Alex Smith Trade Thread (Details Inside)

[bobafett14]

28 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

You have no idea the Hell we have lived through. Alex Smith cannot destroy anything. What is dead can never die. 

 

Imagine if the hell continues and a bunch of demons come around telling you it's heaven and get half the forum on their side.

[CommDownMan]

2 minutes ago, bobafett14 said:

 

Imagine if the hell continues and a bunch of demons come around telling you it's heaven and get half the forum on their side.

 

We know the hell will continue, but stay fans anyway.   Slowly dying inside until we care less.   We have plenty of reasons to be in hell and Smith won't be top 3 anytime soon. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

5 minutes ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

We know the hell will continue, but stay fans anyway.   Slowly dying inside until we care less.   We have plenty of reasons to be in hell and Smith won't be top 3 anytime soon. 

While we know in reality that #1 and #2 have to be Dan and Bruce, they hide in the suite and our fans take out all their anger on the coach and QB.  The only difference is this case is that the folks who are backing this trade for Smith now, I do think will stick with him no matter what happens, and blame Jay, the O-line, receivers, etc.

[PF Chang]

10 minutes ago, Bonez3 said:

Yea- except it's against the CBA. You can't 'hit free agency' under the tag I put on you.

 

So, again, how's Denver sound. Sign here and all your wildest dreams will come true

 

I sign the tag. My agent informs the rest of the league that I won't sign a long term deal with any team that trades for me. Nobody trades anything for me on a 1 year, $34M contract. The Redskins end up stuck with me and I'm happy to pocket $34M for one year and hit FA next year.

 

This is dumb guys. The trade talk is dumb. 

[CommDownMan]

6 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

While we know in reality that #1 and #2 have to be Dan and Bruce, they hide in the suite and our fans take out all their anger on the coach and QB.  The only difference is this case is that the folks who are backing this trade for Smith now, I do think will stick with him no matter what happens, and blame Jay, the O-line, receivers, etc.

 

I don't disagree with this.   My point was related to Smith being a reason to "destroy this board".  

[TK]

19 minutes ago, bobafett14 said:

 

Imagine if the hell continues and a bunch of demons come around telling you it's heaven and get half the forum on their side.

I've got three words for you.

 

 

Cult of Colt.

[Wildbunny]

1 hour ago, WelshSkinsFan said:

Cannot imagine this would have been cool with Kirk as it seems highly likely it as lower offer than the one he refused to counter in the summer.  Whilst we don't know exact details the talk has been that almost all of the guaranteed money in the deal is in the form of injury guarantees and so effectively we can opt out after 2 years.  Kirk specifically referred to the 2 year exit ramp as why he was not interested in previous offers, he wants 3 years or more guaranteed fully at signing. 

4 years extension.

90M

71M Guaranteed.

I really doubt it's a 2 years deal and cut that we offered Alex Smith. That's nearl 80% of the contract that is guaranteed.

No way Kirk would have not signed.

[TMK9973]

11 minutes ago, PF Chang said:

 

I sign the tag. My agent informs the rest of the league that I won't sign a long term deal with any team that trades for me. Nobody trades anything for me on a 1 year, $34M contract. The Redskins end up stuck with me and I'm happy to pocket $34M for one year and hit FA next year.

 

This is dumb guys. The trade talk is dumb. 

BINGO - (Although it will be 28m vs 34m. Transition tag).  Kirk would sign it ASAP.  Meaning the skins cant pull and are now screwed.  No one is gonna trade for KC for 28m for 1 year UNLESS they work out a extension.  And KC has already stated over and over and over he WANTS to hit FA. He has spent the last 2 years betting on himself (really 3) and refusing to sign a LTD because he wants to hit free agency.  You think faced with a "punishment" of sitting on the bench and collecting 28m (While every time Alex Smith makes a bad play fans start chanting for Kirk) will motivate him to give up his 3 years plan of hitting FA??

You are dreaming.  

[UKskins]

3 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

4 years extension.

90M

71M Guaranteed.

I really doubt it's a 2 years deal and cut that we offered Alex Smith. That's nearl 80% of the contract that is guaranteed.

No way Kirk would have not signed.

 

Until we know the terms though, it's not as simple as that. Guaranteed money for injury only is still guaranteed money in the headline figure, but in reality, it's not guaranteed at all. Kirk wasn't signing a deal worth 23.5mill per year. Not for us (or probably anyone else)

2 minutes ago, TMK9973 said:

BINGO - (Although it will be 28m vs 34m. Transition tag).  Kirk would sign it ASAP.  Meaning the skins cant pull and are now screwed.  No one is gonna trade for KC for 28m for 1 year UNLESS they work out a extension.  And KC has already stated over and over and over he WANTS to hit FA. He has spent the last 2 years betting on himself (really 3) and refusing to sign a LTD because he wants to hit free agency.  You think faced with a "punishment" of sitting on the bench and collecting 28m (While every time Alex Smith makes a bad play fans start chanting for Kirk"  will motivate him to give up his 3 years plan of hitting FA??

