The Conspiracy Thread

[Warhead36]

8 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

There's no conspiracy that makes Gruden target Grant 5 times, start Kelley, or Kirk throw the ball 5 yards over Crowders head for a(nother) crushing red Zorn int.

 

thats just Redskins football.

 

the reason it feels like we're always on the short end of the stick is because we always make stupid mistakes, and many of them, it amplifies when the refs make one.

 

If there is a team that has been on the wrong end of two of the most controversial calls in league history, it's the raiders.  The immaculate reception and the tuck rule.  You could argue that they got jobbed both times and it cost them 2 SBs. At least 2 SB appearances.

 

Agreed.

 

I actually think the refs helped us a LOT on Sunday. They called back multiple penalties and even gifted us a 1st down on a 3rd and super long by calling an iffy 5 yard defensive holding.

[REDSKYNYRD]

It's not a conspiracy when it can actually be seen right before your eyes year after year. The job isn't getting done.

 

It's like we keep building at race car with a shiny new paint job every year but the driver and pit crew still sucks.

[Reaper Skins]

20 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

There's no conspiracy that makes Gruden target Grant 5 times, start Kelley, or Kirk throw the ball 5 yards over Crowders head for a(nother) crushing red Zorn int.

 

thats just Redskins football.

 

the reason it feels like we're always on the short end of the stick is because we always make stupid mistakes, and many of them, it amplifies when the refs make one.

 

If there is a team that has been on the wrong end of two of the most controversial calls in league history, it's the raiders.  The immaculate reception and the tuck rule.  You could argue that they got jobbed both times and it cost them 2 SBs. At least 2 SB appearances.

 

How poorly the entire team played for the first 58 minutes of this game has absolutely no correspondence to what happened in the final 2 minutes.  

 

Poor play and bad officiating are not mutually exclusive.

 

The fact is that the Redskins had the ball with 2 minutes and 2 timeouts in a one possession game with a chance to win the game.  An incorrect officiating call is the sole reason that drive ended.

 

Based on the way the team played the rest of the game, is it fair to speculate that they PROBABLY would have found a way to lose it themselves?  Sure.  But that's not what happened.  They had an opportunity to win the game and the officials' interference directly prevented them from doing it.  That's a FACT.

Edited September 12, 2017 by Reaper Skins

[srtman04]

Yeah that was the wrong call and it favored the other team because they scored off that iffy play.  There's no doubt in my mind, if that same situation happened to Brady and the Patriots,  that call is reversed 100% of the time.  The NFL is obviously a fixed league and things will continue to be like this for the foreseeable future with our Skins.  This is the sad reality. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, Reaper Skins said:

They had an opportunity to win the game and the officials' interference directly prevented them from doing it.  That's a FACT.

It might have been a bad call.  Maybe, maybe not. Clearly I would have liked to have seen it over-turned with replay, but it was REALLY close.  

 

But it certainly isn't a grand conspiracy. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

It was close in real time, but conclusive in slow-motion.  I think dude just didn't want to overturn such a pivotal play.  He also might have gotten confused by the crowd and thought he was in Philly.

[skinzplay]

I don't like the idea of replay decisions being decided in New York. That should be done by a replay official in the booth, at the stadium, in coordination with the referee.

 

I still wouldn't blame the refs for the outcome or the flow of the game. They called just as much against the Eagles, and Cousins should've been called for intentional grounding but wasn't........so the deck was not stacked against us in this game.

 

We just need to come out better prepared and, particularly on offense, with a more balanced attack. Running your backs 13 times is just plain stupid. That was the least of any team in week 1, btw.

[Reaper Skins]

Not a fumble.  Absolute turning point in the game.  Getting really tired of these New York reviews and watching the commentators and guys like Pereirra scratching their heads.  All it does is remove accountability for bad calls so the NFL can control exciting endings and manipulate point spreads.  Its becoming unwatchable.

 

The Davis call was bad, the Jets tight end one was even worse.  When everyone in the stands, at home, and calling the game sees one thing, and you call it a different way, that's not ineptitude, it's deliberate.

