All Things North Korea Thread

[renaissance]

The idea that Un would get into a war that would likely lead to his death is laughable.

I think part of the question is whether he is rooted deeply enough in reality that he understands what they and the rest of the world are capable of.

[HeluCopter29]

I think part of the question is whether he is rooted deeply enough in reality that he understands what they and the rest of the world are capable of.

He may not realize how bad off he is. But he knows he's not swinging the biggest stick.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

The idea that Un would get into a war that would likely lead to his death is laughable.

That's the hope. But we know nothing about this guy, not even his age.

[abdcskins]

War is horrible. I wish North Korea would understand this. Nothing good is going to come out of this. Why do they even want to start?

[zoony]

He may not realize how bad off he is. But he knows he's not swinging the biggest stick.

Does he? That's the interesting part, at least to me. Chances are their leadership believes their own bull****

[RVAbrendan]

Un has to have some semblance of his nation's real-time power and stature in the world. After all, he supposedly attended the Berne School in Switzerland under a pseudonym, admires American movie stars, athletes, etc. He's not uninformed like his people. I think he is just upping his ante, continuing to bluff, hoping everybody else folds.

Edited April 4, 2013 by RVAbrendan

[Dan T.]

Does he? That's the interesting part, at least to me. Chances are their leadership believes their own bull****

As a younger man, Kim Jong-Un spent lots of time outside the cocoon of North Korea, though. He went to school in Switzerland, I think it was. He's got to be more globally aware than all the North Koreans he and his father have kept literally AND figuratively in the dark.

Edit: EXcellent point, RVAbrendan.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Dan T.

[renaissance]

War is horrible. I wish North Korea would understand this. Nothing good is going to come out of this. Why do they even want to start?

I suspect they want to go back to the post Korean War era when they were at their economic and political prime and countries like China and the Soviet Union were competing to ally with them while South Korea fell behind in every aspect. Problem is, they no longer have the Soviet Union on their side, and I don't think they really have China on their side when it comes to any kind of conflict with the rest of the world, and at this point they are so far behind any global superpower in terms of development it is ridiculous.

Edited April 4, 2013 by renaissance

[China]

North Korea Blocks Workers From South at the Border

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/04/world/asia/north-korea-blocks-workers-from-south-at-border.html?_r=0

More at link...

Anonymous threatens cyberwar on North Korea, steals 15,000 passwords

http://bgr.com/2013/04/02/anonymous-north-korea-cyber-warefare-410854/

Go Anonymous!

^^I hope they do it.

North Korea's Twitter and Flickr accounts hacked by Anonymous

The official website and Twitter account of North Korea have been targeted by hackers, with the usual stream of platitudes to Kim Jong-un and threats to the US replaced with attacks on the regime.

The Twitter account, @Uriminzok, had its profile picture of a mauve-coloured bridge replaced with a pair of tango dancers. Both dancers were wearing the Guy Fawkes face masks sported by supporters of Anonymous, the hackers' collective.

The picture was captioned "Tango down", and the tweets simply said, in English, "Hacked".

North Korea's Flickr feed was also sabotaged, with the photos from the state media replaced by cartoons of Kim Jong-un as a pig.

In another image, the North Korean flag was covered with an Anonymous face mask.

Uriminzokkiri is best known for posting propaganda videos excoriating the United States and including images like the White House framed in the crosshairs of a sniper's rifle sight.

Click on the link for the full article

[Mad Mike]

The idea that Un would get into a war that would likely lead to his death is laughable.

What's laughable is that you have decided this with no personal knowledge of Un's mindset. You've just decided that since you wouldn't do it, he wouldn't do it either. :doh:

---------- Post added April-4th-2013 at 06:42 PM ----------

North Korea's Twitter and Flickr accounts hacked by Anonymous

The official website and Twitter account of North Korea have been targeted by hackers, with the usual stream of platitudes to Kim Jong-un and threats to the US replaced with attacks on the regime.

The Twitter account, @Uriminzok, had its profile picture of a mauve-coloured bridge replaced with a pair of tango dancers. Both dancers were wearing the Guy Fawkes face masks sported by supporters of Anonymous, the hackers' collective.

The picture was captioned "Tango down", and the tweets simply said, in English, "Hacked".

North Korea's Flickr feed was also sabotaged, with the photos from the state media replaced by cartoons of Kim Jong-un as a pig.

