Anselmheifer Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said: If we burn Haskins and pick another QB this year, then I honestly don't understand how any fan could expect the next guy to succeed for this organization. Franchise QBs are made, not found. It already kind of feels like we are incapable of developing one, burning up Haskins would be proof for me. And the opportunity cost isn't really just the 15th pick in a vacuum because Haskins was a huge value pick. The cost is an elite prospect. That would be two elite QB prospects we've burned up in a span of seven years, and very probably three. Ruining Haskins and Tua... I can't stomach that. The unbelievable bungling of the QB position that this organization has been guilty of--for decades--but most egregiously this decade... it would end my fanhood. Just as a matter of principle, there is absolutely no way I want to see this FO getting yet another shot at QB. Seventh times the charm? No thanks. We need to make it work with Haskins. Agree to disagree. I am not sure I believe QB's are made and not found. Even if that is true, we made Cousins and we can make another QB. I don't think Tua is perfect. He has fallen short against elite level talent. He didn't carry the day against Clemson, but more than that, looked shoddy against Georgia last year before getting hurt and had to be saved by Hurts. I do think Tua is a better prospect than Haskins. If Haskins shows out, maybe its worth it to keep him over Tua. However, the QB position is so important, I'd rather have the QB that is a 90 over the QB that is an 85 plus Jeudy/Thomas/whoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 16 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said: I think it's above average on the whole. QB is pretty good, running back is good, corner is really good, wide receiver is great. The line and front seven talent is far worse than last year's, but the skill talent is far better. This is the year to set our WR up core for long term excellence and fix our secondary. We should be coming away with a good WR and multiple good DBs hopefully. 👍 I really hope the FO looks at this as an opportunity, the players below will save about $45M in cap and I have to believe even the most average GM could turn that list into a 1st and a 2nd rd pick if not much more depending on Reeds health. J Norman J Reed M Moses T Williams R Kerrigan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 22 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said: Agree to disagree. I am not sure I believe QB's are made and not found. Even if that is true, we made Cousins and we can make another QB. It's one of the most widespread and fundamental ways people misunderstand the QB position. And not just draftniks, NFL teams do it too. So many teams fail in the development process, so many coaching staffs and FOs are fundamentally incapable of successfully developing QB prospects. Drafting Cousins was unbelievably stupid in retrospect. It was the organization undermining RGIII's chances here day one. And then Cousins himself was another instance of the team failing to support and fully develop the position and the way it ended here with him was a crushing debacle. But at the end of the day, the modest success Kirk experienced here was capped off by him being a pretty low upside project. He was older when he was drafted and he didn't have a lot of arm or playmaking talent, nor did he have special instincts for the position. Haskins is the opposite. Young and super high upside. All of the instincts and playmaking ability you want. The rugged build and workhorse passing and chain-moving ability to be the kind of QB that can carry an offense down the road. We do not need a better prospect than him, we need to support him and develop him. The difference in grade between Haskins and Tua is like the difference between a 7 and a 7.2. It's like the difference between Watson and Mahomes. You can run an elite passing game with either. Nevermind what it says about our ability to develop and support QB prospects, you'd be paying an absolutely massive opportunity cost to make that marginal upgrade at QB, burning up an elite prospect a year after you get him and then spending a top five pick on QB instead of getting a blue chipper or trading down to stockpile talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mania Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said: It's one of the most widespread and fundamental ways people misunderstand the QB position. And not just draftniks, NFL teams do it too. So many teams fail in the development process, so many coaching staffs and FOs are fundamentally incapable of successfully developing QB prospects. Drafting Cousins was unbelievably stupid in retrospect. It was the organization undermining RGIII's chances here day one. And then Cousins himself was another instance of the team failing to support and fully develop the position and the way it ended here with him was a crushing debacle. But at the end of the day, the modest success Kirk experienced here was capped off by him being a pretty low upside project. He was older when he was drafted and he didn't have a lot of arm or playmaking talent, nor did he have special instincts for the position. Haskins is the opposite. Young and super high upside. All of the instincts and playmaking ability you want. The rugged build and workhorse passing and chain-moving ability to be the kind of QB that can carry an offense down the road. We do not need a better prospect than him, we need to support him and develop him. The difference in grade between Haskins and Tua is like the difference between a 7 and a 7.2. It's like the difference between Watson and Mahomes. You can run an elite passing game with either. Nevermind what it says about our ability to develop and support QB prospects, you'd be paying an absolutely massive opportunity cost to make that marginal upgrade at QB, burning up an elite prospect a year after you get him and then spending a top five pick on QB instead of getting a blue chipper or trading down to stockpile talent. since when is Haskins an elite prospect. I never liked him in college and watched a bunch of his games along with a bunch of his film. I liked Daniel Jones better than Haskins. He's a much better prospect that Haskins. There are a bunch of QB's available this year that are much more