Rookie QB or Veteran QB for "Next Season"??? (I didn't bump this, but I ended up being wrong anyway....)

[Est.1974]

43 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

Im talking for a next year bridge type guy at 5-7 million

I’ve been more accepting of Newton like you are, more than most others anyway . But at this stage, if Smith goes, which looks both likely and necessary, I think Cam would definitely not be plan ‘a’. The bar needs to be higher. You could probably justify Kyle Allen being as effective as Newton. But I would not completely write off the idea just yet in some capacity.

[Dexter]

7 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

I don't think it's going to happen.  

 

 

I really think Smith retires at the end of the year.  Walking away with what he has accomplished would be the ultimate.  I would hate to see him attempt to continue, get released and never play another down.  If I were him I would hang it up, sign a one day contract with the 49ers and retire.  It's obvious he is a warrior, but his football days look numbered.

 

Plus if we are still on the hook for guaranteed money, I would love to have him working with football operations in some capacity.

[profusion]

3 minutes ago, Dexter said:

 

I have my money on Jameis Winston.  I think Winston is a real leader and he is passionate about winning.  A year with Drew Brees and Peyton as your mentor doesn't hurt either.  

 

Winston will want starter money, and he'll probably get it. Ron and Scott will want probably their own guy to develop rather than importing a starter.

 

My guess is that Rivera drafts a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round and then rolls with Smith and Allen to start the year.

[Dexter]

2 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

 

lmao....I knew that was coming.  Outside of that craziness, I think Jameis has a very strong reputation for being a great leader.  Really good passer who can make all the throws.  His upside is certainly worth it.....I would take Jameis 10/10 if picking between him and Cam.

[Dexter]

3 minutes ago, profusion said:

 

Winston will want starter money, and he'll probably get it. Ron and Scott will want probably their own guy to develop rather than importing a starter.

 

My guess is that Rivera drafts a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round and then rolls with Smith and Allen to start the year.

I think you are probably right.  If by miracle a guy like Trey Lance slips into round 2 then I would be ecstatic.  But I think Alex is smart enough to walk away and Allen will certainly be serviceable.  I just think we are a DECENT Qb away from being a top 5 team.  Waiting on a draft pick to develop while we have a below average QB as the starter is not smart IMO.

 

But I trust that Kyle Smith and his scouting department will find a stud QB in this draft or in free agency.

[heyholetsgogrant]

 

19 minutes ago, Dexter said:

Totally agree....I think a blind man can see that Newton is done.

 

I have my money on Jameis Winston.  I think Winston is a real leader and he is passionate about winning.  A year with Drew Brees and Peyton as your mentor doesn't hurt either.  

 I think he’s a turnover machine. If you look at what killed us this season, it’s INT’s, sacks, and fumbles. Jameis would exacerbate this issue.  I guess if we could get him for cheap I would be okay with it, but with a small amount of veteran QB’s available in the off season, there might be a bidding war.

12 minutes ago, profusion said:

 

Winston will want starter money, and he'll probably get it. Ron and Scott will want probably their own guy to develop rather than importing a starter.

 

My guess is that Rivera drafts a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round and then rolls with Smith and Allen to start the year.

This + Heinicke.

Edited January 4, 2021 by heyholetsgogrant

[KDawg]

1 hour ago, wit33 said:

People evolve and it seems from afar he has. To sum him up as a whiner and distraction is wrong in every way. 
 

False narrative is he can no longer run, just look at some cut ups of this season and he still is an elite runner from the QB spot. I don’t love him as a QB, due to feeling his inaccuracy makes it difficult at times to establish rhythm, but he would provide Turner great flexibility in scheming things up and is still dynamic inside the 10 yard line. 
 

Also, the idea is Newton doesn’t need to be elite or great to provide value just compliment the teams offensive weapons and elite defense.  

Why? 
 

Im talking for a next year bridge type guy at 5-7 million. 

Because he can’t hit an open receiver. What would be the point? Have you watched New England? He was horrible. He made Haskins look like Brady as a passer. 
 

Yes, he can run. But if you can run but can’t complete a pass almost anywhere on the field it negates the running ability.

[wit33]

 

16 minutes ago, Dexter said:

Totally agree....I think a blind man can see that Newton is done.

 

Well then lol
 

I still see him as every bit dynamic in the run game as he was when a few years ago. His arm strength would take much more time to break down and see what he’s lost (which I won’t do). 
 

In my mind with a Newton signing, I’m asking him to be average to above and enhance the run game to a top 5 level to compliment the defense. 

[Dexter]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

Because he can’t hit an open receiver. What would be the point? Have you watched New England? He was horrible. He made Haskins look like Brady as a passer. 
 

Yes, he can run. But if you can run but can’t complete a pass almost anywhere on the field it negates the running ability.

Speaking of running ability and hitting an open receiver....what do you guys think about Heinike?  

 

He looked REALLY impressive....pipe dream but what if that kid was our Russell Wilson.  At a minimum he needs to be on the roster next year competing for a 3rd QB job.

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

 

Well then lol
 

I still see him as every bit dynamic in the run game as he was when a few years ago. His arm strength would take much more time to break down and see what he’s lost (which I won’t do). 
 

In my mind with a Newton signing, I’m asking him to be average to above and enhance the run game to a top 5 level to compliment the defense. 

He is not average or above average. He has been terrible.

[JSSkinz]

If we get Cam Newton or Andy Dalton I will curse the franchise for the duration of my existence.

