2024 NFL Draft Position/Tracker - Final Pick #2

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, skinsmania123 said:

Where I agree here, honestly is IF we have a chance to take Harrison we should. But I do not think it is going to happen.  The Bear's who have been building their roster are going to stay with Field's and take Harrison IMO.  It would actually enhance Field's ability to succeed. I would be very surprised if they did not take the pic mainly because Field's has played well in the 2nd half of the season.

 

Even though I have been supportive of Sam all year, I think it is time to move on from him.  Mentally he is fried, and I think he needs a fresh start somewhere else. 

 

I would definitely try to resign Brissett as a backup, and possibly compete with the incoming QB draft pic. Because IMO they are not going to get Harrison. I think a new GM will take Caleb Williams. I watched a bunch of his highlights, and while it is a slanted POV, he is definitely creative and seems to naturally improvise, or go off schedule when he has to. He also throws a very nice long ball, and he is pretty fast. And a real positive is he does not always go with his first read, seems to scan the field well, and then hit his target. 

 

And with all that said, I think we need to be patient and build an O- line for him, PLUS add a big, bodied target at WR or TE, and provide more balance on the play calling side, so he has a better chance to succeed then Sam Howell did. Again, I do not know what he will be in the NFL, but I like him much more now that I watched him.  

 

If the Bears take Harrison it won't be at #1 overall. They'll either trade back to 2 or 3 because they'll know that both we and the Pats are going to take a QB. So they'll trade with whoever offers them the most, which would probably be the Pats at 3. Then they get a haul of picks and still get Harrison.

 

If the Bears aren't going with Williams we're likely going to have to give up a haul to move to #1 for him as you knot the Pats sure as hell will be trying as well.

[skinsmania123]

2 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

If the Bears take Harrison it won't be at #1 overall. They'll either trade back to 2 or 3 because they'll know that both we and the Pats are going to take a QB. So they'll trade with whoever offers them the most, which would probably be the Pats at 3. Then they get a haul of picks and still get Harrison.

 

If the Bears aren't going with Williams we're likely going to have to give up a haul to move to #1 for him as you knot the Pats sure as hell will be trying as well.

Thanks. I did not consider that. Of course they would. 

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

can you imagine for a team that organically picked just twice in a 20 year span (2000 and 2020) top 3 

We also had the second worst record in 2012 but didn’t have the #2 overall pick in 2013 because we had traded our first rounder to get Robert.

Edited January 1 by Sacks 'n' Stuff

[MrJL]

55 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Not sure i follow the logic.  The way I take the point is Ron didn't follow the right logic in that draft but its the right logic in 2024?

 

Loads better prospects based on what?   If you were hardcore on Herbert before that draft, cool.  But if its about consensus loved prospects, i'd say Maye is getting more love than either of those QBs.  Does that matter?  Not if you think the consensus-group think on these prospects is wrong.  But if we are talking about the leaks about what personnel guys think about these QBs -- it feels like Maye gets more love than those 2 and by a good margin comparing then and now. 

 

Heck Rivera himself oddly explained to Sheehan why he wasn't hopped up about either QB because as he said there was no league consensus on Herbert.  Herbert wasn't some slam dunk consensus loved prospect back then.  And Tua lost his luster with his injuries leading up to that draft and questionable arm strength.

 

you're mixing up the years,  2020 is the year we didn't take some QB at 2 and both of the other guys drafted soon after ended up being good. 

 

2021 is the year that Zach Wilson was the number 2 pick

[Rufus T Firefly]

17 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

"For sure" in you book.  It was defintely not a "for sure" drill at the time.  Heck as I said even Rivera used that as a crutch to defend why he didn't dig Herbert in that draft -- it was because there were a lot of questions about Herbert back then I recall that period well.

 

Maye has been hyped for two years running.  Now I get some thinking maybe its a bit too much.  And I got no problem with someone going against the grain but that's what it is.

Yeah, I almost posted an answer myself. It's fine to value QBs however you do. We all have opinions. There's mine, and then there's a bunch of wrong ones. But you are entitled to be wrong. 

 

But the "for sure" makes it seem like we're veering into some revisionism. Those guys came with a lot of questions. I remember that year I didn't watch a lot of Herbert, in part because people didn't like his game, and so I ended up just not spending time on him. In part it was because I just knew we weren't going QB. But point is there was a LOT of dislike for Herbert as a prospect. 