In another image, the North Korean flag was covered with an Anonymous face mask.

Uriminzokkiri is best known for posting propaganda videos excoriating the United States and including images like the White House framed in the crosshairs of a sniper's rifle sight.

Click on the link for the full article

While I like the spirit of the hack, I'm not so sure this is a smart idea. If Un is as unstable as I suspect he is, he is likely to see this as an attack by the US, take offense, and ratchet things up even more.

[China]

While I like the spirit of the hack, I'm not so sure this is a smart idea. If Un is as unstable as I suspect he is, he is likely to see this as an attack by the US, take offense, and ratchet things up even more.

Well, unless he's really unstable (and he may be) he'll likely realize it is in response to the hack N. Korea did to S. Korea, as mentioned at the end of the article, and not an unprovoked attack.

[Mad Mike]

Well, unless he's really unstable (and he may be) he'll likely realize it is in response to the hack N. Korea did to S. Korea, as mentioned at the end of the article, and not an unprovoked attack.

What exactly has he done that makes you think he would react to *anything* in a rational way?

[Predicto]

I suspect they want to go back to the post Korean War era when they were at their economic and political prime and countries like China and the Soviet Union were competing to ally with them while South Korea fell behind in every aspect. Problem is, they no longer have the Soviet Union on their side, and I don't think they really have China on their side when it comes to any kind of conflict with the rest of the world, and at this point they are so far behind any global superpower in terms of development it is ridiculous.

It's a little more complicated than that. North Korea is the most racist society in the world. They have been conditioned to believe that Koreans are the only "clean" race of people and that contact with the outside world will pollute their gene pool and undermine their natural moral superiority. This includes China as well. They are not even really communists. They are a horrible blend of the racist and military-first aspects of far right totalitarianism and the collectivist aspects of far left totalitarianism.

Hitchens wrote about it here.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2010/02/a_nation_of_racist_dwarfs.html

Edited April 4, 2013 by Predicto

[China]

What exactly has he done that makes you think he would react to *anything* in a rational way?

I don't think there is a large enough sample size to know what he will do. Of course, that unpredictability makes him dangerous.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

It's a little more complicated than that. North Korea is the most racist society in the world. They have been conditioned to believe that Koreans are the only "clean" race of people and that contact with the outside world will pollute their gene pool and undermine their natural moral superiority. This includes China as well. They are not even really communists. They are a horrible blend of the racist and military-first aspects of far right totalitarianism and the collectivist aspects of far left totalitarianism.

Hitchens wrote about it here.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2010/02/a_nation_of_racist_dwarfs.html

That was a great article. I miss Hitchens.

That article hints at the fact that there is really no great end-game here. Either the regime explodes violently and millions die. Or the regime collapses quietly and there is an attempt at reunification between a modern, Westernized nation and a racist cult of malnourished people with no job training. At least Eastern Europe knew the West existed and had a culture and economy that was kind of a bad parody of Western Europe. One has to wonder if a modern North Korean could even process something like a modern South Korean factory or school.

I just had a thought: Has anyone ever met a North Korean? My roommate in college lived in the Soviet Union until he was 8. His best friend lived there longer. I had a friend in high school who had family in Czechoslovakia and occasionally saw them. My doctor escaped Hungary during WWII but had been back a few times since. (His son moved there in the early 90s because there was a demand for "capitalists" and he knew the language and already had contacts in place). In other words. even at the height of The Cold War, there was a decent amount of movement between Western Countries and Eastern Bloc countries.

I've never known anyone who has been in North Korea and I have never met anyone who spent any period of time there.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Lombardi's_kid_brother

[RVAbrendan]

That was a great article. I miss Hitchens.

That article hints at the fact that there is really no great end-game here. Either the regime explodes violently and millions die. Or the regime collapses quietly and there is an attempt at reunification between a modern' date=' Westernized nation and a racist cult of malnourished people with no job training. At least Eastern Europe knew the West existed and had a culture and economy that was kind of a bad parody of Western Europe. One has to wonder if a modern North Korean could even process something like a modern South Korean factory or school.[/quote']

I've read accounts of a few different folks who actually managed to defect and escape from NK and now reside in China and NK. Even basic concepts such a love are lost up there. But, once the citizens get a glimpse of society in it's actuality (not as depicted by their regime), you'd think that would be somewhat of an enlightenment.

