A Confidence I Haven't Had in 25 Years

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I think we're all sick of losing.  It's rather apparent in much of the knee jerk reactions and generalizations that run rampant on this very board.

 

What sucks the most, is that for once in my adult life, I actually feel like we have a "team" worthy of being able to take that next step.  Then the pivotal pieces of what made me feel that way started dropping like flies.  What sticks out the most to me is the loss of Allen and the Greek.  We've waited forever to finally draft and develop defensive lineman that make a difference and allow edge rushers to get home.  We also finally have a QB that can move the football and we lose 4/5 of our Oline, and the other 1 is barely standing.  An all pro and a pro bowler/likely to be all pro are in that mix.  I understand injuries happen everywhere but what we've experienced this year is gut wrenching. Then you add in the fact that we were supposed to have a softer schedule and we end up with one of the most difficult in franchise history. It seems like no matter what we do, defeat is inevitable.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

@pjfootballer that's a perfectly legitimate post and opinion. I guess all this comes down to is measuring what we want vs. how do we get it. Your post perfectly describes what we all want...a team that finally takes that next step from competing to contending. We haven't been a contender since 1992. But, even though we can't impact results as fans, my question would be this: What do you think we should/could do differently to make that happen? 

 

Taking that further, do you think changing the coach/QB/whatever in the short-term pushes us closer to that goal? I believe that this coach with this core is our best chance of finally winning 11 games (possibly even more than once). I could certainly be wrong about that. 

[pjfootballer]

Just now, TD_washingtonredskins said:

@pjfootballer that's a perfectly legitimate post and opinion. I guess all this comes down to is measuring what we want vs. how do we get it. Your post perfectly describes what we all want...a team that finally takes that next step from competing to contending. We haven't been a contender since 1992. But, even though we can't impact results as fans, my question would be this: What do you think we should/could do differently to make that happen? 

 

Taking that further, do you think changing the coach/QB/whatever in the short-term pushes us closer to that goal? I believe that this coach with this core is our best chance of finally winning 11 games (possibly even more than once). I could certainly be wrong about that. 

 

I'd like us to stay the course from what Scot started.  But I'm not sure this FO will do that.  I'm not ready to change coaches.  I even said so in the Gruden thread.  While he's not great, he can be pretty good and works well with Kirk.  I'd like to see him hire an OC to call plays.  I think play calling severely distracts him from his head coaching duties.  Maybe we'll have a Tampa situation (Dungy builds, Jon took them home) opposite with this Gruden.  I think this upcoming offseason will be the first "true" test to see if this FO learned anything from Scot.

[LightningBuggs]

@pjfootballer  Could not agree more with your earlier post.

 

For me, the Skins are what they are.  Consistently mediocre overall, once every 5 years on average they get hot, win 5 games in a row to get to 9 or 10 wins, make the playoffs, and then disappoint.  Conversely, every 5 years on average, they're really bad too winning 4-5 games in a season.

 

But I have no delusions of grandeur that this team will ever be strong enough to have a consistently strong season and be able to win 11-12 games.  Not under this ownership and his front office of choice.

 

Unfortunately, this realization and the resulting lowering of my expectations has severed many ties I had to this franchise.  I became a Skins fan with the arrival of George Allen.  Lived and died with their every win/loss.  Put my name on the waiting list for season tickets when I graduated college and was "rewarded" in 2003 for that wait.

 

Now I've quit going to games and only watch them on TV when the weather is lousy and there is nothing else to do.  Their winning or losing moves the needle nada for me now.  

[pjfootballer]

13 minutes ago, LightningBuggs said:

@pjfootballer  Could not agree more with your earlier post.

 

For me, the Skins are what they are.  Consistently mediocre overall, once every 5 years on average they get hot, win 5 games in a row to get to 9 or 10 wins, make the playoffs, and then disappoint.  Conversely, every 5 years on average, they're really bad too winning 4-5 games in a season.

