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Welcome to the Washington Redskins Derrius Guice RB LSU

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1 hour ago, Rogue Jedi said:

However, knowing our fan base... if his first two carries go for a net 3 yards they’ll be screaming “bust” and want him benched.

I couldn't give two ****s about that. I know what I know and I know what I see. I still can't believe we somehow drafted guice. 

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1 hour ago, Rogue Jedi said:

However, knowing our fan base... if his first two carries go for a net 3 yards they’ll be screaming “bust” and want him benched.

 

I disagree, i think our fanbase overvalues high draft picks even when its clear they suck ass.

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3 hours ago, Rogue Jedi said:

Nothing against fat rob or Perine, but they are officially JAGs at this point.

They were always JAGs.  Normally I'd say we had nothing to compare to, but CT was light-years ahead of both of them.  It was just wishful thinking on those two, we do that from time to time.

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54 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

They were always JAGs.  Normally I'd say we had nothing to compare to, but CT was light-years ahead of both of them.  It was just wishful thinking on those two, we do that from time to time.

 

I actually think Kelly has some potential, but ive seen enough from perine.  Perine is nowhere close to an nfl (nevermind staarting) nfl rb.

 

I do wonder if perine could switch positions, maybe te or fb if we need one

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2 minutes ago, zoony said:

 

I actually think Kelly has some potential, but ive seen enough from perine.  Perine is nowhere close to an nfl (nevermind staarting) nfl rb.

 

I do wonder if perine could switch positions, maybe te or fb if we need one

 

I used to be on the Kelly train, but seeing him not able to stay healthy killed that for me.  A lot of my hope came from him getting those extra yards, but I know you saw how "awkward" it felt him going in the flat for passes sometimes.  As for Perine, I have a had time forgiving Jay for letting Young go.  TE is possible, but seems clear Jay doesn't care about having a traditional FB.  I was looking for the name of that running back we let leave and wish we hadn't when RBs were dropping like flies and almost forgot Keith Marshall was still here.  Also see a rookie FB.  I have zero faith he makes the roster, and can see Kelley and Perine staying just because Marshall gets hurt again and odd man outs himself.  We may keep 4 with expectation CT won't play 16 games, think that's only way I'd want to keep Kelley and Perine on the roster.

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@Renegade7 Yeah, I’m of the mindset that the logical thing to do would be keep either Kelley or Perine as the #2 and carry Marshall or Bibbs to backup Thompson.  If we did keep Kelley and Perine, and Thompson got hurt, I wonder if Guice might become a 3 down back (given the occasional breather by Kelley/Perine). That might be putting a bit much on our rookie.  

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Not to be Debbie Downer, but is anyone else worried about Gruden’s usage of Guice?  Between being notorious for forgetting the run game and him recently saying Guice is a “first and second down thumper”, it just left a bad taste in my mouth. Something about type-casting a player before he plays a down for you seems weird to me.  Like, if Guice turns out to be a great pass catcher and blocker, is Gruden going to stick with his initial thought, as opposed to accepting that he has a premier back?  Most of this is coming from my general distrust of Gruden, so feel free to disagree.

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21 minutes ago, browntim16 said:

Not to be Debbie Downer, but is anyone else worried about Gruden’s usage of Guice?  Between being notorious for forgetting the run game and him recently saying Guice is a “first and second down thumper”, it just left a bad taste in my mouth. Something about type-casting a player before he plays a down for you seems weird to me.  Like, if Guice turns out to be a great pass catcher and blocker, is Gruden going to stick with his initial thought, as opposed to accepting that he has a premier back?  Most of this is coming from my general distrust of Gruden, so feel free to disagree.

I have rarely seen Gruden forget the running game. In his time here, the only time we have had a running attack that looked good enough and we were in situations to use to apply the concept of forgetting the run game was 2016.  In 2014, you may argue that it looked quality often but we were not in a situation to actually use it very often.  In 2015, we actually had a quality running game that we were able to rely on until week 5, after that, especially when we played good teams, it was usually a fail. In 2016, Gruden was not really the man who ran the offense and much of our success at running the ball was arguably the result of our opponents being afraid of our passing. Guice is really the first potential blue chip RB he has ever had.