 

Call Philly, they're not getting rid of Wentz, see what it will take to get Hurts.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by JSSkinz

[KDawg]

Just now, Dexter said:

Speaking of running ability and hitting an open receiver....what do you guys think about Heinike?  

 

He looked REALLY impressive....pipe dream but what if that kid was our Russell Wilson.  At a minimum he needs to be on the roster next year competing for a 3rd QB job.

He has some juice. But who knows. I think Allen has the same juice. Except with experience.

[profusion]

6 minutes ago, heyholetsgogrant said:

 

 I think he’s a turnover machine. If you look at what killed us this season, it’s INT’s, sacks, and fumbles. Jameis would exacerbate this issue.  I guess if we could get him for cheap I would be okay with it, but with a small amount of veteran QB’s available in the off season, there might be a bidding war.

 

Winston fits right in with the Cowboys, in terms of both the existing roster and the Jerry Jones mindset.

[tmandoug1]

1 minute ago, JSSkinz said:

If we get Cam Newton or Andy Dalton I will curse the franchise for the duration of my existence.

 

 

 

 

Agree with this x1,000,000,000,000. Another road we have been down before that leads to a dead end. If a QB slides to second or third that we like get him. Otherwise we roll with Alex, Heinicke, Allen in that order. Best one coming out of preseason gets the nod.

[wit33]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

Because he can’t hit an open receiver. What would be the point? Have you watched New England? He was horrible. He made Haskins look like Brady as a passer. 
 

 

It looked real ugly for Brady last year at times and dreadful in their playoff game. New England is atrocious at all skill positions. Like the worst in the NFL bad. Newton still managed to assist with getting team to 7 wins. Very much operating with surface level knowledge as I do with any team outside of Washington, but I still see him as dynamic in the run game and having an ability to stretch the field with throws down the field. 
 

I 100% concede he’s bottom tier in terms of accuracy, but he’s good enough in the short game to establish rhythm and flow at times, albeit not great. 

 

 

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

 

Yes, he can run. But if you can run but can’t complete a pass almost anywhere on the field it negates the running ability.

This I believe is the extreme negative mental representation of Cam, he makes passes down the field. 
 

No weapons in New England. Like none. Zero. Zilch. 

[Warhead36]

Rivera saw Winston up close and personal for several years in the same division. He's not gonna want him.

[wit33]

28 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

I’ve been more accepting of Newton like you are, more than most others anyway . But at this stage, if Smith goes, which looks both likely and necessary, I think Cam would definitely not be plan ‘a’. The bar needs to be higher. You could probably justify Kyle Allen being as effective as Newton. But I would not completely write off the idea just yet in some capacity.

Ya, I’m not in love with the idea but I like the value for this particular franchise if that’s the direction Ron chose to go. Also, there’s zero risk to a move like this, Cam would come even if it’s an open competition with Kyle Allen and first round QB. I just want talent in the room and a guy next year who can provide some known variables to the team next season, due to feeling they will be ready to compete for a SB. 

[rumplestilskin]

If Smitty retires I think Fitzpatrick would be an excellent vet signing. I also think he would EASILY win the starting job and be a gooD mentor for a young QB drafted for development.

[Fred Jones]

A few of these guys were available this past off season and Ron passed on them.  Why would that change this coming off season?

[KDawg]

8 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

It looked real ugly for Brady last year at times and dreadful in their playoff game. New England is atrocious at all skill positions. Like the worst in the NFL bad. Newton still managed to assist with getting team to 7 wins. Very much operating with surface level knowledge as I do with any team outside of Washington, but I still see him as dynamic in the run game and having an ability to stretch the field with throws down the field. 
 

I 100% concede he’s bottom tier in terms of accuracy, but he’s good enough in the short game to establish rhythm and flow at times, albeit not great. 

 

 

This I believe is the extreme negative mental representation of Cam, he makes passes down the field. 
 

No weapons in New England. Like none. Zero. Zilch. 

No. He doesn’t.

[rumplestilskin]

7 minutes ago, Fred Jones said:

A few of these guys were available this past off season and Ron passed on them.  Why would that change this coming off season?

I think Ron was obligated to give Dwayne a fair shake. Otherwise he may have.

Also I will add that salary cap and Alex contract had to do with it as well

Edited January 4, 2021 by rumplestilskin

[ILikeBilly]

Just a feeling, but if Cam was here all this season, we don't make the playoffs.  I also can imagine a rift between Young and Cam.  

[rumplestilskin]

Sorry but Cam is a douche. I say that with 100% confidence and conviction. If it smells like Rat....

[Fred Jones]

14 minutes ago, rumplestilskin said:

I think Ron was obligated to give Dwayne a fair shake. Otherwise he may have.

Also I will add that salary cap and Alex contract had to do with it as well

I don't think that mattered.  Cam was available for a while.  Ron went out and got another Carolina QB instead.  Cam ended up signing a league minimum contract (plus incentives) with NE.

[wit33]

10 minutes ago, ILikeBilly said:

 I also can imagine a rift between Young and Cam.  
 

 

 

Nah, both wired similarly, IMO from afar. Kinship right away would be my guess.  
 

Im out on this one for the day, I’m not even staunchly in favor of it, but would get behind it if that was a move Ron decides to make. 

1 minute ago, Fred Jones said:

I don't think that mattered.  Cam was available for a while.  Ron went out and got another Carolina QB instead.  Cam ended up signing a league minimum contract (plus incentives) with NE.

Covid and Cam coming off injury messed with his value a bit, but I do think he comes cheap next season.