2023 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Chump Bailey]

I think TE Davis Allen Clemson will be a name to watch in the coming weeks.

[Skinsinparadise]

Will Mallory, 6 '5, 245 TE.  Good mid-tier mid round TE.  Better IMO pass catcher than blocker.  I like Sam Laporta over Mallory among the mid-round types but Mallory might be my 2nd fav in that range

 

Could only find on game and watched the highlights.  Good numbers for a college TE.  42 receptions, 542 yards.  Has a sick 4.5% drop rate -- good hands.  He seems to move well, might time in the 4.6's.

 

PFF doesn't think much of him as a run blocker.  Some folks on twitter think very highly of him as a blocker.  I think I am somewhere in between but more negative.  He's a wiling blocker, not a people mover. Whiffed a couple of times in the passing game and got his QB hit on one of those.  Blocks in line, out of the backfield.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

IOL.

 

O'Cyrus Torrence, Guard. I see the love for him. He creates excellent body position and scrapes off of doubles to the second level seamlessly. For a big guy he's good on the move, too. He's got an absolute killswitch that he flips on nearly every play. There are some plays when watching him that the entire Florida offensive line collapses and then there is O'Cyrus locked on his guy at the LoS not moving. He has a hell of a grip and he does a good job of keeping his holds inside the shoulder pads. I've seen people questioning his range as a pass blocker but as an IOL his range isn't all that wild except for exotic sets which can be accounted for via scheme. I have no real concerns here. He is going to be a good player in the League as long as he is a worker and not lazy, which is info I don't have. 

 

Andrew Vorhees, Guard. Every bit as physical as Torrence and always looking for work. His head is always on a swivel. He fans out well. His anchor isn't as strong as O'Cyrus and gets displaced a bit more. He has a lot of power and strength though. Direct drive blocks seem to be an area he struggles and he sometimes doesn't get his hands where they need to be and it allows for the defender to wiggle free.

 

Emil Ekiyor, Guard. I see him as similar to Torrence. I don't think he moves quite as well. But he has an extremely strong anchor and is a lock down blocker. He's like a cruise missile. He locks on and you're in a lot of trouble. He moves well. He reaches well. Good size but not great. 

 

Kenneth Randolph, Guard. Plays with Ekiyor, but he's not the same player. He has a decent anchor and relatively decent hands, but he doesn't have a high degree of awareness. He misses targets on pulls too often for me. But he is an aggressive player. Balance isn't bad, but he excels in double teams. Guys just don't split doubles when he is a part of the duo. 

 

Steve Avila, Guard. Well, I think the absolute obvious statement to make in regards to Avila is he is an absolute power house. Dude is a freight train. Strong as an ox. He can displace or move almost anyone on the defensive line if he gets off the ball and gets his feet in position. My concern with Avila, though, is that he doesn't seem to get his feet in position very often and while he doesn't have slow feet, they also aren't quick. He also shifts his weight too much when getting to a block and that allows the defender to shed him and get through.

 

Braeden Daniels, Guard. He is explosive off the ball. Just flies. That is fun to watch. But he plays with a lot of waist bend which can be beneficial if you are picking up a scraping backer or a guy is exactly where you want him. But when you don't sink your hips as an OL routinely a dynamic defender is going to make it hard for you to stick with him because your center of mass is off kilter. 

 

Jarrett Patterson, Guard (Center). Versatility is the name of the game. He can definitely play both positions. Good power, can slow explosive rushers to a stand still with his punch. His footwork is fluid and sound and gets him in great positions. He's strong and athletic and not only position versatile but scheme versatile as well. Can pull, can get on rail road tracks and can get to the second level well. 

 

John Michael Schmitz, Center. Gets off the snap well with his off hand. Squares, and moves well getting to the second level when he is uncovered. He does a pretty decent job of handling a nose or a tight-shade technique bull rushing at the snap, too. Has a good anchor. 

 

Luke Wypler, Center. Seems to have a good football IQ. He tracks stunts well and doesn't get displaced. He isn't a mover, though. He doesn't create space. He can stalemate a good number of defenders, and he can not lose a rep. He just doesn't seem to win a lot of them. He does get to the second level well in the run game and finds a target and gets to it. 

