The 2017 FA Thread - OP Updated with Signings (Sundberg, Galette, VD, Hood re-signed) *** Terrell McClain, Stacy McGee, DJ Swearinger, Terrelle Pryor, Chris Carter, Brian Quick, ZACH BROWN(!!)***

[Dark Acre]

16 hours ago, dyst said:

When I was much younger during the 90s, I use to eat up these type of articles. How the guys were looking at camp, and the new additions were going to add to our team. As I've gotten older, you just realize that none of it matters or is true. It's such a guess work. Kind of sucks....I miss getting excited.

Also, when you (and I) were much younger during the 90s, that was all the news we got.  Kids:  think about what it would be like if there were no internet and you got your Skins news from the newspaper, radio, and TV + the occasional hanging out with local fans at Kilroy's or something. 

[LightningBuggs]

1 hour ago, GothSkinsFan said:

Also, when you (and I) were much younger during the 90s, that was all the news we got.  Kids:  think about what it would be like if there were no internet and you got your Skins news from the newspaper, radio, and TV + the occasional hanging out with local fans at Kilroy's or something. 

 

Funny.  I often think back to my high school days in the late 70s/early 80s out in the Shenandoah Valley.  I used to go to the library at lunchtime to read the Washington Post sports section which, as some will recall, was in a rack on a big wooden stick.

 

I can still remember reading all about the coaching search in early 1981.  When Gibbs was hired, I vividly recall the conversation I had in Algebra II with the guy next to me who was also a big Skins fan.  I told him Gibbs's roots, his offensive philosophy, etc.  Those were the days!

[Morneblade]

6 hours ago, RabidFan said:

 

I think its more of the fact that he's younger and cheaper than Baker (who we know took off plays or went quite for long spurts between dances) and the fact he was a target by Scot and most likely manusky.  Plus the fact that Barry is gone and Tomsula has a proven record on the DL which was our lacking area coupled with Brown a stouter second level LB, people have hope.

 

Not saying we are the reincarnation of the Fearsome Foursome just that Baker is being just as inflated as  you state Magee and McClain are.    We're just on the hope train but at least we luckboxed into Allen so got something great and young and cheap for the DL now and future.  Would love our first next year if not on a QB to be on the DL again.

 

What Baker did last year is McGee's entire career. Except the injuries.

[RabidFan]

7 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

What Baker did last year is McGee's entire career. Except the injuries.

 

Baker wasn't that special and neither was our D.  No one is saying M&M are going to be hard chargers by any means but we saw something in them.  Of course it could go the way of Stephen Paella but we'll see.  I liked Baker but i think we are inflating his play since he's left.

 

Lets hope M&M and the drafted and undrafted D players as a group can create the improvement we need in the front 7.

[Est.1974]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

What Baker did last year is McGee's entire career. Except the injuries.

 

Thing is we didn't want him back. At all. No offer of any kind. Think we should move on.

[HTTRDynasty]

This makes me sad.  If Grant is still on this roster come September, I'll die a little inside.

 

 

[Peregrine]

I think that whether Grant is on the roster really just depends on Davis or someone else.  You have Pryor, Crowder, Doctson, Quick, Harris as locks for your top 5.  If Davis shows hes worth the look, then I think that means Grant is gone.  If he is still here I think its just because no one clearly stepped up.

[DC Lumber Co.]

16 hours ago, Morneblade said:

I really don't know why people are so high on McGee. It's not like he's actually done anything in his career. At least McClain had ONE good season. Which is one more than McGee has had.

					Games		Def Interceptions					Fumbles					Sacks & Tackles
Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Int	Yds	TD	Lng	PD	FF	Fmb	FR	Yds	TD	Sk	Tkl	Ast	Sfty	AV
Career					51	18						2	0	2	3	0	3.0	44	19		11
2013	23	OAK	dt/nt	92	15	5						0	0	1	3	0	0.5	14	6		3
2014	24	OAK		92	11	0												2	2		1
2015	25	OAK	nt	92	16	4						0	0	1	0	0		14	8		3
2016	26	OAK	de/dt/nt	92	9	9						2	0	0	0	0	2.5	14	3		4

 

Didn't you say yourself that stats don't tell the whole story when it comes to the NT position?

 

The reason why I'm personally a little higher on Mcgee than McClain is the idea that he could be a player that is ascending. How quickly he was grabbed at the start of FA backs up that idea. If he was a scrub and his stats told the whole story, I find it hard to believe that our frugal front office made up their own value for his services and overpaid. There had to have been other interest from teams to set his contract figures at what they were or we would have balked and walked away like we have with plenty other free agents (just look at how firm we are on what we think Kirk's value is...)

