pjfootballer Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Otto Graham? Ken Stabler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 "Modern Era" is too broad. I think it almost has to be broken down further. The game is totally different now than it was even in Brady's first year or two. Montana, for me, was always a bit over rated - but there is no arguing the results. He was a winner. Brady has transcended very well and adapted his game over time. He's taken on more and more responsibility. He is a winner. Manning revolutionized the position. It's amazing to me, that with the model that Peyton Manning has set, there aren't a few more like him (at least as far as their approach to the game is concerned). I attribute a lot of that to coaching in High School and College level taking the "easy approach" and doing more of the spread offenses and "check with me" type plays. I understand why it's done, especially at that level, but I think it's hindered a lot of QB development recently. Which is why we don't have the amount of QBs in the league that are really good to great. But overall, I think Peyton Manning is a scorer, and innovator, but not necessarily a winner. So to summarize, Joe Montana was the greatest QB of the 80s. I think you have to give the 90s to Aikman - if he wasn't the greatest numbers producer he was certainly the greatest leader and manager of personalities. The 00's to present it's Tom Brady. He wins. EDIT: For the old timers, I wasn't a gleam in my daddy's eye during the 70s so I'll yield to your expertise there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 4. Montana - Not saying he isn't good, I just think the other 3 are slightly better. He played in the perfect offense for him and had the luxury of the best WR to play the game. Don't forget, Montana won half his Super Bowl's before Jerry Rice was even in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yohan Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I put Brady and Montana at 1a and 1b. I gave the nod to Brady for knocking up both Gisele Bundchen and Bridget Moynahan. Marino doesn't work for me, for the simple fact, he has unkind words for the 3-0 scab team of the 87 Superbowl Championship team. Plus, the laces weren't out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Don't forget, Montana won half his Super Bowl's before Jerry Rice was even in the league. That is true. I do like DC9's take though. Sure the modern era is considered the Super Bowl era, but the game has changed so much, even over the last decade. Back in 2005, there were 2 QBs who threw for more than 4,000yds. In 2014, there were 11 QBs with over 4,000yds. In 2011, there were 3 5,000yd passers (almost 4, Eli had 4,933). It's so hard to compare QBs because of how pass friendly the league is now. I think Marino would be unstoppable now with the way the league is though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeWolf990 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 talk about NEVER wanting to be taken serious again..on ANY subject. Ever. (you just pulled the football equivalent of comparing a modern-day american politician to Hitler) but I didnt. Like I said before, if you compare their season-by-season numbers against their peers in their respective eras, they are similar in their rankings. On top of that, Eli never had any big time weapons on offense. No great #1 WR. No dominant running game. And his performance in the 2011 playoffs was about as close you can get to one person carrying an offense and making big plays. People love saying Elway was the man without him actually being the man. Dude was a beauty pageant winner at QB. Elway is a better QB than Eli, but Elway does not belong in these "Greatest QBs of all time" conversations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Don't forget, Montana won half his Super Bowl's before Jerry Rice was even in the league. Yes, but Montana also won them using a brand new offensive system that no one knew how to defend yet, and an absolutely stacked roster (especially on defense). The true hero of the 1980s 49ers was Bill Walsh, not Joe Montana. And Ronnie Lott might have been the second most important factor in their success. Montana was the frontman, but I firmly believe that at least 6 or 8 QBs of that era would have been extraordinarily successful had they been given Montana's roster spot under Walsh's tutelage. By the end of the 1980s, defenses had caught up to the WCO, but it took a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s0crates Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 1. Is the Tailgate the right forum for this topic? 2. The poll question is more specific (specifies "modern era") than the thread title, otherwise I'd say Sammy Baugh and Otto Graham should be mentioned when discussing the grestest QBs in "NFL history." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The way I look at those Niner teams is that EITHER 1). The Niners managed to pick two consecutive QBs who were both contenders for Best in NFL. or 2). Something about those teams (system, coaches, team talent) gave both Montana and Young a lot of help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 Yes, but Montana also won them using a brand new offensive system that no one knew how to defend yet, and an absolutely stacked roster (especially on defense). The true hero of the 1980s 49ers was Bill Walsh, not Joe Montana. And Ronnie Lott might have been the second most important factor in their success. Montana was the frontman, but I firmly believe that at least 6 or 8 QBs of that era would have been extraordinarily successful had they been given Montana's roster spot under Walsh's tutelage. By the end of the 1980s, defenses had caught up to the WCO, but it took a while. Well that is why Gibbs is the best coach ever not named Lombardi. Because to win 3 Super Bowls with zero hall of fame QB's in unfathomable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsluggo Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 "Modern Era" is too broad. I think it almost has to be broken down further. The game is totally different now than it was even in Brady's first year or two. Montana, for me, was always a bit over rated - but there is no arguing the results. He was a winner. Brady has transcended very well and adapted his game over time. He's taken on more and more responsibility. He is a winner. Manning revolutionized the position. It's amazing to me, that with the model that Peyton Manning has set, there aren't a few more like him (at least as far as their approach to the game is concerned). I attribute a lot of that to coaching in High School and College level taking the "easy approach" and doing more of the spread offenses and "check with me" type plays. I understand why it's done, especially at that level, but I think it's hindered a lot of QB development recently. Which is why we don't have the amount of QBs in the league that are really good to great. But overall, I think Peyton Manning is a scorer, and innovator, but not necessarily a winner. So to summarize, Joe Montana was the greatest QB of the 80s. I think you have to give