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap3000000861385/Jimmie-Ward-returns-Vernon-Davis-fumble-to-the-1-yard-line

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/look-jets-hosed-by-the-awful-replay-reversal-of-all-awful-replay-reversals/

Edited October 16, 2017 by Reaper Skins

[NoCalMike]

I really think the "overwhelming evidence" asterisk is shielding the officials and allowing them to uphold their calls in cases where it should be overturned.

 

Take the Vernon Davis non-fumble fumble. When the play happens live, I am actually ok with the officials allowing the play to go on because there are plenty of times where plays are blown dead before they truly are and it takes away a big play for the defense.

 

However, once we get to replay lets take a look at what you can see clearly. Vernon Davis's elbow is on the ground and there is no football out of his hands/arms/anywhere in sight.  Common sense tells you that he is down by contact, however I can guarantee what the officials will offer as an explanation is "the replay never gave us a clear view of when the ball actually came out so we upheld the call"  So basically in this case what the replay film actually offered as assistance was virtually useless despite it showing pretty clearly that an elbow was on the ground and there was no loose ball in plain sight.

[onedrop]

17 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

I really think the "overwhelming evidence" asterisk is shielding the officials and allowing them to uphold their calls in cases where it should be overturned.

 

Take the Vernon Davis non-fumble fumble. When the play happens live, I am actually ok with the officials allowing the play to go on because there are plenty of times where plays are blown dead before they truly are and it takes away a big play for the defense.

 

However, once we get to replay lets take a look at what you can see clearly. Vernon Davis's elbow is on the ground and there is no football out of his hands/arms/anywhere in sight.  Common sense tells you that he is down by contact, however I can guarantee what the officials will offer as an explanation is "the replay never gave us a clear view of when the ball actually came out so we upheld the call"  So basically in this case what the replay film actually offered as assistance was virtually useless despite it showing pretty clearly that an elbow was on the ground and there was no loose ball in plain sight.

if you watch the original broadcast again there WAS the perfect view. seemingly only shown right AFTER the official review call was made.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I think the clear shot of Vernons arm being firmly planted to the ground while the ball is still tucked to be overwhelming evidence.  Same as I thought about Kirks arm going forward in week 1.  Both were calls where I literally got up and walked away from the tv for a second telling my wife and kid not to worry about it, they are clear as day reversals.  Yet Hoyer gets the reversal in our house with pretty much a carbon copy of Kirk's play from week 1. 

 

What in the entire F?

[TheGreek1973]

1 hour ago, NoCalMike said:

I really think the "overwhelming evidence" asterisk is shielding the officials and allowing them to uphold their calls in cases where it should be overturned.

 

Take the Vernon Davis non-fumble fumble. When the play happens live, I am actually ok with the officials allowing the play to go on because there are plenty of times where plays are blown dead before they truly are and it takes away a big play for the defense.

 

However, once we get to replay lets take a look at what you can see clearly. Vernon Davis's elbow is on the ground and there is no football out of his hands/arms/anywhere in sight.  Common sense tells you that he is down by contact, however I can guarantee what the officials will offer as an explanation is "the replay never gave us a clear view of when the ball actually came out so we upheld the call"  So basically in this case what the replay film actually offered as assistance was virtually useless despite it showing pretty clearly that an elbow was on the ground and there was no loose ball in plain sight.

And this is what I have a problem with.  If the damn replay itself couldn't show the ball was clearly out, how did a ref see it was clearly out in real speed.  If anything it should have been overturned on that point along.

 

IMO the Jets got robbed yesterday also when they clearly scored a TD.  To say the ball was moving is BS because is not that he didn't have total possession before the hit and when the replay shows the ball move he is actually hitting the pylon, which we all know its an automatic TD.  

 

Last but not least why is Doctson's TD against KC not a TD when both knee and elbow but the one last year of Jordy Nelson is when he actually loses the ball after Norman hits him and he has it for less time than Doctson had it?

 

Personally I hope these rules get cleared up because fans are getting fed up with this BS.

[RandyHolt]

I kind of hate that everything is considered a fumble now. Yesterday's Jets TD aside, all out of fear for blowing the whistle too soon.  I understand it. But then why not call all those "in-completions", where the WR take several steps, gets hit and fumbles, but they blow dead immediately and call it INC.

 

Who knew that cameramen would play such a huge role in our games.  Now that they know a possible fumble will always be called as such, the onus is on the camera man to get the camera zoomed in enough to make the correct call. Is that their job?