 

Sedrick Van Pran, Center. I really like him. He moves really fast off the snap, anchors and plays with a relentless pursuit of destruction. He can get to extra fast DL after the snap which is not easy for a center prospect. Plays with his head on a swivel and he does real well against nose tackles. He relies on the cut block too often for my liking but that could be more scheme specific. NOTE: Just found out he went back to school.

 

Olusegun Oluwatimi, Center. He's a lunger and then tends to get himself too high. Has a pretty good pop and is fairly athletic. He seems to struggle at the second level with remaining engaged and isn't quick enough off the ball to pick up blitzers. But speed wise he's athletic so on pin and pull stuff on the perimeter he's a gamer. 

 

Ricky Stromberg, Center. Okay, he's fun. He does a great job on down blocks, allows some initial push off of a bull but gets his anchor set and stonewalls fairly quickly. He's powerful, he likes to dominate in the run game and although he is clearly not as good in pass pro he can do it just fine. In fact, probably better than fine. One thing he'll need to fix is that he has such a strong punch that sometimes he punches and when the guy doesn't move it's like he's confused and forgets to move his feet. Needs to learn to fire both at the same time and this guy has a really, really high potential ceiling. 

 

Joe Tippman, Center. Sometimes he takes some bad initial angles, but he reacts to those mistakes well and gets in a position to stop defenders from getting to the ball. He's an absolute finisher but when he picks up second level backers he doesn't have the same pop as he does at the LoS and he struggles with more agile second level defenders. Some of that is probably due to his pad level. But at the LoS he is strong and powerful with a good base and he moves really smoothly in pass protection. 

 

Rankings:

 

1. O'Cyrus Torrence

2. Jarrett Patterson

3. Ricky Stromberg

4. Andrew Vorhees

5. Emil Ekiyor

6. Braeden Daniels

7. John Michael Schmitz

8. Joe Tippman

9. Luke Wypler

10. Olusegun Oluwatimi

11. Kenneth Randolph

12. Steve Avila

 

 

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by KDawg

[Blanka]

Van Pran returned to Georgia I believe 

[KDawg]

40 minutes ago, Blanka said:

Van Pran returned to Georgia I believe 

He did. Just looked it up and you are correct. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

IOL.

 

O'Cyrus Torrence, Guard. I see the love for him. He creates excellent body position and scrapes off of doubles to the second level seamlessly. For a big guy he's good on the move, too. He's got an absolute killswitch that he flips on nearly every play. There are some plays when watching him that the entire Florida offensive line collapses and then there is O'Cyrus locked on his guy at the LoS not moving. He has a hell of a grip and he does a good job of keeping his holds inside the shoulder pads. I've seen people questioning his range as a pass blocker but as an IOL his range isn't all that wild except for exotic sets which can be accounted for via scheme. I have no real concerns here. He is going to be a good player in the League as long as he is a worker and not lazy, which is info I don't have. 

 

Andrew Vorhees, Guard. Every bit as physical as Torrence and always looking for work. His head is always on a swivel. He fans out well. His anchor isn't as strong as O'Cyrus and gets displaced a bit more. He has a lot of power and strength though. Direct drive blocks seem to be an area he struggles and he sometimes doesn't get his hands where they need to be and it allows for the defender to wiggle free.

 

Emil Ekiyor, Guard. I see him as similar to Torrence. I don't think he moves quite as well. But he has an extremely strong anchor and is a lock down blocker. He's like a cruise missile. He locks on and you're in a lot of trouble. He moves well. He reaches well. Good size but not great. 

 

Kenneth Randolph, Guard. Plays with Ekiyor, but he's not the same player. He has a decent anchor and relatively decent hands, but he doesn't have a high degree of awareness. He misses targets on pulls too often for me. But he is an aggressive player. Balance isn't bad, but he excels in double teams. Guys just don't split doubles when he is a part of the duo. 

