The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[skinsfan66]

7 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

Wentz backers?

 

NONE OF THOSE EXIST.

 

Why are we even continuing this? It's over. [REDACTED] and Wentz are gone. Move on. Between this and the name change and the last time we are relevant we are always looking in the rearview as a fanbase.

 

Move forward.

Then why keep on hitting Taylor for all QB problems, everyone knows he is not or was the starter, some believe he will be a good backup though.  Wentz and the other castoffs were the problem $, Draft Picks and Lousy play. Can people just get over that?   No need to hold that against Taylor he earned his backup/spot starter money, he is what he is. He has been the best QB here the last 3 years like it or not, that's a fact and the team would have been better without other teams high $ castoffs . Howell &Taylor > Castoffs & Howell my opinion.  I will change Wentz supporters to Castoff supporters as I move when it comes to bashing QB's. 

[Koolblue13]

3 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

Then why keep on hitting Taylor for all QB problems, everyone knows he is not or was the starter, some believe he will be a good backup though.  Wentz and the other castoffs were the problem $, Draft Picks and Lousy play. Can people just get over that?   No need to hold that against Taylor he earned his backup/spot starter money, he is what he is. He has been the best QB here the last 3 years like it or not, that's a fact and the team would have been better without other teams high $ castoffs . Howell &Taylor > Castoffs & Howell my opinion.  I will change Wentz supporters to Castoff supporters as I move when it comes to bashing QB's. 

 

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

Then why keep on hitting Taylor for all QB problems, everyone knows he is not or was the starter, some believe he will be a good backup though.  Wentz and the other castoffs were the problem $, Draft Picks and Lousy play. Can people just get over that?   No need to hold that against Taylor he earned his backup/spot starter money, he is what he is. He has been the best QB here the last 3 years like it or not, that's a fact and the team would have been better without other teams high $ castoffs . Howell &Taylor > Castoffs & Howell my opinion.  I will change Wentz supporters to Castoff supporters as I move when it comes to bashing QB's. 

 

 

 

[bearrock]

If the past few days of this thread is what next year is gonna be, I think it's time to move on from Heinicke.  He may be a credible back up (or he may not), but the juice ain't worth the squeeze.  Ride with Howell and if he craters, just tank for a premier pick.

[FootballZombie]

22 minutes ago, bearrock said:

Ride with Howell and if he craters, just tank for a premier pick.

 

After what was seen this year do you think there is a possibility to get a top pick outside of half the team catching the bubonic plague?

 

We just rode other-worldly bad QB play to an almost playoff birth. I don't think Howell, or any QB for that matter, can drag this team down that far. The surrounding roster is too strong. This year was a showcase of how this roster looks wearing cement shoes. We will be in basically the same spot draft wise next year as we are this year, and I don't expect a lame duck FO to stockpile for the future to put us in better position to trade up.

 

 

[Koolblue13]

People wanted Wentz in the offseason, because he may have been good.

 

Then he started good and then wasn't good and got injured.

 

Heinickie played and then got worse again and Wentz got healthy.

 

People were excited that Wentz might be good again.

 

He wasn't and we went to howell.

 

At NO POINT did a single fan on this board, try and make is seem like Wentz didn't suck or that Wentz shouldn't have been benched.

 

There is NO SUCH THING as a Carson Wentz Fan Boy.

 

You have delusional Holers who think Sneakers was doing a great job or should have been put back in after Wentz sucked.

 

And you have people that wished Howell started sooner.

[goskins10]

Why are we still talking Wentz vs Taylor? There are no, and I repeat NO Wentz supporters. This segment simply does not exist!!  So please let it go! 

 

Things we know, or at least should know: 

Wentz is gone and good riddence - most eveyone wanted howell to replace Taylor and well before the Browns not Wentz. 

Taylor is most likely gone - esp now that Scott T is gone. Gave a nice little spark midseason but it fizzled out due to bad QB play. That's what happens with backups. 

Howell will have a chance to be the starter - some competition will be brought in and it should be. 

 

So, to what should be the conversation, it should be Howell and then the door is open. What I would do is bring in a cheapish veteran - I have always been a Teddy Bridgewater fan, but there are others - and then draft a 2nd tier rookie. This allows them to focus on Oline in the draft and FAs. 

[Jumbo]

We're getting to the point where I'm going to revive an old es mod tradition and just cull the herd.

