Rookie QB or Veteran QB for "Next Season"??? (I didn't bump this, but I ended up being wrong anyway....)

[DWinzit]

20 minutes ago, carex said:

 

well I just did a search and I'm not finding anything new on us, them and Darnold

Reactionary messages based on the rumors. I live in NY

[Skinsinparadise]

Goff?  Expect them to weigh doesn't mean much to me.  I'd expect them to weigh on every available player.  But will see.  Also we don't know what they are willing to offer.  If its a ham sandwich I am an easy date on that, I'd be open to anyone on the cheap even Darnold.  But if its a heavy price, yuck at least to me. 

 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Anselmheifer]

I think there could be just as much, if not more QB movement next year. This year, Green Bay is keeping Rodgers. Dak will probably get franchised. The Texans say they are intent on keeping Watson. 
 

I bet you could pry Aaron Rodgers away next year. And the cowboys won’t be able to franchise Dak again. 
 

Maybe the smart play is to keep the powder dry. Try to build the team up so we are super bowl favorites if we land Rodgers. Maybe even trade our 2nd this year for a 1st next, if we get the opportunity. 
 

Imagine drafting Darrisaw, Freiermuth, and a bell pen RB, and then landing Rodgers next year. 

[redskinss]

If we were only willing to give up a first and third for stafford I see no way we'll give up a first for darnold.

That would reek of desperation. 

Edited February 7, 2021 by redskinss

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, mhd24 said:

 

 

I wouldn't even offer a 3rd.

 

I don't want Darnold.  Flacco came in and immediately was an upgrade this year.

 

I wouldnt either.  And I don't like Darnold either.    Having said that, Rivera has a honeymoon period with me so I'll trust whatever the heck they do for now even if its something I don't like.

 

I recall the typical NFL chatter about Rosen in early 2018.  It was the same stuff you hear now about Darnold.  Exeuctives had high hopes for Rosen before the draft, he has talent, it would be a steal for a team to get him for a 2nd rounder, etc.  So I sat down and watched 5 of Rosen's UCLA games back then and my takeaway was wow this dude is a horrible decision maker -- he got away with a lot of throws that weren't picked in college but I just didn't see how you can get away with that in the NFL.  So on the Qb thread we had that year I was down on Rosen after watching those games.  I was down on Haskins, too after watching him closely. 

 

Not that I am some QB guru, far from it, I've been right and I've been wrong.  But I am bringing it up because Darnold has the same issues from what I saw with Rosen and that is making bad decisions in the heat of the battle but just in a different form.  Unlike Rosen though Darnold doesn't take a ton of risks yet he still fumbles a lot and throws picks.  Some QB guru types believe decision making is the most important trait for QBs.    If Darnold was playing like Fitzpatrick and was a turnover machine, I'd forgive it more but he plays closer to Alex Smith than he does Fitzpatrick as for majoring in the safer throws.

 

The sell on Darnold IMO is all about how for a big dude he has some Heinicke like elusiveness in the pocket.  A play can breakdown for a dude that size you'd think he'd lumber through the play but he doesn't lumber and is suprisingly spry.  But really every QB in the NFL has some good attributes so the question is how about the whole package.  Rosen for example had out of this world level footwork -- it was beautiful but otherwise?  Heck even Haskins has a wheelhouse to his play. 

 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[RWJ]

5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I wouldnt either.  And I don't like Darnold either.    Having said that, Rivera has a honeymoon period with me so I'll trust whatever the heck they do for now even if its something I don't like.

 

I recall the typical NFL chatter about Rosen in early 2018.  It was the same stuff you hear now about Darnold.  Exeuctives had high hopes for Rosen before the draft, he has talent, it would be a steal for a team to get him for a 2nd rounder, etc.  So I sat down and watched 5 of Rosen's UCLA games back then and my takeaway was wow this dude is a horrible decision maker -- he got away with a lot of throws that weren't picked in college but I just didn't see how you can get away with that in the NFL.  So on the Qb thread we had that year I was down on Rosen after watching those games.  I was down on Haskins, too after watching him closely. 

 

Not that I am some QB guru, far from it, I've been right and I've been wrong.  But I am bringing it up because Darnold has the same issues from what I saw with Rosen and that is making bad decisions in the heat of the battle but just in a different form.  Unlike Rosen though Darnold doesn't take a ton of risks yet he still fumbles a lot and throws picks.  Some QB guru types believe decision making is the most important trait for QBs.    If Darnold was playing like Fitzpatrick and was a turnover machine, I'd forgive it more but he plays closer to Alex Smith than he does Fitzpatrick as for majoring in the safer throws.

