Film Breakdown: RG3 vs Cousins vs McCoy (400+ GIFs)

[Jumbo]

Wow...You just made me realize I ....don't have a QB.

 

Do I need one?  I was just going to wait and see who plays well.

 

I would like to see that breakdown as well.

 

Just for the record, it was their (anyone's) "QB take",  not "their QB."

 

Rather important difference (on ES).

[Aireskoi]

there's a defender underneath and another over top of Reed. the ol is awful and not worthy of trust. The right side is being pushed into the center of the pocket right away. RG3 rolls right because he has receivers on that side he can throw to or he may have the option to run if the receivers stay covered. Once he rolls out he can still hit receivers. QBs rollout all the time, especially when the pocket collapses right away. RG3 has flaws but this seems like stuff being twistead to fit a predetermined conclusion.

 

Running toward the pressure is not good.  I would have to ask you, if he moved to his right to look for targets, then why didn't he consider his check-down?

 

The answer could be that he didn't see him because he was busy sprinting right and the back was coming from the left, but he should at least know the back was running his route into that area.

 

He's no longer under any pressure, but doesn't become a passer again?  The defenders are on the ground.

 

 

 

 

Just for the record, it was their (anyone's) "QB take",  not "their QB."

 

Rather important difference (on ES).

 

Yeah, I definitely read that wrong. lol

[elkabong82]

I disagree with this analysis completely. I'd explain, but the two pictures do a perfectly good job of explaining.

yes because pictures tell the whole story, no need for video. The two pictures do a perfectly good job showing the mental gymnastics people will go through to cram the square peg of their predetermined opinion into the round hole of reality.

[elkabong82]

Running toward the pressure is not good. I would have to ask you, if he moved to his right to look for targets, then why didn't he consider his check-down?

The answer could be that he didn't see him because he was busy sprinting right and the back was coming from the left, but he should at least know the back was running his route into that area.

He's no longer under any pressure, but doesn't become a passer again? The defenders are on the ground.

look at your earlier pics. The pocket is being collapsed before the checkdown has even gone past the LOS. Plus, iirc there wasn't much time left at the end of the half so a checkdown May have been a bad decision. This is where video is needed or pics that show down, distance, time left, etc. so the situation is fully understood.

When he rolls out all receivers are covered and defenders have backs turned, and he's got plenty of room to run. Some of you are just looking at a pic, seeing Reed without a defender right on him, and assuming he's open. You aren't factoring in time and space.

2nd photo of previous post with reed, the defender is right underneath him when he's cut into the end zone. Even an anticipation throw would risk being picked with the defender underneath sitting on the route, and a QB can read that pre snap and quickly post snap. You all assume RG3 roll out was panic, yet don't even consider that it was reading the D and reacting, even though his decision gave him running room for a TD, and that is the play iirc where he rushed for the TD but the refs took it away.

There definitely are plays where RG3 didn't do well, but this isn't one of them. In fact he showed progress when he came off the bench and he still has highest ceiling of any QB on roster, even though I'll root for whoever as long as we are winning.

[Skins Wingman]

Running toward the pressure is not good.  I would have to ask you, if he moved to his right to look for targets, then why didn't he consider his check-down?

 

The answer could be that he didn't see him because he was busy sprinting right and the back was coming from the left, but he should at least know the back was running his route into that area.

 

He's no longer under any pressure, but doesn't become a passer again?  The defenders are on the ground.

 

i agree with some of your points, but if he holds on to the ball and scores a td, are we even talking about this play?  i do agree tho that there was no need to bail on the play.  if anything, he should have gone left, away from the pressure and he would have had days to throw.  i dont like the play call tho.  everybody just run straight into the endzone and turn and look for the ball.  the giants drop 7 into coverage for our 4 receivers.  reed is open for about half a second and since he doesnt pull the trigger, the endzone gets crowded too fast. im not sure what else he could have done except slide left and buys enough time for someone to get open.  but, he makes a play and unfortunately loses the ball.

[Tsailand]

yes because pictures tell the whole story, no need for video. The two pictures do a perfectly good job showing the mental gymnastics people will go through to cram the square peg of their predetermined opinion into the round hole of reality.

 

He is open in the pictures and he is open in the video.

 

This is the difference between "college open" and "NFL open".  You are looking for the defender to fall down, or forget to cover a guy, or bite on a double move.  A NFL QB needs to be able to see that even if the defender is close, he won't be able to make a play on the ball.

[Fat Stupid Loser]

yes because pictures tell the whole story, no need for video. The two pictures do a perfectly good job showing the mental gymnastics people will go through to cram the square peg of their predetermined opinion into the round hole of reality.

They show a Pop Warner pop pass over the middle to a wide open receiver calling for the ball. Touchdown. Then it shows that if he had stayed in a solid pocket for 1 more second he could have hit same receiver wide open, calling for the ball in the middle of end zone.

These are the type of plays (many, many, many) that keep getting him benched and continue the QB controversy crap that I continue to allow myself to be drug into. Jumbo is right. There is nothing new to be said. There just isn't anything else to talk about.

