The Official ES 2021 Free Agency Thread / Tracker Fitzpatrick, Curtis Samuel, William Jackson, LB Mayo, C Larsen WR Humphries, CB D. Roberts, KR D. Carter , LT Charles Leno, S Bobby McCain signed

[Est.1974]

2 minutes ago, terpfan said:

Collins is not getting cut this year unless it’s for conduct detrimental to the team. Even cutting him after June 1 this year would result in him counting 16 mil agains the cap this year and almost 10 mil against next year’s cap. Not happening. 

Post June 1 trade for a late pick is possible IMO. Pretty sure that changes the cap hit, but dare say we’d need to eat some salary. So yeah, seems like he gets another season here.

 

I mean, Curl may regress but he was one of the top rated rookies last year. Makes little sense to diminish his role this year to me.

[Koolblue13]

21 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Yeah JDR made it clear Collins is a safety. 

 

He concluded the interview segment on Collins by saying ‘that doesn’t mean he won’t be playing in the box closer to the line is scrimmage, which well at times will be like a LB’ 

 

 

It's a point @KDawg has been trying to explain to people for weeks. 

[Est.1974]

Well the biggest disappointment looks like being we won’t be signing Tre Boston at this rate. That’s was the clubhouse favourite for quite some time...

[Riggo#44]

8 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Post June 1 trade for a late pick is possible IMO. Pretty sure that changes the cap hit, but dare say we’d need to eat some salary. So yeah, seems like he gets another season here.

 

I mean, Curl may regress but he was one of the top rated rookies last year. Makes little sense to diminish his role this year to me.

 

Post June 1 is still a 16m cap hit this year (which is about all we have left). Cutting him after the season is a 9.6 dead cap number, with 6.6 m savings, post June 1 next year is 12m savings...if I read that right.

[terpfan]

4 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Post June 1 trade for a late pick is possible IMO. Pretty sure that changes the cap hit, but dare say we’d need to eat some salary. So yeah, seems like he gets another season here.

 

I mean, Curl may regress but he was one of the top rated rookies last year. Makes little sense to diminish his role this year to don’t see anyone else wanting to take on that contract either.

 

Trading him would save money in the current year. We’d still incur that 9.6m hit in 2022 (although his cap hit would be 16m in 2022 otherwise, so we’d still save money). But we’d lose the option to cut him post June 1 2022 and spread that 9.6 mil hit over 2 years. Debatable how they would prefer to handle that but yeah it’s an option if anyone wanted to take him. I don’t think that’s likely. 
 

But I agree, none of this should mean playing him more than he deserves to, especially over Curl. I think what they like about Curl is that he can play all over the field, which Collins really can’t. Plus it appeases Collins and eases the pressure on Curl to call Collins the starter at SS. I don’t think it’s a bad way of handling it per se, I’m just curious to see how it works on the field. 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

14 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Post June 1 trade for a late pick is possible IMO. Pretty sure that changes the cap hit, but dare say we’d need to eat some salary. So yeah, seems like he gets another season here.

 

I mean, Curl may regress but he was one of the top rated rookies last year. Makes little sense to diminish his role this year to me.

 

I don't necessarily think that Curl's role gets diminished per se. We are in base 4-3 40% of the time and in Nickel or Dime 60% of the time.

 

If only ONE of Collins/CUrl is on the field for base and playing SS ... and if Collins plays 75% of base at SS that is = 30% of total plays. If Curl plays the other 25% of base, that represents 10% of total snaps. Then flip to the nickel packages, where we likely have both on the field. Let's say we are in nickel 40% of the time. So 100% of the time Curl is Buffalo Nickel and Collins is SS. Then in Dime packages, my guess would be Collins comes off, Curl goes to SS, McCain/Reaves/Forrest at FS ... Fuller to the slot CB ... Davis and Holcomb at LB ... if that's 20% of the snaps ... Collins is not on the field ... so 0% and Curl adds 20% to the total snap count by being on the field for all dime packages.

 

So percentage wise ... Curl is on the field 70% of the snaps (10% base, 40% nickel, 20% dime)  ... Collins is on the field 70% of the snaps (30% base, 40% nickel, 0% dime). Both get "rest" by being off the field 30% of the plays, but each is still on the field a strong majority of the time and playing to the package strengths.

 

Admittedly, this seems easy to project on paper but I have no idea if it plays out that way. But I have to think this is how the team would structure the playtime to maximize the skills of both, at least in 2021.

