Convicted felon Donald Trump on Trial (Found guilty on 34 felony counts. 54 criminal count still in the air)

[tshile]

I also laughed when she said yes her intention is to try them all at the same time

 

that sounds like a clown show. I’d love to see them all sitting there together. But seems like a clown show. 

[EmirOfShmo]

10 minutes ago, tshile said:

I also laughed when she said yes her intention is to try them all at the same time

 

that sounds like a clown show. I’d love to see them all sitting there together. But seems like a clown show. 

No way all 19 take this to a trial. Mandatory minimum of 5 years is going to lead to a **** ton of plea deals. Only the dumbasses in the group are going to fight this - probably some of the lawyers who are being charged.

Are the GQP PACs going to pay for the lawyers for all of 19? That's going to chew up that money pretty quickly. 

 

[FootballZombie]

15 minutes ago, EmirOfShmo said:

No way all 19 take this to a trial. Mandatory minimum of 5 years is going to lead to a **** ton of plea deals. Only the dumbasses in the group are going to fight this - probably some of the lawyers who are being charged.

 

Yup

Give 'em the choice to be a canary or a stool pigeon

A lot of them will choose canary.

 

These dudes aint doing jail time they don't gotta for Trump.

 

[The Sisko]

3 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

Whoo-wee that is an expansive indictment. Still pickin' thru it.

 

Lovin' the RICO stuff. 5 year minimum jail time.

And I also like seeing the surrounding gaggle get theirs. This involved a lot of people, and they deserve their piece of the pie too

I especially want to see Rudi do time. 

[Renegade7]

1 hour ago, tshile said:

I also laughed when she said yes her intention is to try them all at the same time

 

that sounds like a clown show. I’d love to see them all sitting there together. But seems like a clown show. 

 

Like that scene from one of the Nolan Batman movies were they arrested every criminal in town at the same time and they in unison claimed not guilty in court...

 

I get where @Larry is coming from that Trump didn't do this by himself...but Feds now have to prove they aren't trying to do too much at the same time here, not just they are all guilty...

[China]

1 hour ago, tshile said:

Yeah I brought up how I was disappointed DOJ went soft on the 1/6 stuff and avoided a case with a bigger net. Cause we all know that indictment should have looked like this one when it comes to the number of people involved. 
 

I was kind of chuckling that a state managed to have more balls in going after the operation than the feds…

 

but I also wonder if it was done on purpose. Maybe they thought it would be a good idea to let the state, or this particular issue, be the one that casts the huge net. 🤷‍♂️ 

 

It was definitely on purpose.  But part of the reason was speed.  A sprawling indictment with lots of defendants takes a long time to prosecute.  The Feds wanted to have a quick trial that doesn't drag on past the election, which this GA trial may.

[mistertim]

14 minutes ago, China said:

 

It was definitely on purpose.  But part of the reason was speed.  A sprawling indictment with lots of defendants takes a long time to prosecute.  The Feds wanted to have a quick trial that doesn't drag on past the election, which this GA trial may.

 

I think it may also be the fact that Trump can't pardon himself from this one if he's re-elected.

[FootballZombie]

The net being spread is is extremely wide, its just that one guy and a handfull of cases surrounding that guy hog the spotlight.

 

While its not a part of the same case directly, lets not forget that there are:

 

-hundreds of cases against people on the ground in J6

-a bunch of fake electors already indicted in Michigan

-Probably a bunch more indictments coming for fake electors in other States

-Defamation claims surrounding the election being paid out and actively tried like Dominion and Smartmatic

-More people being added to the current indictments like the expansion of the Documents case to include new parties and charges

-Everyone indicating that their investigations are not complete, but rather on-going.

 

Georgia's case is a pretty big behemoth, but when you step back and look at the Federal approach, they quite literally have hundreds of separate cases, all building on each other and strengthening each other. Its an absolute Leviathan. Its been described more than once as the biggest endeavor ever taken of this ilk.

 

 

11 minutes ago, mistertim said:

I think it may also be the fact that Trump can't pardon himself from this one if he's re-elected.