Tua, meanwhile, was obviously a good QB prospect but I think many of us had determined he wasn't reaching "great" status. And the injuries concerns were legit. 

 

But basically those guys went 5 and 6 and a lit of people thought they were reaches even there. Those guys were pretty far from "blue chip" level. 

 

If we're going by consensus, then there is really zero doubt that Maye id much more highly regarded at this juncture. Maybe more warts will pop up by draft day, but at this moment he's a good deal more highly thought of.

 

Again, people are welcome to view him differently, but let's not pretend there was any kind of consensus that Herbert in particular would end up being what he did. 

Edited January 1 by Rufus T Firefly

[MrJL]

1 minute ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

Tua, meanwhile, was obviously a good QB prospect but I think many of us had determined he wasn't reaching "great" status. And the injuries concerned were legit. 

 

. 

I thought it was all about the injuries

[Rufus T Firefly]

Just now, MrJL said:

I thought it was all about the injuries

A lot of it. But I thin people had soured on him from the "tank for Tua" start to the season as a prospect, irrespective of the injury problems, 

[moondog]

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

Do you enjoy being stuck in perpetual mediocrity?

Oh boy do I! Spot on. Really solid post here. 

[HigSkin]

 

 

[Number 44]

6 hours ago, HigSkin said:

 

 

Agree, IMO largely dependent on the staff but if it's truly wanting to emulate the Ravens org with FO and coach, I could see a great desire to see a running/mobile QB like Daniels, Williams or for that matter Justin Fields (if available)

 

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/bears-trading-justin-fields-gms-explain-why-its-the-best-route-and-where-compensation-could-land-153257987.html

 

How much would Fields command on the trade market at this point?

 

GM one: A second-round and fourth-round pick, pending a “good finish” to the season.

 

GM two: A second-round pick, pending a “strong finish” to the season.

 

GM three: A third-round pick, plus another late-round pick that could escalate one round based on performance.

 

GM four: One third-round pick in the 2024 draft, one fourth-round pick in the 2025 draft.

 

GM five: A third-round pick or a second-round draft pick for Fields, plus a late-round pick back from the Bears.

 

GMs six and seven had the same proposal: A third-round pick, pending the finish of this season.

 

GM one was the Bears' GM.  🙂

[Daniel.redskins]

I don't think we should trade up for Williams. In my opinion he is not generational. He is on the smaller size and has character concerns (usually where there's smoke, there's fire). But if he slips to #2, take him and don't think twice.  

If New England trades up to #1 for Williams, I'd be perfectly happy with Maye or Daniels. Right now I have Maye as #2 QB. Daniels is electrifying, but not a perfect prospect. Average arm, skinny, and tends to hold the ball too long. To me Maye checks all the boxes. Not many 230 lb QBs can scramble the way he does. Maye isn't perfect, but he is only 21 years old. I don't think he's reached his ceiling in terms of strength and size. 

[AlwaysBeRedskins2Me]

1 hour ago, SoCalSkins said:

Doesn’t matter what the fans want. Caleb Williams will be the first overall pick unless Jayden Daniels doesn’t a meteoric pre draft rise. Regardless, the pick will be Qb either the bears making it or the team they traded it to. If they are in love with Marvin Harrison Jr they can trade with us to guarantee him if we have the second overall pick. But it probably makes more sense for them to drop to 3 or 4. By the time this shakes out it will be qb 1,2,3 in all likelihood given the premium on the position. 
 

I personally want Caleb. I have been against drafting any USC product ever and my posting history backs that up but that dude when he is on is special. Even if we have to give back the 2 for Montez it’s worth it in my opinion. 

Not saying I am necessarily against drafting Caleb but I am just curious, did you see the post about Williams being terrible vs top 25 college defenses? Does that concern you?

[The Sisko]

I'm not sure about either of the top two QB picks. Caleb seems a bit flakey, and UNC hasn't exactly been a hotbed of QB talent, *COUGH* Howell, *COUGH* Trubisky. That said, I don't really watch college football, so I'm not the best judge. However, I think this is where Harris' value of analytics will come into play. I expect whoever he picks to run the F.O. will be strong in this area. Assuming sound analysis, I trust the numbers more than anything. Either way, it's really going to be interesting to watch how WFT 2.0 develops. This will be the most interesting offseason this team has had since I can remember, including Gibbs's return, because, with the recent subtraction of Lord Farquaad, there's actually more hope of sustained success this time around.

