Miami Herald: I’m done trying to understand Trump supporters. Why don’t they try to understand me?

[hail2skins]

Do you think a lot of voters feel the same way as this guy?

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2021/11/02/virginia-governor-race-reluctant-mcauliffe-voter/6234956001/

 

 

[The 12th Commandment]

I feel a little bit like him.  As a moderate Dem I don't like the far left wing.  I think huge spending, even if they (GOPers) asked for it by spending so much to fund tax breaks on their watch, is not the answer.  Targeted infrastructure with demonstrable results.  That's what I want.

 

The big difference this guy doesn't get, or is ignoring, is motivation.  The left are idiots, but in the interest of helping people they think need help (often in a counterproductive way).  The right are morons who are completely unhinged and seem to want to really punish about half of their fellow countrymen and would happily blow up everything this country has always stood for to do it.  Not even self aware enough to realize they're doing it while they do.

[NoCalMike]

3 minutes ago, KAOSkins said:

I feel a little bit like him.  As a moderate Dem I don't like the far left wing. 

 

The problem is in the current political climate we as a collective, are getting further and further from terms like "liberal" "left" "progressive" "moderate" actually meaning anything of substance.   

 

The right-wing media machine has been so successful over the last 30 years in demonizing "the left" as a collective that it really doesn't matter what you or I, or others consider ourselves.   Joe Biden is being called a communist daily on every network, radio show, and right-wing internet blog.  That is the truth of the matter while you and I can see through that nonsense, obviously the people who can't see through it are the ones that probably would be supporting a guy like Biden who is EXACTLY WHAT THE CENTER-RIGHT/MODERATE/INDEPENDENT voter claimed they wanted.   

 

Next up is policy.  On actual policy, you might be surprised to find out that not just a majority of Democrats (regardless of which type of Democrat) but also a big portion of GOP voters support and actually vote for progressive and progressive leaning legislation in local elections even in red states.  

 

So the logical conclusion is that progressive policy is popular and what the people actually want  more times then not, however the messengers of this policy are so bad at fending off nonsense culture issues every election cycle, that they end up losing elections despite their policy aligning with the majority of the country. 

[TradeTheBeal!]

Just remember, the “nonsense culture issues” come from the far left almost as much as from the GQP

[Larry]

50 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

Just remember, the “nonsense culture issues” come from the far left almost as much as from the GQP

I assume that yes, it is possible to find some place where some Democrat has advocated something really stupid. 
 

But I think, if you want to pull out the "both sides" card, you really need to point at some place where the Dems have actually passed something that you assert is equivalent to, say, making it a criminal offense for a teacher to mention slavery, without also claiming that some racists claim that enslaving black people actually improved them. 

[TradeTheBeal!]

9 minutes ago, Larry said:

I assume that yes, it is possible to find some place where some Democrat has advocated something really stupid. 
 

But I think, if you want to pull out the "both sides" card, you really need to point at some place where the Dems have actually passed something that you assert is equivalent to, say, making it a criminal offense for a teacher to mention slavery, without also claiming that some racists claim that enslaving black people actually improved them. 

Far left does not equate to “democrat”…which should be obvious.

[Busch1724]

Abstract point here and maybe a false equivalency, but just last week PETA (obviously a far left organization) got traction on a story about how "bullpens" in baseball are offensive to cows. PETA thinks they should be renamed. How do these idiots think the right leaning folks (and most sane people) are going to react to that? The left constantly shoots themselves in the foot with type of stuff. A lot of the rest of the party doesn't slam it to put it down. I get not giving it the attention it doesn't deserve, but this is a frustration of those that buy into "cancel culture." The story trends and reaffirms many of the things the right has pre-conceived notions about. 

Edited November 3, 2021 by Busch1724

[NoCalMike]

11 minutes ago, Busch1724 said:

Abstract point here and maybe a false equivalency, but just last week PETA (obviously a far left organization) got traction on a story about how "bullpens" in baseball are offensive to cows. PETA thinks they should be renamed. How do these idiots think the right leaning folks (and most sane people) are going to react to that? 

 

When was the last time PETA had a prominent role on the Democratic platform though?  I think that is the main difference.  Neither party can 100% police the crazies out there, especially with the internet, any and all thoughts/opinions will seep into socierty.  The difference is one party seems to embrace the crazy at every turn because they have long since realized the majority of the country would not vote for any of their actual policy suggestions if said outright to them honestly, where as the progressive policy itself is actually pretty popular.