 

Steve Avila, Guard. Well, I think the absolute obvious statement to make in regards to Avila is he is an absolute power house. Dude is a freight train. Strong as an ox. He can displace or move almost anyone on the defensive line if he gets off the ball and gets his feet in position. My concern with Avila, though, is that he doesn't seem to get his feet in position very often and while he doesn't have slow feet, they also aren't quick. He also shifts his weight too much when getting to a block and that allows the defender to shed him and get through.

 

Braeden Daniels, Guard. He is explosive off the ball. Just flies. That is fun to watch. But he plays with a lot of waist bend which can be beneficial if you are picking up a scraping backer or a guy is exactly where you want him. But when you don't sink your hips as an OL routinely a dynamic defender is going to make it hard for you to stick with him because your center of mass is off kilter. 

 

Jarrett Patterson, Guard (Center). Versatility is the name of the game. He can definitely play both positions. Good power, can slow explosive rushers to a stand still with his punch. His footwork is fluid and sound and gets him in great positions. He's strong and athletic and not only position versatile but scheme versatile as well. Can pull, can get on rail road tracks and can get to the second level well. 

 

John Michael Schmitz, Center. Gets off the snap well with his off hand. Squares, and moves well getting to the second level when he is uncovered. He does a pretty decent job of handling a nose or a tight-shade technique bull rushing at the snap, too. Has a good anchor. 

 

Luke Wypler, Center. Seems to have a good football IQ. He tracks stunts well and doesn't get displaced. He isn't a mover, though. He doesn't create space. He can stalemate a good number of defenders, and he can not lose a rep. He just doesn't seem to win a lot of them. He does get to the second level well in the run game and finds a target and gets to it. 

 

Sedrick Van Pran, Center. I really like him. He moves really fast off the snap, anchors and plays with a relentless pursuit of destruction. He can get to extra fast DL after the snap which is not easy for a center prospect. Plays with his head on a swivel and he does real well against nose tackles. He relies on the cut block too often for my liking but that could be more scheme specific.

 

More to come later.

 

 

 

 

 

I wrote about most of those guys over time.   our views overlap mostly
 

With Vorhees its been a long time since i've written about him, noticed he's on the Freaks list.

 

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

Just updated my list with rankings and a few more centers.

 

Fairly underwhelmed by the centers. Though Ricky Stromberg really stuck out. Torrence is a notch above the rest. Patterson's versatility is high end. 

 

There are some mid of the pack guys that wouldn't be bad additions (Tippman). Otherwise it's a pretty okay IOL class. 

 

Need to find some stuff from Jaxon Kirkland this year to watch. Liked him in the past. 

Edited January 26, 2023 by KDawg

[Skinsinparadise]

35 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Just updated my list with rankings and a few more centers.

 

Fairly underwhelmed by the centers. Though Ricky Stromberg really stuck out. Torrence is a notch above the rest. Patterson's versatility is high end. 

 

There are some mid of the pack guys that wouldn't be bad additions (Tippman). Otherwise it's a pretty okay IOL class. 

 

Need to find some stuff from Jaxon Kirkland this year to watch. Liked him in the past. 

 

Yeah I hyped Stromberg, too.  He's not getting a lot of love for whatever reason by draftniks compared to the rest.

 

I like Michael Schmitz.  Tippman. Wypler.  Oluwatimi.

 

Havent watched Forsyth yet.

Edited January 26, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Acworth skins fan]

KDawg and Sip. 
Really appreciate to work you put into this tread, as I bet all of us do. 
thank you, as I don’t have the knowledge to go anywhere near what you two do. 

Edited January 26, 2023 by Acworth skins fan

[Skinsinparadise]

Funky from DJ.  But I am definitely on the Darnell Washington bandwagon -- he seems to have sort of a mixed take from some draftniks, some loving, some paused about him.

 

 

 

[The Consigliere]

5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Maybe.   I'd be surprised.  Bijon is really good but its not a common spot to trade up for in the top half of the draft. 

The evals I've seen is he's in that tier with Rickey Williams, LT2, AP, Gurley, Saquon in terms of ridiculously elite talent as a RB going back the last 25 years. I could see someone pulling the trigger, not a lot of examples of guys w/those evals the last few years. Taylor was close but some were concerned (Wisconsin system back questions etc), so really only Saquon and Gurley and maybe Fournette (though he had some people concerned) had evals this nutty. I would expect him to go top 15, the only possible reason he won't is that teams are finally starting to smarten up w/regards to RB value in drafts. 