talented than Haskins ever will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Watched the surprisingly entertaining Oregon St vs Arizona game. Isaiah Hodgins detonated on Arizona. Jace Whittaker had his work cut out for him and he pretty much got owned. Getting to the point where he should be considered in the same tier as Ceedee Lamb and Tee Higgins and Jeudy/Smith/Ruggs. He can glide and his hands are awesome and these signature double move routes have been impossible covers for college DBs. Washington has been the only team to really solve that issue so far, but Luton was also painfully slow and off schedule and he was feeling the rush so Hodgins wasn't getting his targets. Arizona doesn't really have any serious NFL prospects this year, but you had to like what #21 JJ Taylor put on film. True muscle hamster at the position. Not as shifty and explosive as you'd want from such a small runner. Vision is OK but he can use creases normal runners can't. A pretty brutal runner with a very low center of gravity. He's still got a year of eligibility left and I have a hard time seeing him get drafted before late day three, but he's fun and could be a nice little platoon runner if he comes out this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Watching Alabama. Same old same old, WRs, RB on fire. Tua, too. Tua though sadly might have reinjured the ankle, got bloodied up on a brutal sack where his helmet flew off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinky Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: Watching Alabama. Same old same old, WRs, RB on fire. Tua, too. Tua though sadly might have reinjured the ankle, got bloodied up on a brutal sack where his helmet flew off. looked ugly (Tua) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Yeah. I’m starting to think he may be done for the year. Absolutely no pressure on that ankle coming off the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: Yeah. I’m starting to think he may be done for the year. Absolutely no pressure on that ankle coming off the field. I know there was talk about resting him for this game. They should have. They can crush Miss State with or without Tua. A rare Saban mistake IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panninho Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Apparently not the ankle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Panninho said: Apparently not the ankle The hip issue is he can’t use his hip to swivel his body because his ankle is mangled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panninho Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DazedSkinsfan Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Not good at all for Tua. Man I hope its nothing serious but damn he shouldn't have been playing. I said it all week that he should have sat out the next two weeks. Obviously his overall health comes first, but the kid has a lot to lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWinzit Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Hip injuries are usually way more serious than ankles...I have been through it. I hope he is healthy a few weeks from now. If not this could affect his draft status Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayouBrave86 Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 His career could be over. Rumors that it’s the same injury Bo Jackson had. Not good at all, hate to see it for him. Saban is going to catch so much **** for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 19 minutes ago, BayouBrave86 said: His career could be over. Rumors that it’s the same injury Bo Jackson had. Not good at all, hate to see it for him. Saban is going to catch so much **** for this. Where did you hear this? I turned to the game and dont see anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 36 minutes ago, BayouBrave86 said: His career could be over. Rumors that it’s the same injury Bo Jackson had. Not good at all, hate to see it for him. Saban is going to catch so much **** for this. If this is true it is awful. Nobody recovers from hip replacement to play pro football again. I feel for the guy. I hope he had a good insurance policy. Selfishly though losing Tua at the top of the draft would increase the value for our number 2 pick if we stay in that position. This draft is so stacked at QB that with Tua in the draft teams in the 5-6-7 area could afford to wait to get their guy. IF Tua is lost that makes it more important for them to move up to get their guy. I have Miami in mind at number 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DazedSkinsfan Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 1 hour ago, BayouBrave86 said: His career could be over. Rumors that it’s the same injury Bo Jackson had. Not good at all, hate to see it for him. Saban is going to catch so much **** for Latest update on Tua not sounding too good. Hes being airlifted to a hospital in Birmingham. Not sure why they're not going back to Tuscaloosa but I really don't like hearing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 1 hour ago, BayouBrave86 said: His career could be over. Rumors that it’s the same injury Bo Jackson had. Not good at all, hate to see it for him. Saban is going to catch so much **** for this. Wow... all that from watching a play. Stop spreading baseless **** because you read someone say something on Twitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoneMessedUp Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 That is indeed the same injury as Bo Jackson. Horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 It just became much more important that we lose tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 57 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: Wow... all that from watching a play. Stop spreading baseless **** because you read someone say something on Twitter. May have been posted on twitter but it doesn't sound baseless. And it doesn't sound as if that prognosis is based on watching a play...sounded more like it's based on info relayed to them after the injury occurred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: It just became much more important that we lose tomorrow. Agree. awful for the player, simply awful. Massive impact on the dynamic of the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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