Press Release: #REDSKINS NAME JACK DEL RIO AS DEFENSIVE COORDINATOR

[OldSkinsGuy]

With 2 LBs as our HC & DC, the Hogs' mentality (i.e. old school toughness) is finally back!

[skinny21]

@Skinsinparadise I thought an interesting tidbit from that interview was that analytics suggest coverage is more important than pass rush.  Makes me feel stronger about adding a good corner - especially to pair with a stout Dline.  

[HTTRDynasty]

57 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

@Skinsinparadise I thought an interesting tidbit from that interview was that analytics suggest coverage is more important than pass rush.  Makes me feel stronger about adding a good corner - especially to pair with a stout Dline.  

 

Yeah, it's an interesting debate.

 

I recently read the three articles below regarding this.  I don't have time right now to post my thoughts, but just wanted to share the links for anyone who wanted to do any further research on this.

 

USA Today article:

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2019/06/lsu-creeper-simulated-pressure-dave-aranda-nflpass-rush-coverage

 

New PFF article:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-pff-data-study-coverage-vs-pass-rush-part-three

 

Old PFF article:

 

[Burgold]

I've always thought the two needed to compliment each other. That was often my biggest frustration with Haslett/Barry/Manusky. It seems when they brought pressure, they comboed it with soft or off coverages to try to prevent the big play. The result being that even if the QB was pressured they always had a receiver open and an easy way to escape. Likewise, when we went into our prevent mode, eventually eight or even nine people in coverage is going to give up a reception. Pass rush has to force the throw.  

 

So, I figure the way you want to build it is that you want to be great at one and good at the other. I don't think it really matters which.

[skinny21]

@Burgold I tend to agree.  

 

I think part of the problem with dropping a lot of guys into coverage is that it’s usually (always?) in a zone coverage, making it easier for receivers to eventually find an opening given time.  

 

This is one area I felt bad for Manusky.  When he was hired, he talked about the importance of corners and how you can never have too many.  We hamstrung him with this letting Breeland walk and trading away Fuller, leaving him with rookie slot corners (Stroman and Moreland), and boundary guys like Moreau and Norman.  Couple that with linebackers that weren’t very capable in coverage and not having a good replacement for Preston Smith (not to mention FS issues), and his job was made very difficult.  Not trying to absolve him as a coordinator - there are plenty of things he could have done better - but he also didn’t have the tools to succeed.  
 

Give Del Rio Chase Young, a good (FA?) corner to pair with Dunbar and I think we’ll naturally see an uptick in defensive performance, regardless of his coaching acumen.  Of course, he’s also a far better coach than we’ve had in ages, so I’m looking forward to seeing that manifest on the field.  

 

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

@Burgold and @skinny21, this is a great discussion.  My thoughts:

 

The theory of playing "soft" behind a blitz is you keep everything in front of you and you allow your DBs to come up and make plays, including INTs because they are supposed to KNOW where the outlet is going to be based on film study.  

 

IF you are building the defense correctly, and the pressures correctly, the coaching staff puts the package together, and then teaches it so that the players recognize what is supposed to happen based on the pre-snap look they are showing the QB, and what the highest probability of the check-down is.

 

However, it is my belief that Barry and Manusky just had absolutely no idea how to do this.  They came up with blitz packages essentially against theoretical offenses. Rather than saying, "ok, we've seen if you do THIS to the Bears, they do THAT.  And therefore, we're going to do this wrinkle, and Dunny, you can play off, but when they see our alignment, this receiver is going to cut his route to this spot, and the ball will go HERE, so play that. 

 

This is something Bill Belichick made famous in the 1980's with his Giant defenses.  They played aggressively up-front, but they combined it with such smarts in the back-end, you had to change where your checkdowns were, or else there was a defender right there.

 

Another example, if you remember the Todd Collins playoff game against Seattle in 2007.  The Seahawks KNEW exactly where the check-down was going to go, and they kept getting closer and closer to it, until finally I think they picked one off.  I remember the announcer even commenting on it.  I don't remember the defender, but after the second check-down, he said something like, "Man, xxxx is getting really close to that check-down.  They better be careful." It might have been that idiot Collinsworth.  Which shows you how obvious it was.  For some reason I hear his voice in my head when I remember the comment.  But I could be wrong.  It was 12 years ago. 

 

The other theory is you play tight man with your safeties deep (ie: the famous cover 2, or some version of the Tampa-2 made famous by Dungy).  In this theory, you play bump and run on the outside, not allowing a free release, which combined with pressure automatically shrinks the field, and "funnels" the outlet pass to an inside receiver, TE or RB. Since you have forced this in scheme, you then teach either man or under-zone concepts, so your players know where the outlet should be.

