Obamacare...(new title): GOP DEATH PLAN: Don-Ryan's Express

[PleaseBlitz]

4 minutes ago, Corcaigh said:

FoxNews leads with the decision of the Supreme Court NOT to take a case on concealed carry.

 

Lower billing is given to the CBO Report: Health bill will cut deficit, boost number of uninsured

 

Boosting the uninsured doesn't sound as bad as increase the uninsured by more than 20 million.

 

 

 

 

It's just Trump's way of giving them a boost.  Like this:

 

[mistertim]

4 minutes ago, Corcaigh said:

FoxNews leads with the decision of the Supreme Court NOT to take a case on concealed carry.

 

Lower billing is given to the CBO Report: Health bill will cut deficit, boost number of uninsured

 

Boosting the uninsured doesn't sound as bad as increase the uninsured by more than 20 million.

 

 

 

 

Haha. "This just in: Man in alley aggressively massaged by bullet until CNS activity ceases"

[Corcaigh]

1 minute ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

It's just Trump's way of giving them a boost.  

 

 

"Hey insured, can I give you a boost?"

 

You'd have to be rude, or even an asshole, to refuse such a kind offer.

 

 

[visionary]

 

 

 

 

 

[visionary]

 

 

 

 

Edited June 26, 2017 by visionary

[mistertim]

At least Collins has the guts to say "No" as opposed to people like McCain who has simply said it "doesn't look good" which echoes his consistent wishy-washy comments about being "concerned" or "disturbed" by every single new ridiculous revelation about the Trump WH, without actually taking a stand.

 

Seriously, when did this guy become so milquetoast? Or has he always been this way but was just really good at talking about how much of a "maverick" he is?

Edited June 26, 2017 by mistertim

[visionary]

 

[NoCalMike]

It seems like every time the bill fails to be brought up for a vote, they go back, work on it, and come back with something worse.

If there was any interest by the GOP in actually making ACA/Obamacare work, they could win a lot of people over by working on a solution.  Instead it has merely been about getting rid of Obamacare, because at least half of the holdouts on the bill think it isn't awful enough of a bill.

 

I suppose if Obamacare is going to be known historically for anything, it is going to be jump starting the conversation about universal health care, because I believe it's only a matter of time before that is looked at as an alternative option.  That is what most Americans want.  They might not like the term "Gov't run healthcare" that the GOP will keep pounding into their heads, but the concept of Medicare for all is something the majority seems to want when polled.

 

 

[TheGreatBuzz]

Do we think this forum can handle an adult conversation on where the line is for when to spend money trying to fix someone and when to "let nature take its course?"  Or will Death Panels be brought up immediatly?

 

I could be talked into some form of single payer or something like that but I take a pretty hard line approach as to what should be fixed and when someone should just be made comfortable.  I was going to start a thread a while back but was advised against it.

 

On a different note, one thing I will give the military is the lack of wasting time.  My wife went in for a lump by her boobs.  She expected her appointment to just be for a consult.  Then possibly a few follow ups, maybe a biopsy, then possibly surgery down the road.  She went into her first appointment, the docter poked her a few times, laid her down and cut it out.  It was sent out for tests and came back fine but she couldnt believe they did surgery without a million pre-appointments.  I wonder how much money we waste on consults.

[mistertim]

30 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Do we think this forum can handle an adult conversation on where the line is for when to spend money trying to fix someone and when to "let nature take its course?"  Or will Death Panels be brought up immediatly?

 

I could be talked into some form of single payer or something like that but I take a pretty hard line approach as to what should be fixed and when someone should just be made comfortable.  I was going to start a thread a while back but was advised against it.

 

On a different note, one thing I will give the military is the lack of wasting time.  My wife went in for a lump by her boobs.  She expected her appointment to just be for a consult.  Then possibly a few follow ups, maybe a biopsy, then possibly surgery down the road.  She went into her first appointment, the docter poked her a few times, laid her down and cut it out.  It was sent out for tests and came back fine but she couldnt believe they did surgery without a million pre-appointments.  I wonder how much money we waste on consults.

 

I'm amazed she let him do that. No way in hell would I get surgery without thoroughly understanding why it was necessary and what the full diagnosis was and likely not without getting a second opinion.

[TheGreatBuzz]

8 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

I'm amazed she let him do that. No way in hell would I get surgery without thoroughly understanding why it was necessary and what the full diagnosis was and likely not without getting a second opinion.

I get that opinion. But flip side of the coin, is that part of why costs are so ridiculous?

Edited June 27, 2017 by TheGreatBuzz

[mistertim]

18 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

I get that opinion. But flip side of the coin, is that part of why cists are so ridiculous?

 

Fair point, its certainly possible. 

[LD0506]

[LD0506]

There seems to be a YUGE disconnect between the Congressional Rs and those that identify as R out in the populace, that IMO is where the fake news/ cognitive dissonance/ WTF on a cosmic scale resides at the moment. Given even the smallest opportunity to catch their breath and look at what's happening the reaction has been pretty consistent, "HEY! WTF is this ****??!? Most of the funding for healthcare or retraining or basically anything that helps us is going down the tubes??"  The politicos telling themselves that it was all only dissidents on a Soros payroll is facile masturbation to deny the realities here, their message IS getting out and people ARE understanding it, the problem is that their plans entail leading massive numbers of sheep to slaughter.

