2019 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[OVCChairman]

For comparisons sake, here's Pittsburgh WRs drafted since 2010.  They seem to always find good WRs

 

2010 - 3rd round - Emmanuel Sanders

2010 - 6th round - Antonio Brown

 

2012 - 7th round - Toney Clemmons

 

2013 - 3rd round - Markus Wheaton

2013 - 6th round - Justin Brown

 

2014 - 3rd round - Dri Archer

2014 - 4th round - Martavis Bryant

 

2015 - 5th round - Sammie Coates

 

2016 - 7th round - Demarcus Ayers

 

2017 - 2nd round - Juju Smith-Schuster

 

2018 - 2nd round - James Washington

 

 

5 picks in the 2nd or 3rd round.  Antonio Brown was a 6th, but they continued to invest.  

 

[volsmet]

3 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

For comparisons sake, here's Pittsburgh WRs drafted since 2010.  They seem to always find good WRs

 

2010 - 3rd round - Emmanuel Sanders

2010 - 6th round - Antonio Brown

 

2012 - 7th round - Toney Clemmons

 

2013 - 3rd round - Markus Wheaton

2013 - 6th round - Justin Brown

 

2014 - 3rd round - Dri Archer

2014 - 4th round - Martavis Bryant

 

2015 - 5th round - Sammie Coates

 

2016 - 7th round - Demarcus Ayers

 

2017 - 2nd round - Juju Smith-Schuster

 

2018 - 2nd round - James Washington

 

 

5 picks in the 2nd or 3rd round.  Antonio Brown was a 6th, but they continued to invest.  

 

 

Speed seems an element they’re more fond of than we are. I imagine one of the  combines fastest will be in Pitt this fall.

[Skinsinparadise]

One of the draft geeks types, I think it was McShay who said that Lock took something off of his throws to improve accuracy on some throws.

 

 

 

 

[Anselmheifer]

Apparently ball speed means nothing as a combine measure. I'll be ignoring that measure from now on. 

 

Also, saw that we interviewed Preston Williams. Apparently his pro day was crap. 

 

https://www.denverpost.com/2019/03/06/preston-williams-pro-day-csu-nfl-draft/

[dyst]

6 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 They seem to always find good WRs

...and running backs (Jerome Bettis, Willie Parker, Le'Veon Bell)

...and linebackers (James Farrior, Larry Foote, Kevin Greene, James Harrison, Greg Lloyd, Joey Porter)

...and defensive backs (Troy Polamalu, Rod Woodson)

 

That team is just a well run-functioning organization. If it wasn't for the Patriots, they would be the de-facto best team in the NFL

[OVCChairman]

4 minutes ago, dyst said:

...and running backs (Jerome Bettis, Willie Parker, Le'Veon Bell)

...and linebackers (James Farrior, Larry Foote, Kevin Greene, James Harrison, Greg Lloyd, Joey Porter)

...and defensive backs (Troy Polamalu, Rod Woodson)

 

That team is just a well run-functioning organization. If it wasn't for the Patriots, they would be the de-facto best team in the NFL

 

 

Probably because if they miss on a pick, they don't assume they're not good at it and decide not to take that position in the draft going forward. 

[757SeanTaylor21]

Or they just have good development in players due to their coaches 

[rumplestilskin]

I think whomever gets DK Metcalf is going to get a frikin beast combo of Julio and Calvin. 

[HigSkin]

Speaking of WR's - there's got to be a stud or 2 that we pickup this year.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001021587/article/evaluating-every-nfl-teams-receiving-corps-who-needs-a-wr1

 

UPGRADES NEEDED ACROSS THE BOARD

 

Washington Redskins: No team fared worse last season in the deep passing game than the Redskins. Next Gen Stats show a 15.8 percent catch rate and 25.8 passer rating on balls thrown 20-plus yards. This isn't shocking, given all of the injuries -- Paul Richardson played just seven games, while free agent-to-be Jamison Crowder only managed nine -- and the fact that Alex Smith (who missed six games of his own after a catastrophic leg injury) isn't known as a consistent deep-ball thrower. Building this offseason with Smith likely out the entire 2019 campaign, Washington will need to come up with a plan that creates a consistent source of value and efficiency in the passing game.

