Welcome to the Redskins Chase Young DE Ohio State

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I quickly glanced at the last drive, here's #17.  On an aside, I notice Sweat is practically never double teamed.   I am sure Sweat loves having Chase on the other side for that reason. 

There's only one way that changes, and that is Sweat/whoever is on the other side has to beat the 1:1 consistently and put the fear of God in the offense from the other side.  Then it becomes a "pick your poison" type of thing. 

 

Young is also going to get better at breaking and beating the double team.  My guess is he was double/triple teamed in college a lot also, but he was SUCH a better athlete than both of the people blocking him, it didn't matter.  "Up here in the NFL" (as Coach Joe liked to say) typically when you have a Guard/Tackle on a double team against a DE, the DE is going to have a really tough time of it.  They'll split the double team on occasion, or get around it, but it's almost as if when the offense does that, you've already won because you've occupied 2 guys with 1 guy.

 

If I was Del Rio, I might put a LB/Safety  right next to Chase almost every time, and at least give the OL something else to consider.  If they double team Chase, then Chase can take the double team wide, and the LB can come right up through that gap.  Force the RB to stay in and make a clean tackle on a clean release blitzing LB/Safety.  Or force the guard to stay home and help in protection, which would put Chase on a 1:1.

 

I just think they've got to find ways to get Chase off the double team in some way.  

 

(As you can tell, I'm not down on Chase.  I think he's being extremely impactful.  But you've got to find a way to get him free more often.  That's on Jack.)

[OVCChairman]

1 hour ago, Capsman said:

Did you look at the highlights of the Jones INT carefully?  He had nobody blocking him until the TE came all the way from the other side to try to block him at the last moment. 
 

The LA Rams play was not a leverage win.  The left tackle Immediately started backing up before Young even engaged him.  Perhaps Young got a faster than usual jump which led to that, I don’t know.

 

 

Yes I did, but I don't fault Mclaurin for beating Diggs on a terrible schematic playcall.  He still won the matchup and torched the guy responsible for covering him.  Same for Young, it's not his fault they left the TE on him, he just has to win the matchup.  It's a disruptive play forcing an INT with the other team in our redzone...

 

The tackle in the Rams clip was in pass pro, that is always a first step back and Young engaged and pushed him into Goffs lap so he couldnt step up.  The pocket was not there because Young beat his blocker 

Edited November 17, 2020 by OVCChairman

[OVCChairman]

1 hour ago, Daniel.redskins said:

I do appreciate the film clips.  He was double teamed more than I thought.  I was wrong.

So I guess you would say Sweat and the Bama Boys have underperformed?  Something just isn't right.  This was suppose to be a top 5 d-line.  The Lions o-line beat the **** out of them.  There were plenty of times our whole d-line got pushed back a couple yards.  I don't think you can logically say the entire problem is the linebackers and our d-line looks great.  I don't get the impression that teams really fear them.  The Giants were not scared to play smash mouth football.  

 

 

 

 

Thank you for not taking a hard stance and doubling down, or leaving the convo.  That happens a lot nowadays.  I always respect when someone appreciates the convo and is willing to adjust their stance based on that convo.

 

The D line has struggled, but it's also flashed.  JDR has driven me bonkers at times with the scheme, so I'm hoping it's just a continued feeling out process and they will continue to gel over the 2nd half of the season.  I expected more, and if it the line doesnt show progress, it's going to pose questions in the offseason... something I had hoped we wouldnt have to think about.

[Berggy9598]

1 hour ago, Daniel.redskins said:

I do appreciate the film clips.  He was double teamed more than I thought.  I was wrong.

So I guess you would say Sweat and the Bama Boys have underperformed?  Something just isn't right.  This was suppose to be a top 5 d-line.  The Lions o-line beat the **** out of them.  There were plenty of times our whole d-line got pushed back a couple yards.  I don't think you can logically say the entire problem is the linebackers and our d-line looks great.  I don't get the impression that teams really fear them.  The Giants were not scared to play smash mouth football.  