 

But I have no delusions of grandeur that this team will ever be strong enough to have a consistently strong season and be able to win 11-12 games.  Not under this ownership and his front office of choice.

 

Unfortunately, this realization and the resulting lowering of my expectations has severed many ties I had to this franchise.  I became a Skins fan with the arrival of George Allen.  Lived and died with their every win/loss.  Put my name on the waiting list for season tickets when I graduated college and was "rewarded" in 2003 for that wait.

 

Now I've quit going to games and only watch them on TV when the weather is lousy and there is nothing else to do.  Their winning or losing moves the needle nada for me now.  

 

I hear ya.  I'll be 50 in a couple of months.  Saw Allen's last couple of seasons and was indoctrinated under Jack Pardee.  I have NFL Sunday ticket.  I was 51%-49% on renewing it.  I almost cancelled it.  Most games, it's on, but I'm distracted or don't care. 

 

Back then, I couldn't wait until Sunday came, which usually started about Wednesday. I used to get fired up for games, but sadly I can't.  I mean, I still want the team to win, but it doesn't dig deep anymore, when they don't.

 

I guess what I'm saying is, I want to care again.

[kleese]

5 minutes ago, pjfootballer said:

 

I hear ya.  I'll be 50 in a couple of months.  Saw Allen's last couple of seasons and was indoctrinated under Jack Pardee.  I have NFL Sunday ticket.  I was 51%-49% on renewing it.  I almost cancelled it.  Most games, it's on, but I'm distracted or don't care. 

 

Back then, I couldn't wait until Sunday came, which usually started about Wednesday. I used to get fired up for games, but sadly I can't.  I mean, I still want the team to win, but it doesn't dig deep anymore, when they don't.

 

I guess what I'm saying is, I want to care again.

 

I've said this before, nothing has changed for me. Feel the same way about it as I did in the 80's and early 90s. No doubt there have been years (1998, 2003, 2009, 2013) where I check out emotionally pretty early and lose any real excitement for the games by Thanksgiving if not earlier. But overall, it's all the same for me. If anything as I get older, I probably like/appreciate game day more than I did when I was younger. Life is busier now, but I have far less leisure time. For me, the Redskins are a choice-- I have simply chosen to keep them as a major leisure time priority. I think I could quit them if I ever felt it was no longer enjoyable. Life is certainly too short for that. For those that have tuned out, I don't begrudge them a bit-- not worth it if they aren't enjoying it. But for me, it's really not a whole lot different than 1991 to be perfectly honest-- the results are different of course, but my personal experience really isn't other than I understand my team isn't nearly as good now.

[Wildbunny]

7 minutes ago, pjfootballer said:

 

I hear ya.  I'll be 50 in a couple of months.  Saw Allen's last couple of seasons and was indoctrinated under Jack Pardee.  I have NFL Sunday ticket.  I was 51%-49% on renewing it.  I almost cancelled it.  Most games, it's on, but I'm distracted or don't care. 

 

Back then, I couldn't wait until Sunday came, which usually started about Wednesday. I used to get fired up for games, but sadly I can't.  I mean, I still want the team to win, but it doesn't dig deep anymore, when they don't.

 

I guess what I'm saying is, I want to care again.

How much would you think your carelessness belongs to crappy football team and you growing older being an adult and evolving as a person, life, and such (wife, families, kids, work, whatever...)

 

I always find this kind of thinking interesting, because I also had stuff that I used to love and couldn't do without when I was younger, only to get myself out of it as time went by. Lack of novelty, used to it...

 

I'm pretty sure that if you really thinks about it, you'll find out, that in the end, the product on the field, ie the team, has less to do wih you caring less. Should the , team be relevant and contender again, you wouldn't care much because well you've grown up  (Or Miss pjfootballer is ready to kick ya in the nuts if you want to watch football instead of visiting old aunt Molly for the 6th time in 6th sundays...)

[pjfootballer]

12 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

How much would you think your carelessness belongs to crappy football team and you growing older being an adult and evolving as a person, life, and such (wife, families, kids, work, whatever...)

