addicted Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 If only the problems were Jason Campbell.If only... If only? Do you seriously think this would have happened if Jason Campbell were putting up numbers like Farve did last night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drowland Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Lewis has been out of the game for 5 years...is he really going to be that great of a "consultant"?Here's what happens when a company hires a consultant... - Management identifies a problem (that the workers already know) - Management tries to figure it out (without speaking to the workers) - Management hires a consultant or a team of consultants to analyze the problem (that the workers feel is unnecessary) - Consultant comes back with a solution that not necessarily the best solution (the best solution could have already been suggested by the workers) - Consultant gets paid big bucks & some workers lose their jobs (workers get pissed and now have to hard harder causing more dysfunction) It's a damn Dilbert cartoon! More evidence that Zorn is gone next year. Hopefully, Vinny is too. Might as well bring in the Bobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 This has just turned into a neverending soap opera, where what goes on ON the field is just the side-story. We are not only gonna be the offseason champs, we're gonna be the Monday Through Saturday champs the way this season is going, as long as there's no football being played on those days. All I can do is hang my head and laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 If only? Do you seriously think this would have happened if Jason Campbell were putting up numbers like Farve did last night? Point on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 So these eyes are going to be even larger? Or just more "buggier"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 If only? Do you seriously think this would have happened if Jason Campbell were putting up numbers like Farve did last night? I think the problems with this team are so deep that Jason Campbell and Jim Zorn have no chance. There is no way ANY QB would be putting up Favre like performances playing for the Washington Redskins. The environment is that toxic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger187126 Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 sheehan has been calling for this for a few weeks now. hard to fix a problem when the same people have been working on it for the last year and a half, with no effect. we can't get worse, but let's condemn vinny for trying to turn the offense around. sound thinking guys. i swear this entire team is damned if they do, damned if they don't on here. i'm just glad they don't listen to the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWFLSkins Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Might as well bring in the Bobs. OMG, thank God I have a wireless keyboard, otherwise I would have been electricuted. That Vinny has upper management written all over him. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 I think the problems with this team are so deep that Jason Campbell and Jim Zorn have no chance.There is no way ANY QB would be putting up Favre like performances playing for the Washington Redskins. The environment is that toxic Call me a homer, blind, or just punch drunk but I disagree with just about all of this. I think JC was given plenty of chances and didn't answer the bell. I think Zorn was given a head start last season because no teams had any footage to watch of him cordinating and once that advantage was gone we all know what happened. Lastly I see a ton of talent and problems on offense... Talent: Portis - Though not what he was 2 years ago is still a productive RB Cooley - Pro Bowler Santana Moss - Stud Randle El - As slot receivers go he's way way up there Right there alone I see a potentially explosive offense. Add in some unknowns like Thomas, Mitchell, Kelly, Davis, Mason, Aldridge and I see the makings of a powerful offense under the right hands Problems: Offensive Line and QB We can't change our offensive linemen problem right now but I am in the camp that we could change QB's and find success. Was it fair to either man how things went down? Jason with all of those offenses? No that kinda sucked but I can see much worse things for a QB then to learn under Mark Brunell and Hall of Famer Joe Gibbs. No it wasn't the best situation for Campbell but he didn't make the best of the situations he was given either. He must shoulder most of the blame for his shortcomings and failures himself. What about Zorn? Well the man has to face the music for his team losing as that is what coaches do. He was given an opportunity but he didn't have to accept the job if he wasn't ready. No one held a gun to his head and made him our head coach. If he isn't prepared and seasoned enough to handle the responsibilities then why take on the role of 3 jobs? To me Zorn's problems don't flow from the top down as you suggested, rather they flow from the inside. Zorn holds three jobs right now and that's only because he wanted it that way. His over estimating his own abilities is going to be his real downfall and that doesn't flow from the top down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan035 Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 This team needs more than a new set of eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 This has just turned into a neverending soap opera, where what goes on ON the field is just the side-story. We are not only gonna be the offseason champs, we're gonna be the Monday Through Saturday champs the way this season is going, as long as there's no football being played on those days. All I can do is hang my head and laugh. Only because the board makes it a soap opera. