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The immigration thread: American Melting Pot or Get off my Lawn

Burgold

By Burgold
in The Tailgate

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bearrock

bearrock

Posted
Posted

I thought all damn illegals were taking jobs from Americans? Btw, if people are ****ing about missing 15k guest workers, how many more guest worker permits are we going to issue after millions are deported?  I'm no economist, but shrinking the size of your population by a few percent may not be such a hot idea. :rolleyes: 

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Larry

Larry

Posted
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1 minute ago, bearrock said:

I thought all damn illegals were taking jobs from Americans?  

 

They are.  

 

But, lots of businesses business plans are built around the assumption that they can pay their workers less than what it would take to get Americans to do the work.  

 

Whether that's a good idea or not, in the long run, I think can at least be debated.  (And I'm not really sure I'm qualified to be part of the debate.  But I think I'm qualified to sit in the audience and maybe form an opinion.)  But at least in the short run, a whole lot of people have made decisions based on the assumption that the current system would continue.  

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bearrock

bearrock

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Larry said:

 

They are.  

 

But, lots of businesses business plans are built around the assumption that they can pay their workers less than what it would take to get Americans to do the work.  

 

Whether that's a good idea or not, in the long run, I think can at least be debated.  (And I'm not really sure I'm qualified to be part of the debate.  But I think I'm qualified to sit in the audience and maybe form an opinion.)  But at least in the short run, a whole lot of people have made decisions based on the assumption that the current system would continue.  

 

One thing we have to consider is that at above a certain price point, the job opportunity would no longer exist.  For example, the crab picker in MD.  If they have to pay their pickers high enough of a wage to entice Americans to do the job, it is entirely possible (I would even argue likely) that the cost of picked crabs would go high enough that people would simply consume less picked crabs or source it from overseas.  

 

Same with office cleaning.  Suppose office cleaning becomes twice what it costs now due to labor costs.  You could foresee lot of offices changing their cleaning schedule to clean every other day or once a week, whatever.  

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Larry

Larry

Posted
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1 minute ago, bearrock said:

 

One thing we have to consider is that at above a certain price point, the job opportunity would no longer exist.  For example, the crab picker in MD.  If they have to pay their pickers high enough of a wage to entice Americans to do the job, it is entirely possible (I would even argue likely) that the cost of picked crabs would go high enough that people would simply consume less picked crabs or source it from overseas.  

 

Same with office cleaning.  Suppose office cleaning becomes twice what it costs now due to labor costs.  You could foresee lot of offices changing their cleaning schedule to clean every other day or once a week, whatever.  

 

It's certainly a possibility.  (You like that contrast?  "Certainly" and "Possibility"?)  

 

But yeah, raise the price of labor, and the employer's decisions change.  Raise the minimum wage, and suddenly getting a robot to make the sodas at McDonald's becomes more attractive.  Some jobs that used to be lost to immigrants, instead get lost to automation.  

 

Or, if automation is too expensive, then maybe what happens is that that industry simply isn't economical to run in the US any more, and the industry simply goes away.  

 

No doubt, a US economy without immigrant labor would be different.  Better is a whole lot tougher to predict.  

 

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Corcaigh

Corcaigh

Posted
Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, visionary said:
 

 

There needs to be a serious investigation into ICE and CBP and their practices, and anyone who knew about this stuff and covered it up.

 

 
 

 

There is an element within ICE and CBP who are aggressive toward legal immigrants and legal aliens as well.

 

I didn't experience anything remotely resembling abuse but intimidation is part of their MO. On several occasions an asshole sitting in his leather chair at Dulles or JFK challenged the legality of my visas and I was threatened with refused entry. 

 

They'd make statements that weren't true ... such as "that's not valid visa." All I was able to do is play 'tennis' with the asshole and reply "it was issued by the US Embassy in London on 'date'; and is valid for employment". On a couple of occasions their supervisor came over to check on the delay and waved me through. One time my whole family including our elementary school age kids were told to wait in a room for 30 minutes until the supervisor questioned us and waved us through.

 

This was with someone who lived here, owned a house, and passed through immigration every few months.

 

Their ****ing job is to inspect your documentation to confirm that it is valid. Not play games and try to intimidate.

 

I was also lied to by officials during the permanent residency immigration process, telling me after waiting for half a day for an appointment that my paperwork was invalid and that I would need to come back another time. Again, the response is to be polite and tell them that your immigration attorney has checked everything as valid and tells me it's complete and can you get your supervisor here to review this. Then the response is, "well I'll send it off for processing, but they'll probably return it to you."

 

 

Edited by Corcaigh
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Burgold

Burgold

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Posted

Just following orders has never been a good excuse for committing monstrosities. The United States under Trump is becoming a monstrous country. Deeply saddened by this use of separation of parents and their children as well as the subsequent alleged torture of said children.

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twa

twa

Posted
Posted
On 5/25/2018 at 11:41 AM, Llevron said:

How the **** you misplace 1500 kids? 

 

I would imagine it is mostly teens running away from foster homes ect.

Whole lot more than that drop out of sight all the time

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visionary

visionary

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

 

 

We should keep in mind that bad things are happening both with children taken from their parents after crossing together, and those coming across the border on their own (the later of which is not new).  Also recent stories have focused on people arrested after crossing over illegally.  I'm wondering about the treatment of families that come here legally the past few years and end up losing their legal status for one reason or another.  

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tshile

tshile

Posted
Posted

I’m confused as to what lost means

 

are these kids wandering around the country unaccounted for, or someone took them?

 

or are we unable to state where they are because we cannot contact the people they were given to?

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