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2023 Comprehensive Draft Thread

zCommander

By zCommander
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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

 

 

Washington I can't move past the Mercedes Lewis comparison. 

 

 

If he runs a 4.85 like Mercedes I'd be out.  But some think he can run in the 4.6's.  He looks like a freak athlete but if he doesn't test like one, I'd be out.

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Koolblue13

Koolblue13

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Yeah Mayer is a true Y and if you are looking for a safe pick at TE IMO he's that dude. 

 

Some say Musgrave can be a good Y because of his size but IMO he's just ok as a blocker at best.    Washington IMO is even a better blocker than Mayer, and is a true Y, but is a work in progress as a receiver.  Kincaid is a pure F-TE.

 

The combine may elevate both Musgrave and Washington in particular.

 

In the 2nd round range, I'd love Washington.  I can't recall watching a TE who can block on the 2nd level like him -- with that kind of speed and power.  That kind of blocking helps facilitate explosive plays.  And he's getting better as a receiver too. 

 

I noticed some of the draft media has Musgrave as the #2 TE, some have Kincaid not as many have Washington.  For me I think its Washington but I'll wait for the combine. 

 

 

 

I can't tell if Washington is indeed a unicorn with that size and speed or what. I mean he's basically a receiving Tackle which doesn't exist.  :ols:

 

If he develops into a legit playmaker, he's worthy of being in the 1rst round, if he doesn't he would be a day 3 pick.

 

Really tough to gauge him. I wouldn't draft him, where he will get drafted.

 

If I couldn't get Mayer in the 1rst, I'd be happy with Musgrave in the 3rd.

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

If he runs a 4.85 like Mercedes I'd be out.  But some think he can run in the 4.6's.  He looks like a freak athlete but if he doesn't test like one, I'd be out.

He doesn't get separation on the passing plays that are there. He doesn't run away from anyone and if he plans to use his size to beat defenders in the NFL, there are plenty of athletic LBers who take that away.

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I can't tell if Washington is indeed a unicorn with that size and speed or what. I mean he's basically a receiving Tackle which doesn't exist.  :ols:

 

If he develops into a legit playmaker, he's worthy of being in the 1rst round, if he doesn't he would be a day 3 pick.

 

Really tough to gauge him. I wouldn't draft him, where he will get drafted.

 

 

I haven't been able to find more than one game for Musgrave so while I liked what I saw its tough for me to fall hard until I get my hands on more material.  Love his size, catch radius.  If he blows up the combine as some suspect I can be sold on him.

 

Yeah having Washington sprinting down the field on the 2nd level -- is like having an extra O lineman but with better wheels for the run game.  He's also no joke as a pass blocker.

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I just don't see a world we need a tight end who isn't a high end blue chip guy. We have mid tier developmental types across the roster.

 

Agree you need one who stands out or its not a need. Logan Paulsen has watched the TEs in practice -- likes the potential of Armani Rogers and Turner, he thinks they have potental this coming season.  

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Going Commando

Going Commando

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Posted

Darnell Washington has 45 catches in his entire college career.  He is probably going to take an eternity to develop into a strong receiver.  He should be like a third round project for a regime that has a lot of time and flexibility to develop him.

 

Mayer is the only first round option for us at TE.  I think he's going to be the only one who is good as a rookie.

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

Why zone? When BSJ was healthy we played, I think, the 5th most man coverage in the league?

 

I am not fixated on zone.  But to address that point, I know Keim said we play a lot of zone, he talked about it in the context of the previous season they played better when they shifted back to more zone.  I've not studied it myself to dicipher what they did.  This web site that tracks it said we played the 6th most zone last season in the league.

 

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/which-nfl-teams-play-most-zone-coverage-the-most-this-year

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
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14 minutes ago, Chump Bailey said:

Alright, I goofed on Broderick Jones. He likely has the best power and feet combo of the bunch, but still lunges quite a bit. He's now my #3 overall. Please don't revoke my Junior GM card fellas :)

 

I still like Blake Freeland a lot more than most.

 

I get the hesitation about him but he moves so fluidly both in pass protection and the run game.  You are betting on potential.  He hasn't played the spot for long.  Athleticism matters more for tackle than most spots.

 

I like Blake Freeland, wrote a quick report on him if I recall about a month ago.  Big dude, looks athletic.   Didn't give up a sack.  Is tall and plays a bit upright -- my concern is do some slippery edge rushers with wicked swim moves, etc give him issues in the pros?   But I'd roll the dice on him.  

 

I like Bergeron-Wright-Harrison more.  But he's in that next tier for me with Dawand Jones.   That 2nd round range IMO is fruitful for tackle its part of the reason why I don't want to force it in the first.

 

 

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KDawg

KDawg

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Posted
52 minutes ago, Chump Bailey said:

Alright, I goofed on Broderick Jones. He likely has the best power and feet combo of the bunch, but still lunges quite a bit. He's now my #3 overall. Please don't revoke my Junior GM card fellas :)

 

I still like Blake Freeland a lot more than most.