[Dan T.]

PETA wanted to rename the bullpen the "Arm Barn."  I immediately thought that's what Caps color guy Craig Laughlin, if he did baseball, would call it.

[Llevron]

I don't even consider PETA part of the democratic party at all. I'm surprised anyone does. I generally don't even notice they exist if I'm being honest. 

 

But i mean, equate it to Q and then notice that one of these is accepted by the political party and one isnt. And then notice that these two things are NOT alike and somehow the dems are supposed to answer for it? Seems like horse**** to me. 

[hail2skins]

Just saw this Twitter thread. The person claims to be a never-Democrat, which indicates bias, and in my opinion underestimates how fickle the middle class is (like they won't **** if they have to pay more for stuff), but is a lot of what is said here necessarily untrue?

 

 

[NoCalMike]

8 minutes ago, hail2skins said:

Just saw this Twitter thread. The person claims to be a never-Democrat, which indicates bias, and in my opinion underestimates how fickle the middle class is (like they won't **** if they have to pay more for stuff), but is a lot of what is said here necessarily untrue?

 

 

 

I was ready to give it an honest read through until he started going on on about "elites" vs average folks, as if the GOP is interested in average folks.  They might blather about it during speeches but their policies say otherwise.  So if anything the lesson for Dems is to.....lie more?

[Llevron]

Just now, NoCalMike said:

 

I was ready to give it an honest read through until he started going on on about "elites" vs average folks, as if the GOP is interested in average folks.  They might blather about it during speeches but their policies say otherwise.  So if anything the lesson for Dems is to.....lie more?

 

Its another one of those things like CRT. Telling people the truth doesn't seem to work. Like.....elites? Dens are elites? You just voted for a guy whose net worth is closer to half a billion than it is to a million LOL. Dude defines elite. 

[hail2skins]

7 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

I was ready to give it an honest read through until he started going on on about "elites" vs average folks, as if the GOP is interested in average folks.  They might blather about it during speeches but their policies say otherwise.  So if anything the lesson for Dems is to.....lie more?

The person concluded the thread by opining that Democrats championed middle-class concerns for years and that's why they controlled Congress for so long. It does seem (and maybe I'm wrong) that Dems were in the past more outspoken about immigration and trade issues, having similar viewpoints to Trump. What changed?

[Ball Security]

49 minutes ago, Busch1724 said:

Abstract point here and maybe a false equivalency, but just last week PETA (obviously a far left organization) got traction on a story about how "bullpens" in baseball are offensive to cows. PETA thinks they should be renamed. How do these idiots think the right leaning folks (and most sane people) are going to react to that? The left constantly shoots themselves in the foot with type of stuff. A lot of the rest of the party doesn't slam it to put it down. I get not giving it the attention it doesn't deserve, but this is a frustration of those that buy into "cancel culture." The story trends and reaffirms many of the things the right has pre-conceived notions about. 

Reminds me of a Twitter thread a few years ago from a woman who thought baseball (maybe the Rangers?) was racist because their pitcher record his third strikeout and she saw the unraveling of a third K.  She had no idea what was going on, but was convinced that the Klan was at the game.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

While I'm not sure you can align PETA with the democratic party --- the specific request to rename the bullpen is similar to other issues that get attached to the democrats, like Mr. Potato Head, Aunt Jemima, etc.  Basically any issue revolving around changing something that's been around for a long time because it's been deemed offensive by one group or another is attributed to democrats.  Fairly or unfairly, that's the view.  Why is that?  Because the right wing propaganda folks like Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity, anybody on OAN, all the social media talking heads like Charlie Kirk, etc. rant on and on and on endlessly about this stuff.

 

However, one issue that is strictly part of the democratic platform, that I know for certain many moderates don't really get down with is the entire LGBTQ, trans, pronouns, bathrooms, etc. issues.  Same goes for every issue becoming about race and how someone is racist for thinking this way or that way.  A lot of folks that hang out in the middle, the ones who make and break these tight elections, don't necessarily see eye to eye with the democratic platforms on this kind of stuff and don't appreciate being considered a homophobe or racist because they don't agree with the way dems handle issues for everyone under their tent.

