Welcome To The Washington Commanders Jahan Dotson WR Penn State

[Renegade7]

On 6/9/2022 at 9:20 AM, Est.1974 said:

We all know he’s gonna drop the first one that comes his way week 1 

 

Taylor Jacobs getting run for his money as best practice player ever??? 

[Voice_of_Reason]

5 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Taylor Jacobs getting run for his money as best practice player ever??? 

[SonnySideUp]

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/commanders/who-stood-out-and-who-struggled-commanders-offseason-practices

 

Those who stood out

Jahan Dotson

With no Terry McLaurin in the mix, Dotson emerged as Carson Wentz's favorite target. Actually, that may not be enough emphasis.

 

With no Terry McLaurin in the mix, Dotson emerged as Carson Wentz's FAVORITE TARGET. There, that's better.

 

When Washington drafted Dotson at pick No. 16 in the NFL Draft, some — including the person writing this story — worried that it wasn't the best possible outcome for a club that could've instead ended up with receiver Jameson Williams or safety Kyle Hamilton at No. 11. How Dotson has looked thus far is easing those concerns.

 

With the acknowledgment that Dotson will cede plenty of catches to McLaurin when he returns (Logan Thomas, when healthy, will be a factor, too), the Penn State rookie was a force at OTAs and minicamp thanks to his polish and duct tape-like hands. He just seems so professional already.

[Skinsinparadise]

Standig

 

 

[philibusters]

One of the potential weaknesses I hear about Jahan Dotson is he may struggle against press coverage and could end up a slot receiver only. 

 

PFF had some stats on that.  

 

He faced press coverage 43.6% of the time and averaged 1.7 yards per route and 21.4% of his the ball thrown to him when he was pressed were contested catch situations.   The average ball thrown to him when press coverage was used against him was 13.9 yards.

 

He faced off coverage 56.4% of the time and averaged 3.18 yards per route and only 10.7% of the balls thrown to him when off coverage were used were contested catch situations.  The average ball thrown to him in off coverage was 12.8 yards past the line of scrimmage.

 

Some takeaways, he is better against off coverage, which is the norm--though you will occasionally get some bigger WR's who are slightly more efficient against press coverage (Treylon Burks this year for example).   He faced more press coverage than average in college.  Average is around 25% and he faced it 43.6%

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

I was big Dotson guy during the college season, then lost interest, then closer to the draft I rekindled liking him, I recall saying to @Going Commando on the draft thread are we the only ones on this thread who are big Dotson guys? -- and then I recall him saying there are some others, which was true.

 

But the kicker for me digging Dotson and i said so in real time was watching the Hey Rookie show on ESPN where they follow players in their draft prep -- and Dotson to me was the stand out dude.  His demeanor and professionalism reminded me some of Terry.  His family came off great, too. 

 

He was the focal point of Penn State's offense and he played plenty at Z.  I think he can pull it off at Z too in the NFL -- Desean played Z, ditto smallish-skinny guys like Richardson, etc.  But if he ends up mostly at the slot where he doesn't have to worry about press coverage -- that would be fine.  Slot WRs are a big deal in today's NFL.

 

 

 

Edited July 17, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Going Commando]

Dotson was the reason why I didn't want to pick a WR like Wilson or London at 11, as a lot of the projections had him going in the second round and he felt like an equivalent talent.  That wasn't realistic in hindsight, as I think it's pretty clear now that his draft floor was probably somewhere in the late 20s.  We did the best we could have if the plan was to get him and get as much draft value as possible from the 11th pick.

 

I think I still would have gone with a plan of picking a defensive blue chipper in the first and Metchie in the second because I loved the value of Metchie there.  But Dotson certainly feels like more of a sure thing than Metchie.  He has far better hands than Metchie and he isn't coming off a serious injury.  His hands are just a God-given ability and he can develop more release and route running feel and creativity over time, and I'm not sure it's possible for a WR like Metchie to develop comparable hands to Dotson at thiss stage in the game.

