Ron Rivera: Redskins First (non-interim) Head Coach of Color

[zCommander]

7 hours ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

This is about Hiring a Hispanic/POC to be the top decision maker in the organization. Something that we have NEVER done as an organization (88yrs) and something that has not been happening enough in the NFL. 
 

That is what makes this a big deal. Some people are missing that point. At its essence it’s about power and who wields it. So our organizational chart flows 1. Snyder 2. Rivera w/ Snyder explicitly saying it starts and ends w/ Rivera. 

 

Where does Doug Williams fit into this Org Chart? He has an executive position within the organization too. Is he no longer in charge of players?

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

1 hour ago, zskins said:

 

Where does Doug Williams fit into this Org Chart? He has an executive position within the organization too. Is he no longer in charge of players?

The news on Other Front office moves, Which would include Doug’s position won’t have change until after the draft, per a report that is out there.  
 

But I think if we keep him he’ll will slot in somewhere under Ron as part of the decision making team. We’ll see how it shakes out.

[Stadium-Armory]

Maybe the way to put it for those who don't get it, is:  It's important that a qualified candidate was not, not hired, because of his skin color.

 

Of course we want to hire the most qualified person based on merit. The point is that it's a good thing when the qualified candidates aren't passed up because of their skin color.

[Acworth skins fan]

8 hours ago, tibbidoe said:

Sad that some people can't allow others to take pride in an event that isn't typical to the norm. African American coaches went thru (and still go thru) the same thing. It's the society many here have grown up in and one that many are still trying desperately to cling to.

 

Coach Rivera is an excellent hire and we're going to be better with him aboard. He also gets to be a role model for Puerto Rican and Mexican people, and other non-white people, who don't have nearly the representation that we, the EXTREMELY privileged White people in America, do.

 

Congratulations to Ron Rivera. I’m happy to have you aboard. To those that take pride in him being a minority, that’s great. To me he is the best candidate out there. 
to the people that say privilege, have you walked in my shoes? Worked hard to get to where I am, as did Mr. Rivera. 

[JoeJacobyHOForRIOT]

Was only a matter of time before the Tailgate toxicity worked its way into the Stadium. /sigh

[MartinC]

Hi there.

 

This was a great thread to start and it’s a 100% valid topic. I missed it - but it’s now got my attention. 
 

I mention that as a warning to posters.

 

Race and discrimination based on race is a daily experience for millions of people in this Country. The politics around that belong in the Tailgate not in the Stadium.

 

Now obviously it’s difficult to discuss the topic of Ron Rivera as the first minority HC of this franchise without straying into the area of why that’s important and that starts to drag us into the politics around it - overtly or by inference. 
 

Be careful. I will start giving out warnings in here when warranted. So if you can’t self police and don’t want a time out - don’t post it.

[Jumbo]

thank you @MartinC

 

i had written the post below in quotes before braveonthewarpath solicited mod input in the thread, but i had held off at that time to see if another staff member read the thread and reacted,  and to see how the discussion went a little while longer....i also didn't want to deal with es mod situations  and any resulting dialogues with relevant members or staff and just have a football weekend i've really been looking forward to...so when i saw b.o.w. solicit input from 2 diff mods i just left it and did the stuff i wanted to do 

 

but seeing martin's post, and because i support it 100%, i want to add what i'd written earlier for the record

 

 

Quote

 

our rule here forever has been no posting comments on politics or religion in the stadium---that's tailgate material

 

but on very rare occasion we get a topic that straddles the redskins and sociopolitical themes...a recent example being a redskins player accused of domestic violence....generally what staff has done is to see how it goes and if it gets too dicey in keeping it connected to redskins football, then, if it hasn't been closed, we move it to the tailgate...individual mods have individual discretion and that still can happen

 

clearly the op's topic has only benign and positive and celebratory intentions, but also includes non-football themes that invite discussion

 

imv some of the "pushback" in here has been ok rules/mod-wise (i'll add my member opinion of the topic later fwiw),  but not all 

from my mod pov in the nature of the op and topic, the advice the op and other members gave ala "if this celebratory attitude on this matter disrupts your equilibrium, consider just moving on" was sound....dissent that is in poor taste by some standards is not inherently a rule violation, but rule 5 & 12 cover a lot of turf per mod discretion (especially 12)

 

 

now, my opinion on the topic as a member (normally i would not make a post like this in the stadium):