[rumplestilskin]

5 hours ago, HigSkin said:

Speaking of WR's - there's got to be a stud or 2 that we pickup this year.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001021587/article/evaluating-every-nfl-teams-receiving-corps-who-needs-a-wr1

 

UPGRADES NEEDED ACROSS THE BOARD

 

Washington Redskins: No team fared worse last season in the deep passing game than the Redskins. Next Gen Stats show a 15.8 percent catch rate and 25.8 passer rating on balls thrown 20-plus yards. This isn't shocking, given all of the injuries -- Paul Richardson played just seven games, while free agent-to-be Jamison Crowder only managed nine -- and the fact that Alex Smith (who missed six games of his own after a catastrophic leg injury) isn't known as a consistent deep-ball thrower. Building this offseason with Smith likely out the entire 2019 campaign, Washington will need to come up with a plan that creates a consistent source of value and efficiency in the passing game.

DK... baby.. Throw them bombs.

[Commander Wolffe]

8 hours ago, dyst said:

...and running backs (Jerome Bettis, Willie Parker, Le'Veon Bell)

...and linebackers (James Farrior, Larry Foote, Kevin Greene, James Harrison, Greg Lloyd, Joey Porter)

...and defensive backs (Troy Polamalu, Rod Woodson)

 

That team is just a well run-functioning organization. If it wasn't for the Patriots, they would be the de-facto best team in the NFL

...and Ryan Clark. Defensive back .Previously a Redskins to add salt to the wound! They also usually have strong lines on both sides of the ball. Which adds to the blue collar culture and attitude to the game. and..They have a better Owner. Stability..Diversity.. Leadership.  and...Entire Front Office. Super Bowl winning coaching staff. 

[mistertim]

9 hours ago, rumplestilskin said:

I think whomever gets DK Metcalf is going to get a frikin beast combo of Julio and Calvin. 

 

I don't think Metcalf is anywhere near the prospect that Megatron and Julio were. All three are physical freaks but CJ and Julio were both way more polished out of college than Metcalf. He's going to be a bit of a project in the NFL. He ran a really limited route tree that was mostly vertical concepts so his route running experience is very sparse. He also relied mostly on his athleticism so he was often lazy in and out of his breaks and rounded his routes out frequently. It didn't matter in college because he was so much bigger, faster, and stronger than everyone else but in the NFL it's going to matter much more. 

 

I also don't buy his supposed college playing weight of 225. IIRC before he cut his body fat down drastically for the combine he was supposedly in the 240s and my guess is he'll be closer to that playing weight in the NFL, which may very well affect his speed. 

 

I think he's an incredibly intriguing prospect but he's not near the mostly sure-fire things that Megatron and Julio were. Remember that both of those guys were basically pegged from the beginning of their last collegiate seasons as easy top 10 or better picks, no questions asked. Metcalf has kinda been all over the place and it's only very recently that he's being talked about as a top 10 pick after he dropped jaws at the combine. Guys who rocket up draft boards late always worry me.

[PlayAction]

On 3/8/2019 at 8:07 AM, OVCChairman said:

For comparisons sake, here's Pittsburgh WRs drafted since 2010.  They seem to always find good WRs

5 picks in the 2nd or 3rd round.  Antonio Brown was a 6th, but they continued to invest.  

 

 

Better organization all around.  They correctly picked their long-term QB and then had the draft capital over the years to invest in quality players.  I'm not going to list the numerous draft picks that the Skins squandered over the last ten years in the search for that one franchise QB.  So many draft picks in rounds 1-3 and it's worse than the numbers appear.  Each first round pick is equivalent value to a two seconds and a third; or one second and three thirds.  The second round pick for McNabb alone would have been worth 2 thirds and a fourth.  Ugh!    