 

Now focusing and funneling that into some D support is a very different concept, you are stepping all over their religion and people defend that no matter what the reality is and no matter cost they pay to do so.

 

"May you live in interesting times" Are ya starting to "get" why this is a curse?

 

 

[Going Commando]

Congressional Republicans believe their own bull****.

[Llevron]

54 minutes ago, LD0506 said:

Now focusing and funneling that into some D support is a very different concept, you are stepping all over their religion and people defend that no matter what the reality is and no matter cost they pay to do so.

 

There is one thing that the President says thats true, and its that the Democrats have O message. I would think they would be using this to their Political benefit and finding a way to drum up support. But its been the usual "Dems rule R's drool" drivel from them, mostly. Its hard for the republicans that are actually hurt by this bill to changes sides because the other side is so clearly out of the loop as well. 

 

Its really crazy what we are watching happen when you think about it. 

[Going Commando]

Democrats are totally united in thinking that this bill and the AHCA are absolute trash and that the tenable solution is to reform the ACA.  At every level of government.  They've got a message and they are right.

 

What I'd really like to see is Democrats get behind single payer.  That is the message around which they should unite.  For whatever reason, the party isn't there yet though.  But seeing as how it's the only solution for a civilized society that isn't utter ****, my hope is that they will get there eventually.

[Kilmer17]

I hope the CBO report gives enough cover to the GOPers on the fence to not allow it to proceed. 

 

Let this turd die on its own merits.  Don't save it. 

[LD0506]

So how long before Congressional Rs find a way to muzzle the CBO and it's unwanted facts that keep tripping up their schemes?

[Llevron]

3 minutes ago, LD0506 said:

So how long before Congressional Rs find a way to muzzle the CBO and it's unwanted facts that keep tripping up their schemes?

 

Few hours max

[No Excuses]

At the legislative level, I think this will be a real test of the influence of dark money. 

 

Easy to say that they should let this turd die on merits but we already know that Dean Heller has negative ad buys worth millions FROM HIS OWN PARTY going on the air in Reno.

[Cooked Crack]

2 hours ago, Kilmer17 said:

I hope the CBO report gives enough cover to the GOPers on the fence to not allow it to proceed. 

 

Let this turd die on its own merits.  Don't save it. 

I think this bill passes. Only 2 no votes to count on right now. If a 3rd real no vote comes along maybe I'll believe it dying. It would be hard for Collins and Heller to walk back their comments and vote for this turd. The only other pushbacks are this was pushed out too soon or it isn't terrible enough. Most of the Republicans that might be vulnerable aren't up in 2018. I can't see these guys doing the right thing.

[NoCalMike]

I think the conversation should probably begin with studies on how much money preventative maintenance care would save the general population.  My understanding is that was one of the biggest selling points of the ACA to begin with, that it would get more people in for routine checkups and procedures that normally would not seek medical care at all until something on their body was painful to the extent of being unbearable due to not having insurance so routine visits were unaffordable, let alone follow-ups, prescriptions, etc etc etc that would come along with routine visits. 

That is a good starting point.   If you don't like the ACA and/or think it should be scrapped totally, then please throw out some suggestions how to get everyone covered at least for primary care.

 

I don't think anyone out there was saying the ACA was without it's flaws, but fixing it's loopholes and short-comings seemed like a good way to bring Dems & the GOP together and be heroes to everyone.  Instead you have the GOP split between this awful piece of legislation and the rest of them who think it doesn't go far enough, sprinkled with a few who also want to get rid of ACA but want to keep the few parts their constituencies are making noise about.  

[PleaseBlitz]

24 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

At the legislative level, I think this will be a real test of the influence of dark money. 

 

Easy to say that they should let this turd die on merits but we already know that Dean Heller has negative ad buys worth millions FROM HIS OWN PARTY going on the air in Reno.

 

I'll note that the AARP, which is opposed to the Senate bill and is also maybe the largest and most powerful lobbying group in the country, was running ads demanding that Heller oppose the bill for a month before the Trump PAC got involved.  

 

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

13 hours ago, NoCalMike said:

It seems like every time the bill fails to be brought up for a vote, they go back, work on it, and come back with something worse.

If there was any interest by the GOP in actually making ACA/Obamacare work, they could win a lot of people over by working on a solution.  Instead it has merely been about getting rid of Obamacare, because at least half of the holdouts on the bill think it isn't awful enough of a bill.

 

I suppose if Obamacare is going to be known historically for anything, it is going to be jump starting the conversation about universal health care, because I believe it's only a matter of time before that is looked at as an alternative option.  That is what most Americans want.  They might not like the term "Gov't run healthcare" that the GOP will keep pounding into their heads, but the concept of Medicare for all is something the majority seems to want when polled.

 

 

When you say, Universal Healthcare is what most Americans want, where is that coming from.  Is there an article or a study you are referring to?