 

I mean an all-pro linebacker in Zach Brown got a 1 year deal much later in free agency. I think thats pretty telling.

[DC Lumber Co.]

17 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Then talk about nickle corner. You could talk about us having one competent player in the entire secondary. We threw a bunch of resources at it and are hoping for the best. 

 

We haven't done much at NT after averaging half a first down. Maybe thats why.

 

Entire center of the D sucked last year and might again. Talk about whatever the **** you want.

 

Jeez man, lighten up. There were so many things and positions that contributed to our awful defense last season. I'd understand if the team showed zero attempt at addressing that side of the ball, but damn.

 

We fired a defensive coordinator, have 2 new starting safeties, signed an all-pro ILB, signed 2 run stopping DL, signed Phil Taylor, drafted a top 3 DL talent, and spent 70% of our total draft capital on defense to add to any development we get out of young holdovers. 

 

We got considerably better in terms of talent on defense, at least on paper. The team is even getting love from the media outlets for our offseason (one going as far to say that our D could be "nasty" this year)

 

We get that its not the way you would have done it, but shooting down others perspectives and talking down when they contradict your own is pretty ridiculous. 

 

Isn't there plenty of time during the season to be this negative after we lose anyway?

[goskins10]

20 hours ago, Morneblade said:

 

What Baker did last year is McGee's entire career. Except the injuries.

 

What McClain did was almost Bakers entire season in almost 300 less snaps.

 

Baker - 47 tackles - 3.5 sacks - 2 FFs - 782 snaps

McClain - 40 tackles - 2.5 sacks - 2 FFs - 500 snaps

[beachboy757]

Again I don't understand the Ryan Grant hate? He was a 5th round pick that has developed into a backup and ST Player. He is not lazy and seems to be a good teammate. I'm sure every team in the NFL team has a Ryan Grant. Whoever replaces him (if so) will likely have the same role and not be a premier part of the offense. Why is there such a harshness toward him as if he did not live up expectations? The same can be said for Will Compton.

[Koolblue13]

3 hours ago, DC Lumber Co. said:

 

Isn't there plenty of time during the season to be this negative after we lose anyway?

Yeah, which we'll probably do half the time again and a bit reason for that is lack of healthy talent on a Dline.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

5 hours ago, beachboy757 said:

Again I don't understand the Ryan Grant hate? He was a 5th round pick that has developed into a backup and ST Player. He is not lazy and seems to be a good teammate. I'm sure every team in the NFL team has a Ryan Grant. Whoever replaces him (if so) will likely have the same role and not be a premier part of the offense. Why is there such a harshness toward him as if he did not live up expectations? The same can be said for Will Compton.

 

Speaking for myself, I don't hate Grant but I loathe the way he falls down way too much, and at some damn important moments. I prefer Mo Harris over him at this point, Harris seems to have better hands and so far has made a few clutch catches t hat I just don't see Grant making.

 

At this point I don't give a **** about which round they were drafted in...I care about how much I see them on the field and how reliable and productive they are when called on.

[Master Blaster]

23 hours ago, TheGreek1973 said:

I agree with you.  But lets not forget the reason why we were historically bad on 3rd down conversions was because teams run it against us so effectively so by 3rd down they has lest than 4 yards to go to pick up the first down something like 50% of the time.  The entire playbook of an offense is in play when you have less than 4 yards to pickup for a 1st.  If we can stop the run effectively, and these new DL with Anderson setting the edge on the run well, will probably do it, then it releases pressure on your secondary when the other team has to pickup 8 or 9 yards.  Plus Fuller IMO last year was not completely healthy and our SS/FS players we very weak.

 

 

That might hold water water if the team wasn't historically bad on 3rd and long. 

[Cliffmark1]

What is the realistic win total with and without cousins? 

 

I would guess 9-11 wins with KC

 

3-6 wins without KC. 

 

 

Why doesn't he have a deal yet? 

[Momma There Goes That Man]

17 minutes ago, Cliffmark1 said:

What is the realistic win total with and without cousins? 

 

I would guess 9-11 wins with KC

 

3-6 wins without KC. 

 

 

Why doesn't he have a deal yet? 

We are master negotiators, just wait. 

 

We are like the guy buying a house that wants the entire neighborhood to say "he got it for that?!" after he moves in. 

 

When in reality he never gets the house because someone else comes in and offers the market rate for the house and the seller jumps all over it 

[goskins10]

27 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

We are master negotiators, just wait. 