[Snagletooth]

19 hours ago, dyst said:

...and running backs (Jerome Bettis, Willie Parker, Le'Veon Bell)

...and linebackers (James Farrior, Larry Foote, Kevin Greene, James Harrison, Greg Lloyd, Joey Porter)

...and defensive backs (Troy Polamalu, Rod Woodson)

 

That team is just a well run-functioning organization. If it wasn't for the Patriots, they would be the de-facto best team in the NFL

 

Yeah when I look at our roster I am always thinking If we just had a blue chipper at every level of the offense and defense we would really be a contender.

 

Kerrigan + Payne + Allen.  Now if we just had a Von Miller type too we would own.  Oh and Devin White to pair with R. Foster and Collins too and maybe Nasir Adderley in the second round then we would be set.  Except for LG and WR and QB.  Then Jay could really challenge the Patriots and Chiefs and Saints next season.

[rumplestilskin]

7 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

I don't think Metcalf is anywhere near the prospect that Megatron and Julio were. All three are physical freaks but CJ and Julio were both way more polished out of college than Metcalf. He's going to be a bit of a project in the NFL. He ran a really limited route tree that was mostly vertical concepts so his route running experience is very sparse. He also relied mostly on his athleticism so he was often lazy in and out of his breaks and rounded his routes out frequently. It didn't matter in college because he was so much bigger, faster, and stronger than everyone else but in the NFL it's going to matter much more. 

 

I also don't buy his supposed college playing weight of 225. IIRC before he cut his body fat down drastically for the combine he was supposedly in the 240s and my guess is he'll be closer to that playing weight in the NFL, which may very well affect his speed. 

 

I think he's an incredibly intriguing prospect but he's not near the mostly sure-fire things that Megatron and Julio were. Remember that both of those guys were basically pegged from the beginning of their last collegiate seasons as easy top 10 or better picks, no questions asked. Metcalf has kinda been all over the place and it's only very recently that he's being talked about as a top 10 pick after he dropped jaws at the combine. Guys who rocket up draft boards late always worry me.

I would agree that he is not as polished but that could be more to do with his unfortunate injures slowing his development or simply what he was asked to do. It was Julios combine that solidified his draft status much like DK but both were considered day one picks. I don't know I could be wrong but I just envision a guy that will be unstoppable even in the early stages even before he develops completely. At very least until he does we will finally have our red zone guy.  Simply because he is bigger, meaner and faster with excellent hops to go get the contested ball . The routes will come in time but many great players had a predictable and predominantly go route and vertical threat game much like sober Gordon, Moss and Calvin. The general consensus is he is number one if not two in this class so I am not sure he rocketed up draft boards. I think because of his limited game experience he has gained momentum through the combine and confirmed or solidified his draft position. That is a rare blend of size and speed and his game tape shows a man umungst boys.

[Anselmheifer]

On 3/7/2019 at 4:40 PM, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

I think this draft is extraordinarily deep. I'm glad we have two thirds. If we could trade back and get an extra second and  3rd somehow, I wouldn't mind having two 2nds and three 3rds. Maybe that's pie in the sky. 

 

Something is going on with Greedy Williams. The last two mocks I've seen haven't had him in the first. I thought it was an oversight by Chad Reuters, but then I noticed McShay also has him out of the first. These guys have heard something. Positive drug tests? 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001021406/article/chad-reuter-2019-nfl-mock-draft-30-drew-lock-to-raiders?campaign=tw-cf-sf209050299-sf209050299&sf209050299=1

 

http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2019/insider/story/_/id/26141849/2019-nfl-mock-draft-todd-mcshay-predictions-every-first-round-pick-1-32-draft-order

 

Also, the Giants cut all of their pass rushers and the rumor is that they are going to take a pass rusher at the top of the draft. That would make sense, given the strength of the draft and the weakness of the position in FA. Reading the tea leaves, they must have settled on a QB in FA or through trade. Rosen? Foles? 