 

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1 hour ago, browntim16 said:

Not to be Debbie Downer, but is anyone else worried about Gruden’s usage of Guice?  Between being notorious for forgetting the run game and him recently saying Guice is a “first and second down thumper”, it just left a bad taste in my mouth. Something about type-casting a player before he plays a down for you seems weird to me.  Like, if Guice turns out to be a great pass catcher and blocker, is Gruden going to stick with his initial thought, as opposed to accepting that he has a premier back?  Most of this is coming from my general distrust of Gruden, so feel free to disagree.

Before boy wonder became our OC we were top15 in the league for run attempts. Not sure why people have the notion the Gruden doesn't like to run the ball. We were running a lot for little last year until everyone got hurt also. If anything, if guise ends up being our every down back, he could start putting up more stats than CT was last year and he was headed towards Fault like numbers. 

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Posted (edited)
40 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Before boy wonder became our OC we were top15 in the league for run attempts. Not sure why people have the notion the Gruden doesn't like to run the ball. We were running a lot for little last year until everyone got hurt also. If anything, if guise ends up being our every down back, he could start putting up more stats than CT was last year and he was headed towards Fault like numbers. 

The one with Washington at 13 is pre-Mcvay, which speaks to your point.  But what I’m getting at is the 5-6 times PER YEAR Gruden gets on the mic after a loss with the exact same “I have to have better balance” speech.  Maybe my perception is skewed, but I can’t possibly be the only person who got tired of that post-game phrase.

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881E1115-7051-4255-B1F9-EA6A76E33480.pngThese are in reverse order, sorry.

Edited by browntim16

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3 hours ago, browntim16 said:

The one with Washington at 13 is pre-Mcvay, which speaks to your point.  But what I’m getting at is the 5-6 times PER YEAR Gruden gets on the mic after a loss with the exact same “I have to have better balance” speech.  Maybe my perception is skewed, but I can’t possibly be the only person who got tired of that post-game phrase.

, sorry.

Yeah, pre McVay we ran just fine with Almo. McVay ended that and we haven't had an NFL running back since. We've also needed to rely on the pass more often, because our defense hasn't been great. I think Gruden does want to smash mouth people, otherwise we wouldn't have Callahan as the Oline coach, cause that's all that guy wants to do, but when other teams are just smashing you at will and your run game is garbage, ya kinda just gotta pass the ball a lot.

 

I think this season will be a hell of a lot different and Guise is going to be a double threat monster.

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41 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Yeah, pre McVay we ran just fine with Almo. McVay ended that and we haven't had an NFL running back since. We've also needed to rely on the pass more often, because our defense hasn't been great. I think Gruden does want to smash mouth people, otherwise we wouldn't have Callahan as the Oline coach, cause that's all that guy wants to do, but when other teams are just smashing you at will and your run game is garbage, ya kinda just gotta pass the ball a lot.

 

I think this season will be a hell of a lot different and Guise is going to be a double threat monster.

And I’m with you, but this past season I was screaming at the TV on more than one occasion RUN THE DANG BALL.  I think my biggest issue is that we have had NO identity running the ball since Shanny took the zone with him.  We power, we zone, we trap, we do this, we do that, but none of it well.  So what happens is we run the ball, and with the goal of being multiple, we end up not establishing any one thing.  It’s good to catch ppl off guard, but it’s better to tell ppl what you are gonna do, do it, and show them they can’t stop you.  If we just pick something and let our line and Guice grow in it, I will be beyond satisfied.