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskinjoe Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Another failed attempt to put a coach he put his stamp on up against the ropes. Snyder's standard fig leaf move. I don't agree with Zorn most of the time but I do understand the talent level he has on offense. Snyder has thrown loads of money at the defense but defense is much more plug-n-play than offense. How about three busted second round picks? Was that Zorn's fault? Take out Dockery and Snyder has done nothing for the offense. Piss poor move to cover his pee pee by Snyder... Again! Hey! Danny! Sell the team! That'll make me a $$$ spending fan again. Until then? Well you can _______! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphil006 Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 This is just stupid. FIRE VINNY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Batman Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 I find it ironic that Cerrato feels a need to add "a set of eyes". He's got enough eyes to last 5 people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Clark Fan Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 I hope Sherman spends one week with this organization and walks away saying how disfunctional it is. This is all on Vinny I remember him saying and its played on 980 all the time "we have a plan". Well guess what Vinny the plan sucks and was an epic failure just like you. I hate you and what you and Danny have done to this organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 “We have had some struggles and thought that it was a good time to bring in a fresh set of eyes to see if there’s anything the fresh set of eyes can help us. You bring in a guy to see if there’s any help he can give.”Click the link to read the entire article... I can't really see how this is going to make JC a better QB. I don't think Lewis is here to make JC a better QB, if you look at JC's performance other then 1st half against the Bucs he's already been playing well. But, since Lewis is here to help a struggling offense it follows that JC performance would improve in conjuction with improved offense/playcalling. Sherman Lewis has been a offensive coordinator/playcaller, WR coach, RB coach in various WCO from Bill Walsh 49ers to Holmgrens Packers to Vikes/Lions. He has more playcalling experience then anyone on the staff including Zorn. If you think about it, Sherman Lewis is more qualified to be the HC/playcaller then Zorn, but that is beside the point. I think the main areas Lewis can help are: o game design/play calling- Zorn has been calling an heavy dose of run plays on 1st down, to the point of imbalance favoring the run to the pass. This is inspite of the fact the 1st down passing has been more effective then 1st down runs. o RZ playcalling especially goal-to-go: a staple of most WCO is the goalline play action pass, which we haven't used once this season. I watch alot of football and it sickens me to watch how often team score on playaction on the goalline yet we don't even try it.:doh: o Developing an opening Script or 1st 15 which is also a staple of WCO. Our opening script hasn't lead to any points in a long time and the 1st offense has been anemic. Its even more glaring that the 2nd half offense moves the ball quite well once we are losing and Zorn is forced to pass and put JC in shotgun. o Others like: Installing the plays, running the practices, communicating to the offense to the players and coaches and helping the young receivers because Lewis has coached the WRs in a WCO before. HTTR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 JC is the one who needs an extra set of eyes so he starts seeing the whole field for a change. Poor Zorn. Gibbs and Saunders fared no better with "the coach killer". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins2victory Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 This could be a good thing. He will bring a fresh set of ideas to mix in with what we have. I am excited about this, maybe we can score a few more points this week than usual!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icbmayday Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Seems a little suspect to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokerhog Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 I am actually pretty excited about adding this particular "set of eyes". He has an amazing resume with respect to the WCO. What is concerning is the NEED for a new set of eyes. What does this say about our current set of eyes? I think this is more an indictment of Sherm Smith than of Zorn... although, I will say that Zorn's leash is incredibly short at this point. I also agree that this move could very well be a means to a transition beyond Zorn to either Holmgren, Shanahan, or Gruden. All WCO coaches. Possibly Snyder has had discussions with one of these potential new coaches, and got positive feedback regarding Lewis (purely speculation!). Either that, or maybe Smith is on the way out... Lewis would be a nice offensive coordinator, and would ease the burden of three job duties that Zorn currently has. Whatever the case, I see this as a positive. Will it lead to an overall implosion of the team? Could... After losing to the Rams and barely beating