 

It won't be the old suicide by mod shtick that's been done in the past. It may be the intervention where you direct somebody's next post to be one that absolutely proves some uber repetitious dumbass contention that's become a problem.

 

It nay be using clauses from rule 18 put there for situations where the saturation of some form of repetitive idiocy that's continually lowering the quality of the conversation continues unabated despite countless "nice" as well as "harsh" mod posts warning of there being a problem.

 

If you wonder who has the purview to make such subjective judgements and actually enforce them by closing member accounts than you haven't read or understood the rules and guidelines.

 

I know who the guys are who won't stop and the next time I see any one of them post heinie bs they're real likely to be gone via the above.

 

I'm not saying you can't post anything on heinie. I'm saying that those with the problem need to be very careful about WHAT they post about him and avoid the kind of crap that's been consistently called out by me, as well as others.

 

This is a moderator post on board management, not a members opinion post.

 

Sorry, not sorry. 

[method man]

One of the draft guys I really like is Jordan Reid who is at ESPN now. He would have given Howell a 3rd round grade in this draft and thinks his upside is 18-22 ranked QB. He pointed out that turnovers and reading half the field vs full field in Longo’s Air Raid system as issues

[Koolblue13]

9 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

 

 

This is a moderator post on board management, not a members opinion post.

 

Sorry, not sorry. 

I see you boo. I gotchu back.

[Jumbo]

3 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I see you boo. I gotchu back.

 Oh jeesbus. Kiss of death. 

 

 

To everyone:

 

Also avoid gratuitously slamming heine or baiting his cult. Just let it all go. At least for  a few months. 

[KDawg]

Back on topic:

 

Howell will need a similar backup to his skillset.

 

I think there are guys in the draft who can fit the mold: Duggan, Haener, maybe Bennett to the extent his legs can carry him, maybe Hendon Hooker, definitely Anthony Richardson but I think that's a move too rich for us.

 

There aren't as many FA options who fit that role. 

 

There's a few. But not many. 

 

I would think you'd want a similar style of player regardless of who the OC is, but the OC hire is going to dictate if the OC has a preference of a QB to bring in with him that fits that mold. 

[zCommander]

@Koolblue13 wasn't even thinking about Fromm. But the knock on him is his arm strength though.  But we do have a good defense and a great running game though. 

 

 

Here's the conclusion from Bleacher Report's Matt Miller in his Fromm scouting report:

 

"Fromm is a low-risk, low-reward quarterback who would be ideal for a team with a great defense and a good run game. He won't turn the ball over, but he also won't create many big plays on his own. Fromm's limited athleticism and arm strength will create a belief that he's a game manager. That could work in the right fit, but at worst he's a high-level backup who can win games if pressed into action."

[method man]

2 minutes ago, zCommander said:

@Koolblue13 wasn't even thinking about Fromm. But the knock on him is his arm strength though.  But we do have a good defense and a great running game though. 

 

 

Here's the conclusion from Bleacher Report's Matt Miller in his Fromm scouting report:

 

"Fromm is a low-risk, low-reward quarterback who would be ideal for a team with a great defense and a good run game. He won't turn the ball over, but he also won't create many big plays on his own. Fromm's limited athleticism and arm strength will create a belief that he's a game manager. That could work in the right fit, but at worst he's a high-level backup who can win games if pressed into action."

After his performance for the Giants in 2021, i have no idea why Fromm is on the team. He sucks

[NewCliche21]

1 minute ago, method man said:

After his performance for the Giants in 2021, i have no idea why Fromm is on the team. He sucks

 

I don't follow college, but I swear somebody a few years ago was saying that this kid was going to be an under-the-radar superstar, or maybe that he was a freshman phenom like Johnny Football?  Can someone who knows college let me know if that were ever the case?

It reminded me of, but not to the same extent, that QB from Michigan State that oldfan was pushing YEARS ago. oldfan had a plethora of data for his prediction, but that didn't turn out.  Can't remember that QB's name.

[goskins10]

 

1 minute ago, method man said:

After his performance for the Giants in 2021, i have no idea why Fromm is on the team. He sucks

 

In fairness he was on the practice squad and thus the 4th QB. Pickings get slim when looking for QB4 without spending more than you should. He is basically signed for the league minimum. Is he still on the team when the season starts? I kind of =doubt it but if it's still in that QB4 range then it's not a big deal. 

