giving lip service to the fans and reporters."

 

, 

 

In that line I am referring to the fact that Rivera knows benching Haskins hurts our chances of tanking if he keeps playing this poorly.  The lip service part of it is in regards to his whole "win now" spiel and how it doesn't align with his actions (i.e. not taking timeouts with the game in reach).

[Skinsinparadise]

1 minute ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

In that line I am referring to the fact that Rivera knows benching Haskins hurts our chances of tanking if he keeps playing this poorly.  The lip service part of it is in regards to his whole "win now" spiel and how it doesn't align with his actions (i.e. not taking timeouts with the game in reach).

 

OK I think I follow now, so Rivera knows benching Haskins is a mistake if the goal is to tank the season assuming he keeps playing this poorly?   

[Stefanskins]

To quote Guns n Roses "Just A little Patience"...I was never high on Haskins but that's probably because he's an Ohio State QB...He does have a great arm...and he does have an NFL body...he seems to be smart enough...seems to have that QB "grit" but sans the "poise"...I didn't get to watch the game (work) so I can't quantify or qualify his interceptions...and we all know not every interception is weighted the same...situational context and what not...but 3 ints are gonna kill ya every time, just ask Sexy Rexy...so can't be doing that...I hear that he's staring down receivers...not good...and I don't care if he was reading his progressions quicker than he should...staring down your wider receivers is staring down your wide receivers not matter the reason and that leads to demoralizing interceptions...maybe he can fix that and his mechanics...sometimes he looks great climbing the pocket and resetting but on too many he has happy feet and ugly throwing angles...OSU did him no favors in QB coaching him...but that should be correctable with coaching...however, this **** with Bostic talking to him in TC...and the way he responded to critique is VERY concerning to me and reminds me of petulant spoiled Ryan Leaf...and can only lead to a Not For Long NFL Career...so, I say work him hard and coach him up and if there isn't considerable progress by the bye week then install Kyle Allen, who I was kinda impressed with at the beginning of last year...HTTR

[method man]

16 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

new PFF sum scores are out for the season thus far

 

 

@Alcoholic Zebra at least by PFF standards Christian is improving.  i recall you pushed that narrative some in the off season, that point is trending better

 

Martin is playing a bit better too...just not good enough. As many have pointed out, he just doesn't have the play strength for the position. I want to see Charles, Ismael or Garnett (who I thought I did see in the huddle once or twice on Sunday)

[HTTRDynasty]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

OK I think I follow now, so Rivera knows benching Haskins is a mistake if the goal is to tank the season assuming he keeps playing this poorly?   

 

Exactly.  I should have been more clear, but yes, that is my suspicion based on his actions.  And I agree it's the correct approach in year 1 of this rebuild.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

@Alcoholic Zebra at least by PFF standards Christian is improving.  i recall you pushed that narrative some in the off season, that point is trending better

 

The worries everyone has for him are probably still going to be valid.  He's got a high physical ceiling, but does he have the mental makeup/desire to reach that ceiling?  Hopefully he settles into something above average for a LT.  That then gives us OL flexibility by figuring out what to do with Saahdiq Charles.

 

Whatever leg issue(s) he's got, it's been 2 months.  First the calf and now the thigh.  Anyone know if it's the same leg?

[ExoDus84]

4 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

But I still don't get how this can turn into a referrundem on Haskins and not other players on the team (Logan Thomas, Troy Apke, the Wes Brothers, Collins, etc). Its really turning into the Biblical passage "he who is without sin cast the first stone" because even the great Chase Young had the offsides on third down that led to the Eagles scoring, Kerrigan had an offsides, Chubb had 100+ yards yesterday and that wasn't on Haskins. So its not like we're this elite team outside of Haskins. Heck TMac got called for an OPI and Wright was out of bounds and AGG dropped one on a close call. Those aren't on Haskins but we're impacted by them

 

I know what you're saying. The defense did allow a 100 yard rusher. Cleveland's line is pretty damn good, and Chubb is even better. However, allowing a hundred yard rusher isn't automatically a loss.

 

The Browns had TD drives of 24, 28, and 35 yards because of turnovers. You're just not going to win an NFL game if you're handing your opponents that kind of field position. It's an awful situation to put your defense in.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

4 minutes ago, method man said:

 

Martin is playing a bit better too...just not good enough. As many have pointed out, he just doesn't have the play strength for the position. I want to see Charles, Ismael or Garnett (who I thought I did see in the huddle once or twice on Sunday)

 

Garnett was on the field for 1 snap against the Browns.  Must have been some jumbo 6 OL look, cause the starting 5 OL all played 100% of the snaps.

[Stefanskins]

3 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

 

The worries everyone has for him are probably still going to be valid.  He's got a high physical ceiling, but does he have the mental makeup/desire to reach that ceiling?  Hopefully he settles into something above average for a LT.  That then gives us OL flexibility by figuring out what to do with Saahdiq Charles.

 

Whatever leg issue(s) he's got, it's been 2 months.  First the calf and now the thigh.  Anyone know if it's the same leg?

sounds like another Jonathan Martin...just not as talented

[HTTRDynasty]

 

12 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I take him at his word.  And I think the unspoken message here is that he's got carte blanche for the season and is feeling no pressure from upper management right now.  He's looking at very specific signals from the team and doesn't care about the outcomes of the games, and that he won't seriously compete until next season.

 

It's uncomfortable to see the "trust the process" mentality in the NFL.  But perhaps it's actually a positive sign that the ownership is fully behind Ron.

 

I'm not saying injuries isn't a factor.  I'm saying it's not the primary factor.  I would love to see an analysis showing how much injuries are decreased by punting your timeouts at the end of games when they are still within reach.  I would guess the impact is negligible over the past 10+ seasons.

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

Exactly.  I should have been more clear, but yes, that is my suspicion based on his actions.  And I agree it's the correct approach in year 1 of this rebuild.

 

The idea though of tanking for a pick to me strikes me more of fan driven thing versus a coach like Rivera. But you never know. 

 

But yeah for me personally I'd rather sink or swim with Haskins and if its a disaster its not the end of the world because it likely results in a high pick.  Not sure though Rivera sees it the same way. 

[profusion]

Right now, Haskins is a bad QB on a bad team. End of story. He's got some time.

 

A month from now? Haskins needs to start demonstrating growth soon if he wants to be here next year. He doesn't have to be good per se by a month from now, but those garbage throws need to start becoming rarer.