Edited October 16, 2017 by RandyHolt

[zCommander]

If refs are not going see things correctly with all the tech in the world then they need to get rid of instant replay and challenges all together. Problem solved. 

[SkinsFTW]

The Jets call was probably even worse than the Davis call but IMO the Davis call had clear evidence that he was down the difference was that he wasn't in the end zone but it still swung the game by 7 to 14 points.  

 

The problem with the call in the Jets game is this catch/no catch and possession /no possession rule is clearly just in existence to give them more control of the outcome of games because there is no consistency. As if they didn't already have enough control with the refs being able to ignore clear penalties all game long and pick and choose when to make calls whenever they feel like it. 

 

The NFL is losing their real fans in order to manufacture whatever it is they prefer but to me it almost seems like wrestling at this point. I remember watching wrestling in the 80s and I was never a fan it was mostly just funny. The NFL is getting funny too. 

[NoCalMike]

My main issue with replay right now is there are just way too many calls where the TV commentators & former officials in the studio working the broadcast are all in agreement about a call, yet the officials come to the opposite conclusion.  I don't understand the disconnect when I believe they all have access to the same camera angles and footage. 

 

Some situations it feels like instead of getting the call right, the goal is to justify whatever the officials called on the field, if at all possible. 

[SkinsFTW]

4 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

 

Some situations it feels like instead of getting the call right, the goal is to justify whatever the officials called on the field, if at all possible. 

But then sometimes they go against what was called on the field, like in the jets game, or that time rg3 catapulted into the end zone with the ball but he fumbled when he landed and they changed it to a fumble,  or dozen of similar examples. 

 

0 consistency = Mara is probably sitting back there grinning, or may as well be. It's not good when fans think there may be a conspiracy. 

[LavarArringtonMachine]

I think that they should get rid of the instant replay altogether.  I dont know what a catch is anymore, when it comes to a fumble, they talk about the ball shifting or does he have control, etc, etc, etc.  We should just go back to the old days....

 

If you look like you caught the ball its a catch.  If the ball comes out and the ref misses that your knee was down, oh well.  Human error.  They are still making human errors WITH replay observation.

 

As far as the ref or league conspiracy against any one team.  BS.  Thats loser talk.  The worst travesty in replay history happened to Calvin Johnson, Dez Bryant, and the Raiders with tuck rule garbage involving Tom Brady.  If anybody had a legit reason to whine about conspiracy, it was those particular players and/or teams that were horribly robbed.

 

It was just human error not some fairytale league wide conspiracy against a team.   That only exist in the minds of excuse givers.

Edited October 17, 2017 by LavarArringtonMachine

[SkinsFTW]

Except Dez Bryant wasn't robbed because Detroit was robbed the week before when they had beaten the Cowturds, then the refs stepped in to screw up a call. 

 

 

Called PI on the field, but after the refs got together they "changed their minds"

Edited October 17, 2017 by SkinsFTW
Pics

[Momma There Goes That Man]

11 hours ago, TheGreek1973 said:

And this is what I have a problem with.  If the damn replay itself couldn't show the ball was clearly out, how did a ref see it was clearly out in real speed.  If anything it should have been overturned on that point along.

 

That doesn't really make sense tho.  The refs are advised not to be quick on the whistle in situations like this so that it allows the play to finish and then can be reviewed afterwards. That is better than ruining a blow due to an inadvertent or premature whistle 

 

Secondly the official on the files could have had a very good view compared to the limited views of the replay camera. 

 

It it was a bad call but like Mike said above, I don’t recall seeing it clearly so the rats have to use common sense in some cases on the replays 

 

58 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

Except Dez Bryant wasn't robbed because Detroit was robbed the week before when they had beaten the Cowturds, then the refs stepped in to screw up a call. 

 

Ah the possession arrow of bad calls. I missed this new development. I’ll consider it thoroughly before weighing in. You could be on to something 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Momma There Goes That Man

[LavarArringtonMachine]

15 hours ago, SkinsFTW said:

Except Dez Bryant wasn't robbed because Detroit was robbed the week before when they had beaten the Cowturds, then the refs stepped in to screw up a call. 