Edited May 7, 2021 by JamesMadisonSkins

[terpfan]

2 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said:

 

Post June 1 is still a 16m cap hit this year (which is about all we have left). Cutting him after the season is a 9.6 dead cap number, with 6.6 m savings, post June 1 next year is 12m savings...if I read that right.

To clarify it isn’t a 16 mil penalty in addition to his current cap hit. But the penalty and his current cap hit are basically equal, meaning we save nothing. 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

7 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said:

 

Post June 1 is still a 16m cap hit this year (which is about all we have left). Cutting him after the season is a 9.6 dead cap number, with 6.6 m savings, post June 1 next year is 12m savings...if I read that right.

 

Well, keep in mind his current cap hit for this year is already baked in, which is $15m or so. So cutting him NOW accelarates an additional $1m onto this year's cap. So really just takes another $1m, not $16m.

 

If he's a post-June 1st cut, that spreads out over 2 years. So his cap hit this year is reduced to $9m instead of $15m. But we have a dead hit of $7m or so next year. If we cut him now, we take on the additional $1m in cap this year, but are completely free of his contract next year, freeing up $16m

[Est.1974]

I like the way we’ve quickly jumped on the OT and DB once released. 
 

Wouldn’t mind a guy like Cameron Brate gets ditched by TB. Still like the prospect of having Ertz on board as well.

[terpfan]

1 minute ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

 

If we cut him now, we take on the additional $1m in cap this year, but are completely free of his contract next year, freeing up $16m

I don’t think is right. Cutting him pre June 1 invokes a 26 million dead cap penalty (!!!) in 2021, so we’d actually lose about 9-10 mil in cap space. 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

So, pause on the Collins contract talk. I don't know if more contract details have come out recently or not, but both Spotrac and Overthecap have changed their salary projections for cutting Collins. I haven't checked since pre-Free Agency but back then there was only $16m guaranteed remaining. Meaning we cut him now and accelerate $1m to this years cap ... or we cut him next year and take that on as an $8m hit (same as post June 1st).

 

Now both are reflecting that there's $26m guaranteed remaining. Which means we cut him now and accelerate about $10m onto this year's cap. So I'm not sure why that changed?

5 minutes ago, terpfan said:

I don’t think is right. Cutting him pre June 1 invokes a 26 million dead cap penalty (!!!) in 2021, so we’d actually lose about 9-10 mil in cap space. 

 

Yep, see my post just now. The numbers on both sites have changed since I had last checked back in February. And those numbers were being reported by media too, which at the time were having the same debate. Cut now and take a bit more cap space, or cut post June 1st and save $6m. Not sure what changed between now and then. If one site had changed I would chalk it up to an error, but I assume both changed because more information became available on the contract? Which seems bizarre.

 

 

 

Did Collins' salary become guaranteed at some date this off-season? That seems to be the difference. Not the guaranteed money, but the fact that now $12.5m of his contract THIS year is guaranteed. It looks like his previous base converted to guaranteed on here and Spotrac?

 

In that case, he's definitely not "cutable" this year. He's still owed about $9.6m beyond 2021, so cutting him after the season would save $7 million or so on 2022 cap.

Edited May 7, 2021 by JamesMadisonSkins

[terpfan]

Hmmm that’s odd. I did find the article you’re referring to from February. But it links to OTC which has the newer set of numbers.
 

Something must have changed or more info must have come out. If it would really only cost us 1-2 mil this year to get out of that contract I think we would have already done it. 
 

EDIT: Saw your update... that makes sense. So it’s possible at some point they could have cut him and taken the small hit to get out of the contract, but they chose not to and now really have to wait until next year. Would make sense why JDR is now giving him that vote of confidence lol

Edited May 7, 2021 by terpfan

[JamesMadisonSkins]

7 minutes ago, terpfan said:

Hmmm that’s odd. I did find the article you’re referring to from February. But it links to OTC which has the newer set of numbers.
 

Something must have changed or more info must have come out. If it would really only cost us 1-2 mil this year to get out of that contract I think we would have already done it. 
 

EDIT: Saw your update... that makes sense. So it’s possible at some point they could have cut him and taken the small hit to get out of the contract, but they chose not to and now really have to wait until next year. Would make sense why JDR is now giving him that vote of confidence lol

 

I feel like we would have heard something about the guaranteed trigger though. Seems strange.

 

Maybe Spotrac and OTC have some sort of default mechanism in place that if a player is still on a roster by a certain point the calculators consider the salary guaranteed in the new league year, but that wouldn't make a ton of sense, so I don't really know. Maybe someone on here has more insight.

