The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Skinsinparadise]

 

[HigSkin]

Seems a few FO's are 'disgusted' with their QB's. i.e. see Green Bay, Ravens and now Giants.  Lol

[Jericho]

5 hours ago, Conn said:

Related:

 

 

 

This is pretty on point. Unfortunately, Washington has really done much to follow this. They did let Cousins walk though, one of the few times a team has really done that with a decent QB. In some ways it was arguably smart, but they could have gotten so much more in compensation.

[Koolblue13]

7 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

If I'm the Giants I tag Jones and try to trade him to some QB desperate team. I mean if Daboll can make Jones go from bottom 5 to being offered more than $40 Mil per year, imagine what he can do with someone with legitimate talent.

Exactly what the Eagles and Howie did to load that team. And they already paid Wentz and still traded him.

[method man]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

DJ owes them nothing. I do hope DJ goes back there because, if he doesn’t, they are in play for Carr or Jimmy G

[zCommander]

57 minutes ago, method man said:

DJ owes them nothing. I do hope DJ goes back there because, if he doesn’t, they are in play for Carr or Jimmy G

 

Carr price tag would be higher. Jimmy not so much but Jimmy not going to do any better than DJ. DJ is more mobile too. 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 hours ago, method man said:

DJ owes them nothing. I do hope DJ goes back there because, if he doesn’t, they are in play for Carr or Jimmy G

 

I didn't think of that, good point.  And Carr from what I understand will take his time to make a choice.  Jimmy G with his injury history doesn't worry me as much.

 

Bot both I agree are better than Jones albiet Jones arguably the more valuable on the market because of his age and potential upside.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[mhd24]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I didn't think of that, good point.  And Carr from what I understand will take his time to make a choice.  Jimmy G with his injury history doesn't worry me as much.

 

Bot both I agree are better than Jones.

 

Jimmy G is going to Vegas IMO.  Knows the system and will have weapons.

[Skinsinparadise]

Just now, mhd24 said:

 

Jimmy G is going to Vegas IMO.  Knows the system and will have weapons.

 

I've said the same since that's been the rumorville there or Tampa.

[Skinsinparadise]

22 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

For Sheehan and anyone else that is down on this move, ummm…what exactly were the better options?

 

He’s not going to give up future assets and cash for another retread QB.

We started the offseason with Scott Turner as OC, of whom most all of us had come to accept he needed to go.  But given his contract status seemed unlikely.  Ron pulled the trigger on that and hung out for almost 2 months, and ended up with the SB champs OC.

 

To poop on this move says to me you were going to poop on any move.

 

Seems like he's warmed up a little. On the radio today he's all over the place on it. And says he's 50-50 on it.  It can go either way.  And likes the hire over lets say Shurmur.  I know from other shows he really really really wanted Greg Roman.

 

He says the team has never been right when the team has choose something that the rest of the league rejected.   Then compares it to the Wentz move.  Then says he's not comparing the two. 

 

I'd say he's hedged his bets perfectly here.  It can go either way.   

[skinsfan66]

40 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

 

Jimmy G is going to Vegas IMO.  Knows the system and will have weapons.

I think DJ played much better then Carr last year, and he knows the system. I hope they sign either for 45mil plus, 3 peas in a pod. Its either that or be in a little worst   situation then here?  

[Thinking Skins]

19 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Sheehan owned up to be wrong about Wilson. I can't recall him ever owning up about Darnold and he was beyond persistent about it back in the day.

 

But his obsession is definitely Aaron Rodgers.

 

As far as Howell, he has nothing really profound on the topic.  It's basically this.

 

A. 5th round pick

B.  How many 5th round picks succeed?

C. He thinks the fact that they didn't play him until the end questions how much they truly believe he's good

D.  Expects a down year -- but I haven't heard him say that recently

E.  A veteran to put Howell on the bench should be on the table but he's not really that pushy on that point aside from pushing Rodgers.

 

As for Carr, he thinks he's a decent QB but a bit overhyped.  He's odd on it.  Basically he agrees that Carr is a good QB but then says he never has been a Carr guy unlike Cooley and some others.  So he's a bit all over the place on Carr.

 

In short, he's feeling very confident in all his takes now because of the arrows he took for slamming the Wentz trade.  For example, Craig Hoffman and Russell in contrast were much more against that trade than Sheehan but i don't sense they are strutting about their takes in general now based on their guess about Wentz (which was betting with the house).

 

But Sheehan who again I preface things by saying I love his show.  But he can get obnoxious, when he nails a prediction.  And yeah he's feeling himself because of Wentz busting.

