The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[duffy]

1 hour ago, wit33 said:

Does it discuss intangibles in great depth? 

Useless read. Not one pie chart distinguishing the moxie levels. 

[El Mexican]

2 hours ago, Conn said:

 

An impossible dream, obviously. But not completely insane in a vacuum. We just don’t live in a vacuum. 

 

Dream or nightmare?

 

I clearly remember another veteran QB breaking his hip on the SECOND play of the season because of our porous OL. Bearded man in 2019? Can't recall his name.

Brady would be the worst option ever. Draft and trade for three superior OL and now we're talking.

 

Or just roll with TH.

7 hours ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

Our backups are taking over the league lol...

 

- Heinicke

- Colt McCoy

- Kyle Allen

 

No love for KC, our most esteemed backup?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

8 minutes ago, El Mexican said:

 

Dream or nightmare?

 

I clearly remember another veteran QB breaking his hip on the SECOND play of the season because of our porous OL. Bearded man in 2019? Can't recall his name.

 

 

 

2019...*sigh*

 

"2nd play of the season"...*sigh*

 

This thread, man...

 

[Cooleyfan1993]

17 minutes ago, El Mexican said:

 

Dream or nightmare?

 

I clearly remember another veteran QB breaking his hip on the SECOND play of the season because of our porous OL. Bearded man in 2019? Can't recall his name.

Uh……2019 case keenum was our QB to start the season….and he definitely didn’t break his hip on the 2nd play of the season, or even in the first game (or even at all that season in the games he did start), and I don’t think he had a beard. 
 

Were you thinking of Ryan Fitzpatrick, in 2021, on like the 10th play of the game? (Not sure how many plays into the game it happened, but still)? 2021 and 2019 are two completely different years 😂

[Conn]

Griffin would have a point with his thread if Wilson wasn’t an entitled little brat that his veteran teammates clearly don’t believe in and clearly resent right now. He needs to grow up.
 

Griffin almost gets to the point when talking about how Rivera praised the effort and enthusiasm Heinicke brings out of the rest of the team regardless of his own performance—right there waiting for him to grasp it is the flip side of that coin, which is that Wilson has the opposite effect. 
 

Yes, the expectations are different for the two players. But you can bet that if Heinicke was a spoiled tool who pissed off his teammates, he would also be benched. 
 

The other little thing that Griffin neglected to mention is that someone like Wilson will get a million chances specifically because of his draft pedigree and high expectations. He’s acting like Wilson being benched isn’t a crazy anomaly—those guys usually get years of failure before getting yanked. Wilson was yanked so early, while the team is doing well, because he’s such a prick and isn’t showing personal or professional growth, and needs a wake up call. Someone like Heinicke has to claw and scratch for every opportunity AND be a likable enough guy and teammate to get coaches and teammates to go to bat for him to even get a phone call for an emergency COVID backup job because otherwise he’s out of the league. He earned loyalty with one coach and that’s what it took to extend his career.
 

How Griffin doesn’t see this difference is absurd. He’s writing as if high draft picks are victims of these high expectations, when in reality they are given chance after chance after chance to succeed even when they fail because of that perceived upside. Wilson is an anomaly right now but Griffin is using his situation as some sort of soap box to make a misguided point. Wilson is not a victim of high expectations—those expectations will lead to him getting endless chances—he is currently a victim of his own hubris and poor character, and it’s been so egregious that it actually eventually outweighed all the pedigree and potential talent. 
 

Griffin takes such a bizarre angle on that thread I can’t believe anyone thinks he’s making a good point. If anything his thread should be talking about how RARE it is for a player with such pedigree on a winning team to be benched like this, and thus, how poorly Wilson must be perceived in that locker room compared to some nobody like Heinicke. He had an interesting topic in front of him but he chose the wrong angle.
 

But it’s not surprising that Griffin would find kinship in a talented player with poor locker room presence, and be blinded by that. Makes his whole thread, which he clearly thinks is profound, come off as foolish imo. The fact that he thinks the hype, pedigree, and expectations make Wilson a victim and completely dismisses the way the guy has failed as a teammate and leader—it gives a painfully transparent look into Griffin’s own mind and priorities. And the guy still doesn’t get it. 