[Ball Security]

Enough of the QB talk. At number 2, is there a really fat CB we could take? Pair him with the skinny Forbes? Not saying we’d win any games, but it could be the subject of an unfunny sports-buddy-comedy movie that the world desperately needs.

[MrJL]

43 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

If the Bears take Harrison it won't be at #1 overall. They'll either trade back to 2 or 3 because they'll know that both we and the Pats are going to take a QB. So they'll trade with whoever offers them the most, which would probably be the Pats at 3. Then they get a haul of picks and still get Harrison.

 

If the Bears aren't going with Williams we're likely going to have to give up a haul to move to #1 for him as you knot the Pats sure as hell will be trying as well.

All it would take is the Pat's and us to refuse to play that game to stop it. If they trade farther back then te Cards take Harrison

[Rufus T Firefly]

2 minutes ago, MrJL said:

All it would take is the Pat's and us to refuse to play that game to stop it. If they trade farther back then te Cards take Harrison

LOL. In that scenario, you think the Pats would refuse to deal with Chicago to, what? Screw them over for some reason? 

 

That's not the way any of this works. If they wanted Harrison and us and the Patriots wanted Williams, the two teams would bid on the pick. We're not getting some kind of compact with the Patriots to stop it happening. 

 

[Riggo-toni]

Just thought I should point out that Washington hasn't drafted a winning QB in the first round since....

 

1937.

[The Sisko]

6 minutes ago, MrJL said:

All it would take is the Pat's and us to refuse to play that game to stop it. If they trade farther back then te Cards take Harrison

The Bears have limited leverage against us and the Cheatriots. Whichever team has the #2 pick can let whatever happens at #1 happen and they'll still get one of the top 2. The only way your idea works is if the Cheatriots or we are really wedded to one of the top two and really doesn't like the other QB. The Bears could potentially try to sell the #2/3 teams that they'll trade down with someone else and maybe take one of the top OL or the Georgia TE, but the team with the #2 pick still wouldn't care. That's why I'll swallow my bile and hope the Cowturds get the win.

Edited January 1 by The Sisko

[skinsmania123]

2 minutes ago, MrJL said:

All it would take is the Pat's and us to refuse to play that game to stop it. If they trade farther back then te Cards take Harrison

This is a solid point, but if the Pat's and Commander's do not play that game, I cannot see them letting a generational talent like Harrison Jr. go to trade further back. I just can't see it.  Harrison, upgrades Field's.  He is literally that special. 

[Idaho fan]

7 minutes ago, The Sisko said:

The Bears have limited leverage against us and the Cheatriots. Whichever team has the #2 pick can let whatever happens at #1 happen and they'll still get one of the top 2. The only way your idea works is if the Cheatriots or we are really wedded to one of the top two and really doesn't like the other QB.

I’ll trust the new GM but in my mind we sit tight especially if we are at #2.  Take the best QB that is there.   
 

new GM.  New HC.  New owner, lots of $$ to spend.  Exciting off season.  Just need a new name and stadium to complete the exorcism of Dan.  

[mh86]

9 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said:

Just thought I should point out that Washington hasn't drafted a winning QB in the first round since....

 

1937.

[Idaho fan]

11 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said:

Just thought I should point out that Washington hasn't drafted a winning QB in the first round since....

 

1937.

Sounds like we are due!

[MrJL]

10 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

LOL. In that scenario, you think the Pats would refuse to deal with Chicago to, what? Screw them over for some reason? 

 

That's not the way any of this works. If they wanted Harrison and us and the Patriots wanted Williams, the two teams would bid on the pick. We're not getting some kind of compact with the Patriots to stop it happening. 

 

I'm not saying there'd be a compact.  I've simply seen quite a bit of stuff predicting the Pats to go for Maye so them not needing to trade up to get their guy.isn't there

[Captain Wiggles]

15 minutes ago, Riggo-toni said:

Just thought I should point out that Washington hasn't drafted a winning QB in the first round since....

 

1937.

 

 

[Rufus T Firefly]

2 minutes ago, MrJL said:

I'm not saying there'd be a compact.  I've simply seen quite a bit of stuff predicting the Pats to go for Maye so them not needing to trade up to get their guy.isn't there

That's not really the scenario you were responding to. But even if it was, the idea that two teams are going to sit at 2 and 3 and just assume the QBs they like most will be there and refuse to give up anything to move up and ensure they do, is highly unlikely.