[Skinsinparadise]

14 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

 

http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2019/insider/story/_/id/26141849/2019-nfl-mock-draft-todd-mcshay-predictions-every-first-round-pick-1-32-draft-order

 

Also, the Giants cut all of their pass rushers and the rumor is that they are going to take a pass rusher at the top of the draft. That would make sense, given the strength of the draft and the weakness of the position in FA. Reading the tea leaves, they must have settled on a QB in FA or through trade. Rosen? Foles? 

 

Yeah I've been talking about this as for the NY Giants, I follow a bunch of their reporters and got a lot of family who like them so I am more clued in about them than most teams.  And the vibe I get from people covering that team is they are wrestling between Haskins and a pass rusher.  Gettleman is historically obsessed with the trenches so It might not be easy for him to bypass the loaded draft on the D line.  I also read he's not a believer in later round (post first round) fliers at Qbs as solutions and sees them more as backup type material. 

 

IMO we want to the Rosen domino to fall one way or another, either we get him or some other needy QB team like the Giants do.  If the Giants or lets Denver gets Rosen then it would make it easier to navigate this draft for a QB if that's their intention.  

[Anselmheifer]

Can someone with a good eye look at Devin White vs Devin Bush? I didn't realize how similar they are in size. White was only 1 inch taller and 3 pounds heavier at the combine. Essentially the same arm length, hand size, bench press and 40 time. Bush was better in the vertical, broad jump and 3 cone. Bush had less tackles and TFL, but more sacks. Is bush less instinctive? Can you make that suggestion based on the difference in total tackles? The board has talked about white a good bit, but Bush is a very similar prospect in terms of athletic traits and will likely be available. 

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/devin-white?id=32195748-4939-9982-dafe-8aace4ba0d48

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/devin-white-1.html

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/devin-bush?id=32194255-5323-1883-1a34-05cf13caa3d4

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/devin-bush-2.html

 

https://www.cover1.net/2019-nfl-draft-devin-white-devin-bush-linebackers/

[skinny21]

I’ve been thinking that the Skins really should be looking at selecting 2 receivers this draft.  One to play X - a guy to compete with Doctson and can (hopefully) take over in 2020.  Another receiver that can play both the Z and slot positions.  Quinn fits the latter I think, but between his injuries and Richardson’s, I think it makes sense to get someone that can at least backup both spots.

DraftNetwork has an interesting breakdown...

 

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/breaking-the-2019-wide-receiver-class-into-nfl-roles

 

X - Metcalf, Harmon, Butler, Arcega-Whiteside, Antoine Wesley, Fulgham, Preston Williams, Miles Boykin, Jamal Custis

 

Z - Ridley, Lodge, Hall, McLaurin, Jennings, Tyre Brady, Anthony Johnson, Slayton, Sills

 

Players that can play Z and (should also) take snaps in the slot - Samuel, Campbell, Morgan, KeeSean Johnson, Cody Thompson

 

They also list slot and “big” slot receivers (Brown, Isabella, Renfrow, Dortch, etc. for the slot, and Harry, AJ Brown, etc. for “big” slot)

 

Anyway, this got me wondering - which position do we take day 2 (my guess), and which do we wait on until the 5th or so?

 

On a related note, I’m guessing we try to trade back in the 1st (if we don’t, I doubt we take a receiver at 15).  Guard would be my guess with a trade back, but we could go another direction - there are a handful of guys at other positions of need that may be available - Abram, Butler, Winovich, a TE, etc.

[757SeanTaylor21]

Yall dont know olamide zaccheus from uva. Seen him in person. Dude is gonna be a monster in the league. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

24 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

Can someone with a good eye look at Devin White vs Devin Bush? I didn't realize how similar they are in size. White was only 1 inch taller and 3 pounds heavier at the combine. Essentially the same arm length, hand size, bench press and 40 time. Bush was better in the vertical, broad jump and 3 cone. Bush had less tackles and TFL, but more sacks. Is bush less instinctive? Can you make that suggestion based on the difference in total tackles? The board has talked about white a good bit, but Bush is a very similar prospect in terms of athletic traits and will likely be available. 