[Tsailand]

This is right before RG3 crosses the line of scrimmage (the 8).  If he pulls up here, it's an easy TD toss to Reed.

 

[Hail2TheHogs]

Reed isn't open in the first pic. He's open a little while before the pic is taken, maybe (depends on if Reed is even looking for the ball to be thrown to him). The defender has reacted on that route and is moving to Reed's area.

Second pic the line has already been pushed back and he rolls out. Could have rolled to the left and picked up some yards that way, not to where the pressure was coming from.

[Aireskoi]

yes because pictures tell the whole story, no need for video. The two pictures do a perfectly good job showing the mental gymnastics people will go through to cram the square peg of their predetermined opinion into the round hole of reality.

 

It's a way to pause the video.  It's not like everyone can't access the whole gif on page 1.

 

This last pic I posted shows he was not looking for anyone to throw to during his roll out, as the back was open for a TD.

 

You could say the Defender that is on the "S" on the painted Giants in the end zone is covering him, but if he's on the back then who's on Reed?

 

I want to re-post the pic here, but I want to post for the next week more.  It's post 52.

[mcsluggo]

i watched some of RGIII and KC gifs... the thing that jumps out at me for MOST of the "bad ones" is that in both of their cases the pocket is collapsing before you even start 2-mississippi.   Joe Montana would look like **** in that situation.   

[Jumbo]

i watched some of RGIII and KC gifs... the thing that jumps out at me for MOST of the "bad ones" is that in both of their cases the pocket is collapsing before you even start 2-mississippi.   Joe Montana would look like **** in that situation.   

 

 

No he wouldn't, to anything near the same degree. I saw him deal with amazing rushes. I watched many of his games live. Nor is Rg3 or anyone else we have to be mentioned in the same breath. Yes, the protection is very bad for all our QBs.

[mojo]

i watched some of RGIII and KC gifs... the thing that jumps out at me for MOST of the "bad ones" is that in both of their cases the pocket is collapsing before you even start 2-mississippi. Joe Montana would look like **** in that situation.

I don't consider those "bad ones". That's not on the QB. What I consider "bad" are the countless times RG has time and hesitates causing either a sack or incompletion.

[Peregrine]

I think KC has shown he has the talent to be a top 5 QB in the NFL.  IF he can get over the turnovers and learn to handle pressure better.  Thats why I really didnt like the way Gruden handled things last year.  The best QBs in this league have gone through growing pains, but what you want is a guy who can put up crazy numbers when you need it in crunch time.  To get there, you have to endure some of the pain and deal with turnovers.  A guy who throws 4 TDs and 2 INTs is better than a guy who throws 0 TDs and 0 INTs.  KC had 3 great games, and 2 bad ones, and that was all it took.  

 

Further, if you look at his numbers, he is ridiculously good in his first 20 throws.  Only 1 of his interceptions came in his first 20 throws, its only once he gets to 30 and 40 throws that he starts throwing picks.  Give him an offensive line, and a defense that doesnt allow 34 points a game, and you may have something there...

[amm0409]

Running toward the pressure is not good.  I would have to ask you, if he moved to his right to look for targets, then why didn't he consider his check-down?

 

The answer could be that he didn't see him because he was busy sprinting right and the back was coming from the left, but he should at least know the back was running his route into that area.

 

He's no longer under any pressure, but doesn't become a passer again?  The defenders are on the ground.

 

 

This is right before RG3 crosses the line of scrimmage (the 8).  If he pulls up here, it's an easy TD toss to Reed.

 

 

So this is the play that he decides to run in for a TD, becomes a WR, gets two feet down, ball crosses the plain, but when he hits the ground, the ball comes loose and it became a touchback, smh..... "questioning his decision/ coulda woulda shoulda" His making a football play, cant complain there. 

 

By the way, from both pic's (both quotes), looks like if he did decide to throw the ball while deciding to run and jump in for a TD, he would have to decide to A) run it in or throw across his body in the opposite direction? hmmm...

 

"The Megatron Rule" because of that "decision" he made, will he continue to make that same "decision", I guess we will see.

[Boss_Hogg]

this thread should be stickied. 

 

All three of our QBs struggled, but the one constant was the ****ty play at RG and RT. Holy smokes those guys are bad. 

[Hooper]

Based on everything.

 

Why do people defend Cousins? What leg do they stand on? The picks? The horrible record? The "beta" attitude? Real head scratcher for me.

 

Griffin will beat him in camp, like a drum and he still has a long way to go, says a TON about Cousins to me.

 

Who knows? By several accounts, Cousins beat RG3 like a drum in camp last year. I think if it happens again this year, Jay might hand the job to Cousins. In fact, I think unless RG3 shows substantial improvement in camp and preseason, Kirk will be the opening day starter.

[Tsailand]

So this is the play that he decides to run in for a TD, becomes a WR, gets two feet down, ball crosses the plain, but when he hits the ground, the ball comes loose and it became a touchback, smh..... "questioning his decision/ coulda woulda shoulda" His making a football play, cant complain there.

 

He needs to do less "making football plays" and more making QB plays.

 

Reed comes open immediately from on that play, before RG3 starts running. 