Edited November 24, 2022 by Conn

[Califan007 The Constipated]

2 hours ago, Zim489 said:

Rob with a very good thread 

 

 

That's "very good"?...

 

- Guys drafted at the top of the draft get longer leashes, not shorter ones

- Heinicke has been starting the past two seasons because he outplayed his competition, not his draft status

- Apparently Wilson was not benched simply because of his level of play

 

 

[Conn]

4 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

 

That's "very good"?...

 

- Guys drafted at the top of the draft get longer leashes, not shorter ones

- Heinicke has been starting the past two seasons because he outplayed his competition, not his draft status

- Apparently Wilson was not benched simply because of his level of play

 

 

 

Jeez, I pulled a VoR by typing like 7 paragraphs only to accidentally get succinctly out-paraphrased by someone 2 minutes later. 
 

I should put a “TLDR: What Califan007 said” at the bottom of mine lol 

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, Conn said:

 

Jeez, I pulled a VoR by typing like 7 paragraphs only to accidentally get succinctly out-paraphrased by someone 2 minutes later. 
 

I should put a “TLDR: What Califan007 said” at the bottom of mine lol 

And by Califan no less…

[Califan007 The Constipated]

4 hours ago, Conn said:

 

Jeez, I pulled a VoR by typing like 7 paragraphs only to accidentally get succinctly out-paraphrased by someone 2 minutes later. 
 

I should put a “TLDR: What Califan007 said” at the bottom of mine lol 

 

You know what's wild?...I didn't see your lengthier post about Wilson until now lol...I thought you had scrapped posting it. When I read your other post I thought "This is good, he should have gone ahead and posted it"--then saw my post directly beneath it 😂..."Ohhh, he DID post it" tumbled around in my mind for a few seconds then realized I had missed it.

[zCommander]

On 11/21/2022 at 11:41 PM, NoCalMike said:

 

Well this team doesn't score many TD's with Heinicke either, so it seems mutual with that tier of QB.

 

I want to circle back to this and something Califan said that made me think as well. If Taylor gets the team to the redzone and we run in for a TD that is still a TD but not a throwing TD. It won't show up on the stat sheet as a thrown TD by Taylor. He is a game manager with moxie so to speak. The end result is still a TD doesn't matter who scores as long as the TEAM wins and to me that is the most important stat at the end of the day. 

 

The whole purpose of a a good drive is to end with a TD. I will take it however it comes all the way to the playoffs if possible. 

[KDawg]

Griffin is projecting his feelings for his career into the Heinicke/Wilson thing. That’s all that is. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Taylor ranks 32nd in the Red Zone.

 

Taylor’s believers want it both ways.  They want the critics to lay off and accept he is who he is, but are ready to litigate every criticism thrown his way.  
 

At some point, you have to accept much of the criticism on Taylor as valid, if you expect to be taken seriously.  It’s okay to concede that his physical limitations limit what the offense can do, particularly in tight space like the Red Zone.  While at the same time digging that a guy with so much physical limitation has been finding his way on the winning side more often than not.

 

I said this a while ago, and it’s still true now.  A lot of Taylor’s biggest fans will say they know he’s limited, not a franchise QB, etc. but then argue against that in that whatever his weaknesses are, happen to be primarily the fault of the playcaller who knows him better than anyone.  The reason he’s limited and not a franchise QB are the legitimate weaknesses, that he can’t really do anything about.

 

[Koolblue13]

12 hours ago, duffy said:

Useless read. Not one pie chart distinguishing the moxie levels. 

[The Rook]

18 hours ago, Professor_Nutter_Butter said:

Why the hell are we talking about Geno Smith. Good lord.

 

I mentioned him because he is having a better year than Jimmy G and D Carr, who have been points of discussion on numerous posts in this thread.  Hell, Carson Wentz was on no one's radar  for Washington last November.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

[NeverSurrender]

3 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Taylor ranks 32nd in the Red Zone.

 

Taylor’s believers want it both ways.  They want the critics to lay off and accept he is who he is, but are ready to litigate every criticism thrown his way.  
 

