The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[ILikeBilly2]

33 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

.....I would not expect JD to face as many pressures as Howell did last year playing behind the same Oline. Kinda like how Brissett looked different in the same environment....

 

 

 

 

Brissett was injured after 4 quarters or less.  Couldn't start the last/next game.  He was getting hit just as much and as hard as Howell.  JD wouldn't have taken that many sacks because he would have been CRUSHED by NFL level defenses.

 

Spy him with 2 guys and blitz.  Or some DQ scheme.  He won't last.  Over/under will be about 8 games played.  I sure hope it is for the giants or some other team .

Edited April 9 by ILikeBilly2

[illone]

pssssst

 

Guys, it's still JJ.

 

😂

[DWinzit]

If Daniels and Maye weren't in this draft class we'd be arguing JJ or Penix at two because we can't afford to move out of the spot and risk losing them both. 

[FootballZombie]

23 minutes ago, ILikeBilly2 said:

Bridgett was injured after 4 quarters or less.  Couldn't start the last/next game.  He was getting hit just as much and as hard as Howell.  JD wouldn't have taken that many sacks because he would have been CRUSHED by NFL level defenses.

 

Spy him with 2 guys and blitz.  Or some DQ scheme.  He won't last.  Over/under will be about 8 games played.  I sure hope it is for the giants or some other team .

 

Jacoby did not play a lot, but he took zero sacks.

 

 

and if your so afraid of a QB that you have to demolish your own defensive identity to that extent then the battle is already halfway won. I've changed your defensive philosophy away from whatever it was you do best to something your likely not as good at. Its hard enough to succeed in the NFL doing what you do best.

 

Furthermore vs pressure dude had a 124 NFL passer rating, threw no pics, had an 11% big time throw rate w/ an 82 PFF Offensive grade last year. Giving him easy reads is like leading lambs to the slaughter.

Edited April 9 by FootballZombie

[Conn]

1 hour ago, CommanderInTheRye said:

Statistically invalid nationwide straw poll from ESPN on which qb respondents think will have the best career:

 

 

 

Over 13,000 votes

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This would really only be interesting if they did it with ranked choice voting. How many of the Caleb voters would have voted Maye over Daniels if their first choice were not present? How many of the Daniels voters would prefer Maye or JJ if he weren’t present? Would give a much more accurate view of how these 13,000+ people feel about each prospect in relation to the rest if it was done this way.

 

Of course they aren’t trying to engage in any sort of accurate or informative polling, they’re just trying to farm clicks and content. (nothing against Kimes, she’s a top dog in the field and a social media pro) 

Edited April 9 by Conn

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

Drake Maye is a poet. Jayden Daniels is a court stenographer on adderall.

[SkinsFTW]

4 hours ago, Number 44 said:

The 24%  STP ratio that folks kept throwing out there seemed odd, given the sack number.  It then became clear that, in Daniels' case, the guy was doing an outstanding job avoiding pressure.  Again, I can't see any reason to buy an argument that sacks are a problem for Daniels.

 

You must have really loved Fields then. He also had a high% but only 21 sacks his last year in college.

 

Unfortunately, once in the NFL hes played in 40 games and has been sacked 135 times.

[RWJ]

5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

As I've mentioned on the draft thread my three guys in the 2nd, high floor, all of whom I love in that order:  McConkey, Pearsall, Wilson.  I think all three will be great slot WRs.  Burton to me is right there with him but he's a wildcard for me because he's a headcase.

 

Polk is fun but I wanted him to run faster.  Legette is boom-bust but I like his chances better than Tony Franklin.  He's a tad faster than him and 40 pounds heavier, that's size.  

 

But bringing this back on topic, either dude can use another WR and IMO this is a great draft to add one.

Taking a chance on a late WR that you have mentioned is USC's Tahj Washington in the late 5th/early-mid 6th if Peters like him.  Like him a lot.  

[ILikeBilly2]

2 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

.......Furthermore vs pressure dude had a 124 NFL passer rating......

I might be wrong, but I think the definition of "pressure" in your sentence is different then when we have been discussing pressure to sack ratio.  In P2S%, it is when a defender gets within 1.5 yards of the QB.  I think, in your statement, it means 5 or more defenders rushed the passer.  With a superior oline, rushing 5 often means one less player in coverage, but no actual extra pressure on the QB.  

 

Not to harp too much on last year, but Sam not only often had a defender within 1.5 yards, but he had no clue where the pressure would originate from.  Left, right or center, it could be any or all on every drop back.  If the pressure consistently came from one spot, it would be much easier to avoid.

 

A QB like JD, in my opinion, would have an extremely difficult time keeping his eyes down field.  I don't know if our new analytics department will see it the same as me.  

[Est.1974]

6 hours ago, CommanderInTheRye said:

Patriots reportedly asking for  the equivalent of 5 first round picks or more to move off of their 3rd pick.

 

If the bidding is that crazy and if we can go down a bit and still get our qb, we would be foolish not to at least investigate the opportunity.