 

Near the end of the play, but before RG3 crosses the line of scrimmage, the throw to Reed isn't really across his body, because Reed is on the right side of the endzone, moving towards the corner.

[ThomasRoane]

Robert was at a disadvantage from the get go coming from the zone-read system at Baylor.  It's not doing Bryce Petty any favors either.  I hope the Eagles mortgage their future for Marriotta cause they'll be making a mistake too.  And before people jump on the Eagles for their numbers show me a playoff win and then I'll be impressed. Most of these QB's are struggling because they can't get passed that first read.  That's where Kirk has an advantage.  Kirk's issue is making the transition to reading a defense post-snap.  Teams jump from one coverage to another and surprise him. 

 

Here's a good article based on what experts are saying about the crop of QB's this year (Mayock being one who has been right on the money with his draft analysis in the past). 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000462455/article/senior-bowl-quarterbacks-struggling-with-transition-to-nfl-level

 

I think in the future the best bet is to build a solid team.  Take a QB in the lower rounds and then there won't be the pressure to play him right away so he can learn how to be an NFL QB.  Colleges are doing these kids no favors at all.  These kids are struggling making hand offs from under center for crying out loud!

[amm0409]

He needs to do less "making football plays" and more making QB plays.

 

Reed comes open immediately from on that play, before RG3 starts running. 

 

Near the end of the play, but before RG3 crosses the line of scrimmage, the throw to Reed isn't really across his body, because Reed is on the right side of the endzone, moving towards the corner.

My opinion, I want everyone on my football team "making football plays"

 

No matter how we dissect that picture, his eyes are set on one thing.... A Touchdown. 

 

Isnt across his body.... Reed is to the upper left, while RG3 is in the bottom right. In addition, RG3 is turning his body towards the cone with his eyes looking at that right corner.   For Reed to be straight ahead, Reed would need to be in the middle of the NY logo, does that matter?  No it doesn't, but any throw to the left of that is across the body. Even at the end of the play, Reed is to the left of him. 

 

I interpret a QB who is right handed and makes a throw to his left is across his body. 

 

Even rolling to the left, throwing to an open WR to the left is across your body. What is worse?  Rolling to the right and throwing to the left.  Some would say, "that's an awful play"

 

Now, we can debate this one play all day long, but in the end I am comfortable with RG3's decision in that one particular play.  Will that decision be different next time, will he think about that?  Probably so, cause the Megatron Rule kind of stinks. 

 

When he first made that TD before it was reversed, did you not see the impact it had with not only the players, but the sidelines?

[Thirtyfive2seven]

I'm sorry but RGIII does not know how to anticipate his throws.  He never releases the ball before his receiver breaks on certain routes.  Heck, in the screencaps above he has Reed open for an easy touchdown and instead decides to run.  Then while he's running he has another open receiver and still doesn't deliver the ball.  His drops are messy to say the least and he doesn't seem the entire field well.  Cousins to me is much further along but if you want RGIII to develop you need to leave him in there.  Playing Colt did absolutely nothing and made no sense at all.  I could see playing Cousins again but not Colt.  I guess Gruden wanted to see what he had with each QB.  

The good news to me is that the Redskins finally have a GM and if things go south he can find the next coach.

[Bonez3]

Went through some of RG3s scrambles and found in nearly each one he had open options just prior to breaking LOS.

Alot of them actually showed fairly decent pocket presence, one of the things I blasted him for all year without mercy.

So, hopefully this can be coached into him, the idea of dumping off prior to breaking LOS. The guys seemed easily open without needing complicated throw and all would have gained equal amount.

I just wouldn't throw towel in yet. I think Robert's biggest growth this year has to be eyes down the field. The scrambles I watched he was committed to run from the start.

[Fat Stupid Loser]

 

 

I think in the future the best bet is to build a solid team.  Take a QB in the lower rounds and then there won't be the pressure to play him right away so he can learn how to be an NFL QB.  Colleges are doing these kids no favors at all.  These kids are struggling making hand offs from under center for crying out loud!

 

I agree. Colleges are in the business of winning college football games though, not grooming QBs for the NFL. What beats a sophomore CB from North Texas doesn't beat NFL defenses, except for maybe ours.

[amm0409]

I'm sorry but RGIII does not know how to anticipate his throws.  He never releases the ball before his receiver breaks on certain routes.  

 

One throw I can remember was, 2012 against Dallas to Santana Moss for a TD.  The throw was delivered before Santana made his break, it was anticipated.  So RGIII has shown he can anticipate his throws.

[SkinsFTW]

Yeah if you watch even just the New Orleans game from 2012, which was his first in the league, you'll see RG3 doing things you don't see him doing at all in 2014. It's like he either stopped listening to his coaches or they just stopped teaching him or he is displaying a different form of shell shock than Kirk Cousins when he starts throwing those INT's.

 

I don't think he's been the same since the Seattle playoff game. On his first snap in 2013 it was obvious that he wasn't the same dude. We all said, or wanted to believe, it was his leg but according to everybody his leg was 100%. Maybe RG3 just got Ramsey'd which really he did to himself by not voluntarily leaving that game with us up 14-0 and giving Cousins a high probability of winning that game.