All things defense

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, No Nonsense said:

We’ll see if he survives 3 losing seasons. What has Rivera done previous to coming here? He reminds me of Jeff Fisher. A mediocre coach living off of one Super Bowl appearance many years ago that he loss. No use of delaying the inevitable. If they want to keep him in a management roll, fine. But if he has another losing season, he should not be untouchable. 
 

As for reeling in good coaches to mediocre franchises? I don’t buy that. There’s some luck involved, but you go out and find the next good, young offensive of coordinator and hire him and stop being lazy and going after a named brand coach. 

Good luck getting them to pick Washington with Snyder at the helm.

[CjSuAvE22]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Good luck getting them to pick Washington with Snyder at the helm.

Theres literally a ton of them in the league that were all under snyder at some point. I dont care how much “honor” and “respect” rivera brings here, losing seasons year after year is unacceptable. at least with gruden there were some winning seasons , i do think if bruce allen wasnt involved gruden would have been more successful. 

[No Nonsense]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Good luck getting them to pick Washington with Snyder at the helm.

I know what Dan Snyder is, but I’m not too sure if potential coaches really look at it like that. Especially if they think they’re walking into some talent. 

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

Theres literally a ton of them in the league that were all under snyder at some point. I dont care how much “honor” and “respect” rivera brings here, losing seasons year after year is unacceptable. at least with gruden there were some winning seasons , i do think if bruce allen wasnt involved gruden would have been more successful. 

I love the hope. Keep it alive.

 

3 minutes ago, No Nonsense said:

I know what Dan Snyder is, but I’m not too sure if potential coaches really look at it like that. Especially if they think they’re walking into some talent. 

 

They do. Talent being there is helpful. Lack of a franchise level QB is not and Wentz is seen as a league wide joke true or not.

 

Now… if we bottom out and get the first pick? Yeah. We can snag someone with a ton of potential. But this team never bottoms out in QB years.

[CjSuAvE22]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I love the hope. Keep it alive.

 

 

 

What exactly am i suppose to be hopeful for? Its year 3 and there are no clear upgrades on the roster we are sticking with lame duck coordinators and the past 3 drafts have been suspect at best. If its not riveras fault than whose fault is it?

[KDawg]

9 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

What exactly am i suppose to be hopeful for? Its year 3 and there are no clear upgrades on the roster we are sticking with lame duck coordinators and the past 3 drafts have been suspect at best. If its not riveras fault than whose fault is it?

That you think Rivera would be removed AND upgraded.

[kingdaddy]

6 hours ago, No Nonsense said:

Exactly. I don’t see how Rivera is “as safe as can be.” Any coach should be on the hot seat after potentially 3 losing seasons in a row. 

Because he represents much more than wins and losses. He represents as a credible, well respected career NFL guy who puts a good face on a dumpster fire of an organization. Dan needs guys like RR...at least thats how I see it.

Edited August 21, 2022 by kingdaddy
typo

[NoCalMike]

I brought it up during the gameday thread and I'll reiterate it here despite not saying it's a blanket excuse for the entire performance on defense, however Andy Reid said he was using Week 2 as their season tuneup, which likely means Mahommes is done until Week 1. When you looked at him out there he looked in midseason form the way he was eluding pressure, moving around to buy extra time in the pocket.  He was out there to sling it around, look sharp, and get off the field ASAP.   Mahommes does thing only 2-3 other QBs can do at an elite level consistently.  That wasn't Daniel Jones auditioning to keep his starting role.

 

Now like I said it isn't a blanket excuse for every single play, however the Chiefs offense was clearly driven in that game by Mahommes abilities.  

[Leonard Washington]

2 hours ago, Alexa said:

they don't have a top QB. If we switched qb's w/ KC this would be a totally different team. It would be a top 5 offense. 

No argument there but the Panthers' QBs had no trouble either.

[Alexa]

4 hours ago, KDawg said:

I think you missed the phrase “bounce back year”

I just don't see how. How are they going to bounce back when they were really never any good in the first place? What are they bouncing back from? 

[NoVaSkins21]

 Defense looks far worse than last year and it looks like the offense may have to outscore teams to win games.

[Captain James]

13 minutes ago, NoVaSkins21 said:

 Defense looks far worse than last year and it looks like the offense may have to outscore teams to win games.

Ok John Madden 🤣

[KDawg]

19 minutes ago, Alexa said:

I just don't see how. How are they going to bounce back when they were really never any good in the first place? What are they bouncing back from? 

He is an extremely talented defensive end who has extremely high potential. He hasn’t lived up to it, but he can bounce back to earning his draft status.

[NoVaSkins21]

1 minute ago, Captain James said:

Ok John Madden 🤣

That's a pretty sad predicament given the offense hasn't shown anything in the preseason.

[Skinsinparadise]

6 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

 

 

Again, not worried about guys like Fuller or Curl. They didn't have their best days yesterday, but they're proven guys and they'll be good to go come regular season. But Holcomb and Davis were once again ghosts and we know LB is a weak link and they showed nothing to prove otherwise. DL looked fine yesterday and should be even better if/when Del Rio starts mixing in some blitzes, and of course the eventual return of Young. 

 

I haven't watched Holcomb but I did Davis, and he was far from a ghost.  I posted this on the game thread.  But I gather it works here too.

 

Davis was very active in this game.  Run stopping.  Coverage.  Pass rushing.   Impressve IMO.  I am glad I rewatched the first two drives and just zoned in on him -- it gives me hope that the praise he's getting from those watching practice and from coaches about him isn't just fluff. 