 

Teams nutty enough to do it:

Las Vegas: they seem set to let Jacobs go and he's one of the last RB's to go top 20ish. But there pick is too high.

Houston: they don't have a difference maker at the position and have multiple firsts. 

 

After our pick, Minnesota could already be regretting that Cook deal. Buffalo maybe. Giants to replace Saquon would make perfect sense (and would really suck). Philly has good 2nd tier options beyond Sanders and seemingly hadn't ever been happy w/him until this season. 

 

It is interesting though, not a lot of teams with RB needs picking between 10-30. Miami might have been one of them but they lost their first. 

Edited January 26, 2023 by The Consigliere

[Chump Bailey]

Top Ten RB’s

 

1. Bijan Robinson, Texas
2. Jahmir Gibbs, Alabama
3. Zach Charbonnett, UCLA
4. Zach Evans, Ole Miss
5. Devon Achane, Texas A&M
6. Sean Tucker, Syracuse
7. Kenny McIntosh, Georgia
8. Tyjae Spears, Tulane
9. Chase Brown, Illinois
10. Chris Rodriguez, Kentucky & Israel Abinkanda, Pitt

Edited January 27, 2023 by Chump Bailey

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, The Consigliere said:

The evals I've seen is he's in that tier with Rickey Williams, LT2, AP, Gurley, Saquon in terms of ridiculously elite talent as a RB going back the last 25 years. I could see someone pulling the trigger, not a lot of examples of guys w/those evals the last few years. Taylor was close but some were concerned (Wisconsin system back questions etc), so really only Saquon and Gurley and maybe Fournette (though he had some people concerned) had evals this nutty. I would expect him to go top 15, the only possible reason he won't is that teams are finally starting to smarten up w/regards to RB value in drafts. 

 

 

I am aware of his billing.  No doubt he could go in the top 15 but that wasn't my point.  My point is its a bit bold these days to draft a RB that high but I think it can happen -- but the discussion wasn't just drafting him that high but that a team would trade up to do it.  I think trading up to take him is a bit much.  But you never know.  I doubt it.  But will see.

Edited January 27, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

Kaleb Hayes, haven't watched him yet.

 

 

 

 

 

[method man]

4 hours ago, KDawg said:

Just updated my list with rankings and a few more centers.

 

Fairly underwhelmed by the centers. Though Ricky Stromberg really stuck out. Torrence is a notch above the rest. Patterson's versatility is high end. 

 

There are some mid of the pack guys that wouldn't be bad additions (Tippman). Otherwise it's a pretty okay IOL class. 

 

Need to find some stuff from Jaxon Kirkland this year to watch. Liked him in the past. 

 

This center class is probably lacking a guy who is going to be a high end All Pro type but do you think some of these guys are Day 1 starters that can at least provide you, say, a Tyler Biadasz level of play?

[KDawg]

Realized I haven't done a post about RBs at all... (This is the last position I need to do an initial watch. Next I start watching randoms and slotting them in, big board comes mid Feb/March.

 

Bijan Robinson. Absolutely the best back in this draft. He is strong, low center of gravity, churns his legs and makes defenders pay for lazy or improper tackle technique. He isn't afraid to stick his nose in there and blast someone in pass pro and he sells his blocking assignment well before leaking to the flat for a swing. I love how he uses his lineman's size to kind of get low behind them and hide and then burst through a hole for whatever yardage he can get. He has an excellent one cut and go mentality that really works behind the LoS. 

 

Jahmyr Gibbs. I'm going to be out on an island a little bit here I think... but I think he is every bit the back that Bijan is. If I were a GM and I wanted a back, the fact that Gibbs exists would stop me from pulling the trigger on Bijan too early. If I was in the market for a back I'd trade back if both guys were still on the board. Gibbs is a better receiver than Bijan, in my opinion. In fact, he actually lines up in the slot sometimes. He runs a lot of exit type of stuff. But he is a slightly different style of back to Bijan to be fair as well. Gibbs can go between the tackles and he uses his whole body to maximize his yardage. He seems to be more of a zone read and cut guy than Bijan who is more of a hide and burst through kind of runner. I also think Gibbs is a bit weaker than Bijan as a pass protector. So while I value Gibbs, especially for his modern NFL style of play, he's still not Bijan. 