 

 

Could be a low number of pass rush opportunities given we've been outscored 500 to 3 in first halves. A big part of rushing the passer is about gaining a feel for what the blocker is doing with his body/hands/feet over the course of a game kinda like gaining a feel for what a pitcher is doing in baseball. Also when your linebackers and safeties lack the quickness to cover in short areas the opposing QB will see a good amount of instant separation quickly. If you look at the 49ers last year, they had Warner/Alexander at linebacker, and Tartt/Ward at safety, and all four do a really good job covering on shorter areas. 

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Berggy9598

[PartyPosse]

4 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

Thank you for not taking a hard stance and doubling down, or leaving the convo.  That happens a lot nowadays.  I always respect when someone appreciates the convo and is willing to adjust their stance based on that convo.

 

The D line has struggled, but it's also flashed.  JDR has driven me bonkers at times with the scheme, so I'm hoping it's just a continued feeling out process and they will continue to gel over the 2nd half of the season.  I expected more, and if it the line doesnt show progress, it's going to pose questions in the offseason... something I had hoped we wouldnt have to think about.

Makes you wonder how this defense would look if London Fletcher was back there.

[max21]

Well those screen grabs certainly show he is double teamed more than I noticed, I will try and reserve my judgment next game day thread lol

[benskins26]

I don’t really watch a lot of big ten football, but once it became clear we were eyeing him I started paying attention over the last 6 or so games. I never saw really any game changing plays. Like, at all. And after every game I would come on here where people would defend it by saying he was getting triple teamed (he was) and that he was being used to free up the other guys who were making impacts because of him (I guess?). But the point is, outside of his highlight real, I never saw the direct impact to the game type play. I still haven’t. I chalked it up to my understanding of football being less than some of you all on here, that you all were seeing something I wasn’t. But now I’m not so sure. However, it’s way way too early to be too concerned. Still, give me a highlight game busting type play this year. Something. The same type of thing we were looking for with Haskins. Give me a sense of hope and patience. 

Edited November 17, 2020 by benskins26

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

(As you can tell, I'm not down on Chase.  I think he's being extremely impactful.  But you've got to find a way to get him free more often.  That's on Jack.)

 

Just going through the series of defensive plays if anything it made me concerned not about Chase but the other dudes on the D line.  They almost always are going man on man.  Looks like sometimes whoever is playing 1 technique can get doubled.  But other than that, judging by that game, offensive coordinators want to stop Chase and are taking their chances with the rest of the WFT D line.

Edited November 17, 2020 by Skinsinparadise

[Dark Acre]

The entire DL is hampered because it's wearing concrete galoshes.  We have Rich Milot, Neal Olkewicz, and Mel Kaufman at linebacker, which was fine in the early 80's, but ain't going to cut it today.  Get a real MLB.  Then watch Chase Young dominate.

[CobraCommander]

13 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I quickly glanced at the last drive, here's #17.  On an aside, I notice Sweat is practically never double teamed.   I am sure Sweat loves having Chase on the other side for that reason. 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for doing all that work. Just curious when you were watching the defense how often do you think we actually had 3 lbers on the field? I feel like when I'm watching we are generally in nickle and this seems to hamper the whole notion that you have 3 lbers to plug the running lanes. Whereas in a 3-4 base d you still end up have 3 lbers on the field with only 3 lineman. Is this hurting our run stopping ability? I undertand our Lbers arent very good but if there are only ever 2 on the field how effective are we?

[OVCChairman]

5 minutes ago, Florgon79 said:

Thanks for doing all that work. Just curious when you were watching the defense how often do you think we actually had 3 lbers on the field? I feel like when I'm watching we are generally in nickle and this seems to hamper the whole notion that you have 3 lbers to plug the running lanes. Whereas in a 3-4 base d you still end up have 3 lbers on the field with only 3 lineman. Is this hurting our run stopping ability? I undertand our Lbers arent very good but if there are only ever 2 on the field how effective are we?

