The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Koolblue13]

23 minutes ago, Ghost of said:

 

Mark Rypien says hello. Yes, his peak was brief and he made some boneheaded errors before the great 91 year but he was the closest we had, since...you know, we won a SB. In another era of playoffs we'd have gone from 89 through 92.

Rypien kinda sucked until Gibbs told him to just start winging the ball as deep as he can and let the WRs go get it. Pretty much what I think is about to happen with Wentz.

[Est.1974]

6 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Rypien kinda sucked until Gibbs told him to just start winging the ball as deep as he can and let the WRs go get it. Pretty much what I think is about to happen with Wentz.

Sprint Bomb

[Koolblue13]

3 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Sprint Bomb

Only have to hit it a couple times, before everyone starts keeping two safeties deep and everything else opens wide up.

[Est.1974]

6 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Only have to hit it a couple times, before everyone starts keeping two safeties deep and everything else opens wide up.

Yeah, I mean we all know Wentz has his faults, but my God, I hope we get our fair share of slinging the ball deep. It should be fun to watch. Great arm.

Edited May 27, 2022 by Est.1974

[CobraCommander]

I'm getting Sexy Rexy Flashbacks. 

[Rex Tomb]

17 minutes ago, CobraCommander said:

I'm getting Sexy Rexy Flashbacks. 

[Dark Acre]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Rypien kinda sucked until Gibbs told him to just start winging the ball as deep as he can and let the WRs go get it. Pretty much what I think is about to happen with Wentz.

When your wide receivers are Art Monk, Gary Clark, and Ricky Sanders, it doesn't matter who your running back is, you go deep young man.

[Koolblue13]

26 minutes ago, Dark Acre said:

When your wide receivers are Art Monk, Gary Clark, and Ricky Sanders, it doesn't matter who your running back is, you go deep young man.

We've got some real burners with great hands now too. I definitely expect to see a real Gibbs/Norv style Air Coryell smash and bomb offense like we haven't seen since 91.

[Ghost of]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Rypien kinda sucked until Gibbs told him to just start winging the ball as deep as he can and let the WRs go get it. Pretty much what I think is about to happen with Wentz.

Rypien was one of those developmental guys the NFL used to have, he was on the 1987 SB roster. He was not great in 1988 in his starts but showed some talent. In 1989 he showed he was starter material but he was prone to dumb mistakes but threw for 3,700 yards (when that meant something) and had a 9-5 record. In 1990, the Skins made the playoffs and beat the Eagles with Rypien. But again, he had some baffling turnovers (including fumbles) against San Francisco.

 

Then 1991. But yes, he had a very brief peak but he was not a bad QB at all during that time.

[Koolblue13]

13 minutes ago, Ghost of said:

Rypien was one of those developmental guys the NFL used to have, he was on the 1987 SB roster. He was not great in 1988 in his starts but showed some talent. In 1989 he showed he was starter material but he was prone to dumb mistakes but threw for 3,700 yards (when that meant something) and had a 9-5 record. In 1990, the Skins made the playoffs and beat the Eagles with Rypien. But again, he had some baffling turnovers (including fumbles) against San Francisco.

 

Then 1991. But yes, he had a very brief peak but he was not a bad QB at all during that time.

Yep. He was average with a lot of bad mistakes, but hadn't really shown that he could be 91' Ryp.

 

That also sounds like Wentz without 2017, but with injuries and wheels.

[Dark Acre]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

We've got some real burners with great hands now too. I definitely expect to see a real Gibbs/Norv style Air Coryell smash and bomb offense like we haven't seen since 91.

I'll settle for 1999 when Brad Johnson threw for 4,005 yards and 24 TDs, and I Believe in Stephen ran for 1,405 and 17 TDs.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

49 minutes ago, Dark Acre said:

I'll settle for 1999 when Brad Johnson threw for 4,005 yards and 24 TDs, and I Believe in Stephen ran for 1,405 and 17 TDs.

 

I don’t want any running back over 1000 yards.  We have three, and they should split the load.  
 

Also ideally, Wentz gets to 4,400 -4,600 yards, 30+ TDs and 10 INTs.  
 