 

I always find this kind of thinking interesting, because I also had stuff that I used to love and couldn't do without when I was younger, only to get myself out of it as time went by. Lack of novelty, used to it...

 

I'm pretty sure that if you really thinks about it, you'll find out, that in the end, the product on the field, ie the team, has less to do wih you caring less. Should the , team be relevant and contender again, you wouldn't care much because well you've grown up  (Or Miss pjfootballer is ready to kick ya in the nuts if you want to watch football instead of visiting old aunt Molly for the 6th time in 6th sundays...)

 

Oh no doubt I've changed as I've gotten older.  Priorities have definitely changed the last 10 years.  No Mrs.  Divorced for a year (not football related ).  Sure it's less important to hinge my life on a football team, but living in Panthers territory, I haven't had much to talk about at the water cooler.  .  I think my interest would be more if we were winning more. But sure, not at the heights it was in the early 80s when I was in my teens.

[MassSkinsFan]

Pfft. Getting older makes you care less about the Redskins? Get off my lawn!!!

 

I'll be 53 on Thanksgiving (and watching us take on the New York NFC team). I spent 1969-1974 in Springfield VA and learned that the Redskins were very important. When I moved away, I kept my interest. As I got older and played football I wanted to be on the Redskins. I wanted to be #50, Washington Redskins, Center. Same in college even after I realized I was giving up 30-70 lbs on opposing DL. I still wanted (unrealistically) to be one of the Hogs.

 

I stayed a fan religiously throughout my early 20s. The only thing that took me away from it was complete and total immersion in music. I was playing shows 2-7 nights a week, recording, touring, etc., in 2-6 different bands at once from my mid-20s to my late 30s. During that time I basically lost connection to popular culture (TV, movies, reading, sports) except for music. Total black hole. Even then, I followed the Skins from afar, catching box scores and highlights whenever I could.

 

Coming out the other side, the first thing I reached for was the Redskins. I've had my disappointments to be sure but I still get a thrill seeing the burgundy and gold uniforms. I still get butterflies right before kickoff. Now that I've been married for 14 years my wife has accepted that the Skins will be on TV or my laptop. That's just how it is unless there is something else vitally important like a death in the family. I still watch the entire game no matter what. Because I am a Redskins fan and plan to be for the remainder of my life.

 

After my Dad died, watching the Skins took on new meaning for me. I'm not religious and don't believe in an afterlife, but I do think about how my Dad would react to the ups and downs we fans experience. He would hate Snyder but not say it out loud. He would get just as wound up as me when we win, and when we lose. He would approve of what appears to be a new emphasis on developing OL and DL. He would hate Dallas probably more now than before. And the Gnats. And Philthy. In a lot of ways it helps keep his memory alive for me. And he would agree with me that there is something different about this year's model - more fight, more commitment, and sadly, more injuries. He'd be proud of this team despite the 4-5 record. Just like I am.

 

[RVAskins]

and the same disappointment I have every year......

[hail2skins]

The performance of the defense over the past month or so is what has gotten me. I know they have had a few injuries, but the performance on that side of the ball against the Vikings, Saints, and tonight.....horrid. No wonder Eli, despite not having anyone to throw to, got benched for only being able to put up 3 against our scrub team. 

[Cooleyfan1993]

I blame this thread for our bad season. You jinxed us!! It was right around the time of this thread that our worst iinjuries started happening too....coincidence? I think not 

 

 

[TheItalianStallion]

These injuries have been INCREDIBLY disheartening. It's SUCH a shame, because this could've been a good year for us.

[kleese]

7 minutes ago, TheItalianStallion said:

These injuries have been INCREDIBLY disheartening. It's SUCH a shame, because this could've been a good year for us.

 

That is pretty much where I am. I was disappointed tonight for sure (I was there). I think there is some legit blame to go around tonight aside from the injuries, but overall we are decimated. Just destroyed by injuries and it absolutely derailed this season. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

5 hours ago, TheItalianStallion said:

These injuries have been INCREDIBLY disheartening. It's SUCH a shame, because this could've been a good year for us.