 

 

This is where JDR needs to adjust imho.  He knows a hell of a lot more about football than me, but we've recently been playing this odd zone quarters hybrid style defense on the back end which is forcing our 2nd and 3rd levels to be retreating in pass defense.  Statistically we've given up the most plays over 50 yards (6), but were top 5 in total yards, while bottom half in run defense.... so I can't say it's not working... and if the offense would play 4 quarters of football, the record would be different... but it's a weird dynamic and a very stark contrast between the first half and the second half.  

[Warhead36]

It seems like guys on the DL just aren't winning 1 on 1 matchups in pass rush. I think in run defense they've been good(the issue there is the LBs and Safeties for the most part)but in terms of pass rush, guys just run into opposing OL and get stonewalled. The only guy who wins pass rush 1 on 1s consistently is Kerrigan.

 

I don't see many stuns or swim moves. Just looks like a bunch of bull rushing.

[KDawg]

1 hour ago, Florgon79 said:

Thanks for doing all that work. Just curious when you were watching the defense how often do you think we actually had 3 lbers on the field? I feel like when I'm watching we are generally in nickle and this seems to hamper the whole notion that you have 3 lbers to plug the running lanes. Whereas in a 3-4 base d you still end up have 3 lbers on the field with only 3 lineman. Is this hurting our run stopping ability? I undertand our Lbers arent very good but if there are only ever 2 on the field how effective are we?

 Unless the offense adds a tight end or a plus situation to the attack side of the D, there are 6 primary gaps to fill. A gap (between center and guard), B gap (gap between guard and tackle) and C-gap (gap outside tackle).

 

If you add a tight end to one side there is a D gap. That’s a gap generally filled by a nickel DB or a flexed out backer.

 

6 gaps.

 

It’s a 1-gap defense, so each front player is responsible for a single gap.

 

DL each has 1-gap. Two inside backers have a gap. That’s 6 gaps, even in nickel.

 

Generally you aren’t in nickel personnel if the offense is in anything other than 10 personnel (1 back, 0 tight ends). Though you could use it against 11 personnel. 

Edited November 17, 2020 by KDawg

[GOATFrerotte]

13 hours ago, IrepDC said:

If you look at the learning curve for an NFL DE, Young is developing fine. He will get your stats. The difference between a sack and a pressure is a split second so being in position so often, so early, is a clear good sign. If he were 5th on that list, I could understand concern. We are complaining he isn't far enough out front in 1st?

 

Depends where you look. The qb pressures (qb knockdowns + qb hurries + sacks) he's tied for 87th with 1 knockdown, 3 hurries, and 3.5 sacks. I mean if you guys see something special that's fine, I just haven't seen anything that impressive for a #2 can't pass up pick.  

[IrepDC]

1 hour ago, GOATFrerotte said:

 

Depends where you look. The qb pressures (qb knockdowns + qb hurries + sacks) he's tied for 87th with 1 knockdown, 3 hurries, and 3.5 sacks. I mean if you guys see something special that's fine, I just haven't seen anything that impressive for a #2 can't pass up pick.  

Something special? The amount of attention offenses are giving to slow him down is something I've never seen for a rookie. It's pessimistic to ignore this while he is still leading rookies and pressures.

[XxSpearheadxX]

5 hours ago, GothSkinsFan said:

The entire DL is hampered because it's wearing concrete galoshes.  We have Rich Milot, Neal Olkewicz, and Mel Kaufman at linebacker, which was fine in the early 80's, but ain't going to cut it today.  Get a real MLB.  Then watch Chase Young dominate.

doesnt even have to be a probowl linebacker, just a good one who makes offenses pay, our lbers almost never have blockers on them, with our front 4 lbers should be making one on one tackles all the time. I don't jink our LBers are terrible tacklers just for whatever reason they are neverin the hole they are supposed to be

[PartyPosse]

4 hours ago, GOATFrerotte said:

 

Depends where you look. The qb pressures (qb knockdowns + qb hurries + sacks) he's tied for 87th with 1 knockdown, 3 hurries, and 3.5 sacks. I mean if you guys see something special that's fine, I just haven't seen anything that impressive for a #2 can't pass up pick.  