 

That below is just from the first two drives against the Cheifs first team. 

 

 

Edited August 21, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[50yrSKINSfan]

5 hours ago, KDawg said:

I love the hope. Keep it alive.

 

 

They do. Talent being there is helpful. Lack of a franchise level QB is not and Wentz is seen as a league wide joke true or not.

 

Now… if we bottom out and get the first pick? Yeah. We can snag someone with a ton of potential. But this team never bottoms out in QB years.

We did bottom out when 2 good QBs were available but the brilliant people in charge chose to take a overrated pass rusher instead. Now one of those QBs is lighting it up on the west coast. Then you wonder why we stink year after year, lol.

[Conn]

31 minutes ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

We did bottom out when 2 good QBs were available but the brilliant people in charge chose to take a overrated pass rusher instead. Now one of those QBs is lighting it up on the west coast. Then you wonder why we stink year after year, lol.

This is incredibly revisionist. Even if we were prepared to pull a Josh Rosen on Haskins (Snyder wasn’t allowing that btw), Herbert was not even remotely considered a real possibility at #2, never mind being some sort of slam dunk option. His rookie performance is one of the most shocking in history, at the time we would have been clowned to hell and back if we took him over the “sure thing” in Young. And in an ideal world, that’s the hard decision you pay Rivera and Co. to make, regardless of public opinion—but again, we don’t live in that world and Haskins was Snyder’s handpicked guy just the year before. It wasn’t happening, and even in a miracle universe where Rivera went against every draftnik in the world and loved Herbert for some reason, Snyder wouldn’t have gone for it. So…where does that leave your argument? 

[philibusters]

Very happy to read in this thread that some of the improvements we are hearing and reading about from Jamin Davis in training camp is translating to the preseason games.  This is my hope---last year he wasn't ready.  This year he is ready but still has a lot to learn and is decent, but in the average range.  Next year he is a better than average Linebacker.

[TheShredder]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I haven't watched Holcomb but I did Davis, and he was far from a ghost.  I posted this on the game thread.  But I gather it works here too.

 

Davis was very active in this game.  Run stopping.  Coverage.  Pass rushing.   Impressve IMO.  I am glad I rewatched the first two drives and just zoned in on him -- it gives me hope that the praise he's getting from those watching practice and from coaches about him isn't just fluff. 

Davis had a decent game. Holcomb is still slow to the tackle too often. Too many gaps aren't filled, consistently. Defensive scheme has too much riding on QB pressures and when they aren't getting there a step or two sooner, the scheme collapses and there's an open guy (a lot of times deep). The TD was a poor blitz by St. Juste that wasn't timed well. I like the play though. 1 guy gets beat and they lost, no problem imo. I liked the aggressive play call and only need to fix execution. Kurl hasn't played intense during pre-season, but he'll be better. I'm definitely in the camp for ultra aggressive defensive play calling as part of the 3rd down solution!

[TheShredder]

48 minutes ago, philibusters said:

Very happy to read in this thread that some of the improvements we are hearing and reading about from Jamin Davis in training camp is translating to the preseason games.  This is my hope---last year he wasn't ready.  This year he is ready but still has a lot to learn and is decent, but in the average range.  Next year he is a better than average Linebacker.

That's the hope anyway. His draft slot is the trigger but he hasn't played good. Combine the two and see the same issues unresolved, then here we are. One game of not being bad doesn't mean problem solved. Still a JAG at this point, 50% player. Hopefully he trends up consistently.

[Renegade7]

7 minutes ago, TheShredder said:

Davis had a decent game. Holcomb is still slow to the tackle too often. 

 

To an extent, that's fine if Davis is indeed improving, Cole only has Davis job as starting middle linebacker because Davis isn't ready yet.

 

Tryin to be optimistic here...

[NoCalMike]

Holcomb is limited physically, his game can improve but only to a certain extent, Jamin Davis is the opposite, he has all the physical tools and athleticism but was more of a raw talent draft pick who needed to learn the x's & o's. 

[TheShredder]

4 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

To an extent, that's fine if Davis is indeed improving, Cole only has Davis job as starting middle linebacker because Davis isn't ready yet.

 

Tryin to be optimistic here...

Well, there's drugs and alcohol if optimism fails once again!

[Skinsinparadise]

 

The idea that Davis wasn't bad or just average, I disagree.  Good game from him IMO.  Not great.  But better than average -- good play IMO.  He got washed up in traffic on a few plays but other that IMO he looked good. 

 

From my watch, some nice run stops.  3 times rushing the passer, 2 where he almost got to Mahomes.  Where he shined IMO in particular was coverage -- he was on his man just about every time.  He looked good to me.  I watched a bunch of his Kentucky games, talked about it plenty of times on the draft thread before that draft.  He wasn't who I wanted at 19.  But it wasn't hard to see what Del-Rio-Rivera who both played the spot saw in him -- rewatching yesterdays' game brought me back to some of his Kentucky games. 

 

I was whining along with everyone else on the game day thread yesterday.  I wasn't feeling glass half full yesterday.  But today rewatching Davis, I felt a bit juiced up and that rewatch made me feel better about yesterday.  And I was juiced not because he wasn't bad -- I was juiced because IMHO he actually looked good.  And it would be one thing if this was all in a vaccum.

 

But for weeks we've been hearing about how he's coming on in practice.  And as most draftniks say, LB is typically one of the slower positions for young players to excel in -- it takes plenty of players at that spot, especially ones who are inexperienced like Jamin, time to get good.