 

IMHO, I honestly don't think we'd be in any better a situation without the injuries. 

 

We were never that talented to start with. And when you throw in a real poor coaching staff charged with teaching them/ putting them in the right positions to win, you're on a loser from the get-go. They play hard ..... Which should be the BARE minimum of any professional team. But they're still a poor outfit however hard they play. 

 

It just is what is. Another P poor season of losing Redskins football (I say 'losing' already as I can't get down with even middling around .500 when there's patently zero progress going on, however anyone tries to shine it up), where injuries mask other deficiencies to sell you on the following season of 'hope.'

 

Which will doubtless be more of the same. 

 

Hail. 

[Audible_Red40]

Confidence can disappear quickly

[Burgold]

Just now, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

 

IMHP, I honestly don't think we'd be in any better a situation without the injuries. 

We'd have been better, but probably 8-8 better or 9-7 better. When the light shines brightest Gruden wilts. He's not bad at winning do or die games, but he's awful at winning games that put you in a better position.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Just now, Burgold said:

We'd have been better, but probably 8-8 better or 9-7 better. When the light shines brightest Gruden wilts. He's not bad at winning do or die games, but he's awful at winning games that put you in a better position.

 

They might eek out a 7-9 finish as it is.. Or 8-8. 

 

Even if they finished 6-10, the difference is negligible. Consistent mediocrity is still consistent failure however it's excused. Which this year the injuries are affording them. 

 

Hail. 

[Burgold]

5 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

 

They might eek out a 7-9 finish as it is.. Or 8-8. 

 

Even if they finished 6-10, the difference is negligible. Consistent mediocrity is still consistent failure however it's excused. Which this year the injuries are affording them. 

 

Hail. 

I agree. Gruden has wrighted the ship to the degree that it is now borderline mediocre. That's an improvement from God awful which is what we were under both Shanahan and Zorn. It's hardly a lot to be proud of though.

 

I will admit to being somewhat torn about both the front office and coaching in this respect. With all the injuries, they have (excluding yesterday) got players up to speed and found a way to compete, they've also found a way to fail, but to compete, and considering just the o line that could be remarkable. The Redskins have almost done something worth noting, but it's that falling short which leaves such a bitter taste.

[Capt'n Obvious]

30 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said:

 

IMHO, I honestly don't think we'd be in any better a situation without the injuries. 

 

We were never that talented to start with. And when you throw in a real poor coaching staff charged with teaching them/ putting them in the right positions to win, you're on a loser from the get-go. They play hard ..... Which should be the BARE minimum of any professional team. But they're still a poor outfit however hard they play. 

 

It just is what is. Another P poor season of losing Redskins football (I say 'losing' already as I can't get down with even middling around .500 when there's patently zero progress going on, however anyone tries to shine it up), where injuries mask other deficiencies to sell you on the following season of 'hope.'

 

Which will doubtless be more of the same. 

 

Hail. 

 

Agreed. I think sometimes us Skins fans have a tendency to overrate our players. This team is not talented enough even with all of their players healthy. 

 

They have no #1 or #2 receivers on the roster. Doctson can catch all the 12 yard TD's he wants, he is invisible for the most part until garbage time. Crowder is a decent slot receiver, but drops too many balls and shouldn't be allowed to return any more punts as long as he is here. The teams best DL is a rookie that they were gifted in the first round this year, the line has completely fallen apart without him. Phil Taylor wasn't going to be a savior with Allen. I think Norman and Breeland are extremely overrated. Norman has been getting torched all year, I don't care how many peanut punches you attempt, cover the damn receiver you're lined up against. Breeland has turned a couple good games in four years into being consistently overrated. Swearinger is constantly out of position, but because he is in hype videos people think he is a great safety. I won't even get into Pryor, or the teams overall plan at wide receiver heading into last offseason. 