 

Sean Tucker. My guy is a bowling ball. Low center of gravity but is a game breaking receiver who has excellent vision and is another guy who churns his legs. He can run the ball in virtually any style and is an excellent receiver. He is so smooth in his catch to run transition, despite the fact that his QB looked like garbage. His style and the way he plays reminds me a ton of Marshall Faulk, just not as explosive. Faulk would look like he was shot out of a cannon at times and Tucker is capable of it but not quite on that level. But Tucker is excellent setting up blocks and getting where he has to go. 

 

Zach Charbonnet. Okay, so... Still haven't found a back I don't like. If you've been following my posts about every position, you'll have noted by now that I like players that play violently. This guy isn't the best receiver of the bunch. He can do it, but he's not Gibbs or even Tucker. But he has good hands and can do it fairly well. What he is, though, is a guy who looks for contact, initiates it and finishes it. Watching him play I actually found myself reverting to middle school KD and saying "FATALITY" as he trucked a dude. I don't know what came over me. This guy carries defenders for yards like it's his job. He manipulates his center mass and cuts very well. He lowers his shoulder and pops. He also can get the edge on you and make you pay for it. He fights for every yard he gets. He isn't as fast twitch as the guys above him, though. But I'm not sure that matters. His run speed is good. My knock on him is that he doesn't really make guys miss. He tries to run around them a little bit and if he doesn't he has to go through them. Which... works for me. But it becomes harder to do in the NFL, especially now that corners, who were known as truck highlight makers previous, are getting larger and better at tackling. 

 

Zach Evans. First RB I've posted that I don't love. But I like him. I think he has a role in the NFL game especially and can find himself playing pretty quickly. I think he is a prototypical outside runner/receiver type of back that finds holes and accelerates quickly through them. He's another one that runs around versus making guys miss, though. He has a lot of runs where he is untouched for a good chunk of yards and then brought down on first contact. And he's not a churner, so he often just drops on contact. Part of his success is his line paving the way. But part of it is also his vision and acceleration. 

 

Devon Achane.. There is something really special about him that I think gives him a VERY real shot of breaking out in the NFL. He will make you miss. He will get up to the LoS. Plant and put you in a blender with ease. He changes directions REALLY quickly He has this stutter-stop move where he stutters his feet and almost comes to a full stop and the next thing you know he's five yards by you. He is athletically special. My pause on Achane, though is his size. Can he take the NFL beating? I don't know. But he has some excellent vision. 

 

Chase Brown. He actually seems to play similarly to Achane, except he's bigger. He runs through defenders as well as around them. He fits himself into small holes and EXPLODES through. There is a reason I highlighted explodes. Arm tackles rarely bring him down on first contact and his strides are much longer than they seem. He's not a destroyer of worlds style back like Charbonnet, but this guy plays a violent brand of ball that I am completely on board with. 

 

Israel Abanikanda. He is by no means fast twitch. He isn't going to shake very many dudes out of their cleats or wow them with his electric speed. That's not who or what he is as a player. This dude is a football player, though. Running style is smooth and has a long stride with great balance. Guys can hawk him from behind but he has such a good base they may not bring him down. He has no problem laying down a shoulder, either. I think this is a "steal" pick. Someone is going to get him in the mid to late rounds of the draft and they are going to be very happy with him. I think he lacks the speed to be a higher rated back, but he isn't slow. I wasn't very impressed with his pass protection or receiving ability, though. And while you don't need to be a high end receiving back in the NFL (and most of them turn out to be fairly mediocre NFL players save Kamara and McCaffrey, both of which are great as runners), those things are going to drop him a bit. 