[Koolblue13]

We could have traded back again in the first and possibly come away with Lloyd, Cine and Piece and that would have been much better value than Dotson and Mathis, but the goal was to add an offensive weapon and add depth for two key players that we were/are in danger of losing. 

[Going Commando]

14 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

He was the focal point of Penn State's offense and he played plenty at Z.  I think he can pull it off at Z too in the NFL -- Desean played Z, ditto smallish-skinny guys like Richardson, etc.  But if he ends up mostly at the slot where he doesn't have to worry about press coverage -- that would be fine.  Slot WRs are a big deal in today's NFL.

 

A couple of interesting takeaways for me from that chart are that teams were probably scared to press London and Jameson Williams, but if you had somebody that was good enough to successfully press Williams, then you were going to wipe him out.  That kid is a bean pole with absolutely no strength.

 

I can't see many college defenses having the personnel to press London, and that looks like it was born out in that chart.  You would need someone like St Juste to do it.  Otherwise London will just win with his extreme outlier length and leaping and contested catch ability.

 

I'm glad that Dotson faced a ton of press in college.  He struggled a bit with it, but at least it won't be a culture shock for him in the NFL.  He'll develop his release game over time, and I am certain we'll also give him space off the line via motion in our scheme.  Things are going to be easier for him here as the third threat in a passing game that suddenly looks super explosive.  I think he's got a good chance to thrive and be highly productive.

 

I wish Metchie was on that chart.  I don't have any numbers on it, but to my eye he was the best wr in the class at beating press.  He had next level instincts a d creativity in the release game than reminded me of Doug Baldwin.  He never gets included as a top prospect even though he went top 50.

[Going Commando]

6 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

We could have traded back again in the first and possibly come away with Lloyd, Cine and Piece and that would have been much better value than Dotson and Mathis, but the goal was to add an offensive weapon and add depth for two key players that we were/are in danger of losing. 

 

I still don't see Mathis as a Nose and thus a potential Daron Payne replacement.  If we think we're going to be fine letting Payne walk and having Mathis play 1 tech I think we're in for a bad surprise.  Mathis is a pass rushing 3-5 technique, not a two gapping nose.  I think he is Mich more likely to be an Ioannidis replacement, and if we let Payne walk then we're still going to have to go find a nose.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

49 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

A couple of interesting takeaways for me from that chart are that teams were probably scared to press London and Jameson Williams, but if you had somebody that was good enough to successfully press Williams, then you were going to wipe him out.  That kid is a bean pole with absolutely no strength.

 

I can't see many college defenses having the personnel to press London, and that looks like it was born out in that chart.  You would need someone like St Juste to do it.  Otherwise London will just win with his extreme outlier length and leaping and contested catch ability.

 

I'm glad that Dotson faced a ton of press in college.  He struggled a bit with it, but at least it won't be a culture shock for him in the NFL.  He'll develop his release game over time, and I am certain we'll also give him space off the line via motion in our scheme.  Things are going to be easier for him here as the third threat in a passing game that suddenly looks super explosive.  I think he's got a good chance to thrive and be highly productive.

 

I wish Metchie was on that chart.  I don't have any numbers on it, but to my eye he was the best wr in the class at beating press.  He had next level instincts a d creativity in the release game than reminded me of Doug Baldwin.  He never gets included as a top prospect even though he went top 50.

 

I think I read that Jameson Williams was awful against press, he was schemed up with free releases often. Also read something about Olave having the best stats at successfully releasing against press.

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, Going Commando said:

 

I still don't see Mathis as a Nose and thus a potential Daron Payne replacement.  If we think we're going to be fine letting Payne walk and having Mathis play 1 tech I think we're in for a bad surprise.  Mathis is a pass rushing 3-5 technique, not a two gapping nose.  I think he is Mich more likely to be an Ioannidis replacement, and if we let Payne walk then we're still going to have to go find a nose.

I completely agree about Payne and I still have hope that he stays with us.

 

Payne is where our run defense starts and stops and if we hope to play 2 high safeties, we need payne in that box up front.