 

Bottom line is the best player is a left tackle, and then the dropoff is steep after that. Trent is the only elite player on this team. Injuries or not, this team would not have won more than nine games anyway. Philly still runs away with the division regardless, and I would not have favored the Skins over any of the teams currently in the playoffs in a playoff game, regardless of injuries.

 

The Skins are who they have been in the last 25-30 years, an embarrassment.

 

[skins island connection]

The only confidence I have is, this team will never be anything more than an 8-8 maybe 9-7 team at best with the current coaching/FO in place.

The entire organization is inept, clueless as to how to properly run and organization, sign/trade players, drafting physical athletes, and coaching that doesn't seem to get it until its too late.

 

If Snyder did actually care, he would take a step back and look at the big picture, and see that failure is running amok through this organization and its affecting everyone, including the ones who put the greenbacks in his pocket.

 

It starts with Bruce Allen, who needs to be fired ASAP. He has done nothing but take a paycheck from the team, and he has ruined every team he's been a part of.

S&T staff; all of them must go. They are flat out not doing their jobs when half the team is injured.

Jay Gruden; I've been wishy-washy with him, but just when he looks like he's making progress, he falls on his face, usually on national t.v. I'm not gonna shed a  tear if he's sent packing.

Cousins; good QB but has no pocket awareness. Could be the playcaller's design, but he does tend to play poorly when the heat is on.

 

I'm pretty much done with this season, and until Snyder makes changes, especially with Allen, it won't get better.

Time to hand out pink slips Dan.

[Csup]

17 minutes ago, Capt'n Obvious said:

 

Agreed. I think sometimes us Skins fans have a tendency to overrate our players. This team is not talented enough even with all of their players healthy. 

 

They have no #1 or #2 receivers on the roster. Doctson can catch all the 12 yard TD's he wants, he is invisible for the most part until garbage time. Crowder is a decent slot receiver, but drops too many balls and shouldn't be allowed to return any more punts as long as he is here. The teams best DL is a rookie that they were gifted in the first round this year, the line has completely fallen apart without him. Phil Taylor wasn't going to be a savior with Allen. I think Norman and Breeland are extremely overrated. Norman has been getting torched all year, I don't care how many peanut punches you attempt, cover the damn receiver you're lined up against. Breeland has turned a couple good games in four years into being consistently overrated. Swearinger is constantly out of position, but because he is in hype videos people think he is a great safety. I won't even get into Pryor, or the teams overall plan at wide receiver heading into last offseason. 

 

Bottom line is the best player is a left tackle, and then the dropoff is steep after that. Trent is the only elite player on this team. Injuries or not, this team would not have won more than nine games anyway. Philly still runs away with the division regardless, and I would not have favored the Skins over any of the teams currently in the playoffs in a playoff game, regardless of injuries.

 

The Skins are who they have been in the last 25-30 years, an embarrassment.

 

Agree 100%.  I don’t know why people say the Skins would be a good team without the injuries when it’s based on very little.  I’m not saying the injuries didn’t hurt the skins.   But the talent on this team is overrated.  And with cousins gone next year - gonna get worse.

[skinny21]

Confidence has taken a big shot.  Future doesn’t look too bright with the impending potential loss of Brown and Cousins.  

 

No one will want to hear this, but I do see some positives.  This was the first game we were absolutely manhandled.  We have some young guys that have stepped up and should continue to grow.  We have some talented players in their prime.  We have some pretty talented depth in certain areas.  Here’s hoping we can manage to take a step forward next year.  Man, that was tough to type after that loss.  

 

 

 

[SkinInsite]

I'd rather lose all remaining games for a better draft than having "moral" victory that screwed us out of good draft position like in the year past.

[cakmoney61]

48 minutes ago, SkinInsite said:

I'd rather lose all remaining games for a better draft than having "moral" victory that screwed us out of good draft position like in the year past.

 

The injuries continued last night with no end in sight so you will probably get your wish.  I would not be surprised at all if they went on to lose the rest of their games.  Concerning the draft, the higher the better, because I think they will have to draft a QB to replace Kirk Cousins.