The Sewer That Is The GOP: With All The White Supremacists, Conspiracy Nutters, And Other Malicious Whacko Subgroups, How Does It Get Fixed?

[MEANDWARF]

17 hours ago, SkinsPassion4Life said:

Before you fix either party, you need campaign finance reform and term limits.

Do away with political ads from both parties would be great.

 

 

 

Edited May 30, 2017 by MEANDWARF

[Zguy28]

43 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said:

They need to start recognizing humans over corporations and money. I don't hold much hope for that.

Why do you have to bring the abortion industry into this?

 

 

[LadySkinsFan]

I didn't. 

[GhostofSparta]

Oh boy, here we go.

 

1. So, first of all, focus on the long-term over the short term. Yes, you're in charge NOW. Will you be in 4 years? 10? 25? You can only gerrymander your way to relevance on the national level for so long before it backfires. That was one hell of a ground game in 2010 to go from almost Filibuster-proof minority party to controlling Congress and most state houses. And with the 2010 census, that control has led to an impressive 7 year (so far) run of almost total control and the state (outside of the coasts) and national level. But 2010 was a mid-term year, which is always better for R's than D's due to older people (who lean R) turning out way more often in off-year elections when there's no big race. 2020 could be different. If the Trump backlash is bad enough, could it lead to another 2008 for the D's? If so, and they get a decent enough ground game going for local races (see the Democrat version of this thread for their weaknesses in that area), could they turn the 2020's into their decade of dominance? If so, how does a party that currently relies on an older, dwindling voter base plan to survive that decade to come back in 2030, keeping hoping that each AARP member suddenly registers R?

 

Figure out what the long-term message of the party needs to be. Something simple, basic, and broad. You know, something like "more personal freedom, more efficient government, more jobs that haven't been obsolete for 50 years, etc." But don't make it inflexible. Being anti-gay marriage may have worked in 2005. I don't see it working in 2025.

 

2. This past election has shown a big rift in the R party. Figure out what group/s are most important to pander to/represent, and be honest about it.

 

Is the future the Fiscal Conservatie/Libertarian wing of the party? Then start listening to them and tell the SoCons to shut up and fall in line. After all, who else are they going to vote for, the Democrats? Throw their vote away on a 3rd party and let the Democrats win?

 

Is it the Christian/Social Conservative wing? Tell the libertarian branch to piss off. That what restroom people use and who puts what where in the privacy of their own bedroom is the hill that we're going to die on dammit. And we'll pay lip service to fiscal conservatism, unless we need to spend or waste money fighting tooth and nail for the SoCon agenda.

 

Hawks (neo-con, whatever) or isolationists? Pro big-business or pro little guy? Do we like and want to emulate power-hungry thugs like Vladimir Putin, or do we despise and want to curb people who abuse their power, like Obama?

 

Pick a side and support it. Loudly and proudly. Unless of course you're just a bunch of John Kerry flip-floppers.

 

Or just keep being the party of mostly white, middle class (or better), heterosexual Christians, and then pretend to care about everything and nothing all at once. I suppose you could keep doing that too.

 

3. Stop being hypocrites. If Obama was the devil for doing something, then Bush and Trump doing the same ****ing thing is bad. Stop giving a pass to your own side that you wouldn't give to the other side.

 

If nothing else, think about it practically. If you want to give Trump the power to do something, imagine if Hillary or Bernie or whoever gets elected in 2020. Does the thought of them with the same power fill you with existential dread and horror? Well guess what, it's really hard to take power away from the government once it's been granted. You're cool with Bush's executive orders because the Dems in congress are blocking him? Well guess what Obama's gonna do with a Rep-controlled congress?

 

4. **** the racists and the neo-nazis. If they want to vote R, whatever, you can't stop them. But don't pander to them. Ignore them, marginalize them, ban them from polite company, whatever. Treat them individually as people and try to save them from their horrid ideologies, but treat their ideas like the ****ing plague.

[Riggo-toni]

3 hours ago, twa said:

 

While I agree dropping the Christian banner in politics would be best I do think the political sphere is the right place to assert your morals(no matter the source) under our system.

Right! Getting a bj from an intern is despicable, unless you are famous and rich and grab her by the **** first.

 

Good people don't smoke pot; they stick to Dr prescribed opioids.

 

Same sex marriage is a violation of sacred tradition, because it could lead to a man cheating on another man, instead of on his third wife. We need to keep gay sex where it belongs...in the men's room of Minneapolis airport, or under cover in the Bachmanns' basement.

[NoCalMike]

Honestly, I know this sounds like a cop out of an answer due to being the same as what I said in the (D) party thread, I am going to repeat it anyway. Get money out of politics.  Will this "fix" the GOP? Who knows....but at least what it will do I think is get some more honest and compromising principles out of them.  I also think it would tend to have Libertarian and moderate wing of the party more willing to work with Dems as opposed to relying on the religious right wing of the GOP to get anything accomplished.

 

Really the correct answer to both threads is to address the systematic issue(s) first.