They need to just spread the field and stretch the field.  

[Burgold]

4 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

Sprint Bomb

Smart bomb😜

[Koolblue13]

47 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I don’t want any running back over 1000 yards.  We have three, and they should split the load.  
 

Also ideally, Wentz gets to 4,400 -4,600 yards, 30+ TDs and 10 INTs.  
 

They need to just spread the field and stretch the field.  

If lighter Gibson or Robinson catches fire and they run the wheels off them. I'm cool with it if its working. Rob seems like the kind of back you need to feed.

[TheShredder]

33 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I don’t want any running back over 1000 yards.  We have three, and they should split the load.  
 

Also ideally, Wentz gets to 4,400 -4,600 yards, 30+ TDs and 10 INTs.  
 

They need to just spread the field and stretch the field.  

Top 3 ranked offenses 2021:

DAL, TB, KC

Rushing leaders for each team:

Elliot 1002 yds (Dak 4,449 pyds)

Fournette 812 yds (Brady 5,316)

Williams 558 (Mahomes 4,839)

 

When you look at stats, look at results and work back. SuperBowl LA vs CIN:

LA   O-Rank #9   Sony Michel 845 yds (Stafford 4,886)

CIN  O-Rank #13   Joe Mixon 1,205 yds (Burrow 4,611)

-------> SF NFC Championship team vs LA

SF   O-Rank #7   Elijah Mitchell 963 yds (Jimmy G 3,810)

 

My take on stats for a winning formula for what WSH has is about like SF. QB throwing 3,800+ yds and 3 RB's of 950, 350, and 300 (total 1,600+ yds rushing and 15 TDs).

Yeah, winning is the goal and there's different ways to do that, however it's clear that you don't need one guy to rush for 1,600 yds and 15 TDs, you need 3.

So, they seem to have that figured out.

[mistertim]

5 hours ago, Burgold said:

Smart bomb😜

 

Super smart bomb

[Califan007 The Constipated]

 

 

 

 

[mistertim]

2 hours ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

 

This is absolutely bizarre. Winston and Jimmy G being 10 spots higher is so laughable. Man, a lot of people really really hate Carson Wentz.

[FootballZombie]

34 minutes ago, mistertim said:

This is absolutely bizarre. Winston and Jimmy G being 10 spots higher is so laughable. Man, a lot of people really really hate Carson Wentz.

 

Wentz started a a 72 overall in madden last year, he has been ranked very low for a while. Thanks to adjustments largely in his awareness stat over the season, he rose to a 74, before finishing at a 73 by having some of his awareness growth reduced. By the end of the year, he was ranked 28th (QBs), so he only fell 3 spots this year. Also these new scores are just possible leaks, they may not be true at all.

https://www.ea.com/games/madden-nfl/player-ratings/player-name/Carson Wentz/17543

 

 

Hurts the heart to see it in visual comparison form like that tho, It must look crazy harsh w/ zero context.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 28, 2022 by FootballZombie

[Skinsinparadise]

52 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

This is absolutely bizarre. Winston and Jimmy G being 10 spots higher is so laughable. Man, a lot of people really really hate Carson Wentz.

 

I didn't realize it until we acquired him but yeah he's probably the most hated QB in the league and I don't think there is a close 2nd. 

 

Its one of the wackiest things I've seen in all my time following the sport.  It's just about across the board, just about every of the analytic outfits, almost all of the national media, Madden, random fans on and on -- the narrative from them is Wentz sucks and is a bottom rung QB -- its not that they think he's mediocre, or sliightly above average, they think he sucks.

 

I said months ago signing Trubisky would be taking on the biggest punch line QB on the market.  I was wrong.  Apparently, Wentz is the biggest punch line.  And it's stunning to me.  

 

lol, it probably explains why my son is convinced Wentz sucks.  He plays Madden all the time and goes on youtube for NFL news and he is absolutely convinced Wentz sucks and I can't convince him otherwise.  And lol, he's usually an easy mark for me to convince on football stuff.  

 

The backdrop around Wentz is going to add to the narrative of the season.  Yeah there is a group here, me included, that are high on the acquistion but we are a small minority apparently on this.  So lol, we are either going to look really smart or stupid on the Wentz deal in the end.   But obviously the dude who is on the spot is Ron Rivera.   