 

Having said all that, I just don't think Barry or Manusky did any of this.  I think they were conservative by nature, so, basically they said to their secondary and drop-LBs, "We're going to pressure, read your man, and go get them." 

 

Just like everything I've been screaming about on this team since Jay was hired, it's just compete lack of adjustment and preparation, and lack of attention to details.

 

Just about anything CAN work.  The 4-3 can work.  The 3-4 can work.  Read-react can work. Aggressive can work.  You just need to commit to SOMETHING, make sure your personnel fits what you are committing to, and coach it well so your players are prepared and know what to expect. 

 

If I had to guess, I think out teams spent a lot more time looking at our tape, and not enough of the opponents.  

[Burgold]

I think that's a fair counter, VoR. I just haven't seen it played out that way here. In Washington, we would do a heavy blitz with the corners and safeties backpedaling twenty yards from the nearest receiver, leaving gaping openings that made it really easy for a qb unless the blitz arrived before the second step of a backpedal.

 

It's been more like send five men forward and play scared prevent behind it.

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, Burgold said:

I think that's a fair counter, VoR. I just haven't seen it played out that way here. In Washington, we would do a heavy blitz with the corners and safeties backpedaling twenty yards from the nearest receiver, leaving gaping openings that made it really easy for a qb unless the blitz arrived before the second step of a backpedal.

 

It's been more like send five men forward and play scared prevent behind it.

This is because Manusky is a fool.  That's basically the best explanation I can give you.  It has been an extraordinarily poorly coached and prepared defense since Haz was hired.  

 

Jack and Ron are going to fix that.  

[Conn]

Once we see this Del Rio coached D we are all going to be even more angry that we were subjected to the Haslett, Barry, and Manuski trio all these years. It's really unforgivable. 

[kingdaddy]

I hope our "Bama Boys" Allen and Payne are watching what Clowney is doing to the Eagles tonight. That's how 1st round defensive linemen should dominate a game. No reason why they can't play like that next year.

[Voice_of_Reason]

3 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

I hope our "Bama Boys" Allen and Payne are watching what Clowney is doing to the Eagles tonight. That's how 1st round defensive linemen should dominate a game. No reason why they can't play like that next year.

Yeah, they’re not as good as Clowney.  Clowney was the first overall pick for a reason.  When he wants to be, he’s a game changer.

8 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

Once we see this Del Rio coached D we are all going to be even more angry that we were subjected to the Haslett, Barry, and Manuski trio all these years. It's really unforgivable. 

Let’s not put the cart before the horse.  
 

However, signs point to likely.

[Conn]

13 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Let’s not put the cart before the horse.  
 

However, signs point to likely.

 

In this case, the horse is dead and the cart is rolling down a hill. It's pretty safe to say he couldn't do worse. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

17 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

In this case, the horse is dead and the cart is rolling down a hill. It's pretty safe to say he couldn't do worse. 

That’s true.  

[757SeanTaylor21]

It honestly highlights the even more head scratching decision jay made by not hiring wade. Legit 5-6 years of complete inept defensive coordinators. Hell I cant even call them defensive coordinators. More like...open man coordinators...or blown coverage coordinators. 

[rumplestilskin]

14 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

I hope our "Bama Boys" Allen and Payne are watching what Clowney is doing to the Eagles tonight. That's how 1st round defensive linemen should dominate a game. No reason why they can't play like that next year.

He played good but he won't be playing next game after his dirty hit. That was an ugly play.

[kingdaddy]

1 hour ago, rumplestilskin said:

He played good but he won't be playing next game after his dirty hit. That was an ugly play.

Most interesting about Clowney's hit on Wentz was that two teams were going for Clowney at the deadline and he listed two destinations of where he wanted to go....Seattle and Philly. Look how that played out.

[Master Blaster]

On 1/5/2020 at 10:34 AM, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

 

This is something Bill Belichick made famous in the 1980's with his Giant defenses.  They played aggressively up-front, but they combined it with such smarts in the back-end, you had to change where your checkdowns were, or else there was a defender right there.

 

 

I remember Teddy Bruschi or however you spell it showing this when the Patriots were playing against the Colts and he intercepted Manning.  There was a blitz they would run and Manning would always check to a quick slant pass against it.  Bruschi was on the other side of the formation but was told at the snap to immediately sprint to the slant.  He did and got the interception. 

[NickyJ]

The Rams let Wade Phillips go. I would have killed for Wade, but hopefully Del Rio's does as well a job.

[Jericho]

1 hour ago, NickyJ said:

The Rams let Wade Phillips go. I would have killed for Wade, but hopefully Del Rio's does as well a job.