 

Dewayne McBride. Lol. Yes. Lol. Maybe people have mentioned him. I don't know. But I'm not sure how the hell people haven't talked more about this guy. Holy cow this dude is an absolute specimen. His cut to stiff arm to ball protection transitions are smooth as hell. The way he uses his free hand is special. The way he uses his vision in the second and third levels and beyond is special. The way he runs through tackle attempts and uses a hop move but does it in a way where he barely breaks stride is disgusting. In pass pro he sticks his head in there and can make dudes pay for showing it. Hands catcher. Violent. He led the nation in yards after contact at 4.72. Want to talk about a dude who is going to be a dude? It's this guy. Put him on your radar and ****ing leave him there. 

 

Tank Bigsby.  He runs through contact, one cut runs. He runs, he catches, he finishes and he can pass protect. He runs a bit upright and he isn't as violent as the other guys, but he is a good overall back. 

 

It's amazing to me that I like all ten of these guys. This is the strongest group as a whole in the draft class aside from corner, in my opinion. And because RBs are sometimes thought to be a dime a dozen I think there is a very good chance we can come away with an Antonio Gibson replacement/JD McKissick replacement in the mid rounds and not feel like we overreached. This class is absolutely loaded at RB. 

 

1. Bijan Robinson

2. Jahmyr Gibbs

3. DeWayne McBride (Give me some more time with him and he may be 2 soon)

4. Zach Charbonnet

5. Chase Brown

6. Devon Achane

7. Sean Tucker

9. Zach Evans

9. Israel Abanikanda

10. Tank Bigsby

 

34 minutes ago, method man said:

 

This center class is probably lacking a guy who is going to be a high end All Pro type but do you think some of these guys are Day 1 starters that can at least provide you, say, a Tyler Biadasz level of play?

 

No, not really. I think Tippman, Wypler and Schmitz can probably start at day 1, but they aren't Biadasz. Stromberg is a player though, I think. I think he can start and be a nuisance. 

 

I think we can get a center in this draft, fairly late too, that would be an upgrade to what we wound up having most of the season at the position. But Roullier will still be a better player than most if not all of these dudes if healthy. But I think we can get a damn solid insurance policy for this year and a starter for their sophomore season. I'm rolling with Stromberg as my guy there, though. 

[Going Commando]

11 hours ago, method man said:

 

This center class is probably lacking a guy who is going to be a high end All Pro type but do you think some of these guys are Day 1 starters that can at least provide you, say, a Tyler Biadasz level of play?

 

Looks like Biadasz only started four games as a rookie.  Got only 2 AV for that season, so it seems like his rookie year impact was negligible.  Then the past two seasons he's started every game but one and provided 7 AV each season which is solid starter level play.  I loved him as a prospect because of his run blocking, and looks like that's carried over to the next level as he tied for fifth in run block win rate among center's this year, and tied for second in 2021.

 

Biadasz was a really good player in college, won the Rimington as a RS junior and was an All American that year.  He ended up being a fourth round pick, but I'm almost positive I had him in my top 40 that year.  If we're using him as a baseline for center prospect quality, that feels kind of high.  Olu Olawatimi seems like the only prospect who is cresting that bar this year.  Steve Avila comes close, but he didn't win the Rimington.  But neither of those players are very highly ranked on any of the big boards I see.  Neither have made the top 100 on the Athletic's or the Draft Network's top 100 boards and Oluwatimi just barely made it on CBS's at 96th (Avila is ranked 197 there, so he is probably on the fringes of the draft).  On Dane Brugler's positional rankings, Olu is at the bottom of the 15 deep IOL rankings and Avila is not ranked.  So this is not going to be one of those easy to project years where the best players at the center position in college are easily translatable to the NFL like it was with say, Linderbaum or Biadasz or Ryan Kelly.

 

EDIT: Actually I was wrong about Brugler's top 15, Avila is #5 in his IOL rankings.  I missed him before.  Maybe he's a much better NFL prospect than I originally thought?  I haven't watched his cut ups yet to form a take of my own.

Edited January 27, 2023 by Going Commando

[Zim489]

 

Fantastic ball skills and seems to really love using the boundaries as an extra defender 

[Ball Security]

12 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Kaleb Hayes, haven't watched him yet.

