FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[Darrell Green Fan]

27 minutes ago, Cooleyfan1993 said:

https://www.si.com/nfl/browns/news/rumor-did-the-seattle-seahawks-try-to-trade-russell-wilson-to-cleveland-browns
 

that could be what he’s referring to. I didnt read the whole thing so i dont know how much of it, if any, is true. It’s possible @volsmet just believes everything he reads. Who knows 😂

If an article from two and a half years ago they clearly states it was a crazy rumor to begin with is all @volsmethas got then yeah.....

[wtfskins]

Welcome to the NFL Dwayne Haskins your a good solid young man but maybe sooner than later you will eventually have to learn the game a lil more from the sideline.  Your completion percentage is to low and your mobility is very suspect for this fast paced league.  The completion percentage could of been overlooked a little but the turnovers are frightening.  4 turnovers for a quarter of nfl games is not the recipe for success and it will eventually doom you this year.  
 

But what does one expect the young man only got 1 year of college games under his belt he needed 1 more.  
 

Kyle Allen will eventually replace you and hopefully sooner than later so you can learn this system a little more.  It’s is necessary and stay ready because you might be called upon if circumstances present themselves.  

[volsmet]

2 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

If an article from two and a half years ago they clearly states it was a crazy rumor to begin with is all @volsmethas got then yeah.....

 

 

I believe I told the ES that this was coming ... how many days before the announcement? 

 

On 6/7/2020 at 8:31 PM, volsmet said:

Uncle Kevin hired by the Browns today, adjust your nfl props accordingly.

Humble yourself in the presence of the only source of information you’ve got, or be vanquished. 

[wtfskins]

 

[volsmet]

3 minutes ago, wtfskins said:

 

Unfortunately, man coverage with no pressure is 7 v 7. 

[wtfskins]

2 minutes ago, volsmet said:

Unfortunately, man coverage with no pressure is 7 v 7. 

Our coaches didn’t make him a priority for no reason.  Believe me our coaches have egos too they will replace Haskins in a NY minute if it means they get to keep coaching another year or two. 

[volsmet]

30 minutes ago, wtfskins said:

Our coaches didn’t make him a priority for no reason.  Believe me our coaches have egos too they will replace Haskins in a NY minute if it means they get to keep coaching another year or two. 

I trust you. 

[GOATFrerotte]

44 minutes ago, wtfskins said:

 

I hope we get a chance to see him if we continue to be ineffective throwing downfield. He looks like a much more polished passer, not sure what happened to him his last 7 games even though he still threw for decent yards. Just too many turnovers.

[KDawg]

6 minutes ago, volsmet said:

I trust you. 

Narrator: “But he didn’t really.”

[CTskin]

9 hours ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The Cardinals did this without even giving Rosen a shot with the new coaching staff.  They threw in the towel.  It worked out for them.  

Yea... they had the #1 overall pick staring at them. Made that decision a whole lot easier and a whole lot different than our situation.

8 hours ago, httr2020dynasty said:

 

With a minimum of 200 passes, he had the worst qbr in the NFL last year. And he's last again this year. I have no clue what you're watching. By many statistics he's been the worst qb in the NFL his 10 starts. 

Apparently you didn’t watch the last 6 or so games of the year... I get it, many didn’t. Don’t ask what I’m looking at if all you’re looking at are cumulative stats and didn’t watch the games. I guarantee he wasn’t rated the worst over that span of games. Go look at those game logs or better yet watch the games and then come talk.

[GOATFrerotte]

9 minutes ago, CTskin said:

Yea... they had the #1 overall pick staring at them. Made that decision a whole lot easier and a whole lot different than our situation.

Apparently you didn’t watch the last 6 or so games of the year... I get it, many didn’t. Don’t ask what I’m looking at if all you’re looking at are cumulative stats and didn’t watch the games. I guarantee he wasn’t rated the worst over that span of games. Go look at those game logs or better yet watch the games and then come talk.

well I’ve seen all of Haskins games and can’t imagine it can be much worse than that. So I’ll take my chances with what I saw from Allen when I did see him play.