 

The sell on Darnold IMO is all about how for a big dude he has some Heinicke like elusiveness in the pocket.  A play can breakdown for a dude that size you'd think he'd lumber through the play but he doesn't lumber and is suprisingly spry.  But really every QB in the NFL has some good attributes so the question is how about the whole package.  Rosen for example had out of this world level footwork -- it was beautiful but otherwise?  Heck even Haskins has a wheelhouse to his play. 

If we trade for Darnold even a 7th round pick, RR/Mayhew/Hurnery at more stupid than the Bears GM if they trade for Wentz.  My take.  

Edited February 7, 2021 by RWJ

[mudhog]

1 hour ago, Ghedrick said:

Dak is going to be one of the worst contracts in the league mark it down. Your going to be paying top 3 three QB money for guy thats not a bonefied top 10 QB. I much rather trade 2 1st for Carr and his 20 million  cap hit for 2 years  than pay Dak 40 million per year and give up two 1st. 

This post shows that we have now come full circle. Alex Smith, compared to Carr is arguably a 1 to 1 comparison. Probably give the slight edge to Carr. Why give up high picks for a mirror of what we have right now? We still pay the 20mil either way. We already have Alex, and everyone should be healthy by TC.

I think what we offered for Stafford was sound. 2x1s for Carr is crazy talk.

[Skinsinparadise]

22 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

I think there could be just as much, if not more QB movement next year. This year, Green Bay is keeping Rodgers. Dak will probably get franchised. The Texans say they are intent on keeping Watson. 
 

I bet you could pry Aaron Rodgers away next year. And the cowboys won’t be able to franchise Dak again. 
 

Maybe the smart play is to keep the powder dry. Try to build the team up so we are super bowl favorites if we land Rodgers. Maybe even trade our 2nd this year for a 1st next, if we get the opportunity. 
 

Imagine drafting Darrisaw, Freiermuth, and a bell pen RB, and then landing Rodgers next year. 

 

My take has been consistent on this just play it Zen.  If there is a dude you want go get them and be as aggressive as you need to be within your perspective of value.  If it doesn't happen then it doesn't happen.   But don't overpay or get a guy just to get a guy. 

 

I don't know if next year will be better.  Clearly there will be teams that want a Qb this year who will also miss out so it won't probably just be us if we miss out.  The draft right now isn't looking hot at Qb in 2022 and FA looks even more pathetic than this time.

 

I bet Dak gets signed with Dallas or at worst is traded.  We can't count on them playing this like Bruce where we gave up Kirk for nothing.    I'd guess Matt Ryan at 37 is traded next year, its the exit ramp season if I recall for him.  As for Rodgers, maybe yeah, maybe no, If I had to guess it I'd think he plays there for another 2 years. 

Edited February 7, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[BurgundyBooger]

1 hour ago, DWinzit said:

It's 930am and I have received texts from 2 big Jets fans I rarely hear from.

They both are lol'ing.

One said "Washington being Washington, thanks Dan"

I sure as hell hope its no higher than a 3rd if they feel this is their guy. 

That's Washington, all right: always eager to slip the 10-carat diamond ring on the finger of the girl everyone else from the bar knows about except us.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, RWJ said:

If we trade for Darnold even a 7th round pick, RR/Mayhew/Hurnery at more stupid than the Bears GM if they trade for Wentz.  My take.  

 

If they trade for him, I'd gather they think they can fix him.  Because IMO he certainly needs fixing.  I guess you can say they made something more out of Thomas than what he was in Detriot. 

 

I am not a Darnold guy to say the least but I am really more fixated on the price than anything.  I don't buy what NFL observers said about Rosen back then, hey he was a first rounder, so now you can get him for a 2nd, so what a bargain.  That to me is silly. 

 

Plenty of first rounders bust.  Maybe some team should have traded a 2nd to us for Doctson, maybe that would be a steal back then too since he was a first rounder?

 

If they traded a 4th for Darnold or whomever I likely wouldn't hate it.  My guess would be Heinicke would beat him out in training camp but the opportunity cost isn't big so no big loss.  But a first rounder or a 2nd rounder to me is crazy for Darnold and even a third is pushing it for me.  Personally I'd rather not have him at all.  

Edited February 7, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[RWJ]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

If they trade for him, I'd gather they think they can fix him.  Because IMO he certainly needs fixing.  I guess you can see they made something more out of Logan Thomas than what he was in Detriot. 

 

I am not a Darnold guy to say the least but I am really more fixated on the price than anything.  I don't buy what NFL observers said about Rosen back then, hey he was a first rounder, so now you can get him for a 2nd, so what a bargain.  That to me is silly. 

 

Plenty of first rounders bust.  Maybe some team should have traded a 2nd to us for Doctson, maybe that would be a steal back then too since he was a first rounder?