 

And I know, I know - someone is going to chime in and say the above folks ARE racists and/or homophobes because of X, Y and Z.  Which is part of the problem, as those folks in the middle don't see everything that black and white.  Dems need those votes.  There are a lot of folks out there that don't ride with everything democrat, but are repulsed by Trump and any politician like him.  Dems need these people.  How they satisfy everyone under the tent and them, I'm not sure - outside of the opposition trotting out Donald Trump again in 2024.

 

 

Edited November 3, 2021 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[TradeTheBeal!]

I am very much a left-tilting moderate and I find Gender Fluid/T+ lefty Twitter every bit as exhausting and nihilistic as hard Maga Twitter.  And they have a lot more in common with each other than they would ever admit.

[Fergasun]

@hail2skins

@NoCalMike

 

I read that thread, its a bit scary because it seems to indicate that being anti-immigrant and anti-equality are winning issues also anti-mask and anti-mandate. Also the "Trump ended sex traffiking, but Biden stopped that program" claims are bizarre. 

 

Dems switched over on immigration to be non anti-immigrant because it is clear that we need comprehensive immigration reform, not hardline wall building.  But, even intelligent people I know believe immigrants get crazy benefits and scam the system; and argue about the wall.  I also think the pronoun stuff is silly, but who cares if there are some people who have differences I'll never understand.  

 

It's okay to be a an anti-immigrant, anti-LGBTQ as long as you cater to the white middle class?  

 

 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

22 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

I am very much a left-tilting moderate and I find Gender Fluid/T+ lefty Twitter every bit as exhausting and nihilistic as hard Maga Twitter.  And they have a lot more in common with each other than they would ever admit.

Thank you.

 

I feel the exact same.  I was watching a video of the protest outside of Netflix offices over the Chappelle special and just watching them raging out on the few folks counter protesting them made me think of how much they have in common with the maga crowd.

[NoCalMike]

EDIT: Wrong thread

Edited November 3, 2021 by NoCalMike

[Long n Left]

2 hours ago, hail2skins said:

Just saw this Twitter thread. The person claims to be a never-Democrat, which indicates bias, and in my opinion underestimates how fickle the middle class is (like they won't **** if they have to pay more for stuff), but is a lot of what is said here necessarily untrue?

 

 

Really?? This person is hitting every right wing talking point possible, and trying to couch it as “what most people in the US ( middle class) want.” Elites? The true elites are the 1% that control 98% of this nation’s wealth, and vote staunchly Republican because they know the gop will give them tax breaks galore, as long as they continue to fund the gop. This is the cycle that is turning this country upside down. The gop knows money is their road to power and control, so they cow tow to the mostly white super rich that control most all of the money to keep each other in positions of power.

 

IMO, this thread is 90% horse****.

Edited November 3, 2021 by Long n Left

[The Evil Genius]

1 hour ago, TryTheBeal! said:

I am very much a left-tilting moderate and I find Gender Fluid/T+ lefty Twitter every bit as exhausting and nihilistic as hard Maga Twitter.  And they have a lot more in common with each other than they would ever admit.

 

45 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Thank you.

 

I feel the exact same.  I was watching a video of the protest outside of Netflix offices over the Chappelle special and just watching them raging out on the few folks counter protesting them made me think of how much they have in common with the maga crowd.

 

How so? Maga are upset because they want permission to use offensive racial and/or other terms for people and also don't want to be called out for being ****ing morons about subject matter that they blame liberals for.

 

How is that anything like the woke/gender fluidity/Trans/gay rights crowd?

 

I don’t see it. 

Edited November 3, 2021 by The Evil Genius

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

3 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

How is that anything like the woke/gender fluidity/Trans/gay rights crowd?

I

Well for starters, they only subscribe to science and theories that specifically speak to what they want to believe and entirely dismiss anything goes against what they want to believe. They demonize the opposition and tend to be just as close minded as those they oppose.

[TradeTheBeal!]

If your cultural/political identity requires ideological purity and the desire to stifle and eradicate all dissenting position or opinion by any means available…then you are what you have made yourself.

 

I simply sit back and notice the similarities.  Both in ends and means.

 

When a BLM march gets hijacked by anarchists and Proud Boys and devolves into random competing factions beating on each other in the streets for six months…you can pick sides if you want to, but I can’t tell em apart.

Edited November 3, 2021 by TryTheBeal!

[China]

Greenville GOP adds Trump’s signature hair to party logo