 

Yes, very significant.

President does not possess the power to pardon state charges, only federal.

Georgia is one of a handful of states where Governors don't have pardon power, so current Gov Kemp can't bail him out either

[tshile]

32 minutes ago, China said:

 

It was definitely on purpose.  But part of the reason was speed.  A sprawling indictment with lots of defendants takes a long time to prosecute.  The Feds wanted to have a quick trial that doesn't drag on past the election, which this GA trial may.

oh it’s definitely going to drag past the election. They’re going to have, at a minimum, 19 people with lawyers creating reasons for a judge to approve delays and long timelines. 
 

I see a lot of talk about how some portion of the 19 will flip and wind up not being part of the trial. I know next to nothing about all of this especially strategy. So I can’t argue against that - but I’m super skeptical that’s how it plays out. If I were to guess, whoever was going to flip already has, and maybe that’s why we’ve got 30 unindicted co conspirators. But again - totally guessing and have no idea. 

6 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

Georgia's case is a pretty big behemoth, but when you step back and look at the Federal approach, they quite literally have hundreds of separate cases, all building on each other and strengthening each other. Its an absolute Leviathan. Its been described more than once as the biggest endeavor ever taken of this ilk.

 

well. No. 
 

most of those people were caught up on trespassing and other low level things like obstructing an official proceeding. Things like destruction of property. Some even got some theft charges. A small handful got additional charges like assault. 

 

outside of a couple of oath keepers, all of those cases lack any mention of conspiracy and overthrowing the government. 

[tshile]

The doj doesn’t get credit for throwing a big net there. What they did isn’t even close to what we’re talking about in terms of throwing a bigger net and getting the people involved in coordinating things

 

in fact I don’t believe we’ve seen one person accused of giving oath keepers and other tours of the capital the day(s) before get caught up on anything… there’s a lot of people that skated away from that without getting in trouble…

[mistertim]

7 minutes ago, tshile said:

The doj doesn’t get credit for throwing a big net there. What they did isn’t even close to what we’re talking about in terms of throwing a bigger net and getting the people involved in coordinating things

 

in fact I don’t believe we’ve seen one person accused of giving oath keepers and other tours of the capital the day(s) before get caught up on anything… there’s a lot of people that skated away from that without getting in trouble…

 

I was curious whether there's be any members of Congress on this indictment as some of them went out of their way to help Trump do some of these things. I assume indicting a sitting member of Congress would being up a slew of new issues to wade through, though.

[PokerPacker]

26 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I was curious whether there's be any members of Congress on this indictment as some of them went out of their way to help Trump do some of these things. I assume indicting a sitting member of Congress would being up a slew of new issues to wade through, though.

It's not like we don't already have a sitting House member under indictment right now.

[@DCGoldPants]

2 hours ago, EmirOfShmo said:

No way all 19 take this to a trial. Mandatory minimum of 5 years is going to lead to a **** ton of plea deals. Only the dumbasses in the group are going to fight this - probably some of the lawyers who are being charged.

Are the GQP PACs going to pay for the lawyers for all of 19? That's going to chew up that money pretty quickly. 

 

 

Would be nice if more than a few flip hard to cut a deal

[Dan T.]

Much credit is due to Politico and to Rachel Maddow for shedding a harsh light on the fake electors scheme way back in January 2022.  Politico reported in early January 2022 that the National Archives received fake certificates signed by "alternate electors" from Michigan and Arizona. Then Maddow's crew dug and, a week or so later, found actual copies of forged elector certificates from FIVE states. She broadcast those findings and - importantly - noted the similarity of those five documents both in wording and in format - which strongly suggested some organized, nationwide scheme involving those fake electors and not some disparate grass-roots effort by individual state GOP organizations. 

 

And now that fake elector scheme is a big part of the latest indictment in Georgia and in the DC indictment as well.

 

 

Maddow Unearths Five Fake State Documents Declaring Trump Victory in 2020 Election (thedailybeast.com)

[Dan T.]