 

 

 

 

 

He’ll be in his age 24 season in 2023.  Is that a concern at all?  Not just him, but others who have played an extra year or two college with the COVID exemptions.  I’d imagine not for the mid to late picks, but should it be a consideration for your early picks?

[Warhead36]

Banks in round 2 would be good if we go TE or OL in round 1.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Banks in round 2 would be good if we go TE or OL in round 1.

 

Judging by mocks, doubt he's there in the 2nd but maybe early 2nd.  But combine will be a game changer especially at CB, will see. 

 

Kiper is a big fan of his, he talked about him in a podcast.  Watched a PFF guy talk about him, said he's feisty and tough but doesn't play the ball enough.  Just one career pick.

 

He's on my list of players to watch for sure.

Edited January 27, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

The idea of three TEs going in the first might not be that crazy.  One major mock had that, forgetting which one.  Maybe DJ?   Plenty have two.  I am guessing more likely one in the first and two in the early 2nd.

 

I was just listening to Nagy talk about Luke Musgrave.  He thinks he's going to kill it at the Senior Bowl and expects him to run in the 4.4's.  I've said previously, I need to see Musgrave and Washington if I'd be into either in the late first or even early 2nd -- kill it at the combine.  Sounds like there is a good shot both do so.

 

Musgrave has really freakish long legs.  If he runs in the 4.4's considering his size that starts to border Kyle Pitts level freakish athleticism.  Decent blocker too but IMO a bit overrated on that front, average IMO blocker from what I saw.  Really soft hands, big catch radius.  Made Feldman's freak list.

 

Heck some like DJ have Kincaid as the top TE.  I don't agree with him on that.  But the top 4 TEs might go earlish in this draft.

 

And to ward off the people who think teams are fools to take TEs early, I get it, I don't want to debate that again, I am sick of that discussion 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 27, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[method man]

1 hour ago, Going Commando said:

 

Looks like Biadasz only started four games as a rookie.  Got only 2 AV for that season, so it seems like his rookie year impact was negligible.  Then the past two seasons he's started every game but one and provided 7 AV each season which is solid starter level play.  I loved him as a prospect because of his run blocking, and looks like that's carried over to the next level as he tied for fifth in run block win rate among center's this year, and tied for second in 2021.

 

Biadasz was a really good player in college, won the Rimington as a RS junior and was an All American that year.  He ended up being a fourth round pick, but I'm almost positive I had him in my top 40 that year.  If we're using him as a baseline for center prospect quality, that feels kind of high.  Olu Olawatimi seems like the only prospect who is cresting that bar this year.  Steve Avila comes close, but he didn't win the Rimington.  But neither of those players are very highly ranked on any of the big boards I see.  Neither have made the top 100 on the Athletic's or the Draft Network's top 100 boards and Oluwatimi just barely made it on CBS's at 96th (Avila is ranked 197 there, so he is probably on the fringes of the draft).  On Dane Brugler's positional rankings, Olu is at the bottom of the 15 deep IOL rankings and Avila is not ranked.  So this is not going to be one of those easy to project years where the best players at the center position in college are easily translatable to the NFL like it was with say, Linderbaum or Biadasz or Ryan Kelly.

 

EDIT: Actually I was wrong about Brugler's top 15, Avila is #5 in his IOL rankings.  I missed him before.  Maybe he's a much better NFL prospect than I originally thought?  I haven't watched his cut ups yet to form a take of my own.

I remember that year that Biadasz dropping to rd 4 was a bit of a surprise because he had a rd 2-3 grade by many. Dallas ultimately got good value by getting themselves an average starting center early Day 3. 

I think for a guy to be able to start Day 1 at the position, he needs to have a lot of experience, decent at a minimum starting functional strength and needs to be a brainiac. Schmitz and Stromberg seem to fit all three. 
 

This center class reminds me a bit of the QB class from last year - a lot of guys with seemingly higher floors but capped ceilings due to athletic deficiencies or something else. From a tools standpoint, Tippman seems to have the best but he is simply too tall for the position and that is going to likely hurt his upside

[Dark Acre]

CB then OL, all day, every day, particularly tackles.