I just can't stand him in his negativity. Even if he's right, I'd rather listen to a positive take or just silence than the constant negativity. I'm into my reading books now when these shows get negative because it's too much for my psyche. 

[Warhead36]

Why do we care so much what Sheehan thinks? He's just a fan like any of us. He has no real football experience. 

[No Nonsense]

If the Bears shopped Justin Fields, would you be interested? 

[zCommander]

16 minutes ago, No Nonsense said:

If the Bears shopped Justin Fields, would you be interested? 

 

As #2. Sure. 

[Thinking Skins]

38 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Why do we care so much what Sheehan thinks? He's just a fan like any of us. He has no real football experience. 

That's just it. I don't. Guys like Ken Beatrice used to hold a special place in my heart and I'd rush to get to the radio to hear what he thought about things. He wasn't going for bits though and trying to get me animated, he was knowledgeable and cool. 

 

Now, most of these hosts are just trying to say things to get us excited, Sheehan too. I don't say he doesn't believe in what he's saying but he actively promotes the philosophy of bet against the public opinion. Others seem to go with these takes about manhood or pride or hard practice or just making jokes about the team. Sometimes that's cool, but more often it falls flat, especially when we've got a QB whose on a 5 game winning streak but we've got to listen to hosts talk about "but he's not an NFL QB" or "the other guy could have done it" or "what will they do when he loses". 

 

It's frustrating because it was ruining a joyful part of the season. So I just stepped away. Away from radio and away from here to just stay in the positive zone with this team. If we wind up losing, so what its just a game, but I have more fun in the lead up with positive thoughts than just thinking we'll somehow mess this thing up like the radio hosts like to say. 

[No Nonsense]

11 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

As #2. Sure. 

So you’re confident Howell will be better? 

[zCommander]

1 hour ago, No Nonsense said:

So you’re confident Howell will be better? 

 

Have you looked at Fields stats? Howell is hell of a lot more accurate passer and can also run. 

[No Nonsense]

3 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

Have you looked at Fields stats? Howell is hell of a lot more accurate passer and can also run. 

Let’s be fair. We’ve only seen one game from Howell. I don’t have a problem if we go into next year with Howell, but they’re practically the same age and Fields was the 11th pick just two years ago, while Howell was drafted in the 5th round. And Fields is still on his rookie contract and Washington wouldn’t have to mortgage the future. 
 

If Fields became available, I’d be surprised if Washington didn’t do their due diligence. 

[lavar1156]

Fields ain't it. Just like every other failed OSU QB. Maybe GM's will learn one day.

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, Thinking Skins said:

That's just it. I don't. Guys like Ken Beatrice used to hold a special place in my heart and I'd rush to get to the radio to hear what he thought about things. He wasn't going for bits though and trying to get me animated, he was knowledgeable and cool. 

 

Now, most of these hosts are just trying to say things to get us excited, Sheehan too. I don't say he doesn't believe in what he's saying but he actively promotes the philosophy of bet against the public opinion. Others seem to go with these takes about manhood or pride or hard practice or just making jokes about the team. Sometimes that's cool, but more often it falls flat, especially when we've got a QB whose on a 5 game winning streak but we've got to listen to hosts talk about "but he's not an NFL QB" or "the other guy could have done it" or "what will they do when he loses". 

 

It's frustrating because it was ruining a joyful part of the season. So I just stepped away. Away from radio and away from here to just stay in the positive zone with this team. If we wind up losing, so what its just a game, but I have more fun in the lead up with positive thoughts than just thinking we'll somehow mess this thing up like the radio hosts like to say. 

 

I think we are in a weird place right now as fans with the sale looming.  While most have said over the years if Dan ever sells it will change everything, including Sheehan, it feels like it is not really happening until it actually happens and then the sports world for this team at least perception wise i think will do a 180.   But I think with some it will be difficult to go Cold Turkey because the default position that seems to prevail is cynicism so it might take some time to kick it..

 

As you know I was cynical about the Bruce regime with Dan so I was among the negative people then.   I am much more upbeat about Ron.  At a minimum he brings a needed dose of class to the organization.  But overall, for me, Dan selling means everything.  My global view will change the instant he sells.   As far as fans, local media, etc changing too -- I suspect they will, too, or at least most of them.   

 

Heck on the FO thread me and some others took some arrows from fellow Dan haters for pushing the narrative this past summer that Dan might sell.  They saw us as naive and not the swiftest people for believing in this.   In short negativity reigns with the fan base.   I don't blame anyone for it though.  we are about as beaten down a fan base as it gets. The cool position, Sheehan often takes it is betting against this team.   But I do think things are about to change. 