[Koolblue13]

4 minutes ago, method man said:

After his performance for the Giants in 2021, i have no idea why Fromm is on the team. He sucks

That's the video I posted second post at the top. 

 

Fromm highlights are one drive last year.

[Spaceman Spiff]

1 hour ago, bearrock said:

If the past few days of this thread is what next year is gonna be, I think it's time to move on from Heinicke.  He may be a credible back up (or he may not), but the juice ain't worth the squeeze.  Ride with Howell and if he craters, just tank for a premier pick.

 

It's kind of hard to look at this roster and want to tank.  We've got a pretty solid defense, weapons on offense...yes, the O-line needs an upgrade but, as noted previously, we were in playoff contention with mediocre to bad quarterback play throughout the season.  I hate the terms "win now" or "this is our window" but I think that applies here.  

 

Depending on what develops over the offseason I can see riding with Howell into the season and being comfortable with it.  But if he doesn't produce next year and if the QB situation isn't solved, then we're wasting time with this group that we have, IMO.  

[zCommander]

3 minutes ago, NewCliche21 said:

 

I don't follow college, but I swear somebody a few years ago was saying that this kid was going to be an under-the-radar superstar, or maybe that he was a freshman phenom like Johnny Football?  Can someone who knows college let me know if that were ever the case?

It reminded me of, but not to the same extent, that QB from Michigan State that oldfan was pushing YEARS ago. oldfan had a plethora of data for his prediction, but that didn't turn out.  Can't remember that QB's name.

 

From the same article I was reading it also said: 

 

"Jake Fromm Praised by Anonymous NFL Exec: 'He'll Play 10 to 12 Years'"

 

Maybe that is what you were thinking. 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

I like how Wentz looks in Dallas' colors.  

 

Edited January 25, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[NewCliche21]

6 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

From the same article I was reading it also said: 

 

"Jake Fromm Praised by Anonymous NFL Exec: 'He'll Play 10 to 12 Years'"

 

Maybe that is what you were thinking. 

 

 

Oh duh, might help if I clicked the article, thanks!  I think I'm right, found this in your link

 

Quote

—Regressed throughout his career at Georgia and never built on freshman-season momentum, when his football IQ and accuracy were promising.

 

Must've been something freshman year and then flamed out

 

Thanks again for redirecting me to your link!

[Chris 44]

20 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I like how Wentz looks in Dallas' colors.  

 

Yeah if only Wentz had at least average receivers in Washington he probably would have made the pro bowl. All he needed was some weapons, cant anyone else see that?

[SkinsFTW]

45 minutes ago, Chris 44 said:

Yeah if only Wentz had at least average receivers in Washington he probably would have made the pro bowl. All he needed was some weapons, cant anyone else see that?

 

If you put Wince behind the 91 Redskins OL and with those weapons he may have won the SB.

 

Too bad nobody has an OL anywhere near that good anymore. 

Edited January 25, 2023 by SkinsFTW

[zCommander]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I like how Wentz looks in Dallas' colors.  

 

Well white and blue has been good for him. Burgundy and gold not so much lol

[MartinC]

1 hour ago, method man said:

One of the draft guys I really like is Jordan Reid who is at ESPN now. He would have given Howell a 3rd round grade in this draft and thinks his upside is 18-22 ranked QB. He pointed out that turnovers and reading half the field vs full field in Longo’s Air Raid system as issues

How many true full field reads are there in a modern NFL offense? And what actually IS a full field read anyway? (Obviously this will vary from system to system, OC to OC and sometimes play to play). 

 

If you use a lot of play action that is almost alway a half field read for a start. If its drop back that is often pick a side to work pre snap based on coverage (man beater to one side, zone beater to the other side) or matchup and then work a progression to that side which is often a high/low decision based on one or maybe two defenders with sometimes a hot read as a blitz control if a certain defender rushes and is 'owned' by the QB (after confirming your pre-snap read which is normally done by reading the rotation of the safeties) . Some systems are pure progression many are a hybrid of progression based on coverage and, again normally you are only actually working one side of the field or one concept with a check down.

 

I am not saying that its easy - but its also not rocket science. An awful lot of 'complex' NFL concepts end up being a high/low read on a single defender. The trick is getting your eyes to the right place and then allowing things to happen almost subconsciously.