[Riggo-toni]

Contrary to popular opinion, it's not simply money or its influence that is making the GOP unpalatable; it is the need to continue to appease the hardcore evangelical/redneck component to survive a primary.  Ever since getting a taste of the sweet juice of pandering at the 92 convention, the appetite of nativist theocrats has been insatiable.  The Koch Brothers, those wacky financiers of the tea party, are for gay marriage, but they realize that stance won't fly in Kentucky or Montana.

[NoCalMike]

4 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said:

Contrary to popular opinion, it's not simply money or its influence that is making the GOP unpalatable; it is the need to continue to appease the hardcore evangelical/redneck component to survive a primary.  Ever since getting a taste of the sweet juice of pandering at the 92 convention, the appetite of nativist theocrats has been insatiable.  The Koch Brothers, those wacky financiers of the tea party, are for gay marriage, but they realize that stance won't fly in Kentucky or Montana.

 

I agree with this somewhat. If the mainstream GOP were willing to maybe lose a few election cycles while distancing themselves from evangelicals overall, it could do them some long term good.

[mcsluggo]

On 5/29/2017 at 3:24 PM, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

Yeah, I've given up on society, mostly.  Occasionally I'll see some stuff on the news that gives me some hope but by and large it's a pretty sad state of affairs.  

 

really?  from what you see of people in person, in your day-to-day life...??  or from what you read on the internet?  (or in the comment section of the internet)

 

in general, the people i interact with are fairly decent (as least as decent as they were 35 years ago, or whenever Nirvana was?) but the collective stupid on the internet...?   jeez.

 

 

 

[MEANDWARF]

36 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

I agree with this somewhat. If the mainstream GOP were willing to maybe lose a few election cycles while distancing themselves from evangelicals overall, it could do them some long term good.

Really think that the GOP would consider committing political suicide? In 2012, a large chunk but not evangelicals stayed home because they could not handle voting for a Mormon, and look what happen.

[twa]

1 hour ago, Riggo-toni said:

Right! Getting a bj from an intern is despicable, unless you are famous and rich and grab her by the **** first.

 

Good people don't smoke pot; they stick to Dr prescribed opioids.

 

Same sex marriage is a violation of sacred tradition, because it could lead to a man cheating on another man, instead of on his third wife. We need to keep gay sex where it belongs...in the men's room of Minneapolis airport, or under cover in the Bachmanns' basement.

 

If those are your morals....... who am I to judge? 

 

[Jumbo]

let's get the posting in here back on the topic

 

 

 

 

 

[PeterMP]

Start by admitting that Reagan wasn't really a great President and was wrong on his two biggest ideas.  Trickle down economics doesn't create real long term growth and the Soviet Union was not really that large of a threat (and was already a dying entity) to western civilization.

 

If they can do those two things, other things will fall into place (because realistically at that point in time, it will mean they are valuing actual information and not talking points).

Edited May 30, 2017 by PeterMP

[NoCalMike]

38 minutes ago, MEANDWARF said:

Really think that the GOP would consider committing political suicide? In 2012, a large chunk but not evangelicals stayed home because they could not handle voting for a Mormon, and look what happen.

 

That's why I said it would lose them election in the short term, but could be a winning long-term strategy to pull the party back to the middle and have the evangelicals back to being a fringe group.  Right now the GOP likely views the evangelicals as too easy of a honey pot because they are either voting GOP or staying home for the most part.  It's too enticing to just pander to them. It would be a big undertaking to give it up, but in the big picture it would be a good thing.

[tshile]

Another idea that I think has to do with the core problem:

 

Lack of empathy shown towards anyone that isn't white/christian/at least middle class in the economy.

 

I'm not going to go so far as to say it's across the board intentional (plenty of people already making those arguments) I'm just pointing out it exists and they should do something about it.

 

There are plenty of ways to show empathy towards those groups without adopting the Democrats platform or ideas - and honestly, I think there's plenty of people in those groups that would love to entertain other ideas than the ones they get from the Democrats, they just have to be ideas that actually appear to try to help those groups.

 

There's a severe lack of empathy from the Republicans. 

 

(This will sound hilarious to anyone who just read my posts in the fix the dems threads, I promise you there's a middle ground I'm shooting for here, boring as that may be)

[Epochalypse]

I'm probably making a mistake walking into this but hopefully I can tread carefully enough...

 

As a white, Christian middle class male, I think a large part of the problem is the misrepresentation of Christians, particularly by people claiming to be "Christians".  The God I know preaches love and choosing to live a life that attracts others to choose to live the same life, not hating those who don't believe as you believe and forcing people to adhere to your beliefs.

 

Jesus didn't command his followers to enact laws to exclude people; in fact he spoke against it when the Pharisees did it.  He wanted inclusion.  He commanded us to go out and love people and teach them about the gospel.  Not force it down their throats.

 

If you want people to stop having abortions, don't outlaw it; instead live your life as an example to those around you to choose to be more responsible.  Offer to adopt and care for pregnant women (which unfortunately is not what Planned Parenthood stands for IMO).

 

God never intended Christianity to be used as a barrier to keep people out; Christians were always intended to be the ones who should be going out with love and bringing people in.  And if they don't want to come in, well God gave us free will for a reason.

