Mike Shanahan Tells All on ESPN 980 (RGIII, McNabb, Manning, Haynseworth) Link included w/ Audio

[gortiz]

Half this board either could have or did predict that.

It made no sense to square peg Griffin into a west coast offense and have him sit in a less than impressive pocket.

It didn't make sense to do that when we hired Jay and it doesn't make sense to "run it back" and try again next year.

But I say that as somebody that believes Griffin can run offenses without needing the RO as a crutch but I don't think the WCO was a great fit. If Shanahan wanted to run the Baylor offense when he drafted Griffin like he said he told Dan and Bruce, he sure as hell didn't implement it.

Oh, I don't know about that. The dramatic inability to do the most basic things from the pocket after 2012 was not easily predictable or foreseeable, regardless of what type of offense he was running.

[Taylor 36]

Poorly phrased. Conceded. They were a great pair.

Without Elway, not so much. In fact, almost exactly average.

(facts- not opinions- for the record, lest I be accused of slandering the almighty one)

Hey, I wasn't trying to say you were slandering anyone. Sorry if you took it that way.  I am in no way sticking up for Shanny, just pointing out that he was there for all of Elway's successful seasons minus one playoff win. As a matter of fact, I'm not hitching my wagon to anyone on either side here, because I am not privy to enough information to claim to begin to think who is lying about what. The whole thing just makes me sick. 

[Hail4Life]

I don't know man, I  bought what he was selling.  I will admit he is great at deflecting blame and twisting stories but I ate it all up the way I'd like my girl to.

[Tsailand]

You won't find a bigger RG3 fan than me.  It's pretty clear what happened after listening to the whole interview.  Robert had Dan Snyder (and probably others) in his ear, telling him that he needs to be a dropback QB to increase the length of his career.

 

RG2 had to be a huge part of that.  I wonder if he realizes what a huge disservice he's done to his son with his meddling and jealousy over Cousins.

 

.

[grego]

Hey, I wasn't trying to say you were slandering anyone. Sorry if you took it that way. I am in no way sticking up for Shanny, just pointing out that he was there for all of Elway's successful seasons minus one playoff win. As a matter of fact, I'm not hitching my wagon to anyone on either side here, because I am not privy to enough information to claim to begin to think who is lying about what. The whole thing just makes me sick.

LOL. No, not you. But some people don't like any criticism of shanny.

I get it, but I don't get it

[Hail4Life]

Poorly phrased. Conceded. They were a great pair.

Without Elway, not so much. In fact, almost exactly average.

(facts- not opinions- for the record, lest I be accused of slandering the almighty one)

Average?  That would require about .500 win pct to qualify as mediocre or average.

[Spear]

I derived hope from that interview. If Robert ever gets his head out of his ass, gets over his hang-ups about being labeled a running quarterback, devotes some of the time he spends working out to studying film, and learns to trust someone not named Art Briles or Terry Shea, he could be back on track to being special.

 

That's not where I place my hope, because I know it won't happen. He's still running back to Tery Shea and he's still blaming his injury for his failures this season, rather than owning up to sucking before he got hurt. No, my hope is that Cousins gets the monkey off his back and takes the job before its too late and and he becomes a good player for another team.

[Darrell Green Fan]

RG2 had to be a huge part of that.  I wonder if he realizes what a huge disservice he's done to his son with his meddling and jealousy over Cousins.

 

.

This is an excellent point and one not discussed enough. Between Dad and Owner they created a monster. 

 

It probably won't happen but it would be great if Shanny got another stint and showed the haters just how wrong they are about him.  Some many put all the blame on Mike Shanahan for what happened here but I've seen what took place before he got here and since he left and know better.  I tend to believe what I heard in that interview because a lot of it simply backs stories we have heard in the past.