You play a lot of fantasy football, don't you.

[GOATFrerotte]

32 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

You play a lot of fantasy football, don't you.

 

Not sure if you know this, but production is kind of important in the game of football.

[PartyPosse]

3 minutes ago, GOATFrerotte said:

 

Not sure if you know this, but production is kind of important in the game of football.

Vince Wilfork is considered one of the best defensive players in the history of the patriots and the dude had 16 sacks in his whole career spanning 13 seasons. Stats are primarily for those who don't actually watch the games. Kirk Cousins was a near 5,000 yard guy with a high completion percentage but I can safely say most no longer regret letting him walk. 

[GOATFrerotte]

3 hours ago, IrepDC said:

Something special? The amount of attention offenses are giving to slow him down is something I've never seen for a rookie. It's pessimistic to ignore this while he is still leading rookies and pressures.

 

I've heard so many excuses for the lack of production of Washington draft picks the past 30 years I just can't anymore. We just went through this same thing with Haskins. His pressures are barely more than a 4th round draft pick and he's barely top 90 in the league. If that's what you expect out of the #2 pick in the draft who's supposed to be an absolute game changer and dominate the line of scrimmage, than I don't know what to tell you. 

1 minute ago, PartyPosse said:

Vince Wilfork is considered one of the best defensive players in the history of the patriots and the dude had 16 sacks in his whole career spanning 13 seasons. Stats are primarily for those who don't actually watch the games. Kirk Cousins was a near 5,000 yard guy with a high completion percentage but I can safely say most no longer regret letting him walk. 

 

Wilfork was a massive DT and Kirk is a QB. Let me know about other elite DE's that don't put up productive numbers. Since you watch games and are a big expert. Lol. 

[PartyPosse]

2 minutes ago, GOATFrerotte said:

 

I've heard so many excuses for the lack of production of Washington draft picks the past 30 years I just can't anymore. We just went through this same thing with Haskins. His pressures are barely more than a 4th round draft pick and he's barely top 90 in the league. If that's what you expect out of the #2 pick in the draft who's supposed to be an absolute game changer and dominate the line of scrimmage, than I don't know what to tell you. 

 

Wilfork was a massive DT and Kirk is a QB. Let me know about other elite DE's that don't put up productive numbers. Since you watch games and are a big expert. Lol. 

You are so fixated solely on numbers. Darell Revis, for example, was an all-pro one year with 32 tackles and 0 interceptions. Teams planned around certain players and they're very obviously doing it for Chase. That's rare to have someone like that let alone a rookie. 

 

If these numbers and impact are his floor as a rookie then I'm content. You seem to think this is all you're going to get from him. Let's revisit this in ten years and see if you still feel the same way.

[GOATFrerotte]

2 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

You are so fixated solely on numbers. Darell Revis, for example, was an all-pro one year with 32 tackles and 0 interceptions. Teams planned around certain players and they're very obviously doing it for Chase. That's rare to have someone like that let alone a rookie. 

 

If these numbers and impact are his floor as a rookie then I'm content. You seem to think this is all you're going to get from him. Let's revisit this in ten years and see if you still feel the same way.

 

I hope you're right. I definitely don't think you are, but we will see. Anyone who's not a little concerned about the lack of production is just being naïve. You would hope the #2 pick in the draft and an absolute can't miss talent was a little more disruptive than he's been. 

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, GOATFrerotte said:

 

I hope you're right. I definitely don't think you are, but we will see. Anyone who's not a little concerned about the lack of production is just being naïve. You would hope the #2 pick in the draft and an absolute can't miss talent was a little more disruptive than he's been. 

I'm not concerned in the least. You do know Nick Bosa only had 5 sacks his first year. Myles Garrett had 7. 

[Koolblue13]

Of all the **** to complain about with this franchise of failure, Chase Young is probably the last one. 

[KDawg]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Of all the **** to complain about with this franchise of failure, Chase Young is probably the last one. 

 

Third to last.

 

McLaurin and the MVP, Tress Way.

Edited November 18, 2020 by KDawg