 

i support the op's basic sentiment 100%, even if some of the 'details' in the rivera case are open to quibbling

 

 in typical pushack on certain forms of minority advocacy there's often what i see as some chosen rigidity in ignorance and some unfortunate ideas of "priorities" in concerns related to the topic

 

as in putting the focus on how hue is gauged (an interesting and real topic)  vs the intended heart of the issue: hundreds and hundreds of years of institutional racism and bias being deeply ingrained in the society and its functioning across life in every aspect, generation after generation

 

even as the claims of  "but it's a lot  better now" hold  truth, the "fear" of racism/prejudice being "exaggerated", often at the supposed expense of non-poc's (apologies to the hue-troubled), seems a pretty weak cause to me in comparison, and also seems to serve as an attempt to dilute the need/drive for much more to be done yet, even if those making the arguments bristle at that idea and soundly protest that's not their intention (and it may not be)

 

this issue isn't presented as though each example fully and completely describes the experience of every poc or of every caucasian as individuals...it's addressing a sweeping reality that permeates our historical fabric deeply and affects everything to varying degrees...it is real and you have to reject reality to think otherwise...i say that knowing many people across this nation actually do reject that premise and certainly am familiar with the ways their objections are framed/argued

 

those actively concerned with serious ongoing effort to remedy/heal this massive infection over time aren't going to be 100% right on every example, nor is every example of pushback inherently racist or unsympathetic or even adversarial to that cause in intention

 

it's fair to examine where one's priorities rank, what one's real (self-examine) purpose is in making their comments and what one thinks those comments actually serve

 

peace out 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MartinC]

What he said ^ 🙂

[mike42]

20 hours ago, dyst said:

It is very hard for minorities to consistently break through the barriers put forth by management, the owners and the league. 
 

There are tons of qualified minority assistants coaches, head coaches and GM who do not get the opportunity because unqualified guys like Joe Barry, Jeff Fisher and Bruce Allen continue to “magically” qualify for these positions. 

 

What about the lack of white/asian/arab/hispanic players in the NFL? Is it fair to question the barriers put forth by management/ownership that prevents that? No. it's all performance based and the lack of those groups being involved. Coaching is no exception here.

 

There isn't "tons" of minorities in the coaching/front office.

 

Bruce Allen, Joe Barry, Jeff Fisher looked promising at the time of hire and was not just "magically" hired. Minorities and majorities was over looked in all of those hires. Was Huge Jackson "magically" hired in Cleveland?

 

Coaching and playing the game are different fields of study and require a much different qualifications. This generates a different result. Most players don't move on to coaching after playing in the NFL. This is what makes Ron Rivera is rare, not his heritage, but because of making it as a professional football player and as a head coach which is something to be proud about. Same thing for to Jack Del Rio.

[dyst]

@mike42 There are lots of former players who move onto coaching in the NFL and usually get in as positional coaches but rarely do they move up beyond that. Guess its' hard for them to unseat the gurus like's Haslett, Barry and Munusky. 

[98ORAKPO98]

Guys, white privilege doesn't exist, this is the year 2020, not 1960. If anything, I see where black privilege exists in today's society. It's a shame people don't have the same opportunities as others simply because of skin color. I really wish everything was equal in society and based on character and qualifications. Sadly that isn't the case at this point in time.

 

Black privilege is being able to take pride in your race without fear of persecution. 
Black privilege is when people assume you are poor because of racism, not because you’re lazy.
Black privilege is being wealthy without people assuming you wealth was all handed to you or that you exploited others. 
Black privilege is being able to commit violent crimes against another race without people assuming you are racist. 
Black privilege is being given ‘affirmative action’ which advantages you in jobs and colleges based on your skin tone. 
Black privilege is having the media cover up your race in the event of a black flash mob or gruesome murder 
Black privilege is being able to make insensitive comments about other races and not being called out on it 
Black privilege is when people assume that the police pulled you over because of racism. 
Black privilege is being able to blame your shortcoming on racism. 
Black privilege is when people consider you to be superior at sports or ‘better in bed’ without it being racist. 
Black privilege is not having to be fearful of offending minorities. 
Black privilege is having the establishment lie to cover up problems in your community or protect you from criticism. 
Black privilege is when you can be over-represented in a certain field without people trying to amend it 
Black privilege is having the government pander to your interests in order to ‘get the black vote’ 
Black privilege is having Hollywood alwayspresent you in a positive light