 

There is no doubt he should have pulled Griff against the Hawks.  But what people are discounting is the **** storm that this would have created.  We have a player who repeatedly lied to his coach about the extent of his injury, then threw him under the bus when he got hurt more seriously.  We have a player who forced his way back into the Ravens game, then cried like a little **** when he didn't start the following week even though it was a 2 week injury at best.  Can you image what he would have done had Shanny pulled him from a close playoff game?  I"ll tell you what would have happened.  He would have run to the owner, who was obviously enabling his diva  behavior (demanding plays being taken from the playbook while using "Snyder Language") and the already fragile coach/QB relationship would have been ruined beyond repair.

 

Nope  Robert Griffin put the coach in a no win situation and is to blame for a large part of this entire mess.  The recent quote where he blamed his injury and another head coach, not Robert Griffin III, for his bad play tells us he hasn't changed a damn bit.

 

When 2 different coaching staffs, as well as the majority of the locker room, hate your guts maybe it's time you look in the mirror Robert. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

It probably won't happen but it would be great if Shanny got another stint and showed the haters just how wrong they are about him.  Some many put all the blame on Mike Shanahan for what happened here but I've seen what took place before he got here and since he left and know better.  I tend to believe what I heard in that interview because a lot of it simply backs stories we have heard in the past.

 

 

 

 

I don't get why Shanny's reputation (Sheehan style) is so wrapped up in RG3 and the offense exclusively.   If you read the articles about why he was canned in Denver, it read that while he was trusted on offense, his defenses stank and his personnel moves were checkered at best.  It was Shanny the GM that got him fired.  It was Shanny who was in charge of the defense that got him fired. And how about that special teams he left us with?

 

Cooley has an interesting expose at the end of Shanny's tenure where he said he talked to Danny Smith who told him he saw the special teams implosion coming because he hadn't been with a coach with such a lack of interest in finding special teams players.

 

It's the other parts of the job in my opinion that are likely why he will struggle to find another job.  As to who was at fault for the injury in the Seattle game and the back and forth stuff with him and RG3, I don't think will be a predominant factor as to what happens next with him.  Although, I don't think that interview he just did will help matters.

[Darrell Green Fan]

Below is the list of Redskins head coaches hired by Daniel Snyder who have gotten another NFL head coaching job after leaving this dumpster fire:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[Burgold]

Nope... Norv got several jobs after being fired.

[Darrell Green Fan]

Nope... Norv got several jobs after being fired.

I said hired by Snyder. 

[Burgold]

I said hired by Snyder. 

whoops. Read fired. not sure why. Though you could argue (not in the NFL) that Spurrier made it back happily to the head coaching ranks and is doing fine.

[Darrell Green Fan]

whoops. Read fired. not sure why. Though you could argue (not in the NFL) that Spurrier made it back happily to the head coaching ranks and is doing fine.

 

 

Yeah no worries, I started to write fired but then remembers Norv. But SS's success at SC means nothing, we're talking NFL.

 

As for Shanny in Denver he was there for 14 years.  That is an eternity by NFL standards.  Sometimes it's just time to go, just like with Andy Reid in Philly.  But like Reid that hardly means he was not successful.  . 

 

For those claiming he only won because of Elway his post Elway record in Denver was 91-69.  That's not average, or below average as some here have contended.  No a wining percentage of .560 is tremendous, for reference Bill Parceill's career winning percentage was .569.  Now compare that with Shanny's  record in Washington where he went 24-40.   You may think that it's all the coach that would make a guy go from from 22 games over .500 (post Elway) to 16 games under in DC but not me.  I've seen what has been going on here for too long not to understand it wasn't all the coach.  Not even close. 

 

Cutler, Griese, Plummer.  These are 3 very pedestrian QBs who had their greatest success by far  under Mike Shannahan.  But alas Robert Griffin's ego would not allow him to be coached by a guy who knows a thing or two more than he does about playing QB in the NFL

[Skinsinparadise]

Gibbs retired, am sure he could have gotten a head coaching job.  Marty got hired.  Zorn was never even a coordinator nevermind a head coach before he got here, no shocker, he ended up back where he started as a Qb coach.  Spurrier wanted to go back to college and he did. 