 

*Edit - I tweeted Jason_OTC so I'll post his response if I get one.

Edited May 7, 2021 by JamesMadisonSkins

[JamesMadisonSkins]

 

Okay, he’s not getting cut then 😂

Edited May 7, 2021 by JamesMadisonSkins

[terpfan]

LMAO nice work 

[clskinsfan]

42 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

I like the way we’ve quickly jumped on the OT and DB once released. 
 

Wouldn’t mind a guy like Cameron Brate gets ditched by TB. Still like the prospect of having Ertz on board as well.

I would be all in on Brate. The guy is a TD machine. 

[terpfan]

Just now, clskinsfan said:

I would be all in on Brate. The guy is a TD machine. 

For sure. Any reliable TE2 would be a big help I think. Can’t expect a guy who had 47 career catches in college to come in and be that guy right away. 

[Jericho]

Just an FYI, but Collins' 2021 base salary became fully guaranteed on the 5th day of the new league year. It even came up on this board. That's why it's guaranteed now. If the team was going to cut Collins, it was going to do it back in mid-March before another $12,500,000 got guaranteed. The fact they didn't should tell you all you need to know. Collins isn't going anywhere for 2021.

 

 

[mojo]

21 minutes ago, terpfan said:

For sure. Any reliable TE2 would be a big help I think. Can’t expect a guy who had 47 career catches in college to come in and be that guy right away. 

No but we should be able to expect that from the DoorDash Adonis 

[skinny21]

1 minute ago, mojo said:

No but we should be able to expect that from the DoorDash Adonis 

Speaking of which, imagine how Reyes would be feeling - we draft Bates, sign Yelder, and then if we got Brate/Ertz/someone similar?

 

 

I’m still wondering if we wind up trading Scherff (I really doubt it).  I think RR still wants him long term, but we now have Flowers, Sweitzer, and possibly Charles/Cosmi as G options.  If we sign Leno and at least one of Charles/Cosmi show out at G (if they even compete there), a trade starts to look a lot more appealing...  Something like a conditional 3rd (that could bump to a 2nd) would have to enticing, especially in terms of trying to land/trade up for a qb in the draft next year.

 

[terpfan]

I’d trade Scherff for a 2nd in a second. A 3rd I’d have to think about but it would be enticing. 
 

The question would be what would anyone give up for one year of a guy making 18 mil. Maybe if we paid down some of his salary like the Dolphins did with Flowers. 

[NickyJ]

26 minutes ago, mojo said:

No but we should be able to expect that from the DoorDash Adonis 

That's a good point. We should bring back Adonis Alexander and convert him to TE.

[Skinsinparadise]

It should be interesting to see what happens with McCain next week.  As a personality/player he seems to fit the Rivera profile to a tee.  Ron said he values good communicators on the field.  Leadership-high character.  McCain also has a boisterous personality.  Captain.  I'd add Mayhew talked about bulidng a special locker room and that has been a key ingredient in championship teams he's been around.   

 

He's not the be all and end all FS but seems a nice fit.  I mentioned back before that draft Chase wouldn't just bring killer play but he's an Alpha Dog personality which he's bring to a team with a lot of quiet dudes.  You can see that in training camp:  Allen, Payne, Kerrigan, Anderson, Ioannidis, Holcomb, Fuller, etc are all mostly quiet dudes.  Kerrigan admitted last year that Chase quickly became the pre game leader who helped motivate the troops.

 

I've heard Gibbs talk about how you need guys like that on the team.  McCain seems to be cut from that same cloth as a personality/leader.  And I think this defense needs a guy like that more than most.

 

I recall whining on the Giants game thread before that infamous end of season game that knocked us out of the playoffs years ago that reading the NY papers the Giant players are more fired up to beat us than we seemed to be to get into the playoffs.  I was reading about pep talks given by Giant players during practice among other things.  The Giants had a good defense that year and had players with brought some emotion/motivation.  They were fired up.  The WFT clearly were not.   

 

So, I thinking adding another dude who can help give Chase some of that emotional push wouldn't hurt.   Talent > Leadership/Emotion.  But its good to have some players who bring both. 

 

 

 

Edited May 7, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Conn]

5 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Cut Trapke

I know this was really hard for you to type, I just want you to know that we’re all here for you in this time of need 

[Koolblue13]

8 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

I know this was really hard for you to type, I just want you to know that we’re all here for you in this time of need 

Don't ever let it be said that I'm not a team first guy.