 

I copy pasted the above, of course I don't believe all black American's take advantage of the system, but some do.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/why-2016-is-the-year-of-the-angry-white-male.amp  (Should be required reading for every American)

 

Hiring Employees in the Private Sector

How many Americans are aware that the Obama administration sued major corporations to ban them from using criminal background checks on black job applicants? The Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) had the anti-white, outright racist audacity to argue that criminal background checks for whites are perfectly acceptable, but

corporations should be banned from checking on the criminal records of blacks. Why? Because, they argued, black males are so likely to have a criminal record, they would never be hired. So business owners have no right to know the back- ground of the person they’re hiring to handle money and deal with valued customers? According to Obama, drug dealers, pimps, and rapists should wait on your female customers.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost.com/2018/10/17/harvards-gatekeeper-reveals-sat-cutoff-scores-based-on-race/amp/

 

Harvard University dean testified that the school has different SAT score standards for prospective students based on factors such as race and sex — but insisted that the practice isn’t discriminatory, as a trial alleging racism against Asian-American applicants began this week.

The Ivy League school was sued in 2014 by the group Students for Fair Admissions, which claims that Asian-American students, despite top-notch academic records, had the lowest admission rate among any race.

 

 The trial began Monday, and has so far only included testimony from dean of admissions William Fitzsimmons.

He said Harvard sends recruitment letters to African-American, Native American and Hispanic high schoolers with mid-range SAT scores, around 1100 on math and verbal combined out of a possible 1600, CNN reported.

 

Asian-Americans only receive a recruitment letter if they score at least 250 points higher — 1350 for women, and 1380 for men.

Fitzsimmons explained a similar process for white wannabe students in states that don’t see a lot of Harvard attendees, like Montana or Nevada. Students in those states would receive a recruitment letter if they had at least a 1310 on their SATs.

“That’s race discrimination, plain and simple,” John Hughes, a lawyer for Students for Fair Admissions, challenged the dean.

“It is not,” the dean insisted. He said the school targeted certain groups in order to “break the cycle” and try to convince students to apply to Harvard who normally wouldn’t consider the school.

Fitzsimmons’ office oversees the screening process of about 40,000 applications and whittles them down to 2,000 acceptance letters that are handed out each year.

 

Adam Mortara, another attorney representing Students for Fair Admissions, accused Harvard of giving Asian-Americans significantly lower ratings for certain personal qualities, such as leadership and compassion, than other races, according to the Washington Post.

“Harvard has engaged in, and continues to engage in, intentional discrimination against Asian-Americans,” Mortara said.

William Lee, the lawyer representing the Cambridge, Mass., school, denied that it engages in discriminatory practices, saying its doors are “open to students of all backgrounds and means.”

“Harvard never considers an applicant’s race to be a negative,” he said.

The trial, which will last at least three weeks, is being heard by Judge Allison Burroughs — not a jury.

No matter the outcome of the case, an appeal that could reach the US Supreme Court is anticipated. It could shape the long-standing debate surrounding affirmative action, a landmark policy from 1978 that has given mostly African-American and Hispanic students an advantage in the college application process.

 

 

 

I wouldn't have posted this, but it just irritates me when so many people spout about so called "white privilege". Maybe back in the day, but not in our current place in time. 

 

Hopefully at some point society can truly be equal to all!

 

https://www.amazon.com/Antidote-Healing-America-Poison-Victimhood/dp/1942475004

 

 

2 hours ago, mike42 said:

 

What about the lack of white/asian/arab/hispanic players in the NFL? Is it fair to question the barriers put forth by management/ownership that prevents that? No. it's all performance based and the lack of those groups being involved. Coaching is no exception here.

 

There isn't "tons" of minorities in the coaching/front office.

 

Bruce Allen, Joe Barry, Jeff Fisher looked promising at the time of hire and was not just "magically" hired. Minorities and majorities was over looked in all of those hires. Was Huge Jackson "magically" hired in Cleveland?

 

Coaching and playing the game are different fields of study and require a much different qualifications. This generates a different result. Most players don't move on to coaching after playing in the NFL. This is what makes Ron Rivera is rare, not his heritage, but because of making it as a professional football player and as a head coach which is something to be proud about. Same thing for to Jack Del Rio.

Well said sir. 

[DJHJR86]

This thread went from 0 to yikes incredibly fast.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Oh. My.