 

I do think a lot of the bad karma this team has gotten is a function of Dan.  You remove Dan and i think our luck shifts dramatically,  We suffered too much as a fan base.  We are due for some good luck.  I think the law of averages is about to kick in and in our favor for a change.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[MartinC]

11 hours ago, method man said:

DJ owes them nothing. I do hope DJ goes back there because, if he doesn’t, they are in play for Carr or Jimmy G

Jones, Carrr and Jimmy are all pretty much on the same level IMO. Jones maybe a notch below the other two but not by much. And all three are just above average starting QBs who will want paying like top 10 guys.

 

I wouldn’t want to be the team giving anyone of those three a top of market contract. 

[zCommander]

4 minutes ago, No Nonsense said:

Let’s be fair. We’ve only seen one game from Howell. I don’t have a problem if we go into next year with Howell, but they’re practically the same age and Fields was the 11th pick just two years ago, while Howell was drafted in the 5th round. And Fields is still on his rookie contract and Washington wouldn’t have to mortgage the future. 
 

If Fields became available, I’d be surprised if Washington didn’t do their due diligence. 

 

If you want to play the fair game then it is not his fault he wasn't selected in the 1st or the 2nd because what happened in his senior year. If he had come out a year earlier he would have been a top 5 easily. But still I am looking at more than just the Dallas game whereas you are only looking at just one game. By this admission you are the one who is not being fair to Howell here. 

 

If you have actually watched Fields play you would have seen Howell's body of work is way better than Fields. Fields looks lost most of the times too and that is with him being starter for the last two years too. That is not a good sign. He has for his career 24TD to 21INT. Also we played the Bears last year. Did he really WOW you?

 

Howell is 1.5 years younger than Fields. So really not practically the same age. 

[KDawg]

36 minutes ago, MartinC said:

Jones, Carrr and Jimmy are all pretty much on the same level IMO. Jones maybe a notch below the other two but not by much. And all three are just above average starting QBs who will want paying like top 10 guys.

 

I wouldn’t want to be the team giving anyone of those three a top of market contract. 

 

Using my self created handy dandy chart:

 

Tier 1 - Elite of the Elite

Kansas City - Patrick Mahomes

 

Tier 2 - Elite, but not Patrick Mahomes Elite

Green Bay - Aaron Rodgers

Philadelphia - Jalen Hurts

Buffalo - Josh Allen

Cincinnati - Joe Burrow

LA Chargers - Justin Herbert

Baltimore - Lamar Jackson

 

Tier 3 - Franchise Quarterbacks

Free Agent - Derek Carr

Free Agent - Jimmy Garrapolo

Minnesota - Kirk Cousins

Los Angeles Rams - Matthew Stafford

Arizona - Kyler Murray

Detroit - Jared Goff

Dallas - Dak Prescott

 

Tier 4 - Teetering on Franchise

Jacksonville - Trevor Lawrence

Miami - Tua Tagovailoa 

Denver - Russell Wilson

NY Giants - Daniel Jones

Chicago - Justin Fields

San Francisco - Brock Purdy

Seattle - Geno Smith

 

Tier 5 - Prove It (They slot in tier 5, but they could easily drop to the end of the list or move up)

Washington - Sam Howell

San Francisco - Trey Lance

Atlanta - Desmond Ridder

New England - Mac Jones

Pittsburgh - Kenny Pickett

Tennessee - Malik Willis

Houston - Davis Mills

Free Agent - Baker Mayfield

 

Tier 6 - Journeymen Who Aren't Bad But Don't Fit in the Above

Free Agent - Jacoby Brissett

Free Agent - Teddy Bridgewater

New Orleans - Andy Dalton (think he's a free agent, too?)

Tennessee - Ryan Tannehill

Free Agent - [REDACTED] (just so I don't hear it from the peanut gallery)

 

Tier 7 - They Exist and Play Quarterback

Carolina - Sam Darnold

Tampa Bay - Kyle Trask

New York Jets - Zach Wilson

Free Agent To Be - Carson Wentz

 

Tier 8 - Deshaun Watson

Cleveland - Deshaun Watson

 

Tier 9 - Do They Even Have a Quarterback?

Indianapolis Colts

 

Jones is a tier below the others. But almost to them. 

 

But he is clear pegs above Tier 5, 6, 7, 8 and 9. 

Edited February 21, 2023 by KDawg

[MartinC]

@KDawg The guy missing from your list is Baker Mayfield. He’s probably a prove it guy at this point. 
 

I think you have Fields a touch high as well - but that’s quibbling 🙂