Someone really could screw the Vikings over very soon.

[FootballZombie]

19 minutes ago, ILikeBilly2 said:

I might be wrong, but I think the definition of "pressure" in your sentence is different then when we have been discussing pressure to sack ratio.  In P2S%, it is when a defender gets within 1.5 yards of the QB.  I think, in your statement, it means 5 or more defenders rushed the passer.  With a superior oline, rushing 5 often means one less player in coverage, but no actual extra pressure on the QB.  

 

Nope, same definition of pressure.

Those were the numbers provided by PFF for plays vs pressure, not vs blitz. It was the result of passes thrown when defenders were close. Obviously, they were pretty good.

 

 

JD has demonstrated a great ability to dissect a D from the pocket vs pressure. Especially when compared to the other top prospects who noticeably struggled in the same department.

 

What JD has not shown is a strong enough tendency to pass if he breaks said pocket. He ran like 90% of the time in those situations. He will have to throw more often in the NFL rather than tucking it when he does bail.

 

 

And beyond that even on the plays where he chose to keep it himself, its not like he didn't murder-ize teams w/ his legs vs pressure, its more of a case of what is a good call in college not being as much of one in the NFL. We know directly from the horses mouths that in college, he was instructed by his coaches to run. We have posters here who broke down film that came away with the conclusion that the designed "Hot" read for a play was Jayden's legs by design. At the next level you want him throwing more passes. We will have to see if he can do that at a higher clip. As I said he did not do it a lot so I can't just blindly award him the ability.

 

 

But all that said, I like Jayden's play vs pressure a lot more than the other top prospects overall. He's got stuff to work on, but who doesn't

[zCommander]

4 hours ago, illone said:

pssssst

 

Guys, it's still JJ.

 

😂

 

Well that is good to know that he hasn't had any sex change operation then. Not that there's anything wrong with that. 

[DiscoBob]

8 hours ago, illone said:

pssssst

 

Guys, it's still JJ.

 

😂

 

Big Janet Jackson fan?

[RandyHolt]

I am thinking copy pasting could stave off carpal for somebody here.

 

Is it draft day yet? Requisite gif.

 

[Skinsinparadise]

8 hours ago, illone said:

pssssst

 

Guys, it's still JJ.

 

😂

 

Speaking of which.  I take rumors leaks a little more seriously closer to the draft, especially the last 2 weeks depending on who its from.  We aren't in that last 2 weeks period yet.  But listening to Schefter yesterday he thinks that McCarthey coud fall to the 8-12 range.  That's hard for me to believe with all of the QB needy teams.

Edited April 9 by Skinsinparadise

[Destino]

9 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

 

Can't make that kind of comparison my guy. That is woefully oblivious to the idea that a QB that is a fast processor and gets the ball out will face less pressure than a guy who historically stands there and holds the ball for an eternity.

 

JD improves the Oline in front of him just by being on the field. Logan Paulsen has hit on this repeatedly. You can't rush him the same way, or as fast.

I would not expect JD to face as many pressures as Howell did last year playing behind the same Oline. Kinda like how Brissett looked different in the same environment.

I’m not buying this. JD is in a near ideal situation at LSU. A dominant OLine and wide outs running wide open. So open that he rarely used the middle of the field, and still put up monstrous numbers.

 

That isn’t remotely what awaits him in the NFL, and his ability to run will not change that. I think JD has a future in the NFL but I think he’s going to struggle early versus expectations.

 

[skinsfan66]

9 hours ago, DWinzit said:

If Daniels and Maye weren't in this draft class we'd be arguing JJ or Penix at two because we can't afford to move out of the spot and risk losing them both. 

 You hit it out of the park.

[DogofWar1]

An interesting hypo is what if Maye and JJ went back to school and the class was Caleb/Jayden/Penix/Nix.

 

Do we stay at 2 and take Daniels or since there is now more projected talent in the 2025 class does trading down and acquiring extra picks for 2025 moves become more palatable?

 

Probably stay at 2 and swing at Daniels, but it's an interesting hypo

[Est.1974]

35 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Speaking of which.  I take rumors leaks a little more seriously closer to the draft, especially the last 2 weeks depending on who its from.  We aren't in that last 2 weeks period yet.  But listening to Schefter yesterday he thinks that McCarthey coud fall to the 8-12 range.  That's hard for me to believe with all of the QB needy teams.

I could see the top end WR class being seen as elite, teams may either sit or move up. I’ve seen the Bears linked with MHJ. They could easily move up from #9.

[Skinsinparadise]

4 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

I could see the top end WR class being seen as elite, teams may either sit or move up. I’ve seen the Bears linked with MHJ. They could easily move up from #9.

 

Tough for me to see McCarthy getting past the Giants at 6.

 

Only wildcard to me though is if there was anything to McGinn talking to 3 scouts about McCarthy, the NFL might not be as high on him as the buzz seems to be right now.  But that was only 3 guys. I take his stuff more seriously when he gets the 7-8 NFL team scouts the week before the draft.  Will see.