 

Even funnier is how Rotoworld threw out the name Joe Barry as a possible replacement for Wade. That one made me laugh out loud

[CowboyKillerz]

12 hours ago, rumplestilskin said:

He played good but he won't be playing next game after his dirty hit. That was an ugly play.

 

I disagree with that man... Dirty hit? Nah.

If anything it was a moronic play by Wentz. He gave up all of his QB protections by diving head first. Had he slid feet first (like a qb protecting himself does) then he makes it back to the huddle; and can finally complete a playoff game for the team he led there. Instead, for what ever reason, he goes head first which is a green light for defenders to hit him. And he got hit. Guess what? Thats what you get! 

By no means am I saying Im glad he got hurt, that sucks big time for the kid... But he also hurt his team by putting himself in a position to take an unnecessary hit.

Clowny dove at him... And the contact wasnt egregious- but rather unfortunate. Watch it in full speed. You think he had time to think 'oh im going to hit him on the back of the helmet if he dives',  then had the perfect internal clock to time his dive at Wentz when he started to dive? Wents went head first and got hit legally. The fact that it knocked him out of the game doesn't change the fact that it was a clean hit that should've been avoided altogether if Wentz just slid like a normal qb 

 

;rantoff

[rumplestilskin]

12 hours ago, CowboyKillerz said:

 

I disagree with that man... Dirty hit? Nah.

If anything it was a moronic play by Wentz. He gave up all of his QB protections by diving head first. Had he slid feet first (like a qb protecting himself does) then he makes it back to the huddle; and can finally complete a playoff game for the team he led there. Instead, for what ever reason, he goes head first which is a green light for defenders to hit him. And he got hit. Guess what? Thats what you get! 

By no means am I saying Im glad he got hurt, that sucks big time for the kid... But he also hurt his team by putting himself in a position to take an unnecessary hit.

Clowny dove at him... And the contact wasnt egregious- but rather unfortunate. Watch it in full speed. You think he had time to think 'oh im going to hit him on the back of the helmet if he dives',  then had the perfect internal clock to time his dive at Wentz when he started to dive? Wents went head first and got hit legally. The fact that it knocked him out of the game doesn't change the fact that it was a clean hit that should've been avoided altogether if Wentz just slid like a normal qb 

 

;rantoff

Well we see the play a bit differently. I agree with everything you said regarding Wentz. Where we differ in opinion is where Clowney in the process of the tackle, lowers his head at the last second. Keep in mind it was a pursuit tackle where both players are going the same direction so there is more time. It looked to me like targeting and I would be shocked if he isn't suspended. 

[SemperFi Skins]

Lot of talk on Payne and Allen... our best Dlineman is probably Ioannidis, currently. Del Rio is going to love this young talent. 

[goskins10]

On 1/6/2020 at 2:47 PM, NickyJ said:

The Rams let Wade Phillips go. I would have killed for Wade, but hopefully Del Rio's does as well a job.

 

We do not need Wade Phillips. He was let go because his defenses are good for a year maybe two. Then they go down hill, and fast. All that talent on the Rams D and all they could muster this year was:  17th in pts/gm - 13th in total yds - 12th in passing yds - 19th in rushing yds. 

 

He would be a huge no for me. Glad we got Del Rio. That is a huge get and he will be a much better job than Phillips, by far. 

[CowboyKillerz]

11 hours ago, rumplestilskin said:

Well we see the play a bit differently. I agree with everything you said regarding Wentz. Where we differ in opinion is where Clowney in the process of the tackle, lowers his head at the last second. Keep in mind it was a pursuit tackle where both players are going the same direction so there is more time. It looked to me like targeting and I would be shocked if he isn't suspended. 

 

Thats fair.

 

But ya I def see it differently, and Wentz has to be held accountable for his actions too. I do tend to side with the defenders due to the target area shrinking every year, and the not lead with the head? Try simply walking without leading with your head! LMAO but seriously the game HAS changed and I feel like defenders are severely handcuffed. Two of my all time favorite Skins were Dexter and ST, and love good hits in the game! - unless its like the hit J Reed took... THAT was dirty AF and yet no suspension. 

Id be surprised if Clowney is even fined, but i can see the league trying to save face by fining him. A suspension would be ludicrous especially given how Wentz didn't utilize the rules and negated the option to protect himself from ANY hit like he should have.

 

I know sports casters are back and forth on the topic...

 

I see Clowny go to punish Wentz for being dumb af, and actually you can see his helmet/ head tilt to the left trying to spare the some of the helmet to helmet.

 

 

[FrFan]