Mr. Sinister Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, LD0506 said: I was going to post something similar (but using way too many words) to this in response to Mommy's question, but that's basically it in a nutshell. She went so high he just walked right under her. She played chess and he pissed on the board. She expected knowledge and common sense to prevail, but he seized control of the dumbest of the dumb, and the most gullible people imaginable, and beat her, and managed to turn many people off of both of them (which was a win for him ultimately) Nah... They go low, you kick them in the face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 2 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Does your resentment also grow for the Dems putting up a candidate that couldn't beat freaking Donald Trump? People eat at McDonalds, and you want to blame the steakhouse because people picked something that was bad for them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 1 hour ago, No Excuses said: I have a problem with the "pulse of America" designation. Again, I'm not going to get into the Electoral College. There is another thread for that. And honestly this probably isn't the best thread for discussing who has how much blame for the current situation. Not to mention it has been had several times already. So I'll make this post and then probably just leave it unless someone directly calls me out. I'm at least partly responsible for this derail and don't think I should continue it. The "pulse of Amercia" is just shorthand for what could be a long description of our current society. In short, Hillary ran a bad campaign. She didn't campaign in the right areas. Trump came to Pensacola like 4 times and Mobile (which is like 45 minutes away) at least once. Hillary never came close to our location. While the outskirts of those areas are pro-trump, the cities themselves are quite liberal. And there are plenty of other places that are the same situation. She mostly went where she was comfortable. And I get the importance of motivating those people. But she should have campaigned in more toss up places. Quote President-elect Donald Trump heavily out-campaigned his Democratic opponent in the last 100 days of the election, spending roughly 50 percent more time in six key battleground states that pushed him to victory on Nov. 8. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/trump-out-campaigned-clinton-50-percent-key-battlegrounds-final-100-n683116 Also, she didn't gauge just how much of the country was tired of "the establishment". See the rise of Bernie and well, the fact Trump won. She didn't do enough to overcome that attitude. If I had to pick the one biggest thing that made me not vote for her (and there is more than one thing), it would be that she wouldn't release the transcripts of the bank speeches. If she had, I honestly probably wouldn't even have read them. I'd have just waited for the cliff notes. But it made it seem like she was hiding something. To me, it felt a lot like Trump not releasing his tax returns. Makes you wonder what they are hiding. Bernie did a great job beating her up on this. It was like a boxer throwing non-stop kidney punches. And she just kept taking them while protecting her head instead of fighting back. 22 minutes ago, AsburySkinsFan said: People eat at McDonalds, and you want to blame the steakhouse because people picked something that was bad for them? Cute bumper sticker. So I have attempted to actually back up my position. You may disagree with what I have said. Care to actually counter-point it actual discussion points? ****For the record, I have said several times that we all bear some responsibility for Trump. Protest voters/non-voters certainly have some blame. The GOP and their followers obviously have the most. But the Dems have some responsibility too. People that like to blame everyone else without taking their bite of the **** sandwich just annoy the crap out of me. "When you point one finger, there are three fingers pointing back to you." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Fine, blame me as a registred Independent in a blood red state for Trump. Good luck with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 4 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Denial isn't just a river in Egypt. That quote works better when it’s used by someone who wasn’t just trying to argue that the blame for the election of Trump isn’t due to the people who voted for him, it belongs to the candidate who didn’t get enough people to vote against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogofWar1 Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 No one listens to me when I say that everyone needs to vote for Democrats but maybe you'll listen to George Will. Look at that hideous bow-tie! That guy is absolutely the most Republican. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 2 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said: The GOP and their followers obviously have the most. 52 minutes ago, Larry said: That quote works better when it’s used by someone who wasn’t just trying to argue that the blame for the election of Trump isn’t due to the people who voted for him, it belongs to the candidate who didn’t get enough people to vote against him. Reading is fundamental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 5 hours ago, Momma There Goes That Man said: It surely isn't the Dems fault for putting out the most qualified and experienced candidate in at least 40 years. its such a pointless conversation. The people who think Hillary is awesome will never get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacks 'n' Stuff Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 I don't really care for or about Hillary but I'll say this... She ain't even a micro-fraction as bad as what the GOP convinced it's base to believe (and what they do to anybody who they consider a threat). I'd say she's a political hawk who's guided by her aspirations more than any sort of philosophy or belief system. I think she would have been a fine president though... Not great. Probably just business as usual. I don't know that we would be any better off in the long run though... just prolonging judgement day and it may have even gotten worse. Trump isn't the real problem. A radicalized base that would elect a Donald Trump is the real problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 19 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said: Trump isn't the real problem Reminds me of a long post I made a while ago. The country is ill. Trump is just the nausea that makes us realize we may need a doctor. He isn't the illness, only the most visible symptom. @Larry. Still waiting for you to explain how I was 59 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: trying to argue that the blame for the election of Trump isn’t due to the people who voted for him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 1 hour ago, tshile said: its such a pointless conversation. The people who think Hillary is awesome will never get it. Come on dude, you've been participating in these threads long enough to know that is just a dishonest statement. It's not about thinking Hillary is/was/ever will be "awesome" As far as campaigning goes, maybe I am cynical because I love in a solidly blue state (at least when it comes to national elections), but I still don't get the "So and so came and talked to us" hullabaloo. Most people have never been to a campaign rally in their life, furthermore they are nothing but red meat vague pep rallies where little to no policy discussion/solutions ever take place. If the people in Red States were foolish enough to think a "Wealthy Coastal Elite" was going to enact policies that improved their lives that is on them. If anything it should be a wake up call going forward..