I have him (Jones) at 2 but there will be some ebb and flow with my rankings. Always is every year. 
 

And you are allowed to change your views. I wasn’t high on Dotson until about 5 days before the draft last year. Then I was watching and said, “holy ****… this dude is wide receiver 4 for me”.

 

Sometimes you watch a guy in the wrong frame of mind. I try to watch guys a few times during the process and I document most of it here to kind of show my personal ebb and flow. 
 

I’m giving myself some space from Skoronski and will rewatch him after watching the IOL and tackles I haven’t watched yet… see if that changes my thoughts on him.

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Chump Bailey

Chump Bailey

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I’m giving myself some space from Skoronski and will rewatch him after watching the IOL and tackles I haven’t watched yet… see if that changes my thoughts on him.

 

I think I will take that approach as well. He is the consensus #1 pretty much everywhere I look. 

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
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Actually speaing of Blake Freeland just watched Ryan Hayes, similar build to Freeland, tall and lanky. 

 

Not bad. mid rounder type.  Solid.  Reminds my of Steen who i think will be in that same range in the draft, I'd go Steen over him because he comes off to me more athletic.  Hayes has the chance though to jump up boards by showcasing what he can do at the Senior Bowl.  Jack of all trades IMO, master of none.

 

Solid in pass protection, mirrors, anchors, recovers well.  Against Ohio state he rarely faced Zach Harrison but when he did, he did fine against him albeit Harrison on some plays was a handful. 

 

In the run game, he gets in front of his assignment.  Not blown away by him in the run game though, he seems assignment sound but he doesn't really maul in short yardage with some exceptions and he doesn't motor down the field on the 2nd level to the extent he stood out to me.

 

Strikes me as one of those sort of in between prospects where you wouldn't be surpised if he went earlier than expected or for that matter late in the draft -- I need to see his combine because unlike some of the others I've watched his athleticism is hard for me to guage. 

 

Nagy touts his ability to get out there in space, i didn't see it so much but sometimes that's just a function of what games you watch.  He's sort of TBD for me.  Hard to land on an answer but I saw enough to see him as potentiallly a solid player.

 

Ex-TE at LT usually means high upside as to athleticism.  He's playing in the Senior Bowl so he will be showcased, will see.  I watched an interview too and heard Harbaugh talk about him, seems high character, solid person.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Always A Commander Never A Captain

Always A Commander Never A Captain

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am not fixated on zone.  But to address that point, I know Keim said we play a lot of zone, he talked about it in the context of the previous season they played better when they shifted back to more zone.  I've not studied it myself to dicipher what they did.  This web site that tracks it said we played the 6th most zone last season in the league.

 

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/which-nfl-teams-play-most-zone-coverage-the-most-this-year

 

Not you, the twitter guy you linked clearly is though. He even capitalized 'ZONE' for emphasis. But I don't think that makes sense.

 

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Skinsinparadise

Skinsinparadise

Posted
Posted (edited)

Steve Avilia.  The media draftniks seem to like him.  He is more of an old school, big bodied O lineman.   I think a dude like M. Parsons if they rush him inside would give him fits. 

 

Played center the previous season.  Played guard this year.  If they are looking for shorter guys on the interior as Keim says is a possibility, he fits at 6 '3, some say 6'4.  So average height.  If Rivera wants position flex, he brings that.

 

Bowling ball physique.  It's like Vita Vea at guard.  Weird that he has a bad grade from PFF at power (gap) and better grade for zone.  I didn't care enough to compare him in both schemes.

 

I watched a game at guard and a game at center.  He has a better PFF grade for the year he played center. And of the two games I watched he to my eyes played better at center.

 

Strong upper body, stout when he anchors in pass protection.  Can maul in the run game but doesn't move as well as I'd like which makes sense considering his weight.  He's kind of like the Dawand Jones of guards in this group of players.  Like Dawand i'd like to see him lose weight to improve his movement in space.   Dawand IMO moves better in space versus Avilia even though he weighs more than him.

 

Decent balance for a dude that size.  Hard dude to overpower on the interior not just because of his size but has strong hands and strong upper body.  Pass rushers with some agility and speed can get by him on stunts.  "Meh" on the 2nd level for obvious reasons why is lack of speed. 

 

For me its no unless he lost 10 pounds.  I like more athleticism from my O lineman.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Going Commando

Going Commando

Posted
Posted

Kiper has Deonte Banks and Emmanuel Forbes in the first round, but not Cam Smith or Kelee Ringo.  Interesting.

 

This CB class is all over the place.  CBs 1-10 rankings are completely up for grabs, but I do see some consensus forming around Witherspoon as CB1.  Let's see what he runs at the combine to determine if that consensus lasts.  I have a feeling Ringo and Gonzalez are going to kill the 40 and get people to rethink them.

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