You are dreaming.  

No way Cousins sits for a year out of spite. None whatsoever. That doesn't help his market value for next year one bit...

[WelshSkinsFan]

Well Kirk said the tag was the starting point for any annual salary when we tagged him last year at $24 million so I am thinking $23.5 million a year would not be entertained at this point with the cap going up.  The big sticking point with Bruce has been that he will not guarantee squat beyond year 2 of a LTD and so the actual guaranteed money in the Smith deal is probably around $47 million, the $71 million being talked about likely includes injury guarantees which are something else entirely.  Kirk was offered north of $50 million in guarantees in the summer and did not even counter so yes I am 100% certain the Smith contract would not have been cool with Kirk or his agent.

 

Not to say we could not have offered Kirk a deal but it would have needed to be in the 5 years $125 million range with $75 million fully guaranteed for the first 3 years to get his attention.  Would have been nice to make the offer just to see what happened but that ship has sailed.

[JSSkinz]

Do we know how much of that $71M is fully guaranteed or are we guessing that the entire $71M is fully guaranteed?

[Llevron]

26 minutes ago, bobafett14 said:

 

Imagine if the hell continues and a bunch of demons come around telling you it's heaven and get half the forum on their side.

 

Seriously - same exact stuff you described happened with Kurt, RG3, McNibble, Colt (brennan, not mccoy), Todd Collins, Jason Candle and I think even John Beck fell into that category. Only guy that was universally loved AND hated was probably the Sex Cannon and even then we all knew what it was lol. 

 

We have seen levels of depravity you cant even imagine!

10 minutes ago, TK said:

I've got three words for you.

 

 

Cult of Colt.

 

This guy gets it

[Tay]

7 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

4 years extension.

90M

71M Guaranteed.

I really doubt it's a 2 years deal and cut that we offered Alex Smith. That's nearl 80% of the contract that is guaranteed.

No way Kirk would have not signed.

 

We know little to nothing about the contract. It could turn out that this is a year to year contract with team options every year.

 

The money over the 71M guaranteed could be "not likely to be earned incentives", which would make the cap hit just over $17M per year.

 

We will learn a lot more about this deal in 6 weeks.

[TMK9973]

7 minutes ago, UKskins said:

 

 

No way Cousins sits for a year out of spite. None whatsoever. That doesn't help his market value for next year one bit...

The guy has made it super clear he wants to hit FA. He has had a 3 year plan of doing just that.  You think hes going to give that up NOW????  

[OVCChairman]

4 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

Do we know how much of that $71M is fully guaranteed or are we guessing that the entire $71M is fully guaranteed?

The report was that the new money was 4 year, $23.5 mil, $71 mil guaranteed.  If we work this right, we could absorb $7 mil of signing bonus money into 2018, which would level out a good bit of that.  Take that and apply prorated bonus of $7 mil per year in signing bonus across next year and the first 3 years of the deal, that's a $28 mil signing bonus. Then it's $14.3 mil in base salary over the 1st 3 years of the contract, having the 4th be a team option.  Kick that out over 3 years, we're actually in a really good place.  That pays a cap hit of $24 mil the 1st year of the deal, then drops the base salary to $14.3 per year with the bonus bringing the cap hit up to $21.3... That would mean we're looking at $2.2 mil per year in incentives, and the team option at the end being worth $23.5, putting us at $94 mil total for the deal

 

2018 - $24 mil

2019 / 2020 / 2021 - base salary - $14.33 / Prorated Bonus - $7

2022 - Team option @ possible $23.5

 

 

You cap guys, is that the way it works, or am I way off? 

[SWFLSkins]

50 minutes ago, NewCliche21 said:

 

How could the host not be that high if Fuller was the cost?

 

It didn't have to be done.  Even with a few days to think it over, I still hate the move.  It's completely short-sighted.  We're not winning the Super Bowl because of Alex Smith.  Losing the best slot corner in the game AND a third round pick will hurt us going forward and delay any Super Bowl victory.  It highlights the incompetence of the front office to get a deal done, to find a real GM, and to swallow their pride when ****ing up.  Philly turned it around in TWO YEARS.  Bruce has been ****ing it up for EIGHT.

 

There's no bright side here.

 

There is always a bright side. Kirk drama is over in D.C. Jay and Bruce are on a shorter leash. Smith is plenty good and should excel with Jay's system. WE have corners, add some DL and you'll forget Fuller being gone. 

 

That's all I got for now. lol. Winning will cure all. Smith has won more than Kirk. 

[UKskins]

6 minutes ago, TMK9973 said:

The guy has made it super clear he wants to hit FA. He has had a 3 year plan of doing just that.  You think hes going to give that up NOW????  

