Heinicke Hive: The LEGEND of Taylor Heinicke Thread

[Koolblue13]

2 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

There is no trading Heineke, his value is a backup in Scott Turner’s system.

His ceiling is above his sisters couch.

 

Start playing Allen.

[Skinsinparadise]

Heinicke will have to look like Dan Marino in the next two weeks to convince me that he's the guy.

 

Heinicke's heights aren't really high at least in terms of numbers.  It feels that way because to his credit he's had some clutch drives to help win games -- and that's cool.

 

But as for games on his back, he's had a whopping one 300 yard game this year.   5 games under 200 yards.  That's hard to do in today's NFL.  

 

We got even Mr. Positive Ron Rivera rip Heinicke for how bad that throw was to Terry against Dallas.  He doesn't have baseline arm strength.  And his accuracy at best is inconsistent.

 

Love his personality.  Love his moxie.  Love his clutch gene.  But on a scale of 0-10 right now, he's to me at a dead 0 as for me seeing him as a franchise QB.    Listening to Keim's recent podcasts, sounds like the team feels the same way but they do like him as a backup. 

[NoCalMike]

37 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Heinicke will have to look like Dan Marino in the next two weeks to convince me that he's the guy.

 

Heinicke's heights aren't really high at least in terms of numbers.  It feels that way because to his credit he's had some clutch drives to help win games -- and that's cool.

 

But as for games on his back, he's had a whopping one 300 yard game this year.   5 games under 200 yards.  That's hard to do in today's NFL.  

 

We got even Mr. Positive Ron Rivera rip Heinicke for how bad that throw was to Terry against Dallas.  He doesn't have baseline arm strength.  And his accuracy at best is inconsistent.

 

Love his personality.  Love his moxie.  Love his clutch gene.  But on a scale of 0-10 right now, he's to me at a dead 0 as for me seeing him as a franchise QB.    Listening to Keim's recent podcasts, sounds like the team feels the same way but they do like him as a backup. 

 

Agreed.  I am failing to understand what his defenders view as his strengths.  He can.....hit guys who are wide open in soft zones?  Ok great, so can any QB in the NFL.  What else?  He sometimes can scramble for a 1st down?  Cool, but he barely even uses that ability to begin with.   What else are his strengths?

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

Agreed.  I am failing to understand what his defenders view as his strengths.  He can.....hit guys who are wide open in soft zones?  Ok great, so can any QB in the NFL.  What else?  He sometimes can scramble for a 1st down?  Cool, but he barely even uses that ability to begin with.   What else are his strengths?

 
Off script plays.

 

I think he’s good at selling play action and doing his part to take advantage of passing lanes created by misdirection driven by their zone run scheme when it’s working well.

 

The thing is though if u shut down the run game and force him to sling it than he looks very vulnerable and “meh”.

 

IMO a franchise QB needs to be able to be the lead dance if need be.  But that’s not him IMO.

 

 

[NoCalMike]

3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 
Off script plays.

 

I think he’s good at selling play action and doing his part to take advantage of passing lanes created by misdirection driven by their zone run scheme when it’s working well.

 

The thing is though if u shut down the run game and force him to sling it than he looks very vulnerable and “meh”.

 

IMO a franchise QB needs to be able to be the lead dance if need be.  But that’s not him IMO.

 

 

 

Off script plays I agree he can sometimes be good, but I also get weary at the limited types of throws he is capable of due to the arm.  He has definitely made some impressive ones though.

[kingdaddy]

5 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

There is no trading Heineke, his value is a backup in Scott Turner’s system.

Wonder how TH would look in Dallas as the backup to DAK? I could see Dallas making this trade for a late round pick. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

3 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

Wonder how TH would look in Dallas as the backup to DAK? I could see Dallas making this trade for a late round pick. 

Why?

 

[skins island connection]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 
Off script plays.

 

I think he’s good at selling play action and doing his part to take advantage of passing lanes created by misdirection driven by their zone run scheme when it’s working well.

 

The thing is though if u shut down the run game and force him to sling it than he looks very vulnerable and “meh”.

 

IMO a franchise QB needs to be able to be the lead dance if need be.  But that’s not him IMO.

 

 

 

 One thing he really does good at and thats on roll-out plays or extending plays by getting out of the pocket.

 Why he hasn't been doing this hardly at all is beyond me; if its Turner's play calling then obviously Turner isn't much of a strategist and is trying to force an issue that won't work.

If Turner IS calling for designed roll out plays and TH is not doing it, maybe trying to prove he can be a good pocket passer, then he should be sat down period, then told if he wants to play in the league he needs to do as he's told. 

 

The guy doesn't have a strong arm, everyone knows, but there's alot of things he can do especially when he gets out of the pocket that does extend plays and downs.

