Califan007 The Constipated Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 6 hours ago, Kurd Cudins said: Seriously? Um, could you say that again?...I couldn't hear you over the sound of your signature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onedrop Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 the redskins team itself and the fans are to the greater organization like the local kids that get a bum rap because their parents suck. why would anyone of proven merit or a high potential up and comer WANT to come here? we are living one of the longest, if accidental, experiments in nfl history and the results are obvious. no matter the experience level, personality type or philosophy of the head coach this model fails. even when dan, supposedly, ceded control of the most expensive plaything in the history of the world he did so only relinquishing control to a power hungry egomaniac. whose only real goal is to stay in command by discrediting and disparaging those around him and distracting fans from the inevitable with legacies and shiny baubles. proven coaches know time spent here will likely tarnish their own legacy and it has been proven that young coaches need to move on to gain success or be recognized. it does not work here, nothing does, and there is 20 years of data proving it. the only bait left for coach is the proverbial brinks truck, but once they realize that for all that money they won't be allowed to succeed they'll end up looking just as befuddled and discouraged as jay on the sideline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 100 percent truth. The Skins are a league-wide joke. Owners make fun of Snyder, the league is concerned about what he has done to what was once a league crown jewel. His destruction is truly staggering at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogdirty Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 I believe this narrative that good coaches won't coach for Snyder is weak. As much as fans hate Dan you have to give him some credit for bringing 1 Hall of Fame and 2 border line Hall of Fame coaches to the team. Lets be real with 32 spots to be the head coach in this league the job is highly desirable. I got my eye Kris Richard Bruce is a problem, but no matter how many hashtags people use on social media he will be here until he probably leaves on his own terms. The best we can hope for is getting someone at the HC that can maybe give the team a bunker mentality. Players can go far if they have their coaches back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burger35 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 44 minutes ago, hogdirty said: I believe this narrative that good coaches won't coach for Snyder is weak. As much as fans hate Dan you have to give him some credit for bringing 1 Hall of Fame and 2 border line Hall of Fame coaches to the team. Lets be real with 32 spots to be the head coach in this league the job is highly desirable. I got my eye Kris Richard Bruce is a problem, but no matter how many hashtags people use on social media he will be here until he probably leaves on his own terms. The best we can hope for is getting someone at the HC that can maybe give the team a bunker mentality. Players can go far if they have their coaches back. He’s ruined both opportunities.. no he’s got a stigma now we need to deal with that and understand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogdirty Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Burger35 said: He’s ruined both opportunities.. no he’s got a stigma now we need to deal with that and understand It's understandable for prospective coaches to have reservations but lets be real coaches take these positions knowing the situations and realize they will have work to do. In most circumstances these coaches know they won't inherit a Super Bowl team. What I don't understand from reading the post on this forum are these two narratives regarding keeping Jay: 1) no coaches want to work for Dan & Bruce 2) Dan & Bruce won't find nobody better than Jay. What drives me crazy about thinking this is we will basically have Jay Gruden as the coach FOREVER. Dan will not fire himself or sell the team and lets be real Bruce will not be going anywhere no time soon. There are options for the Skins to find coaches that will come in and work under this front office and will be better than Jay. They just have to clear the way for them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyst Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 People aren’t saying it’s always been this way, but it is this way NOW. The Wade debacle only added to the dysfunction. There was zero reason to hire Joe Barry. It certainly wasn’t for his production. As Wade says, Jay hired his “friend”. Just pathetic. This has been building up for years, but early on it wasn’t as obvious but you could see trigger signs even then. The way Norv, Mike Nolan, Marty, Gregg Williams and Zorn were treated had an affect. Coaches talk and the league took notice. Shanahan, Wade Phillips and to an extent Scott McCloughin only adds to the scenario. If you are a coach, stay away. We don’t just fire guys, we do it extraordinarily by ruining your reputation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, dyst said: The way Norv, Mike Nolan, Marty, Gregg Williams and Zorn were treated had an affect. Coaches talk and the league took notice. Shanahan, Wade Phillips and to an extent Scott McCloughin only adds to the scenario. If you are a coach, stay away. We don’t just fire guys, we do it extraordinarily by ruining your reputation. It's a good point, its been discussed by national reporters on different talk shows over the years which is the NFL is a small knit community -- if a place gets a bad rep, its gets around. JLC talked about that last year relating to the front office situation. If and when Bruce is let go it should help because Dan perception wise at least according to multiple local-national reporters isn't the only problem at Redskins Park -- Bruce to some is an even bigger problem because he insists on control and the idea that he will take on anyone who he sees as a threat for him being the top dog of just about everything isn't a well kept secret. The Lafemina firing just adds to that fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 the above lines of thought also raise the troubling question of do we want the kind of guy who would be willing to take a job like this and work for dan i mean that guy must make the kind of life judgments you hear at your first rehab meetings which reminds me i need a drink hey, that right there would qualify me for a top exec position at the park Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Why would anyone else outside of retreads come here? For a retread, coming here will not tarnish your career. For a Kris Richard or someone young who has some promise, this could kill your career Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 meh. Myth or no myth it is still a fact that no good coaches will be coming to washington next season... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redd Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 I'm still salty we went with Joe Barry instead of Phillips. Wished we let Jay go and promoted McVay to HC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 8 hours ago, Hooper said: 100 percent truth. The Skins are a league-wide joke. Owners make fun of Snyder, the league is concerned about what he has done to what was once a league crown jewel. His destruction is truly staggering at this point. People need to do more to force him to sell the team then. I'm not a big Snyder fan. But I believe he really wants to win. He just doesn't know how. His biggest detractors need to be more vocal. I guess they are speaking by hitting him in the pockets and not coming to the games. But Dan is still sitting in the owner's box. So what can you do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onedrop Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 9 minutes ago, Vanguard said: People need to do more to force him to sell the team then. I'm not a big Snyder fan. But I believe he really wants to win. He just doesn't know how. His biggest detractors need to be more vocal. I guess they are speaking by hitting him in the pockets and not coming to the games. But Dan is still sitting in the owner's box. So what can you do? if one wants dan to sell the team they will need to give up nfl football completely. can't go to games, watch or buy merchandise in any way that can be tracked to the skins market. the nfl stepping in due to lost profits is the only hope, short of a huge scandal of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurgundyBooger Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 The loss of profit thing is overstated. Whatever money the NFL has lost resulting from the Redskins implosion has been more than made up by the resurgent Los Angeles market spearheaded by the Rams and the Chargers, two teams that made the playoffs and helped rejuvenate fan interest in an alpha world city. Face it, we're stuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 15 hours ago, Vanguard said: People need to do more to force him to sell the team then. I'm not a big Snyder fan. But I believe he really wants to win. He just doesn't know how. If he truly wanted to win, he would do things like successful owners do. Dan always does things different. He's never hired a GM who wasn't a complete lackey. He wants to do things his way more than he wants to win. It's undeniable at this point. You don't hire Cerrato twice, then keep Bruce Allen around for a decade if you just want to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 6 hours ago, Hooper said: He wants to do things his way more than he wants to win. It's undeniable at this point. You really might be right about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 who says he wants to win? he hires people who doesn't want confrontation with and someone to be buddy-buddy with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 It used to be the claim that all he wants to do is win. Which was ridiculous. He fired Marty because he's didn't like being out of the decision making. Reality is and always was that he wants to do it his way win or lose. If he's winning he'd be out there soaking up the praise but since he's completely clueless and has been losing for 2 entire decades he has decided to instead hide under a rock. He's the Redskins version of Westbrook36 except he actually owns the team. He still hasn't changed anything, the lackeys all remain in place, and he hasn't sold the team yet either. He's perfectly fine watching the Redskins be garbage if the only alternative is that he GTFO of the way and let the professionals take over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Command The 414 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 On 1/15/2019 at 7:43 PM, hogdirty said: I believe this narrative that good coaches won't coach for Snyder is weak. As much as fans hate Dan you have to give him some credit for bringing 1 Hall of Fame and 2 border line Hall of Fame coaches to the team. Lets be real with 32 spots to be the head coach in this league the job is highly desirable. I got my eye Kris Richard Bruce is a problem, but no matter how many hashtags people use on social media he will be here until he probably leaves on his own terms. The best we can hope for is getting someone at the HC that can maybe give the team a bunker mentality. Players can go far if they have their coaches back. Totally agree..... there’s no doubt a 1st time young coach wouldn’t jump at the opportunity to come here if given the chance; and honestly the charismatic attitude of these young coaches seem to be breathing life into their respected teams and that’s definitely what this team could use Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Snyder's biggest issue is surrounding himself with incompetent yes men. He doesn't have self awareness and has zero critical thinking, outside the box, or creative thinking skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 posted by our beloved amigo, the indefatigable Wildbunny in B&H's BRN http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/38054/mike-shanahan-knew-he-had-something-special-in-his-young-assistants Quote The coaching talent was obvious, but the coaches were just young -- in some cases, too young to even rent a car. But it was a group that helped develop one of the NFL's most dynamic offenses for a season in Washington, and eventually delivered head coaches