[FootballZombie]

38 minutes ago, Destino said:

I think JD has a future in the NFL but I think he’s going to struggle early versus expectations.

 

I guess that depends on what your expectations are.

 

Nobody should be expecting CJ Stroud pt 2.

If a rookie plays plus football in year 1 they are generally hailed.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

22 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Speaking of which.  I take rumors leaks a little more seriously closer to the draft, especially the last 2 weeks depending on who it’s from.  We aren't in that last 2 weeks period yet.  But listening to Schefter yesterday he thinks that McCarthey coud fall to the 8-12 range.  That's hard for me to believe with all of the QB needy teams.

I generally don’t ever take the rumors seriously because often time there are competing rumors going in opposite directions, and the source of the rumors is either misinformation or agents.

 

Unless it’s like the Haskins draft where us picking Haskins wasn’t a rumor.  It was reported because the football people were pissed the owner overruled them and they just went and told the reporters what was happening.  But that’s not rumor so much as a report.

 

Here’s what I think: QBs will go in the top 3.  Most likely it’s Williams then Maye/Daniels in some order.  
 

I don’t see either Arizona trading out of the pick because they won’t be able to get back to pick Harrison.  If they trade down, LA Chargers at 5 just take Harrison and pair him with Herbert and that’s that Jack. 
 

The tricky pick is then the Chargers at 5.  They don’t need a QB.  The could take the best tackle and just call it a day.  Or they could trade back and this could be the McCarthy pick.  But they’re not trading back with the Raiders or Denver so it would be the Vikings.  And I good absolutely see that.  The reason the Vikings might want to come up to 5 instead of 6 is because the Giants might just take McCarthy or the Giants would trade with either the Raiders or Denver.  So more competition for the 6th pick.  
 

I really could se it going QB, QB, QB, Harrison, Tackle, then put the Giants on the clock.  
 

If the Giants pass, then all of a sudden McCarthy is into that 7-10 range and none of those teams are picking him so the QB teams might just wait.

 

My hope is we take Maye and the Vikings blow their load to take McCarthy at 3 and Daniels drops.  Because that would make me smile from a chaos perspective.  

25 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

An interesting hypo is what if Maye and JJ went back to school and the class was Caleb/Jayden/Penix/Nix.

 

Do we stay at 2 and take Daniels or since there is now more projected talent in the 2025 class does trading down and acquiring extra picks for 2025 moves become more palatable?

 

Probably stay at 2 and swing at Daniels, but it's an interesting hypo

We would pick Daniels which would be the right thing to do.  
 

You can’t project a year out.  Who knows what can happen. 

[Warhead36]

Ngl I am a little bit concerned we havent scheduled a top 30 visit yet with Maye

[Skinsinparadise]

1 minute ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I generally don’t ever take the rumors seriously because often time there are competing rumors going in opposite directions, and the source of the rumors is either misinformation or agents.

 

Unless it’s like the Haskins draft where us picking Haskins wasn’t a rumor.  It was reported because the football people were pissed the owner overruled them and they just went and told the reporters what was happening.  But that’s not rumor so much as a report.

 

Here’s what I think: QBs will go in the top 3.  Most likely it’s Williams then Maye/Daniels in some order.  
 

I don’t see either Arizona trading out of the pick because they won’t be able to get back to pick Harrison.  If they trade down, LA Chargers at 5 just take Harrison and pair him with Herbert and that’s that Jack. 
 

The tricky pick is then the Chargers at 5.  They don’t need a QB.  The could take the best tackle and just call it a day.  Or they could trade back and this could be the McCarthy pick.  But they’re not trading back with the Raiders or Denver so it would be the Vikings.  And I good absolutely see that.  The reason the Vikings might want to come up to 5 instead of 6 is because the Giants might just take McCarthy or the Giants would trade with either the Raiders or Denver.  So more competition for the 6th pick.  
 

I really could se it going QB, QB, QB, Harrison, Tackle, then put the Giants on the clock.  
 

If the Giants pass, then all of a sudden McCarthy is into that 7-10 range and none of those teams are picking him so the QB teams might just wait.

 

My hope is we take Maye and the Vikings blow their load to take McCarthy at 3 and Daniels drops.  Because that would make me smile from a chaos perspective.  

 

Depends on me as to the rumor, who is saying it, and how many others say the same thing.   From my experience paying attention to it, its not a one size fits all exercise.

 

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

20 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Tough for me to see McCarthy getting past the Giants at 6.

 

Only wildcard to me though is if there was anything to McGinn talking to 3 scouts about McCarthy, the NFL might not be as high on him as the buzz seems to be right now.  But that was only 3 guys. I take his stuff more seriously when he gets the 7-8 NFL team scouts the week before the draft.  Will see.

If I were the giants and my OL was as trash as it’s been, and I was stuck with Jones for another year, I wouldn’t over think it.  I’d take the best tackle on the board and expect to be picking high next year to get a QB.  That’s not great for Dabol but if I’m the GM, that’s what I’d do.