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: Come on dude, you've been participating in these threads long enough to know that is just a dishonest statement. It's not about thinking Hillary is/was/ever will be "awesome" Most qualified candidate in 40 years 40 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Just now, tshile said: Most qualified candidate in 40 years 40 years Qualifications are a different matter from being "awesome" Most everyone in this thread was a resigned to a "Well, she is still the better option over other guy" attitude. I am not sure I have seen many "Hillary-Lovers" around at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 6 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: I still don't get the "So and so came and talked to us" hullabaloo. Most people have never been to a campaign rally in their life, furthermore they are nothing but red meat vague pep rallies where little to no policy discussion/solutions ever take place. Got any research or statistics to show that where campaigning is done doesn't matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 1 minute ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Got any research or statistics to show that where campaigning is done doesn't matter? No you misunderstood. I didn't say it doesn't matter. I am making a statement that I don't understand *why* it matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Just now, NoCalMike said: No you misunderstood. I didn't say it doesn't matter. I am making a statement that I don't understand *why* it matters. Gotcha. My apologies. Wouldn't it fall under "motivating the base?" I will admit that when you think about it, where a person visits shouldn't matter. Their "policy" shouldn't change depending on their location. But neither should their accent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Gotcha. My apologies. Wouldn't it fall under "motivating the base?" I will admit that when you think about it, where a person visits shouldn't matter. Their "policy" shouldn't change depending on their location. But neither should their accent. Yeah I mean maaaaybe I could understand why it worked 50 years ago, but now we have 24/7 round the clock coverage of every word they say, every move they make (the media will be watching them ) I guess for me I always try my hardest to focus on policy and leave emotions out of it. When I hear things like "He came here and talked to us and showed us he really cares" yet a quick google search would show his economic policies are the same tripe that got their region in the mess it is....(over simplifying for sake of conversation) it has me questioning people's priorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: Yeah I mean maaaaybe I could understand why it worked 50 years ago, but now we have 24/7 round the clock coverage of every word they say, every move they make (the media will be watching them ) I guess for me I always try my hardest to focus on policy and leave emotions out of it. When I hear things like "He came here and talked to us and showed us he really cares" yet a quick google search would show his economic policies are the same tripe that got their region in the mess it is....(over simplifying for sake of conversation) it has me questioning people's priorities. Definitely a interesting thought. A psychologist could probably give more information on why it is important. But results show that it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 1 minute ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Definitely a interesting thought. A psychologist could probably give more information on why it is important. But results show that it is. Right and I am not saying Political Rallies don't serve a purpose. I'd probably go to one out of curiosity and for the experience if I was a fan of the speaker or if I knew it would be a total sh!t show. Hahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 9 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: Right and I am not saying Political Rallies don't serve a purpose. I'd probably go to one out of curiosity and for the experience if I was a fan of the speaker or if I knew it would be a total sh!t show. Hahaha I went to the first Trump rally in Pensacola. And I was a registered Republican at the time. We only stay for the first half of it or so. And then I would not be voting for him. But I did think it was important to hear him out. It just confirmed what I already thought of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Been at Disney. (First day of three). Did Hall of Presidents today. (First time in years). It's a good show. And at least when I left, I didn't hate Trump as much. Yeah, OK. It was a robot Trump. (Obviously) sticking exactly to script. (Script probably written by Disney). But still, my opinion of the creep is so low that I felt I should give his robot props for not sucking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 2 hours ago, DogofWar1 said: No one listens to me when I say that everyone needs to vote for Democrats but maybe you'll listen to George Will. Look at that hideous bow-tie! That guy is absolutely the most Republican. He probably just got fired for saying that He's right though. The GOP is morally corrupt and needs to be taken out of power at all levels. So, for 2018, 2019,2020,2021 elections; the Dems need to win. You can argue about 2016 until your blue in the face. It's over and done with. Most people thought Hillary was winning, including the winner: Donald Trump.. Learn from the mistakes of 2016. For those who made the mistake, you can correct that in elections for the next 4 years. Hopefully, the Dems nominate someone that can beat him in 2020. I was wrong for not seeing how much of threat Donald really was, if he won. I was just as arrogant as the everyone who though Hillary had in a bag; so I could go with my third party dream. I still have that dream but it's postponed until 2022. I was in denial that the GOP would go along with everything Donald said in the campaign. They nominated Trump; should've been all I needed to see but I didn't. Only thing I can do is change what I do in the future, to correct my 2016 error. I now some feel, I have no right to speak. I helped Trump win. I'm not going to rehash past arguments. You think, I am full of **** and should shut up; then block me and you will be fine. There's only one way to fix the mess and make the changes that are needed. You have to vote against the corrupt GOP out of power and right now, the Dems are the only option. Hopefully, that changes but for 2018 and 2020; the Dems need to win.You can't change the past but you can change the future. How many laws need changing because of the Trump presidency? How many amendments to the constitution do we need? The GOP has rigged it, so they win; even if the lose the vote overall. You can't get of the Electoral College until the GOP is gone. You can't get fairing districts drawn, until the GOP is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 We know Everything Trump has been doing is to reverse everything Obama did. Obama did it, well i has to go. I wonder why he chose not to run in 2012 against Obama, the man he so despises. Did he think, he couldn't beat him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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