to three different teams. When Matt LaFleur was hired last week by the Green Bay Packers, he became the third former Redskins assistant coach under Mike Shanahan to be hired as an NFL head coach. One of the others, Sean McVay, is preparing his team for the NFC Championship Game in only his second season with the Los Angeles Rams. Kyle Shanahan just finished his second season with the San Francisco 49ers. Shanahan and LaFleur were fired by Washington after the 2013 season; McVay stayed through 2016, when he then accepted the Rams' job. Each one helped the other, said Mike Shanahan, the Redskins' head coach from 2010 to 2013. regardless of any cred issues with mike one may have, i'm just on "woulda coulda shoulda" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 47 minutes ago, Jumbo said: posted by our beloved amigo, the indefatigable Wildbunny in B&H's BRN http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/38054/mike-shanahan-knew-he-had-something-special-in-his-young-assistants regardless of any cred issues with mike one may have, i'm just on "woulda coulda shoulda" I started with having a mega man crush on Shanny but I lost my esteem for him when the defense for years was not up to snuff. That to me lived up to his Denver reputation for better and worse. But today, I'd take it in a heartbeat. I never had any doubt that the dude was an offensive genius. I still think he's the best offensive coach we've had since Gibbs 1. The sad thing for me is back then I took for granted that Dan for his faults could still attract high caliber HCs whether it was because of him willing to spend money or living off of the franchise's pedigree, etc. Those days are gone at least for now. Heck these days we can't even outdo some of the leagues worst teams in landing defensive coordinators. We've now become what the Cleveland Browns once were -- a widely accepted dysfunctional franchise where in all likelihood you have to reach for the 2nd tier guys if you want coaching or personnel talent. I never thought we'd reach that kind of low. But the idea that you can attract a Shanny type to this team now is laughable. All these people here for example who want Jay gone and dream of greener pastures -- IMO they aren't likely getting the hotter-sexy names they covet let alone if they did said coach wouldn't last in this jungle anyway. For example the idea that Nick Saban would leave his great coaching gig for this franchise is as laughable now as how it would have sounded 2 years ago for him leaving Alabama to coach the Browns. My only hope is listening to some people (JLC among others) explain why the Redskins are so unattractive -- Bruce is a very large part of it. Vinny for his faults was an amiable type and was willing to pay for top talent. Bruce is like scrooge -- he's cheap, will run you down and want to control things -- and that's even before delving into whether you want a politician versus a personnel guy running personnel and can a team succeed with that structure. When I read the except from Adam Schefter saying the Jets wanting Gregg Williams more badly than the Redskins -- my first thought was perhaps Bruce hinted at a cheap deal to Gregg's agent or Bruce's cheap reputation preceded him on that front. I said money could have been part of the narrative back then and just caught Sheehan on his recent podcast pondering the same thing. Some say this cheap streak is about Dan being cash poor. But reading about his multiple yachts, he can't be that cash poor. I do think Bruce has helped turned Dan into being cheap across the board. And that has cost them the key carrot to lure people. The nature of my business gives my opportunities to work for different clients with reputations that precede them. Am never willing to work for a high maintenance client who is cheap. But I have taken on multiple jobs for clients that I knew were difficult but paid well. And most coaches are mercenaries. Gibbs was a unicorn on that front. Guys like Parcells would go from team to team with pay being a big factor. And I think the old Dan, had at least one redeeming value which is that he'd splash the cash. He would pay well at least for some aspects for team building. If he needed to lure a new HC or coordinator and they wanted to reboot the assistant coaches, he'd likely go along even if he had to eat money. You want to go after top FAs -- he'd do that as well. Not today so much. I think the only way out of this hole is fire Bruce and replace him with someone respected around the league -- if its Eric Schaffer fine. I think they can sell at that point that the dysfunction came from Bruce and not from Dan. I doubt anyone would fully believe that (nor would I) but I can bank on Schaffer perhaps using his contacts to lure someone and say look he will have their back and work something into the contract to keep Dan away from meddling too much. My gut is firing Bruce would give Dan one last shot at the well and if he blows that then they are in old school Browns territory for perpetuity unless they get very lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HardcoreZorn Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 People said the same thing when we had to settle for Jim Zorn. Couldn't attract nobody. Then came Shanny. Step off the ledge people, we are one of 32 franchises. There will always be someone out there with the ego that thinks they can turn the ship around and be a hero for a winning starved franchise and city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 45 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said: People said the same thing when we had to settle for Jim Zorn. Couldn't attract nobody. Then came Shanny. Step off the ledge people, we are one of 32 franchises. There will always be someone out there with the ego that thinks they can turn the ship around and be a hero for a winning starved franchise and city. Oh, we will get a coach who is considered a good hire at some point. We have done so before. You're right -- only 32 HC jobs. But as long as Danny is the owner the toxic culture will never change and that coach will fail like all the rest. It's been 20 years of the same thing. Best you can hope for is a random playoff run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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