At some point, you have to accept much of the criticism on Taylor as valid, if you expect to be taken seriously.  It’s okay to concede that his physical limitations limit what the offense can do, particularly in tight space like the Red Zone.  While at the same time digging that a guy with so much physical limitation has been finding his way on the winning side more often than not.

 

I said this a while ago, and it’s still true now.  A lot of Taylor’s biggest fans will say they know he’s limited, not a franchise QB, etc. but then argue against that in that whatever his weaknesses are, happen to be primarily the fault of the playcaller who knows him better than anyone.  The reason he’s limited and not a franchise QB are the legitimate weaknesses, that he can’t really do anything about.

 

But then what if they fix the redzone issues?

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

9 minutes ago, NeverSurrender said:

But then what if they fix the redzone issues?

If Taylor all the sudden is able to make all the throws needed to be solid in the red zone that would be great.

 

I’m not real sure what you are looking for here.  What leads you to believe that is going to happen?  Or that the running game will be so good, they don’t need him to throw in the RZ?

[CjSuAvE22]

I dunno during games in the gameday thread ppl want us to run playaction rollout plays, I saw us run that a few times last game and heinicke did not look good rolling out and throwing he looked extremely uncomfortable it seems he needs plays that are in front of him and if he scrambled it’s for gaining some yardage as opposed to looking downfield and tossing it 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

6 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

I dunno during games in the gameday thread ppl want us to run playaction rollout plays, I saw us run that a few times last game and heinicke did not look good rolling out and throwing he looked extremely uncomfortable it seems he needs plays that are in front of him and if he scrambled it’s for gaining some yardage as opposed to looking downfield and tossing it 

I’ll second this, and have never understood the desire to cut the field in half.

[Professor_Nutter_Butter]

1 hour ago, The Rook said:

 

I mentioned him because he is having a better year than Jimmy G and D Carr, who have been points of discussion on numerous posts in this thread.  Hell, Carson Wentz was on no one's radar  for Washington last November.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

I will repeatedly stomp my feet like a petulant child if Geno Smith is even a possibility for Washington 

[KDawg]

2 hours ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

I dunno during games in the gameday thread ppl want us to run playaction rollout plays, I saw us run that a few times last game and heinicke did not look good rolling out and throwing he looked extremely uncomfortable it seems he needs plays that are in front of him and if he scrambled it’s for gaining some yardage as opposed to looking downfield and tossing it 

I’ve been saying forever that’s not the answer in those threads. Many, many times.

[skins island connection]

4 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

If Taylor all the sudden is able to make all the throws needed to be solid in the red zone that would be great.

 

I’m not real sure what you are looking for here.  What leads you to believe that is going to happen?  Or that the running game will be so good, they don’t need him to throw in the RZ?

 Whatever the OC calls for a play is what TH has to do. I doubt he's given full authority to option out of a play called, then factor in what the defense is showing vs what they end up in at the snap, and there's other factors that weigh in as well. Its just unusually different to be in paloff talks or position and some just can't handle the possiblities. I doubt they make it in the end but they gave it everything they had, and there will be some who want to point the finger at TH, and they're just not being realistic. If he goes on a stink the next 4 or 5 games then yes blame can be put his way, but winning 4 of last 5 is not bad regardless of opponent.

[Die Hard]

3 hours ago, Professor_Nutter_Butter said:

I will repeatedly stomp my feet like a petulant child if Geno Smith is even a possibility for Washington 

Thats how I felt about the Redskins signing Tony Banks and Rob Johnson. Very low points.

[dc1]

Continuing my evaluation of NFL QB's that suck (whenever I have an opportunity to watch them live): Daniel Jones is infact not good.

 

I'm thankful on this day for TH and the fun bunch 2.0.

[HTTSkins]

Hard pass on Jimmy G or Carr

[dc1]

2 hours ago, Die Hard said:

Thats how I felt about the Redskins signing Tony Banks and Rob Johnson. Very low points.

Tony Banks made me laugh out loud every time he stepped on the field. Straight up Mark Sanchez vibs but ..more scared if that makes sense (edit: deer in headlights maybe a better analogy).

 

Rob (straight back) Johnson...I was kind of cool with that dude.

Edited November 25, 2022 by dc1