[BornaSkinsFan83]

[Busch1724]

^^^link to the story

 

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/11/1619079/-Comparing-Presidential-Administrations-by-Arrests-and-Convictions-A-Warning-for-Trump-Appointees

 

 

[BornaSkinsFan83]

26 minutes ago, Epochalypse said:

Offer to adopt and care for pregnant women (which unfortunately is not what Planned Parenthood stands for IMO).

 

Just wanted to point out that Planned Parenthood absolutely provides adoption services and pregnancy care. 

 

Also as an outsider looking in, I completely agree with the rest. I've been a strong agnostic literally my entire life (parents are basically the same) and I swear the behavior of Christians in this country--particularly their hypocrisy and blatant ****ization of Jesus' teachings--has done more to push me away from organized religion and "finding God" than anything. By far. 

11 minutes ago, Busch1724 said:

^^^link to the story

 

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/11/1619079/-Comparing-Presidential-Administrations-by-Arrests-and-Convictions-A-Warning-for-Trump-Appointees

 

 

Dont see my image on there but I'm on mobile so that's probably why. But yeah same breakdown. Thank you. Just grabbed it from someone off of twitter.

 

Didn't realize the differences were that stark. Must be a Deep State conspiracy. /s

Edited May 31, 2017 by BornaSkinsFan83

[Kilmer17]

Dems are clearly better at eliminating their enemies before they are able to arrest them for their crimes.

[ExoDus84]

Fixing the Republican party..is that even possible?

 

I'd say the biggest step is for Republican politicians in that party to grow a spine and develop just an ounce of ****ing integrity. There's an epidemic of gun violence, yet they are too afraid of the NRA to do anything about it. All the science in the world confirms climate change and they refuse to do anything about it or favor any kind of environmental protection, and at worst call it a "hoax", all because their corporate overlords might be negatively affected financially. Ditto for Wall Street, whom Republicans are too busy deep-throating to favor anything that resembles common sense regulations, even after they tanked the global economy 8 years ago and bankrupted millions. They sell their soul to corporations and the rich, at the expense of everything and everyone, including common sense. They pander to the lowest of their base, and have no spine to actually stand up against the racists, bigots, and idiots that shout the loudest. 

 

There's no integrity in the party. They sold out for Trump, even knowing he's a racist idiot who has no idea what he's doing. Party before country. Money before people. Until this changes, and until the majority of their base realizes that they are voting against their own economic interests, the party will do far more harm than good.

1 minute ago, Kilmer17 said:

Dems are clearly better at eliminating their enemies before they are able to arrest them for their crimes.

 

Or maybe the Dems aren't as infested with greedy, shady scumbags the way the Republican party is.

[Kilmer17]

3 minutes ago, ExoDus84 said:

Fixing the Republican party..is that even possible?

 

I'd say the biggest step is for Republican politicians in that party to grow a spine and develop just an ounce of ****ing integrity. There's an epidemic of gun violence, yet they are too afraid of the NRA to do anything about it. All the science in the world confirms climate change and they refuse to do anything about it or favor any kind of environmental protection, and at worst call it a "hoax", all because their corporate overlords might be negatively affected financially. Ditto for Wall Street, whom Republicans are too busy deep-throating to favor anything that resembles common sense regulations, even after they tanked the global economy 8 years ago and bankrupted millions. They sell their soul to corporations and the rich, at the expense of everything and everyone, including common sense. They pander to the lowest of their base, and have no spine to actually stand up against the racists, bigots, and idiots that shout the loudest. 

 

There's no integrity in the party. They sold out for Trump, even knowing he's a racist idiot who has no idea what he's doing. Party before country. Money before people. Until this changes, and until the majority of their base realizes that they are voting against their own economic interests, the party will do far more harm than good.

 

Or maybe the Dems aren't as infested with greedy, shady scumbags the way the Republican party is.

It was a joke.   But your thought truly is what the left in this country thinks of the right.  So it's not hard to figure out why someone on the right isnt quick to join the left.  Even if the issue moves him or her in that direction.

[ExoDus84]

2 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

It was a joke.   But your thought truly is what the left in this country thinks of the right.  So it's not hard to figure out why someone on the right isnt quick to join the left.  Even if the issue moves him or her in that direction.

No, my thoughts are what the left in this country thinks about politicians on the right. Republican fiscal policy, Wall Street deregulation, etc., is far more likely to hurt the Republican base than anyone else. My thoughts that the Republican party is full of alt-right pandering nutters is only half true, but that they are filled with greedy corporatism and lack a spine is a fact. 

[SkinsHokieFan]

 

the Republican Party of today

Edited June 1, 2017 by SkinsHokieFan

[grego]

On 5/31/2017 at 0:43 PM, BornaSkinsFan83 said:

 

 I swear the behavior of Jews in this country--particularly their hypocrisy..... 

 

Anti semitic 

 

Quote

 I swear the behavior of muslims in this country--particularly their hypocrisy...

 

islamophobic

 

Quote

 I swear the behavior of christians in this country--particularly their hypocrisy...

 

no problem

Edited June 2, 2017 by grego