[stoshuaj]

1 hour ago, wtfskins said:

  Believe me 

why do ppl think that using “believe me”, “trust me”, “I guarantee”, “Ron will”, “”Ron is”, etc.  in an attempt to impart some implied familiarity/validity to their respective opinion?

 

here’s a hint, it doesn’t

[wtfskins]

54 minutes ago, stoshuaj said:

why do ppl think that using “believe me”, “trust me”, “I guarantee”, “Ron will”, “”Ron is”, etc.  in an attempt to impart some implied familiarity/validity to their respective opinion?

 

here’s a hint, it doesn’t

Wow are you going to offer some input on the conversation of the QB or just type nonsense?

1 hour ago, httr2020dynasty said:

I hope we get a chance to see him if we continue to be ineffective throwing downfield. He looks like a much more polished passer, not sure what happened to him his last 7 games even though he still threw for decent yards. Just too many turnovers.

I agree he has to clean up his sack fumble problem.  But he is very quick footed and elusive and a gunslinger. 

[Koolblue13]

7 hours ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

No no I didn't call you an anti-masker. Read the post again, I said this is like arguing with an anti-masker because I found a lot of holes in your argument.   Apologies if that was not clear.  

Gotcha. Thank goodness.

 

I was just saying he hasn't had a preseason as a starter and we're only 3 games into the year and his supporting cast is horse flop. 

[volsmet]

If Allen was a pocket passer, would he have been worth the wait. 

[wtfskins]

17 minutes ago, volsmet said:

If Allen was a pocket passer, would he have been worth the wait. 

A pocket passer?  We have a so called pocket passer right now but he keeps trying to escape the pocket which is not a bad idea if he was fast.  Someone let Haskins know he is slow to quit running out of the pocket. 

24 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Gotcha. Thank goodness.

 

I was just saying he hasn't had a preseason as a starter and we're only 3 games into the year and his supporting cast is horse flop. 

But he is dead last ranked QB.  With turnovers. 

[Koolblue13]

14 minutes ago, wtfskins said:

A pocket passer?  We have a so called pocket passer right now but he keeps trying to escape the pocket which is not a bad idea if he was fast.  Someone let Haskins know he is slow to quit running out of the pocket. 

But he is dead last ranked QB.  With turnovers. 

I don't care.

[wtfskins]

So what do you care about what’s your point? Koolblue13

[Skinsinparadise]

18 hours ago, wit33 said:

Most definitely, he was a great dual threat QB during a period of time when there wasn’t many. His value to the run game during those years and his overall playmaking was immense. 
 

 

 

You harp some that there are more dual threat QBs as a major point as if it dilutes the value some.  Are you suggesting that if Wilson entered the league today as a rookie it wouldn't be the same?  I don't see the relevance.  I'd get it if defenses figured it out but they haven't.  Yeah if every team had a Russell Wilson than the talent would even out but that's not the case either.

 

RG3 couldn't protect himself and became damaged goods and some said didn't want to be a RO QB anymore.  If all those things didn't happen, he'd probably have been fine.  But they did. 

[Skinsinparadise]

7 hours ago, volsmet said:

If Allen was a pocket passer, would he have been worth the wait. 

 

Probably not for me.    Though for me it always depends on what's the available plan B. 

[KDawg]

7 hours ago, volsmet said:

If Allen was a pocket passer, would he have been worth the wait. 

No.

[Riggo#44]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

No.

 

Why not? He's been fantastic as a passer this year.

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, Riggo#44 said:

 

Why not? He's been fantastic as a passer this year.

The reason he’s as good of a passer as he is now is due to the fact that he had the mobility to keep his team in games when he struggled passing. That kept people patient, including himself. Had he struggled in the pocket, minus the mobility aspect, he’d have pressed and played far worse, in my opinion.