 

I've watched 2 games for White, 1 of Bush.  I know some say Bush is more the cerebral of the two and can anticipate better where the play is going to.  And some say White is more of the athletic beast of the two of them and the harder hitter.  Though some say Bush is better against the run.  And White is better against the pass.   Their combine numbers though revealed both of them are athletic.  Both supposedly mega leaders especially White.  I've been thinking of diving into both players too -- I haven't made up my own conclusions about them.

 

I want to refresh myself with Burns.  Hence I posted all of that above.  My gut right now is if they don't go QB, they go pass rusher.  And right now it looks like the best shot is Ferrell or Burns, I think one might be there at 15.     Burns might be the guy considering I read the Dolphins like Ferrell and has one of his old Clemson coaches on staff.  

[Anselmheifer]

Look at the difference in the field workouts for Byron Murphy and Greedy Williams. 

 

 

 

SIPS, you need to watch some Byron Murphy videos. He's such a fun watch.

 

Also, thanks for posting all of the Brian Burns videos. I would be ok with him at 15. He definitely is built like a WR, albeit a smaller WR than Metcalf or Butler. I don't see him holding up in the run game and based on what the redskins are always prioritizing, the ability of an OLB to defend the run, I don't think he would be our pick at that spot. I bet we would prefer Ferrell. I however would be quicker to draft Burns and hire DJ Swearinger as our defensive coordinator. 

My issue with Burns at 15, is that there is going to be so much talent in the back half of the first and the top half of the second. In the back half of the first, or later, McShay has Clelin Ferrell, Ed Oliver, Devin Bush, Byron Murphy, Johnathan Abram, Hakim Butler, DeAndre Baker. I think there will be a player at 25 just as valuable as the guy grabbed at 15. Meaning, if we stay at 15, I want an impact player. Not just the best blend of talent and fit. Marquise Brown at 15, at 5'9" and 166 pounds, or Deebo Samuel or Hakim Butler in the second? There is just so much later value at WR in this draft. 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

Look at the difference in the field workouts for Byron Murphy and Greedy Williams. 

 

 

SIPS, you need to watch some Byron Murphy videos. He's such a fun watch.

 

 

Just put on the Ohio State game, its not always easy to watch corners without coaches tape because you can't always track the full route.  All corners will get beat sometimes so nothing against Murphy here but it shows my 3rd roundish man crush, McLaurin's 4.35ish speed versus Murphy's 4.53ish speed. 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

 

Also, thanks for posting all of the Brian Burns videos. I would be ok with him at 15. He definitely is built like a WR, albeit a smaller WR than Metcalf or Butler. I don't see him holding up in the run game and based on what the redskins are always prioritizing, the ability of an OLB to defend the run, I don't think he would be our pick at that spot. I bet we would prefer Ferrell. I however would be quicker to draft Burns and hire DJ Swearinger as our defensive coordinator. 

My issue with Burns at 15, is that there is going to be so much talent in the back half of the first and the top half of the second.

 

I haven't watched them all to dissect that.  But I'd say its not hard to see that the typical draft geek type-site, etc have tier 1 as:  Allen, Bosa, Ferrell, Sweat, Burns, Polite and then a drop off to tier 2.   Polite now in tier 2 post combine. Some think Burns has top 5 type talent.  I haven't dived into watching enough to land on an opinion.  I'll just say among the mock draft types they'd see Burns as a good pick.  I agree that they prefer more well rounded OLBs and I have said so on this thread a bunch of times.  But if Ferrell is gone it wouldn't shock me if its Burns.

 

Burns has bulked up to 250 plus.  Cooley among others like to say the problem with the pass rush is there is no speed rusher in that mix.  Polian once explained in his mind why the Redskins even though have a good D line are still vulnerable on 3rd down including 3rd and long -- his take is on obvious passing downs, that's when the speed rusher is the most needed and more dangerous because you can line them up wide and just have them run past the tackle without worrying about holding that gap to stop the run.  

[Skinsinparadise]

Josh Norris mock, H. Butler I've seen in the late first in some mocks, not top 10.  Though i do like him. Another draft with Oliver landing near our pick.  Another one where Ferrell can be had among other things.