[philibusters]

5 hours ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

I think I read that Jameson Williams was awful against press, he was schemed up with free releases often. Also read something about Olave having the best stats at successfully releasing against press.

 

Not sure about a stat about Olave getting a release against press coverage, but his overall numbers against press coverage are fairly middle of the pack.  Olave faced press cover 31.3% of the time compared to Dotson 43.6% (the average in college football is 25% so they both faced it more than average).  He averaged 1.85 yards per route compared to Dotsons 1.7 so he is a bit better than Dotson on that stat, but both are middle of the pack.  When he faced press coverage and the ball was throw to him on 75.6% of the passes he was open enough the ball was not contested, compared to Dotson at 78.6% so on that metric Dotson actually has him slightly beat.  All in all both Olave and Dotson are fairly middle of the pack against press coverage by NFL draft prospects standards, though they both have faced a lot of it. 

 

Guys can definitely get better at it.  Justin Jefferson has a 90 grade against press coverage this past season in the NFL (caught 72 of 109 ball thrown to him on plays he faced press coverage), but in college he was middle of the pack against press coverage.  I don't know what changed, but I think some of the people who didn't like Justin Jefferson coming out of college didn't like him because they thought there was a possibility he would be a slot only guy in the NFL.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2022-nfl-draft-wide-receiver-prospect-clustering-press-coverage

6 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

I still don't see Mathis as a Nose and thus a potential Daron Payne replacement.  If we think we're going to be fine letting Payne walk and having Mathis play 1 tech I think we're in for a bad surprise.  Mathis is a pass rushing 3-5 technique, not a two gapping nose.  I think he is Mich more likely to be an Ioannidis replacement, and if we let Payne walk then we're still going to have to go find a nose.

 

Interesting.  I thought the profile on Mathis was that he was not explosive, but had the traits that could make him a run stuffer--- he plays with good leverage and plays very disciplined--doesn't leave his lane and is very aware of what his role is on every play.  I thought part of the reason they let Matt Ion go was because they thought he was a bit of a lone wolf--to likely to open up a scrambling lane for a QB when trying to beat an O-Lineman on a pass rush and they thought Mathis would be the disciplined guy

Edited July 18, 2022 by philibusters

[philibusters]

6 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

We could have traded back again in the first and possibly come away with Lloyd, Cine and Piece and that would have been much better value than Dotson and Mathis, but the goal was to add an offensive weapon and add depth for two key players that we were/are in danger of losing. 

 

I don't see how we could have got Lloyd and Cine given that both went in the first round.

[Koolblue13]

28 minutes ago, philibusters said:

 

I don't see how we could have got Lloyd and Cine given that both went in the first round.

There were a few teams that wanted to trade up with us and one might of had two 1rsts.

 

Who cares? Its revisionist history. Doesn't have to be exact when its imaginary. 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

30 minutes ago, philibusters said:

 

I don't see how we could have got Lloyd and Cine given that both went in the first round.

 

My assumption is that moving back in the 1st round would either 1) come with another 1st round pick, or 2) could use both of the two 2nd round picks we now have and trade up into the 1st.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 hour ago, philibusters said:

 

Not sure about a stat about Olave getting a release against press coverage, but his overall numbers against press coverage are fairly middle of the pack.  Olave faced press cover 31.3% of the time compared to Dotson 43.6% (the average in college football is 25% so they both faced it more than average).  He averaged 1.85 yards per route compared to Dotsons 1.7 so he is a bit better than Dotson on that stat, but both are middle of the pack.  When he faced press coverage and the ball was throw to him on 75.6% of the passes he was open enough the ball was not contested, compared to Dotson at 78.6% so on that metric Dotson actually has him slightly beat.  All in all both Olave and Dotson are fairly middle of the pack against press coverage by NFL draft prospects standards, though they both have faced a lot of it. 