 

 

Called PI on the field, but after the refs got together they "changed their minds"

 

 

And this is my point exactly.  Refs make human era calls.  Not bias, conspiracy, vendetta calls.  Everybody benefits from, and get hosed by human error, not this fairytale, self imagined ref bias against one team out of all 32 teams.  We have benefited from horrible calls too!  Why would we get a call in our favor in the pic below, if we are this NFL stepchild?

Edited October 17, 2017 by LavarArringtonMachine

[Reaper Skins]

1 hour ago, LavarArringtonMachine said:

 

 

 Refs make human era calls.  Not bias, conspiracy, vendetta calls.... self imagined ref bias against one team out of all 32 teams

 

Here's at least one official, Mike Carey, who has openly admitted that he would not officiate Redskins games due to the name and his inability to remain objective.  Despite this, he was voted one of the two best refs in the league along with Ed Hoculi.

 

"Carey had established himself as one of the most well-respected referees in football. In 2008, an ESPN poll of NFL coaches named him and Ed Hochuli the two best refs in the league.

 

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2014/8/20/6049193/nfl-referee-washington-redskins-name

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2169580-former-nfl-referee-mike-carey-avoided-officiating-redskins-games-over-nickname

 

Also, cherry picking one bad call in our favor (against another bottom dweller organization like the Browns no less) doesn't negate everything against us.  That's like saying global warming doesn't exist because we had one day where it snowed.  I made this thread to catalog anything unfair that happened to THIS team.  That doesn't mean unfair stuff doesn't happen to other teams too.  it's not mutually exclusive.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Reaper Skins

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I can chalk calls on the field up to human error.  It's another thing when plays can be dissected on replay, from multiple angles.  I think both Kirk and Vernon's "fumbles" this year fall into a category where calling a fumble on the field is fine, but upon replay it's clear as day that neither were fumbles.

[LavarArringtonMachine]

10 minutes ago, Reaper Skins said:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2169580-former-nfl-referee-mike-carey-avoided-officiating-redskins-games-over-nickname

 

Also, cherry picking one bad call in our favor (against another bottom dweller organization like the Browns no less) doesn't negate everything against us.  That's like saying global warming doesn't exist because we had one day where it snowed.  I made this thread to catalog anything unfair that happened to THIS team.  That doesn't mean unfair stuff doesn't happen to other teams too.  it's not mutually exclusive.

 

 

The refs, dont drop passes, fumble the ball, hire Zorn as HC, call extra conservative plays during the last minutes of the quarter, try to purchase all the top free agents to build an unsuccessful super team, hire Cerrato's dumb ass as a GM, get Albert Haynesworth and McNabb in free agency, and most of all draft colossal busts like RG3.  The refs didnt do that...  our organization did that to itself.  However, we ARE on the right path to success.

 

We have not been relevant and unsuccessful for many years because of our own doing, not because of some imaginary league wide ref bias.  Do you really think refs get up Sunday morning, drink their coffee, eat their breakfast and sit there trying to figure out all the ways they can JUST screw over the Washington Redskins?  Cmon fam, we are smarter, bigger, and better than that as a fanbase to lean on such a weak excuse as to whether we win or lose a ballgame.

 

Thats just as bad as the people Ive heard say that they dont like ESPN, NFL Network, and other media outlets because they have a "bias" against us.  Why should they feature us over the last 20 years?  Seriously.  When is the last time we won a playoff game?

 

If we win and show promise like we have been doing, then we will get our just due.  As fans of this great franchise, we have to change our mindset and way of thinking.  I know we have been down a long time, but we have something special and real here brewing.

 

We gotta get out of the paranoid, "they dont like us", "everybody is against us", "CONSPIRACY" way of thinking.  WE ARE THE FANS OF THE WASHINGTON REDSKINS!!!!  Lets start acting like it without the excuses.  HTTR

[Reaper Skins]

6 minutes ago, LavarArringtonMachine said:

 

We have not been relevant and unsuccessful for many years because of our own doing, not because of some imaginary league wide ref bias.  Do you really think refs get up Sunday morning, drink their coffee, eat their breakfast and sit there trying to figure out all the ways they can JUST screw over the Washington Redskins?  Cmon fam, we are smarter, bigger, and better than that as a fanbase to lean on such a weak excuse as to whether we win or lose a ballgame.

 

Again, the two aren't mutually exclusive. 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Reaper Skins