 

Allen has his legs. That gave him the time needed to develop as a passer. And his legs still help him as a passer because he still makes things happen that a defense has to be wary of. And I think a few years down the line, when he loses some of that mobility, it will have afforded him enough time to develop his pocket awareness, timing and coverage recognition to play a bit longer.

 

Without his legs he wouldn’t have gotten to the point he’s at. And now he’s evolving into a quality quarterback because of them.

[Thinking Skins]

So aside from this discussion of Haskins staring at WRs or not vs playing too fast vs throwing too many checkdowns vs being too aggressive, I'm legit wondering what we are looking for in terms of "growth" from Haskins. Last year Sheehan was adamant about he wanted to see "it" from Haskins. He said he couldn't define "it" or put metrics on "it" but said its one of those "you know it when you see it" type things. Then he came and said that the Giants and Philly games (I forget which came first and which one he only played a half and don't have the time to do the search right now) were him showing "it". 

 

This year Sheehan and Cooley were in disagreement (after the Eagles game) on the whole Haskins rising to the occasion and making plays when they need to be made. Then in this last game Cooley was saying that he graded the ints as single negative plays, but in reality the fact that they are such big plays he could have graded them as more negative plays. This comes after his (Monday?) comments that he likes seeing this Haskins in week 3 vs the checkdown Haskins we saw in the first two weeks because its something to learn from and for us to assess (can he throw it deep, can he lead the WRs, can he look off the safety, etc).

 

I am kinda in disagreement with Cooley because I think that with a young QB the most important thing is confidence, both him in himself, the coach and OC in the QB, and the fans in the QB. So I liked the Calahan type approach, allowing Haskins to make some small mistakes but really putting the game in AP's hands for the most part and keeping it close and just asking Haskins to do a few things well. And I'd think that as he grows in the offense those things will also grow. Cooley seems really upset that Haskins is not taking enough deep shots (especially because he has them available) and I'm more concerned about is he getting the ball to a guy and is that guy getting the first down. 

 

Its funny because now (after week 3) we're talking about Haskins interception problem but he's demonstrated he can be safe with the ball. I would like for him and Turner to continue to grow together and learn each other's style. I would love to see more drag routes implemented in this offense (maybe a guy like Gibson or JMC from a wide position) where he has a safety valve. I think the problem Sunday was he was trying to do too much and possibly got too comfortable because he was doing so well early (started off 3/4 for 27 yards on the first drive, then 3/4 for 44 yards and a TD on the second drive). Even on that third drive he was moving the ball, he was 3/5 for 52 yards before the int. He made a critical mistake with the pass to Gibson and he was probably trying to do too much with the incompletion to Thomas. 

 

But are we looking for more deep passes (seems like this is something a lot of people are focusing on with the yards per attempt stuff and Cooley's focus on stats with passes above 10 yards). 
Are we looking for the number of guys who get the ball? 
Are we looking for the number of times he goes to Terry? 
Are we looking for a count of his "forced throws" or "interceptable passes"? 
Are we looking for a count of his "remarkable throws" or "Haskins made that play"? 
Is it a point thing, like how many times will this team score 21 points? 24 points? 30 points? 
Is it a yards thing, how many times will he throw for 150? 200? 225? 300? 
Is it a TD thing, how many 2TD games will he have? 3TD games? more?
Are we discounting things like "garbage time stats" or "yards after the catch"? 

And how are we aggregating these things? Does Haskins performing really well in the first and third quarters get negated to nothing because of his second and 4th quarters? Or the second halves in the Philly and Arizona games being negated by the first halves in both games? 

[Warhead36]

Interceptions from not reading the D or trying to make aggressive throws into tight windows don't bother me that much. That's expected from young QBs. And things like pocket awareness can be improved on as well.

 

But when you flat out misfire on wide open guys, THAT is a concern. Things like footwork and mechanical issues, those are hard to fix. Its kinda one of those "you are what you are" deals.