 

Guys can definitely get better at it.  Justin Jefferson has a 90 grade against press coverage this past season in the NFL (caught 72 of 109 ball thrown to him on plays he faced press coverage), but in college he was middle of the pack against press coverage.  I don't know what changed, but I think some of the people who didn't like Justin Jefferson coming out of college didn't like him because they thought there was a possibility he would be a slot only guy in the NFL.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2022-nfl-draft-wide-receiver-prospect-clustering-press-coverage

 

Interesting.  I thought the profile on Mathis was that he was not explosive, but had the traits that could make him a run stuffer--- he plays with good leverage and plays very disciplined--doesn't leave his lane and is very aware of what his role is on every play.  I thought part of the reason they let Matt Ion go was because they thought he was a bit of a lone wolf--to likely to open up a scrambling lane for a QB when trying to beat an O-Lineman on a pass rush and they thought Mathis would be the disciplined guy

 

Yards per route run are a weird stat. That offense was loaded with weapons. Olave had to compete against another first rounder and a likely Top 10 pick in 2023 for targets. It's possible to win the rep but not get the ball because some other super college talent also won his rep and was the earlier read in the progression.

 

But the stats I saw for Olave vs press were also similarly unreliable by certain circumstances. So who knows?

[philibusters]

Madden rating came out today for WR and TE.  Jahan Dotson got a 75 and Cole Turner 65.  This is how Madden rated the rookie WR's

 

1.  Drake London 75

2.  Garrett Wilson 76

3.  Chris Olave 76

4.  Jameson Williams 78

5.  Jahan Dotson 75

6.  Treylon Burks 73

7.  Christian Watson 71

8.  Wan'dale Robinson 72

9.  John Metchie 73

10.   Tyquan Thornton 69

11.  George Pickens 74

12.    Alec Pierce 70

13.  Skyy Moore  72

14.    Velus Jones 69

15.    Jalen Tolbert  71

16.  David Bell 68

17.  Danny Gray 70

18.  Erik Ezukanma 66

19.   Romeo Doubs

20.  Calvin Austin 70

56 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

My assumption is that moving back in the 1st round would either 1) come with another 1st round pick, or 2) could use both of the two 2nd round picks we now have and trade up into the 1st.

 

In most drafts yes.  In this draft no.  I think part of the reason that this draft had twice as many picks traded in the 1st round was because the cost of moving up was lower than usual this year.   

[philibusters]

Other Commanders

 

Terry McLaurin 91 (9th highest WR)

Curtis Samuels 78

Logan Thomas  78

Dyami Brown 71

Cam Sims 71

John Bates 67

Dax Milne 66

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, philibusters said:

Terry McLaurin 91 (9th highest WR)

Curtis Samuels 78

Logan Thomas  78

Dyami Brown 71

Cam Sims 71

John Bates 67

Dax Milne 66

 

Woof...

 

I guess Logan's and Curtis's injury history factors into that a bit. Everyone else is understandable.

[zCommander]

11 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

We could have traded back again in the first and possibly come away with Lloyd, Cine and Piece and that would have been much better value than Dotson and Mathis, but the goal was to add an offensive weapon and add depth for two key players that we were/are in danger of losing. 

 

Why would you do that when they wanted a almost Terrys' clone. In case Terry goes down Wentz will still have someone to throw to and keep on winning games. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

16 hours ago, philibusters said:

4.  Jameson Williams 78

The latest I heard is he's not supposed to be ready until mid-season.  That's a bit high for a guy who probably won't play until week 7 at the earliest.  

 

Though I don't know how Madden handles things like that. I haven't played Madden since ... my God it's been a long time.  

[HigSkin]

Greg Cosell is super high on Dotson.  Good listen.

 

 

[Conn]

Not really related to Dotson other than the comparison of who we should have drafted, and there was no way for us to know, but damn Metchie has cancer @Going Commando

[Koolblue13]

39 minutes ago, Conn said:

Not really related to Dotson other than the comparison of who we should have drafted, and there was no way for us to know, but damn Metchie has cancer @Going Commando

Just saw that. Out for the year. Feel awful for him.