[CobraCommander]

3 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

Wonder how TH would look in Dallas as the backup to DAK? I could see Dallas making this trade for a late round pick. 

He would look like he does now, but in a Cowboys uniform on the sideline.
 

There isn’t a snowballs chance in hell anyone trades a pick for Heinicke, much less the Cowboys. If the shoes were on the other foot I could see Snyder doing something that stupid. Like if Heinicke had to start last year in place of an injured Dak I could see that scenario playing out. But not the reverse. 

[CjSuAvE22]

We need a top ten pick and need to take whatever QB falls to us. I hope we don't win another game making the playoffs 2 years in a row with a losing record is uneventful imo. What's the point of going in the first round to say "WE DID IT! GET YOUR 2022 SEASON TICKETS WE ARE CLOSE BABY!"? I actually think Heinicke will help us lose the next two games if he played the entire game, hes had 2 good games this season with mistake free football, out side of that hes been average to sub average.

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, skins island connection said:

 

 One thing he really does good at and thats on roll-out plays or extending plays by getting out of the pocket.

 Why he hasn't been doing this hardly at all is beyond me; if its Turner's play calling then obviously Turner isn't much of a strategist and is trying to force an issue that won't work.

If Turner IS calling for designed roll out plays and TH is not doing it, maybe trying to prove he can be a good pocket passer, then he should be sat down period, then told if he wants to play in the league he needs to do as he's told. 

 

The guy doesn't have a strong arm, everyone knows, but there's alot of things he can do especially when he gets out of the pocket that does extend plays and downs.

 

When I was at the Raiders game where I was paying attention to formations, they were rolling out Heinicke like crazy.  If anything too much. Outside zone runs or outsize zone fakes on play action, then Taylor rolls the opposite way, just has to read half the field, and has an open guy in the flat.

 

My thought watching it and I talked about it at the time is basically shut down Taylor's ability to capitalize on roll outs by holding the edge on both sides.  Force him to stay in the pocket and fling it.

 

I think Scott has done a great job masking Heinicke's weaknesses as opposed to holding him back

 

We've done this dance about Scott Turner before.  I know you don't like him.  Clearly you aren't going to be convinced.  I know some thought Scott was holding Haskins back, too.  Haskins maybe eventually will get the chance to show that he was held back by Turner.  Taylor maybe someday, too.  Will see.  I seriously doubt it.  But anything is possible. 

Edited January 2, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

Rewatched some of the Raiders game just now.  Game pass doesn't give the best resolution.  But you can sort of see it, the O line blocking going in one direction and Heinicke rolling in the opposite direction and all that movement creates a wide open target.

 

Also watched a sack, the last clip, where he had a dude wide open.  It happens.  But PFF ranks Heinicke as one of the worst QBs in the context of being responsible (as opposed to his O line) for his own sacks.   He also has more time to throw (thanks to O line protection) than most QBs according to PFF metrics.  That was a classic case.  He had plenty of time.    He had a dude wide open for what seemed like at least 2.5 seconds.  But he took a sack.

 

Logan Paulsen said it weeks back, he wasn't sure about Turner but when he had time to rewatch games during the bye week he was more impressed with Turner because he saw guys getting open and Taylor just not hitting them or seeing them.

 

Who knows.  But for me (and I am not the only one who feels this way) I think there is a good chance that they are getting all they can get out of Taylor versus them holding back his talent. 

 

 

Edited January 2, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[petey hodge]

As a Monarch fan, my selfish goal for TH is to be a long career'd backup QB in the League... this way, hopefully, he'll donate lots of money back to ODU Athletics so we can build a new North Endzone in our new stadium.  Heck, we could even name it after him.

 

As a Redskins fan, I agree that we need a consistent performing QB with all the NFL physical attributes.

 

 

(North Endzone is currently aluminum bleachers on the left side of picture.)

[kingdaddy]

6 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Why?

 

Someone said on here that no one would trade for TH....I'm not so sure about that. I think he has value, especially at his bargain contract rate.

6 hours ago, Florgon79 said:

He would look like he does now, but in a Cowboys uniform on the sideline.
 

There isn’t a snowballs chance in hell anyone trades a pick for Heinicke, much less the Cowboys. If the shoes were on the other foot I could see Snyder doing something that stupid. Like if Heinicke had to start last year in place of an injured Dak I could see that scenario playing out. But not the reverse. 

The Eagles dealt a 6th round pick for Gardner Minshew...you don't think a team would deal a late round pick for TH as a backup? I disagree way more than your "snowballs chance in hell" theory. Have you seen some of the backup QB's in the league? TH is a steal as a backup at his salary and the way competes. 

[KDawg]

30 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Someone said on here that no one would trade for TH....I'm not so sure about that. I think he has value, especially at his bargain contract rate.