the Bucs, I would welcome a team implosion as well, though... I think we all agree that the offense has been very, very bad, and if this helps to iron out some issues, then I am all for it! If not, then what's the difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 o game design/play calling- Zorn has been calling an heavy dose of run plays on 1st down, to the point of imbalance favoring the run to the pass. This is inspite of the fact the 1st down passing has been more effective then 1st down runs. o RZ playcalling especially goal-to-go: a staple of most WCO is the goalline play action pass, which we haven't used once this season. I watch alot of football and it sickens me to watch how often team score on playaction on the goalline yet we don't even try it.:doh: Re your first point I think your wrong there. I have not gone and checked the play by play but my impression is we have been passing more than running on 1st down - until we get to the red zone that is. Apart from the first half versus the Bucs, the offense has been pretty effective in moving the ball (we were ranked 11th in the NFL in passing yardage before the Bucs game) but ineffective at turning that yardage into points. I agree with your point about the red zone offense though. When we get inside the 20 Zorn seems to revert to the run, run, pass, FG formula. To be fair we have scored TDs on our last 2 red zone visits (both passes by the way) but thats a small sample size to see if we have cured the problem. Best case bringing this guy in could develop a couple of ideas which might help in terms of game planning and play calling in certain situations. Worst case it undermines Zorn and has players wondering who is calling the shots. It certainly smacks of desperation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 You are reading too much into this, JJ. Dan Snyder, unsatisfied with the pace of progress, is merely giving Zorn some help. I doubt that Jim Zorn is concerned for his job security. This hire is consistent with my theory as set forth in my thread -- Why Vinny and Jim Likely Have Job Security. The OP reads as follows : I have Dan Snyder pegged as a narcissist. He has an IQ of about 115-120 but he's a know-it-all. His ****iness has led to some very bad decision-making. He has learned from experience, though. I don't like Dan's win-now goal, but the Redskins organization today is doing a lot of things right. There are two basic approaches an owner can take to managing an NFL team. Robert Kraft represents the hands off approach; Jerry Jones the hands on. Let's not be too hasty in deciding that Kraft's way is better. Among those with coaching experience, for every Belichick, there's a list of mediocre performers like George Allen, Marty, Shanahan, Gibbs or Parcells who, given full control of an NFL team, were unlikely to win Super Bowls. Among the GMs, for every Bill Polian, there's a long list of men who can't hack it I think Snyder has opted for the Jerry Jones approach, and, in his shoes, I'd do the same. I think of it as a modular approach to management. For convenience, let's assume that there are 26 areas of management involved in running an NFL team. So, we can label them A through Z (A-Z). We'll say that Vinny Cerrato is responsible for A-M and Jim Zorn for N-Z. While Dan will want to continually look for ways to upgrade A-Z, the primary focus will be on the problem areas. Let's say that Vinny's performance seems weak on B, D and K, while Jim's seems weak on Q, T and V. Dan will want to hear their analysis of the problem and what they plan to do about it. If those plans make sense, he approves. If they don't, he orders them back to the drawing board. The Kraft hands-off approach is great when there's a Belichick available, but it's a high-risk hire. If the man can't cut it and has to be replaced, you go through another reorganization. Players have to learn to adapt to new coaches and new schemes. In the hands-on approach, if you have to bring in someone to replace Vinny or Zorn, you prefer to promote from within the organization to maintain continuity. The basic idea is to allow a system, on and off the field, to evolve and improve continually and not be greatly affected by changes in personnel, whether they are coaches, front office management or players. If I have Dan Snyder figured out, Jim Zorn's and Vinny Cerrato's jobs are secure and that's a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metalhead Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Isn't Sherman Smith our OC? Where's the problem? He's supposed to have input with Zorn, although it apparently doesn't happen. Zorn is the guy that brough him here. Or are people just upset at Vinny just saying something publicly? Edit* Ohh. Smith is our OC. No idea who this Lewis guy is. I misread it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Some people just can't help but be polyannas but bringing in consultants is a very bad omen. Thinking back I believe even Bobby Beathard did this in 1987 when Chuck Banker's special teams were struggling and Paul Lanham was brought in to assist. Banker was kept around one more year but Lanham was the coach. They brought Wayne Sevier back in 1989. Point is even when well run organizations bring in "a new set of eyes" that spells the beginning of the end for the "old eyes". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monte51Coleman Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 How much does a "fresh set of eyes" cost? Not a lot. Only Jim Zorn's dignity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.