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1 hour ago, browntim16 said:

And I’m with you, but this past season I was screaming at the TV on more than one occasion RUN THE DANG BALL.  I think my biggest issue is that we have had NO identity running the ball since Shanny took the zone with him.  We power, we zone, we trap, we do this, we do that, but none of it well.  So what happens is we run the ball, and with the goal of being multiple, we end up not establishing any one thing.  It’s good to catch ppl off guard, but it’s better to tell ppl what you are gonna do, do it, and show them they can’t stop you.  If we just pick something and let our line and Guice grow in it, I will be beyond satisfied.

Yeah, I missed most of last season after the first couple games, then when TV and internet finally came back around Dec, I couldn't bare anymore disappointment in my life. :ols:

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The first half of Zorn's first year is the last time I remember having much confidence that we could force the issue in the run game with anything approaching consitency.  Even with Shanny's run game, it always felt that we could only force the issue when the other guys had multiple things to contend with.

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The whole "we need to run the ball more" is overblown, go look at those games where our offense was pass heavy or unbalanced against the run and tell me what our average yards per carry was on 1st down, I don't even need to look it up to know its been terrible for the last 3 years.

 

Our inability to get 4 yards on 1st down and convert 3rd and 4th downs when we need 1-2 yards has put Jay in tough situations.

 

 

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3 hours ago, pjfootballer said:

Agree. We run the ball plenty. We just don’t run it well.

That will change this year....too much talent. Having a better defense will help us run the ball more too....get the defense off the field and have more offensive snaps. 

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Posted (edited)
On 6/5/2018 at 12:14 AM, skinny21 said:

@Renegade7 Yeah, I’m of the mindset that the logical thing to do would be keep either Kelley or Perine as the #2 and carry Marshall or Bibbs to backup Thompson.  If we did keep Kelley and Perine, and Thompson got hurt, I wonder if Guice might become a 3 down back (given the occasional breather by Kelley/Perine). That might be putting a bit much on our rookie.  

Elliiot did fine, Giants are certainly going to get their $ worth from their new guy.  These rookie are so athletic that we're seeing many of them basically just hit the ground running (no pun intended) these days.

 

I agree with thinking about a backup for Guice being different then a backup for CT.  I mean, when RBs started going down one after the other, we almost had no choice but to use Perine more then we wanted to.  If CT goes down and Guice is the best back on the roster, training wheels will have to come off so we can keep winning games.  CT stays healthy, he's the 3rd down back, I don't want to see Guice on 3rd down unless its 3rd and short.  I wouldn't be scared to feed him if he can prove he can handle it (and I believe we're going to test if he can early) but I agree with not going into the season expecting to run him like Elliot and Barkley.  Worst comes to worst, its gonna happen anyway.

 

I do want to see looks with CT and Guice in the backfield same time, even if CT goes in motion to the slot, just to F with people.

Edited by Renegade7
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5 hours ago, pjfootballer said:

Agree. We run the ball plenty. We just don’t run it well.

Ya, we do try, but we've been so inept at it, we either kill a drive (limiting our chances to run more) or accept its not working and say F it.  It seemed like after every lose it was "we don't run enough", and the response was "we'll we'd run more if we weren't so bad at it it was killing drives".

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just a reminder...hoping Guice really does use all the bull**** that came out around the draft as his motivation:

 

 

Joe BannerVerified account @JoeBanner13

Everyone thought Gregory was a steal for Cowboys. Everyone thought Foster was a steal for the 49ers and now we have Guice as the latest steal. Character matters. These guys usually do ok for a while and then it blows up.

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9 hours ago, Califan007 said:

Joe BannerVerified account @JoeBanner13

Everyone thought Gregory was a steal for Cowboys. Everyone thought Foster was a steal for the 49ers and now we have Guice as the latest steal. Character matters. These guys usually do ok for a while and then it blows up.

 

Character does matter, Banner.

 

However, there is some serious doubtfulness about the veracity of the questions about Guice's character.

 

To put up a statement like this on twitter like the questions about his character are a forgone conclusion is irresponsible.

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Coincidentally, the QB of my High School team was named Guice Smith. 

 

 

 

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