I'm sure there would be loyalists, but once the general population discovers what a 'food court' is, or 'cable tv', or really ANY modern luxury, I'm sure their beliefs, as told by KJI and KJU, will slowly lose their validity.

Edited April 4, 2013 by RVAbrendan

[pjfootballer]

I feel like I've gone back in time 10 years.

Not sure I follow you with this reply.

[renaissance]

Not sure I follow you with this reply.

The way I see it, the ultimate decision will come down to do we take proactive military action or do we sit and wait. The backstory and justifications may be different, but it's a really similar conflict.

[HeluCopter29]

What's laughable is that you have decided this with no personal knowledge of Un's mindset. You've just decided that since you wouldn't do it, he wouldn't do it either. :doh:

Or perhaps I have respect for the guy who runs his own country.

[mojo]

I've read accounts of a few different folks who actually managed to defect and escape from NK and now reside in China and NK. Even basic concepts such a love are lost up there. But, once the citizens get a glimpse of society in it's actuality (not as depicted by their regime), you'd think that would be somewhat of an enlightenment.

I'm sure there would be loyalists, but once the general population discovers what a 'food court' is, or 'cable tv', or really ANY modern luxury, I'm sure their beliefs, as told by KJI and KJU, will slowly lose their validity.

I couldn't imagine how horrible a decision it would be to even attempt to defect, knowing that if you're caught or successful, it would mean your family and close friends would end up in prison camps or worse.

[pjfootballer]

The way I see it, the ultimate decision will come down to do we take proactive military action or do we sit and wait. The backstory and justifications may be different, but it's a really similar conflict.

Oh, Ok. Gotcha. Sorry. Late in the day. I just finished a cup of coffee as it's been slow here this afternoon. I'm trying to get out of my daze.

[visionary]

http://www.nknews.org/2013/04/three-experts-explain-why-north-korea-keeps-ratcheting-tensions/

Three Experts Explain Why North Korea Keeps Ratcheting Tensions

With a seemingly never-ending cycle of threats and counter-threats, North Korea has been in the news at an unusually high frequency in recent weeks.

From the North Korean side, threats of “pre-emptive nuclear strikes”, a severance of military hotlines, and the potential closure of the only joint run inter-Korean industrial complex (Kaesong) have all been on the cards in recent days and weeks.

From the South Korean and U.S. side, B-2 and B-52 nuclear bomber training sorties, missile defense deployments and ongoing Foal Eagle drills have been detailed to media by military spokespersons in Washington DC and Seoul at unprecedented levels of late.

While the nature of threats made on the Koreas seems to increase by the day, few know what Pyongyang’s over-arching strategy is, how likely it is that a military escalation will take place, or how tensions can possibly be dampened at this point.

[Jumbo]

Hope ya saw Stewart's 4/2 show.

A North Korean salute:evilg:--awesome.

Long focus on the topic and lots of great stuff. :cool:

[RansomthePasserby]

I've never known anyone who has been in North Korea and I have never met anyone who spent any period of time there.

I have a friend who's North Korean, but lives here now. Also, my church sponsors some missionaries who live in China and smuggle food across the border to North Korean orphans. We've had volunteers go over on a short term basis to help out. By all accounts, it's pretty rough over there.

[The Sisko]

It's a little more complicated than that. North Korea is the most racist society in the world. They have been conditioned to believe that Koreans are the only "clean" race of people and that contact with the outside world will pollute their gene pool and undermine their natural moral superiority. This includes China as well. They are not even really communists. They are a horrible blend of the racist and military-first aspects of far right totalitarianism and the collectivist aspects of far left totalitarianism.

Hitchens wrote about it here.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2010/02/a_nation_of_racist_dwarfs.html

Wow. I knew the North Korean govt. wasn't exactly made up of choirboys but I had no idea they were on the "master race" train too. I guess they forgot how that turned out for Germany.

I've read accounts of a few different folks who actually managed to defect and escape from NK and now reside in China and NK. Even basic concepts such a love are lost up there. But, once the citizens get a glimpse of society in it's actuality (not as depicted by their regime), you'd think that would be somewhat of an enlightenment.

I'm sure there would be loyalists, but once the general population discovers what a 'food court' is, or 'cable tv', or really ANY modern luxury, I'm sure their beliefs, as told by KJI and KJU, will slowly lose their validity.

Forget food courts and modern luxuries. All they need to see to realize they've been lied to in a big way is this....