 

Shanny was no Belichick when we hired him.  Mid to late 90s, Denver had some glory years but in later years they were mired in medicority, we all know the one playoff win in 14 years.  I liked the hire at the time and had some intense debates with Oldfan on the subject.  He kept at it about his defenses and personnel and that he was a glorified offensive coordinator -- I argued otherwise and thought it would be different here.  He was right, I was wrong. 

[Chump Bailey]

Where is Oldfan SIP?

 

I remember those debates well too.

[Burgold]

Marty is probably the most interesting question.  Like Shanahan, Schottenheimer was picked up after being fired.  The Redskins may have been the only person knocking though no Marty's door.  He was out of the NFL to the degree that he decided to coach a minor league team.

 

He had very mixed results here. He ended up with an okay record, but he nearly caused a mutiny and the players really hated him.  He was a major tyrant from all reports.  Given the fact that no one wanted him for years before Danny grabbed him plus his age I suspect that is why he never got another shot.

 

Besides, you more or less know the ceiling with Schottenheimer. Tough, aggressive teams that will play it close to the vest and probably make it to the playoffs before the zero risk strategy causes them to falter.

[darrelgreenie]

Your timeline on Marty is wrong.

[Burgold]

Your timeline on Marty is wrong.

You're right, I forgot he was three years out of coaching as an analyst before coming to the Redskins. Relying on memory.  However, that also means that Darrell Green Fan was wrong.  Looks like he landed his head coaching stint with San Diego after Snyder hired and fired him.

[MartinC]

You're right, I forgot he was three years out of coaching as an analyst before coming to the Redskins. Relying on memory.  However, that also means that Darrell Green Fan was wrong.  Looks like he landed his head coaching stint with San Diego after Snyder hired and fired him.

I was just going to post that. Marty was hired by San Diego right after being fired by the Redskins. He had 5 years with the Chargers going 47-33 winning 2 division titles. But he was 0-2 in the post season. He lost a power battle with AJ Smith and was fired after going 14-2 the year before. 14 and 2 and he got fired ...

[grego]

 

 

For those claiming he only won because of Elway his post Elway record in Denver was 91-69.  That's not average, or below average as some here have contended.  No a wining percentage of .560 is tremendous, for reference Bill Parceill's career winning percentage was .569.  Now compare that with Shanny's  record in Washington where he went 24-40.   

 

 

 

there are a a few ways to spin mike shanahans career. one is to look at his overall record in denver, and its clearly very good. and most will not pay any attention to his 4 years in washington or his year + in oakland, cuz, well, its washington and oakland, where coaches go to die. its an automatic pass. 

 

mike shanahan did some things very well. he got the most out of his QB's. plummer hated him. elway doesnt get along with him so well. but both excelled under him- more so than they had at any point in their careers. 

 

if mike had been happy to be a HC with a competent GM, he probably would still be coaching in denver and be regarded as one of the greatest of all time 

 

but he wasnt. hes a control freak (which, as i said before, isnt a bad thing if it works).

 

so, another way to look at mikes career is that he was very fortunate to become the HC of a team led by one of the greatest of all time. i say that, because, the fact is, while he had a few double digit win seasons post-elway, and a respectable win %, in the 14 seasons as a head coach/GM since then, he has won one playoff game.

 

that is abysmal by any standard- even ours. there is no way to spin that positively.

 

his broncos won 9 games in 06. since then, in 6 seasons as a HC, hes had one winning season. sure, we were 3-6 to start the season, but won 7 in a row, to mikes credit. 

 

ive talked about mikes HC record without elway, and its basically .500. thats not bad. its not good, but its really not bad. 

 

anyway, those are the numbers. many people think hes a great coach, and thats fine. hes not the only coach to have the benefit of inheriting HOF players and taking advantage of it. barry switzer won a super bowl with the big 3 in dallas. 

 

mike should have stuck to being a HC.