 

We are like the guy buying a house that wants the entire neighborhood to say "he got it for that?!" after he moves in. 

 

When in reality he never gets the house because someone else comes in and offers the market rate for the house and the seller jumps all over it 

 

There is a major flaw with this analogy. We have exclusive negotiating rights. At this point, it is impossible for anyone to come in with a better offer. Hence the name "exclusive franchise tag".

[beachboy757]

1 hour ago, Califan007 said:

 

Speaking for myself, I don't hate Grant but I loathe the way he falls down way too much, and at some damn important moments. I prefer Mo Harris over him at this point, Harris seems to have better hands and so far has made a few clutch catches t hat I just don't see Grant making.

 

I only remember Grant having that one fall down which cost us the Falcons game in 2015 but he bounced back with productive games against the Jets and Bucs the following 2 weeks when D-Jax was out. Mo Harris had a critical fall down as well against the Giants but I do agree with you that he can probably make some catches Grant cannot make due to his size.

[Conn]

Harris has already made more clutch 3rd down/sideline receptions in one season as a noob than Grant has made after years in this offense with this QB. 

[skinny21]

Overall, I'm thinking we should be better on dline than we were last year.  Of course, that's not necessarily saying much.  

 

I think it's pretty reasonable to assume that McClain, McGee and Allen are better than Baker and RJF.  Ioannidas and Hood should look better this year as well (assuming they stick to DE).  

 

Taylor (or one of the other guys vying for the NT position) should be an improvement over Golston/Hood/Ioannidas.

 

With a slightly different scheme (more A gap blitzes for instance), Tomsula 'coaching them up', and better players behind them... I'm expecting a significant change in dline play.  Maybe not great, or even good, but certainly better than we saw last year.  

 

Actually, the more I look at things, that general evaluation applies to all the other defensive positions as well - at least somewhat improved talent, better scheme/coaching/communication, and help from the other unit's improvement.  

 

I'll be surprised if this D reaches the level of 'nasty', but improving at every unit, plus coaching, should have a big net effect.  

[skinny21]

Much like Doughty, Golston, etc., Grant probably gets a bit more flack than he deserves.  

 

Of course, the combination of Gruden's love for him, his lack of plays, and the fact that he was a tell for our run game (though not his fault), makes it hard to care feel good about him.  The slip against the Falcons has probably outshone his positive play, so that doesn't help either.  This is his last year to show something, IMO, and I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt given he's still young and likely to be our 5th-6th receiver.  

[HTTRDynasty]

It's not just the slips that have me low on Grant.  I mean, Harris had a huge slip against the Giants in our Week 17 game last year that led to a Kirk INT.  You expect that out of rookie WRs.  The difference between the two is that we've had 3 seasons to see what Grant is, and it's not pretty.  He's still making the same idiotic mistakes that rookie WRs make, and he doesn't have any plays where he flashes special ability that makes you want to look past those mistakes.

[Thinking Skins]

1 hour ago, skinny21 said:

Overall, I'm thinking we should be better on dline than we were last year.  Of course, that's not necessarily saying much.  

 

I think it's pretty reasonable to assume that McClain, McGee and Allen are better than Baker and RJF.  Ioannidas and Hood should look better this year as well (assuming they stick to DE).  

 

Taylor (or one of the other guys vying for the NT position) should be an improvement over Golston/Hood/Ioannidas.

 

With a slightly different scheme (more A gap blitzes for instance), Tomsula 'coaching them up', and better players behind them... I'm expecting a significant change in dline play.  Maybe not great, or even good, but certainly better than we saw last year.  

 

Actually, the more I look at things, that general evaluation applies to all the other defensive positions as well - at least somewhat improved talent, better scheme/coaching/communication, and help from the other unit's improvement.  

 

I'll be surprised if this D reaches the level of 'nasty', but improving at every unit, plus coaching, should have a big net effect.  

 

Why are you dismissing Ioannidis as a potental NT? I can't see how he gets into the rotation at DE where we have so many bodies going for a spot (McClain, McGee, Allen, Hood, Lanier). I figure those top 3 are locks to make the roster with Hood as a real possibility. Lanier's probably on equal footing with Ioannidis, but is better suited for DE. Ioannidis has the strength and potential to play NT and my guess is that he's the one that's most likely going to be the starter there unless Taylor returns to form or one of the young guys improves above their history. 

[HTTRDynasty]

 

[Conn]

I wish we knew what Ionnidas weighed right now.