57 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I was curious whether there's be any members of Congress on this indictment as some of them went out of their way to help Trump do some of these things. I assume indicting a sitting member of Congress would being up a slew of new issues to wade through, though.

 

I haven't gotten through the Georgia indictment yet, but I wonder if Lindsey Graham is one of the 30 unindicted co-conspirators.

[PokerPacker]

I think we need @PleaseBlitz's interpretation here. https://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2022/title-17/chapter-6/article-1/section-17-6-1/#:~:text=When determining bail for a,the alleged offense and the

[Ball Security]

I do wonder what the intent/thought behind saying she wants to take this to trial in six months comes from. She definitely knew that question would be asked. So it has a purpose. The talking heads on CNN/MSNBC all said that was an unrealistic timeline. 
 

Also, regarding members of Congress, I have to imagine they are part of the group of suspects that weren’t included in this indictment. (Tuberville, Cawthorn, Biggs, Boebert, Brooks, Gohmert, Gosar, Greene, possibly others).
 

And of those additional co conspirators that haven’t been indicted, how many are actively assisting with the case?

[TheGreatBuzz]

1 minute ago, Dan T. said:

 

I haven't gotten through the Georgia indictment yet, but I wonder if Lindsey Graham is one of the 30 unindicted co-conspirators.

 

I doubt it based on how he has been talking on all the shows, etc.

[Dan T.]

Not sure if it's posted yet, but here's a link to the Georgia indictment:

 

1ccdf52e-1ba2-434c-93f8-2a7020293967.pdf (washingtonpost.com)

 

 

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

 

I doubt it based on how he has been talking on all the shows, etc.

 

Hmm, thanks.  I haven't seen him interviewed.  Is Lindsey railing against the indictment like all the other GOP chicken-**** weasels? 

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2023 by Dan T.

[mistertim]

20 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

I do wonder what the intent/thought behind saying she wants to take this to trial in six months comes from. She definitely knew that question would be asked. So it has a purpose. The talking heads on CNN/MSNBC all said that was an unrealistic timeline. 
 

Also, regarding members of Congress, I have to imagine they are part of the group of suspects that weren’t included in this indictment. (Tuberville, Cawthorn, Biggs, Boebert, Brooks, Gohmert, Gosar, Greene, possibly others).
 

And of those additional co conspirators that haven’t been indicted, how many are actively assisting with the case?

 

Probably unrealistic for the actual trial, but maybe she's being aggressive there because that's when she wants all of the inevitable delay tactics to start.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I think we should be thanking whoever leaked that phone call from Trump to Raffensperger, because that really set everything in motion in Georgia.

[China]

1 hour ago, tshile said:

oh it’s definitely going to drag past the election. They’re going to have, at a minimum, 19 people with lawyers creating reasons for a judge to approve delays and long timelines. 
 

I see a lot of talk about how some portion of the 19 will flip and wind up not being part of the trial. I know next to nothing about all of this especially strategy. So I can’t argue against that - but I’m super skeptical that’s how it plays out. If I were to guess, whoever was going to flip already has, and maybe that’s why we’ve got 30 unindicted co conspirators. But again - totally guessing and have no idea. 

 

 

I tend to agree with you about the flipping part.  Fani Willis' statement in February that charges were "imminent" was meant as a warning to some of the targets that now was the time to cooperate, which is why charges didn't actually happen for another 6 months.  Based on reporting, a bunch of them did cooperate.  Anybody who flips now isn't going to get as good of a deal.  Some of the unindicted co-conspirators may have already reached a deal, and some may be getting off because the difficulty/sureness of a successful prosecution for these people was much lower (as some have said referring to politicians/congressfolk and issues with regard to political speech being protected).

[China]

[Larry]

4 hours ago, Dan T. said:

A mandatory minimum sentence of 5 years.  But a former Georgia prosecutor said last night it doesn’t necessarily have to be served as prison time.

I read a poster here who said Georgia law denies bail to people who are expected to intimidate witnesses. 
 

That could be really popcorn-worthy. 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

 

Jenna Ellis when she was told she's being indicted...