 

 

 

 

You may think that it's all the coach that would make a guy go from from 22 games over .500 (post Elway) to 16 games under in DC but not me.  I've seen what has been going on here for too long not to understand it wasn't all the coach.  Not even close. 

 

 

i think thats a bit lazy (not saying you personally are lazy, i'm saying its overly simplistic to say 'its the redskins'). 

 

remember, he had 10 years to show what kind of a coach he was in the town where he was a legend. and he failed. and he got fired. 

 

#1 shanny apologist kevin sheehan confirmed yesterday that dan didnt meddle in personnel. this was his boat, and he sunk it. was it all his fault? not at all. the cap penalty was a dagger. but he (yes, mike) made so many bad moves that put this franchise behind the 8 ball for years to come. 

 

he wanted final say and he got it. what he needs to do is suck it up and take responsibility for his moves. he's nearly 100% unaccountable for his tenure here because everyone says "its the redskins". if he's going to go on the radio and blame others for most of his own failings just because its the redskins, i dont know why anyone, especially redskins fans, would just sit by and take it. 

 

then again, we are like abused spouses. i think we feel like we deserve it. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

OK OK I was wrong on Marty.  Sheesh. 

 

But I stand by what I said about Shanny in Denver.   And if you don't think "It's the Redskins" has played a part well you just haven't been paying attention to what's been going on around here for a generation.  Is anyone really arguing that Snyder enabled Griffin's diva behavior and it played a huge roll in the issues we have to this day?  Really?  Griffin's last quote where he blamed his injury and yet another head coach, not Robert Griffin III, for his play last year tells me he still doesn't get it. 

 

As for Shanny's moves in DC I think a lot of weight should be given to the comment that had they known about the cap penalty earlier, not an hour before FA began in a totally unnecessary twist of the knife, they would not have done the Griffin trade.  While it was their idea to roll the dice, and deserve partial blame for the gamble, there is no question in my mind that they got screwed for contracts the NFL had previously approved and it absolutely nuked a plan that they had been implementing for 2 full years.  This isn't an excuse.  It's not a apology.  It's a fact, that cap penalty played a huge roll in what happened here.   

 

I get the frustration, I feel it too.  But I just think the Shanahans are easy targets.  A lot of these same people were saying Kyle only had the job here due to his last name.  Well considering how he made something called Matt Schaub a near franchise QB in Houston, how he got production out of perhaps the worst offensive personnel in the league last year in Cleveland, and how we saw the huge regression in Griffin after the Shannahan's left, I think it's fair to say that Kyle Shanahan knows what he is doing after all.. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

 

remember, he had 10 years to show what kind of a coach he was in the town where he was a legend. and he failed. and he got fired. 

 

 

 

Andy Reid got fired

Marty got fired

Bill Belichick got fired. 

 

This is nonsense.  I just gave you his record post Elway yet you guy continue to post like he was Marion Campbell.   Just about every head coach gets fired eventually, as I said they always run their course. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Where is Oldfan SIP?

 

I remember those debates well too.

 

Yeah don't know.  Banned?   He would get into some big time rows in his debates.   I was about 50-50 with him as for agreement, sometimes I agreed, sometimes not.  But he was entertaining and put meat into his arguments and we got along fine.    He was animated on the Shanny hire, predicting the offense would go well, the defense and the rest of the team would not -- and he would be mediocre at best in the GM role, and overall it won't end well.   He cited he would hire Shanny in a minute to run his offense and be a coordinator but not run the whole team which is two entirely different animals.  I was a lot more optimistic than him about the hire, we debated it.  And as I said, I was dead wrong, he was eerily on the money on just about the whole drill on Shanny.

[grego]

Andy Reid got fired

Marty got fired

Bill Belichick got fired.

This is nonsense. I just gave you his record post Elway yet you guy continue to post like he was Marion Campbell. Just about every head coach gets fired eventually, as I said they always run their course.

out of everything I posted you pick three words to take issue with?