The Eagles dealt a 6th round pick for Gardner Minshew...you don't think a team would deal a late round pick for TH as a backup? I disagree way more than your "snowballs chance in hell" theory. Have you seen some of the backup QB's in the league? TH is a steal as a backup at his salary and the way competes. 

Minshew is better than Heinicke.

[CjSuAvE22]

1 hour ago, kingdaddy said:

Someone said on here that no one would trade for TH....I'm not so sure about that. I think he has value, especially at his bargain contract rate.

The Eagles dealt a 6th round pick for Gardner Minshew...you don't think a team would deal a late round pick for TH as a backup? I disagree way more than your "snowballs chance in hell" theory. Have you seen some of the backup QB's in the league? TH is a steal as a backup at his salary and the way competes. 

Minshew is better than Taylor Heinicke....oh i guess Kdawg beat me to it

Edited January 2, 2022 by CjSuAvE22

[CobraCommander]

6 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

Someone said on here that no one would trade for TH....I'm not so sure about that. I think he has value, especially at his bargain contract rate.

The Eagles dealt a 6th round pick for Gardner Minshew...you don't think a team would deal a late round pick for TH as a backup? I disagree way more than your "snowballs chance in hell" theory. Have you seen some of the backup QB's in the league? TH is a steal as a backup at his salary and the way competes. 

Minshew is better than Heinicke. 😂

And no, I don’t think anyone would trade for Heinicke, but I specifically was responding to the notion that the Cowboys of all teams would. Snowballs chance I’m hell isn’t a theory, that’s a fact, jack. Cowboys aren’t trading a late round pick for Taylor Heinicke. I will eat my hat, without hot sauce, if that were ever to happen. 
 

What makes Heinicke anymore valuable as a backup in this league than Kyle Allen? His arm strength? His accuracy? Or is it just the way he plays against the Bucs? 
 

And of all the teams, the Cowboys are the ones that effectively broke the guy. He was shaking in his boots on the sideline before the first game before and he hasn’t looked the same since. Micah Parsons is running free in his nightmares. The Cowboys spooked the little guy back into diapers and you think they are gonna give us, the team they have owned for the majority of their existence, a draft pick?It’s ****ing laughable, man. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

7 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

14 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

Someone said on here that no one would trade for TH....I'm not so sure about that. I think he has value, especially at his bargain contract rate.

TH struggles in an offense he’s spent the most amount of time in, why would someone else want to trade for a 28 year old and spend years teaching him their system?

 

 

[Koolblue13]

Should be his last start today finally. 

[DWinzit]

8 hours ago, KDawg said:

Minshew is better than Heinicke.

I was hoping they'd swap out Allen for Minshew. He isn't great but has more upside and would have been here through next year

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Should be his last start today finally. 

Unless the running game and D gets it going again, and he has a 213 yard 1TD outing that gets the Hive all lathered up again.

[TradeTheBeal!]

Taylor Heinicke vs 15mph wind gusts…CHOOSE YOUR FIGHTER!

[NickyJ]

Heinicke is beyond playing for the starting job in my book. He's playing vs. Allen for clipboard holder.

[DWinzit]

Just now, NickyJ said:

Heinicke is beyond playing for the starting job in my book. He's playing vs. Allen for clipboard holder.

Absolutely. Only one of them will be on the team next year.

[skins island connection]

16 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

When I was at the Raiders game where I was paying attention to formations, they were rolling out Heinicke like crazy.  If anything too much. Outside zone runs or outsize zone fakes on play action, then Taylor rolls the opposite way, just has to read half the field, and has an open guy in the flat.

 

My thought watching it and I talked about it at the time is basically shut down Taylor's ability to capitalize on roll outs by holding the edge on both sides.  Force him to stay in the pocket and fling it.

 

I think Scott has done a great job masking Heinicke's weaknesses as opposed to holding him back

 

We've done this dance about Scott Turner before.  I know you don't like him.  Clearly you aren't going to be convinced.  I know some thought Scott was holding Haskins back, too.  Haskins maybe eventually will get the chance to show that he was held back by Turner.  Taylor maybe someday, too.  Will see.  I seriously doubt it.  But anything is possible. 

 

" clearly are not going to be convinced" about what?

I'm not fond of Turner but but I don't have a sheer hatred for an overhyped dud like I do for DelTaco. 

While TH may have rolled out 'too much' as you put it against the Raiders { which WFT won } , the last few games it didn't look as if that were anything remotely close to being the same situation.

I don't think Turner is holding TH back; IMO TH is holding TH back. Haskins, I dunno why you brought him into the convo, i've got no care in the world for him, but the point of TH being able to make plays out of the pocket vs in the pocket are clear; he does extend plays out of the box. Naturally he will have to throw from the pocket in order to keep defenses honest, but an over-aggressive defense, especially on the ends, can work to TH's advantage, even if he has to squirt through a hole left from a DE rushing in.