the 90s to Aikman - if he wasn't the greatest numbers producer he was certainly the greatest leader and manager of personalities. The 00's to present it's Tom Brady. He wins. EDIT: For the old timers, I wasn't a gleam in my daddy's eye during the 70s so I'll yield to your expertise there. you could've narrowed your post to say: Montana won the most superbowls in the 80s, Aikman in the 90s and Brady in the 2000s. /QED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 Dan Marino throwing for 48 TDs and 5,000 yards in 1984 is the best season ever and he is certainly not barely in the top 15. The winner nonsense is what it is, nonsense. If you win 4 SB's you deserve to be boosted, but if you don't have the roster another guy has, you don't deserve to be knocked down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I voted Brady. Montana is #2 now, imo. We saw what Brady did with marginal talent at WR and RB his entire career. We also saw what he could do with an elite WR (Randy Moss), go 16-0 in the regular season, break records and make it to the Super Bowl with an 18-0 record (best ever in a season since the Dolphins went 17-0). If not a fluke pass/catch, he would have another ring. He only got Moss 2 seasons, he was hurt week 1 in 2008. Then Moss was traded in week 2 or 3 in 2010 and was at that point at the end of his career (considering he did nothing after his Pats departure). Yes, I know, a controversial call leading to an INT sealed the victory for Brady this time. But hey, bad calls and lots of luck (for the Giants) cost him two more rings, so it's a wash imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 This question cannot be answered until we determine if Joe Flacco is elite or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The way I look at those Niner teams is that EITHER 1). The Niners managed to pick two consecutive QBs who were both contenders for Best in NFL. or 2). Something about those teams (system, coaches, team talent) gave both Montana and Young a lot of help. The Niners didn't pick Young. He was traded for and basically sat behind Montana for 4 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 you could've narrowed your post to say: Montana won the most superbowls in the 80s, Aikman in the 90s and Brady in the 2000s. /QED That doesn't make that QB the best ever. It just happens to work out that way. I'm with Predicto as far as the 80s go. Montana was a winner and the game ending drives were a lot of fun to watch as a kid. But Warren Moon, Dan Fouts, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, Steve Young, Bernie Kosar, Boomer Esiason, any number of those guys could've won just as many (if not more) Super Bowls than Montana did. But Montana was a/the winner. That's why he gets my nod for QB of the 80s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Well that is why Gibbs is the best coach ever not named Lombardi. Because to win 3 Super Bowls with zero hall of fame QB's in unfathomable. Not only that, but he did with with three different QBs. And, I think the thing that cements Gibbs as if not the best Head Coach of all-time, but certainly in the top 3 or 4, he came back after 12 years away from the game and went to the playoffs TWICE in four years and won a game with a sorry team. Still convinced if Taylor never died, in year five we would have done some damage with Gibbs. Remember that year we started off 6-2 with Jim Zorn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Welker has almost 900 catches. He will pass our great, Art Monk, in 2015 and will probable top or be near the 1000-1050 catch range by the time he quits. I suspect that falls into the elite, even in the pass happy NFL. I will say this, Brady does benefit from the era he plays in. In shotgun many more times than Montana was, Brady also benefits because WR's aren't allowed to be mugged like they were in the 80's and pass offenses are much more sophisticated. That said, give Brady props because CB's have become much more elite at what they are doing. But to me, if it takes someone 6 tries to tie/break what someone did in 4..I go with the 4 (almost all things being the same). Look at Welker's numbers when Brady is passing to him, then look at his numbers prior to the Pats and after. Those stats are telling. Welker is a very good slot receiver. Brady and the Pats' system made him. I disagree that he is elite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Montana beat John Elway, Dan Marino, Boomer Esiason, and Ken Anderson in the Super Bowl. Brady beat Kurt Warner, Jake Delhomme, Donovan McNabb, and Russell Wilson. Also..as I mentioned earlier, late in his career, Montana took KC to the AFC championship game. System QB who was only great because of Rice and the other talent? No, not really. To me, the SB era of QB lists begins with Montana. But to each their own, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Montana beat John Elway, Dan Marino, Boomer Esiason, and Ken Anderson in the Super Bowl. Brady beat Kurt Warner, Jake Delhomme, Donovan McNabb, and Russell Wilson. Mark Rypien beat Jim Kelly. Peyton Manning beat Rex Grossman. I don't understand your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 My point was that Montana's teams had to beat 2 HOFers, 1 NFL MVP, and a solid QB. Brady's teams had to beat Warner (future HOFer..maybe) and some solid QB's. Personally, Montana's SB wins are more impressive to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 Mark Rypien beat Jim Kelly. Peyton Manning beat Rex Grossman. I don't understand your point? The point is he faced tougher competition in the big game than Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The point is he faced tougher competition in the big game than Brady. How is that Brady's fault? And really the only bad he's played against is Delhomme. McNabb during his time was what one of the 3 or 4 winningest QBs in the league. Warner is a borderline HoF and more than likely gets in at some point and Wilson looks to be one of the better young QBs in the game. It's not like he's played all scrubs. The Rams team was one of the best offenses in NFL history and the Seahawks defense he just beat was probably one of the top 3 or 5 defenses of all-time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins3D Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Don't forget, Montana won half his Super Bowl's before Jerry Rice was even in the league. Brady never had a Rice, or anything in Rice's stratosphere. (But when he had moss, they went 16-0) This isn't an allstar team, week 2 the headlines were that the dynasty was over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The Rams team was one of the best offenses in NFL history and the Seahawks defense he just beat was probably one of the top 3 or 5 defenses of all-time. Of all time? I think the 85/86 bears, the Taylor in his prime NYG D (90?), the Ravens D from 2000, the Purple People Eaters from the early 70's, and the Steel Curtain from the mid to late 70's would be far ahead of them. But that's another poll and discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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