[98ORAKPO98]

Hopefully I won't be banned for stating my opinion on the matter, as it seems I may be at odds in my view points with some of the mods.

If so my fellow Redskin brethren, at the end of the day we all bleed burgundy and gold. good luck to the Skins this season and to their great new poc head coach! 

 

Hopefully this isn't the end but just in case...

aurevoir

[ntotoro]

Someone please pass me the sfogliatelle and kibbeh while I make sense of all this.

[ShredSkins]

in 1927 the Hominy Indians, an all Native American football team from Oklahoma beat the New York Giants. 

 

So, that was pretty cool. 🤷‍♂️.

[Master Blaster]

On 1/4/2020 at 10:34 AM, ntotoro said:

I know I can’t be the only one thinking how a Mexican and Puerto Rican married without killing each other, but that’s just me.

 

Haha my first thought.  Never knew the hatred towards each other until I joined the Army. 

On 1/4/2020 at 5:10 PM, justice98 said:

And yet, when he got hired, there were still people wondering about how they got around the Rooney Rule.  lol

 

This isn't as ignorant as you may think, and actually, on a world basis, he would not be a minority.

America is the only region which separates Hispanic and white.  To the rest of the World, Hispanics are white.  That is why when you select white on a survey you also have to select Hispanic or non-Hispanic. 

[tibbidoe]

59 minutes ago, 98ORAKPO98 said:

Guys, white privilege doesn't exist, this is the year 2020, not 1960.

 

[foxnews link]

 

You're wrong, but the link makes your stance on the subject more easily understood.

 

Like the Voting Rights Act, the Rooney Rule exists because there is need for it. The fact that some people here want to aggressively prevent others from taking pride in or celebrating the ethnic diversity of our new coach also says a lot.

[98ORAKPO98]

13 minutes ago, tibbidoe said:

 

You're wrong, but the link makes your stance on the subject more easily understood.

 

Like the Voting Rights Act, the Rooney Rule exists because there is need for it. The fact that some people here want to aggressively prevent others from taking pride in or celebrating the ethnic diversity of our new coach also says a lot.

 

[PlayAction]

The word "privilege" should be banned from discourse.  It's offensive and IMO it was purposefully chosen to be offensive.  Nevertheless, I think a substantial majority of people would agree that most white people are treated differently in society than most black people (by everyone).  Not always and not in every situation but in general.  Having said that I fully support the Rooney Rule.  The idea is to consider everyone and give them a chance - the issue these days is more that the game is geared toward offense and black coaches are disproportionately DC.  Also, NFL coaching seems to have become more and more like an old style union job where positions are given to family members and those with connections.  For what it's worth, Skins could have had Marvin Lewis as HC if he had stuck around during his first stint with the Skins but he left for his promotion.

98ORAKPO98 - you are going nuclear by quoting Ben Shapiro.  He's articulate and a highly skilled debater but we are probably veering too far from pure football.

[Stadium-Armory]

1 hour ago, 98ORAKPO98 said:

Hopefully I won't be banned for stating my opinion on the matter, as it seems I may be at odds in my view points with some of the mods.

If so my fellow Redskin brethren, at the end of the day we all bleed burgundy and gold. good luck to the Skins this season and to their great new poc head coach! 

 

Hopefully this isn't the end but just in case...

aurevoir

 

If you were to be banned it wouldn't be because of your opinion being different. It would be because we don't talk politics in the Stadium, and posting a Ben Shapiro video about white privilege probably crosses that line.

[98ORAKPO98]

13 minutes ago, Stadium-Armory said:

 

If you were to be banned it wouldn't be because of your opinion being different. It would be because we don't talk politics in the Stadium, and posting a Ben Shapiro video about white privilege probably crosses that line.

I just thought I'd go ahead and let good ol Ben put the false narrative of white privilege to bed. He does the job masterfully in the above video.

[Brother Redskin]

It's crazy that Fritz Pollard was the first non-white NFL head coach way back in 1919 and now just over 100 years later there are 3 coaches that are non white while the other 29 are white. Maybe by 2119 we can get it up to 6 total.

[dyst]

@orakpo98 no need for you to get banned. It is true, you just have a different opinion on the matter.

[Stadium-Armory]

9 minutes ago, 98ORAKPO98 said:

I just thought I'd go ahead and let good ol Ben put the false narrative of white privilege to bed. He does the job masterfully in the above video.

 

Do it in the Tail Gate.