AsburySkinsFan Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 19 minutes ago, Burgold said: Anyone watches FOX's attempt to pivot who tries to continue the narrative that modern conservative isn't laced with racism has blinders on. At least there are a few voices on FOX who are condemning this. I've seen one or two guests speak out leaving host befuddled as to how to spin this. The rightwing media needs to think carefully about their marching orders and how they are being asked to march. It is seriously a crossroads for them; either embrace Trump's position and thus embrace Nazism or criticize him and risk alienating viewers. Here's the easy answer, you don't defend Nazis....ever. If they need a criminal defense team that's their right, but you don't try to appear like they had a valid point worth hearing and the others were bad because they didn't have a permit. What was the line from Tropic Thunder? "Never go full retard." Well here it's "Never defend Nazis, the Klan or other White Supremacists." You don't get to walk that back, ESPECIALLY if you already tried to walk it back the day before but then all but screamed your original assertion a day later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 i don't watch the late nite talks show, but it looks like they had some great takes last night...this is a lame PSA type post for anyone who wants to go look as i am too shiftless to go find the clips i just saw on the news... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 25 minutes ago, Burgold said: Anyone watches FOX's attempt to pivot who tries to continue the narrative that modern conservative isn't laced with racism has blinders on. At least there are a few voices on FOX who are condemning this. I've seen one or two guests speak out leaving host befuddled as to how to spin this. The rightwing media needs to think carefully about their marching orders and how they are being asked to march. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Someone on Twitter suggested I look to Robert Byrd (whose been dead since 2010) before criticizing Trump today. Take care of your own, he argues. I really am just thunderstruck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 3 minutes ago, Burgold said: Someone on Twitter suggested I look to Robert Byrd (whose been dead since 2010) before criticizing Trump today. Take care of your own, he argues. I really am just thunderstruck. Robert Byrd, who spend decades of his life trying to make up for the racist ignorance of his youth. Just LOL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, Predicto said: Robert Byrd, who spend decades of his life trying to make up for the racist ignorance of his youth. Just LOL. Exactly. But even beyond that... He's dead, Jim! The good or harm he can do is over with. Edited August 16, 2017 by Burgold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Oh, watching those clowns in Charlottesville march around made me think of this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 2 minutes ago, Burgold said: Someone on Twitter suggested I look to Robert Byrd (whose been dead since 2010) before criticizing Trump today. Take care of your own, he argues. I really am just thunderstruck. Funny. One of our regular posters on ES just tried a variation of the same tactic to try to defend supporting Nazis. I can't imagine where people get this notion that the Right consists of a legion of mind-wiped robots, repeating programmed messages (without noticing that they don't make sense). Must be liberal fake news, or something. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) BASF, ask him why he supports the losers in wars like our Civil War and WWII, the big one? Doesn't he want to support and model winning causes? Because there's no way that Nazis, white supremacists, and the KKK are going to be successful. Edited August 16, 2017 by LadySkinsFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornaSkinsFan83 Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 One last question I'm sure someone here can answer for me (maybe the honorable @Predictoas I recall him commenting on experiences with them in San Francisco): what is the overlap between anarchist groups and antifa groups? Are they one and the same? Is it antifa groups getting their panties in a bunch and tearing apart a McDonald's anytime more than 10 rich people ho through the same doorway? Or are those anarchist groups? I want to commit myself and get more directly involved, on something more specific and focused--rather than just floating around whenever something pops up--but I have no interest in covering for a bunch of kids and getting pulled into their Galleanists cosplays. Just starting to gather info right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 BASF, stay away from antifa and anarchist groups. They may be infiltrated by those who want to foment violence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornaSkinsFan83 Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Btw here's an idea for left wingers and other anti-Nazi. Rather than staying always nreactionary in this, why not stage a massive and peaceful rally and march in an area with a high rate of alt right ****stains? One, show we aren't scared of you. And two, be a good chance to meet the locals and destroy the caricatures they are force fed on Fox everyday. Just go in and be nice as ****. Doesn't need to be down south. I'm thinking Indiana or West Virginia. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 1 minute ago, BornaSkinsFan83 said: One last question I'm sure someone here can answer for me (maybe the honorable @Predictoas I recall him commenting on experiences with them in San Francisco): what is the overlap between anarchist groups and antifa groups? Are they one and the same? Is it antifa groups getting their panties in a bunch and tearing apart a McDonald's anytime more than 10 rich people ho through the same doorway? Or are those anarchist groups? They are not one and the same, but they do overlap. Most of the antifa people are not violent and are well intentioned. I know some of them personally, two of whom are Quakers. But any time they gather to protest something, you can be sure that lots of the resident hardcore anarchist hotheads (usually called "black bloc") will join in and they will be out front and center trying to escalate things. It is very hard to control, especially because antifa groups are not organized and have no membership. They are more of an ad hoc response to specific events, gathering by facebook posts and so on. Here's a good Vice article from a few months back about it. https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/3d9d4k/the-bay-areas-antifa-movements-are-alive-and-well-v24n4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 One thing we can all do is to monitor the legislation to supress voting, and help people get correctly registered. Someone posted a bit ago the egregious laws in Texas, and when I move, that's going to be one of my focus areas. Others are abortion rights and Meals on Wheels. Anything we can do to push back against the Republicans is something good for actual humans. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornaSkinsFan83 Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 23 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said: BASF, stay away from antifa and anarchist groups. They may be infiltrated by those who want to foment violence. http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/08/what_the_alt_left_was_actually_doing_in_charlottesville.html I'm not opposed to violence. Like with the Trump rally, one of the few men there the biggest of them, I found myself quickly running security, mainly trying to protect the kids. There were quite a few times where it got ugly and almost popped off. I enjoyed it, felt like I helped and did something productive and had no problem with it. Last night at the rally had what I was certain was an alt-right ****stain there to take pictures of people (i swear I have a sixth sense for spotting them), let him know I spotted him, put all my focus on him and just mean mugged him until he quickly ran off. Same thing. Felt like i served a purpose. I can go on but you get the point. So yeah, I'm not opposed to violence but I have no interest in going out with violence being the goal. I like to think of it more like being a bounced rather than a street fighter. My opinion, violence for the sake of violence is when bad and stupid things happen and innocent people get hurt. And don't get me started on tearing up a McDonald's or whatever. And thanks @Predicto. Checking out that article now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) Every member of antifa may not be violent, but as a group they are not opposed to violence. Mark Bray is writing a book about them, and what amounts to a brochure on the group is in the Washingtonpost today. Here's his overly charitable phrasing of Antifa's stance on violence: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/made-by-history/wp/2017/08/16/who-are-the-antifa/?utm_term=.27c3a30ba6ff#comments Quote The vast majority of anti-fascist organizing is nonviolent. But their willingness to physically defend themselves and others from white supremacist violence and preemptively shut down fascist organizing efforts before they turn deadly distinguishes them from liberal anti-racists. Note that it doesnt read "the majority of Antifa is nonviolent" but that most of their organizing is. I'm sure some street gangs can claim that most days they don't shoot anyone. Willingness must be considered, not just frequency. As for anarchist, no they aren't all anarchist. They aren't all anything as they have no national or global leadership (doubt they'd have many anarchists if they had a hierarchy). You'd need to check local groups to see exactly what mix of anarchists, communists, socialists, and quakers (per Predictor) you get. Think of it as a fun surprise. Edited August 16, 2017 by Destino 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Destino said: Note that they doesnt read "the majority of Antifa is nonviolent" but that most of their organizing is. I'm sure some street gangs can claim that most days they don't shoot anyone. Willingness must be considered, not just frequency This paragraph seems wrong to me. "Willingness to defend themselves" etc, is not the same as "organizing violence." And comparing them to street gangs is kind of heading down the Hannity highway. Edited August 16, 2017 by Predicto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 i mentioned the trouble msnbc was having getting the regular (usually no matter what trump's said/done) platoon of elected gopers to comment today, now there's a cnn reporter just said they went down their "regular guest" elected goper lsit and the first 55 said no... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FanboyOf91 Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Did not see the Juggalo-Antifa Alliance coming. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 17 minutes ago, Predicto said: This paragraph seems wrong to me. "Willingness to defend themselves" etc, is not the same as "organizing violence." That's what I meant by overly charitable. They "defend" themselves if you don't let them shut down your event. They dont protest across the street. That's a very thinly stretched definition of defense. There's a reason they choose to identify as Antifa and not one of the many other protest group out there that reject violence. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Really hope that what I'm reading as a threat to escalate violence, isn't. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 I know people are upset but if you go out there looking to incite violence you will end up dead or in jail, if the Nazi's don't shoot you the police will. Be smart. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 wait are the juggalos carrying mace or hatchets? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llevron Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 8 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said: I know people are upset but if you go out there looking to incite violence you will end up dead or in jail, if the Nazi's don't shoot you the police will. Be smart. Right. There will be enough people out there. Guaranteed, they wont need you. And DCPD ain't gonna pretend this is Charlottesville just for the ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 I've never had an issue with violence if there's appropriate discernment in application. That's the tricky part. That there subjective stuff. I got that **** down, though. Practtie practice practice. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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