 

If they traded a 4th for Darnold or whomever I likely wouldn't hate it.  My guess would be Heinicke would beat him out in training camp but the opportunity cost isn't big so no big loss.  But a first rounder or a 2nd rounder to me is crazy for Darnold and even a third is pushing it for me.  Personally I'd rather not have him at all.  

Me stating a 7th round shows you how much I don't like the guy.  He's Patrick Ramsey all over again.  Gun shy.  Same mental issues, IMO when Spurrier ruined him, SIP by letting Ramsey get killed by no OL.  I see Darnold the same way.

[Warhead36]

I wouldn't even give up a 3rd for Darnold. Maybe a 5th at most.

[RWJ]

Just now, Warhead36 said:

I wouldn't even give up a 3rd for Darnold. Maybe a 5th at most.

0 for me.

[bakedtater1]

We better not be looking at darnold as a possible option.

[Est.1974]

I really can’t see another team wanting Smith as a starter. Wonder if we offer him a vet minimum with incentives type deal to come back through the offseason to compete, contribute, motivate etc etc etc.

Or do we just cut and move on????

[TheGoodBits]

8 minutes ago, RWJ said:

0 for me.

He’s a 23 year old QB who has at least shown flashes of potential at the NFL level. There’s no point in saying he has zero value. If you can get a guy like that for relatively cheap, you absolutely roll those dice. If you can help him put it together, you solve you QB needs for a decade. If not, you’ve spent a non-premium draft pick on a young QB that didn’t pan out. 
 

IMO if I had to pick between Darnold and whichever rookie is available with my 2nd round pick, I’d absolutely take Darnold. 

[Anselmheifer]

In what way has Darnold looked better than Heinicke? I would not give up any assets to get him. 

[RWJ]

1 minute ago, skinsfan_1215 said:

He’s a 23 year old QB who has at least shown flashes of potential at the NFL level. There’s no point in saying he has zero value. If you can get a guy like that for relatively cheap, you absolutely roll those dice. If you can help him put it together, you solve you QB needs for a decade. If not, you’ve spent a non-premium draft pick on a young QB that didn’t pan out. 
 

IMO if I had to pick between Darnold and whichever rookie is available with my 2nd round pick, I’d absolutely take Darnold. 

That's you; not me. 

[TheGoodBits]

1 minute ago, Anselmheifer said:

In what way has Darnold looked better than Heinicke? I would not give up any assets to get him. 

Ability to withstand an NFL season is the critical way. 

[Est.1974]

1 minute ago, Anselmheifer said:

In what way has Darnold looked better than Heinicke? I would not give up any assets to get him. 

I can’t believe the hype Heinicke has gotten from 5 quarters of football. I’d rather roll with Kyle Allen, although I know that puts me in the minority.

[carex]

53 minutes ago, mudhog said:

This post shows that we have now come full circle. Alex Smith, compared to Carr is arguably a 1 to 1 comparison. Probably give the slight edge to Carr. Why give up high picks for a mirror of what we have right now? We still pay the 20mil either way. We already have Alex, and everyone should be healthy by TC.

I think what we offered for Stafford was sound. 2x1s for Carr is crazy talk.

 

younger, doesn't have the bad leg.  If he can give us Alex Smith level talent for six or seven years while Alex Smith can only give us Alex Smith level talent for a year then acquiring Carr puts us ahead theoretically

Edited February 7, 2021 by carex

[PartyPosse]

Darnold, eh?

 

‘Scuse me...

 

[Warhead36]

I'd rather roll with Heinecke/Allen over Darnold too to be honest. Knows the system, teammates like em, wouldn't cost draft picks. All that has to be taken into consideration.

 

Darnold is damaged goods. He needs to go to a team like KC or New Orleans with proven QB developers and sit and learn for a year.

[LetThePointsSoar]

22 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

I really can’t see another team wanting Smith as a starter. Wonder if we offer him a vet minimum with incentives type deal to come back through the offseason to compete, contribute, motivate etc etc etc.

Or do we just cut and move on????

 

Yes. Please. 

[Andre The Giant]

Mort & Schefter were just on to discuss QB Carousel. 
 

Carolina: In the market to upgrade at QB.  Offered 1st Round Pick, 5th Round Pick, and Teddy Bridgewater for Stafford.  Teddy is available. 
 

SF: may move on from Jimmy G.  Availability is main concern. 
 

Jets: weighing their options but will likely trade Darnold in the coming weeks. 
 

Hou: Holding fast that they won’t trade Watson. Other teams don’t know what’s going to happen there. 
 

Raiders: Taking calls on both their QBs.