I think that if the choice is taken away from him (which depends on the Skins being able to find a trade partner for a rental) and his options are ride the pine with the Skins and hurt his value for FA that he craves so much, or take the trade, bet on himself again to show up and show out, and increase his value for when he hits that FA market in 2019.

 

It's all hypotheticals and I'm done talking round in circles.... In this specific scenario, if you think Kirk would sit for a year, looking like a spoilt brat and hurting his own value he's worked so hard to build, rather than go somewhere else (considering he damn sure doesn't want to be in Washington anymore anyway) and gamble on himself to increase his value even more then I think you're nuts.... but regardless you're entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine - We'll see how all this plays out, and most likely thing to happen is for him to hit FA but I'm not going to rule anything out - the NFL is a crazy league... I'm going to go do something more productive than debate hypotheticals about Cousins though. 

[bobandweave]

18 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

Do we know how much of that $71M is fully guaranteed or are we guessing that the entire $71M is fully guaranteed?

 

This was just posted

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000913035/article/winners-losers-of-the-alex-smith-trade-kirk-cousins-benefits

 

The writer says that the Redskins did not overpay for Smith, and that the 70 million guaranteed money being discussed was only for injury. He also states that it’s likely the team can cut Smith for performance reasons and not have to pay that much to him

[mistertim]

17 minutes ago, TMK9973 said:

The guy has made it super clear he wants to hit FA. He has had a 3 year plan of doing just that.  You think hes going to give that up NOW????  

 

At the risk of not taking a single snap for over a year? You honestly think that when given this choice between these:

 

1) Sign the tag and get traded to his likely dream team in Denver an get a very nice, but not insane contract there.

 

2) Sign the tag and then go out and get a potentially enormous contract from the Browns or the Jets (though I've seen reports that the Jets may be interested but are wary of his asking price) and go to a perennial bottom feeder that is extremely unlikely to sniff the Super Bowl any time soon.

 

3) Sign the tag and don't go out and look for deals out of spite and literally take zero snaps for an entire year. Come the 2019 season he'd then be a 31 year old QB who hadn't played a single down of NFL football in over a year. Absolutely no way that won't affect his market price...possibly drastically. 

 

You think that he'd actually choose #2 or #3 over the first option? Kirk isn't stupid and neither is his agent. 

[WelshSkinsFan]

He can sign the tag and then we are on the hook for his salary and Alex's salary.  He can choose not to accept a trade until the trade deadline and we will be up **** creek without a paddle because we can't extend our guys, sign free agents or even sign our draft picks with both salaries on the books.  He will eventually take the trade but only after a 4 month long f you tour of DC.  That is the risk.

[SWFLSkins]

47 minutes ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

We know the hell will continue, but stay fans anyway.   Slowly dying inside until we care less.   We have plenty of reasons to be in hell and Smith won't be top 3 anytime soon. 

 

[bobandweave]

The risk of things not working out well for the Redskins if they tag Kirk will keep them from tagging Kirk. Imo. 

 

Sure its possible to tag and trade Kirk at this point, that is possible. But it makes no sense for them to do that and if it’s actually done the team would have only one week to move Kirk or face the possibility they can’t afford Smith and be forced to trade him.

 

What would the Broncos give for Kirk at this point? A very late round draft pick? All they have to do is kick back and wait and give up nothing. Hardly worth it to me to tag him just for a 7th or 6th round pick

 

Just because something is possible it doesn’t mean that it’s likely to happen. If the team was all along looking to trade him then things would have gone down much differently then they have

[UKskins]

1 minute ago, WelshSkinsFan said:

He can sign the tag and then we are on the hook for his salary and Alex's salary.  He can choose not to accept a trade until the trade deadline and we will be up **** creek without a paddle because we can't extend our guys, sign free agents or even sign our draft picks with both salaries on the books.  He will eventually take the trade but only after a 4 month long f you tour of DC.  That is the risk.

Yeah but if he wants his choice of landing spots then that's hardly likely. The Browns will be the ones who bid his contract up - The Broncos are the spot he likely wants to land (excluding Minny if the dump Keenum). Both of those have a top 5 draft pick and they're going to sit on their hands and wait for Cousins because he's too busy playing some petty **** out with Bruce Allen? No way, no how, no chance.

[SWFLSkins]

 

[mistertim]

5 minutes ago, WelshSkinsFan said:

He can sign the tag and then we are on the hook for his salary and Alex's salary.  He can choose not to accept a trade until the trade deadline and we will be up **** creek without a paddle because we can't extend our guys, sign free agents or even sign our draft picks with both salaries on the books.  He will eventually take the trade but only after a 4 month long f you tour of DC.  That is the risk.

 

Obviously it's a risk. I would never say otherwise. Just pointing out that if the Skins really wanted to play hardball and basically go with a "everyone is ****ed now" scorched earth strategy they could likely force Kirk into a trade as I see it incredibly unlikely that he'd be fine with taking zero snaps for an entire year just as a "**** you" to the Skins, considering the damage the whole thing would likely to do his market value in 2019.