 

While the natioonal media mostly loves Rivera, they abandoned him on this move and are basically clowning on him.  In my view the Colts are indirectly clowning on Rivera too everytime they take shots at Wentz considering he's a Commander now not a Colt.    So a lot at stake for Rivera on this one -- the media has built a narrative where he either looks like a genius for seeing something most others don't or if he fails they will clown on him for paying a big price for in their eyes one of the worst QBs in the league. 

Edited May 28, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[bowhunter]

Heck it's possible he could throw for 4500 yards, 65% completion, 24 TDs and 6 INTs. Someone in the media would come up with some "advanced metric" that would rank him as QB #30 in the league. Logic goes out the window when there's a narrative to reinforce.

[skinsfan93]

 

1 hour ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

 

 

The team should print this out and tape it in the locker room as a motivational thing for Wentz! He should take this as a direct insult.  

 

I haven’t played Madden in years but it’s ridiculous that Tua is ranked 7 spots ahead of Wentz. He is a bust and has no ability to throw mid to long passes. I could maybe understand his rating would be higher if he was a great scrambler but he’s not. Pickett as a rookie is higher than Tua? He’s a rookie with no wheels and needs gloves for his small hands. Cmon. And Ryan is 15 spots ahead? He was a good qb 5 years ago but he has zero arm strength now and probably couldn’t beat Eisen in the 40. 

[CommanderCarson]

56 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I didn't realize it until we acquired him but yeah he's probably the most hated QB in the league and I don't think there is a close 2nd. 

 

Its one of the wackiest things I've seen in all my time following the sport.  It's just about across the board, just about every of the analytic outfits, almost all of the national media, Madden, random fans on and on -- the narrative from them is Wentz sucks and is a bottom rung QB -- its not that they think he's mediocre, or sliightly above average, they think he sucks.

 

I said months ago signing Trubisky would be taking on the biggest punch line QB on the market.  I was wrong.  Apparently, Wentz is the biggest punch line.  And it's stunning to me.  

 

lol, it probably explains why my son is convinced Wentz sucks.  He plays Madden all the time and goes on youtube for NFL news and he is absolutely convinced Wentz sucks and I can't convince him otherwise.  And lol, he's usually an easy mark for me to convince on football stuff.  

 

The backdrop around Wentz is going to add to the narrative of the season.  Yeah there is a group here, me included, that are high on the acquistion but we are a small minority apparently on this.  So lol, we are either going to look really smart or stupid on the Wentz deal in the end.   But obviously the dude who is on the spot is Ron Rivera.   

 

While the natioonal media mostly loves Rivera, they abandoned him on this move and are basically clowning on him.  In my view the Colts are indirectly clowning on Rivera too everytime they take shots at Wentz considering he's a Commander now not a Colt.    So a lot at stake for Rivera on this one -- the media has built a narrative where he either looks like a genius for seeing something most others don't or if he fails they will clown on him for paying a big price for in their eyes one of the worst QBs in the league. 

I agree with all of this, I was just telling my buddy how incredible it was how hated Wentz is and that it’s one of the wackiest narratives I can ever recall following just in general around the league. I remember him tearing us a new one when he was an eagle and was terrified at the prospect of playing him twice a year for 15 plus years. And it’s not like a griffin situation where he’s only had one flash in the pan season, he’s had one incredible season and multiple others where he was solid and respectable and one where he was poor and not himself. Logic would tell you the bad season is the outlier, but doesn’t seem that way.

 

If he were traded to the Steelers, the narrative isn’t the same. The negative coverage on this team is downright over the top and unnecessary at this point for a team that’s been largely mediocre outside of one season for the last 6 seasons. It’s sillieness, and I so badly want Wentz to shut everyone the hell up. And this entire team for that matter, just for once go win 10+ games and shut these people up. 

[Skinsinparadise]

7 hours ago, CommanderCarson said:

I agree with all of this, I was just telling my buddy how incredible it was how hated Wentz is and that it’s one of the wackiest narratives I can ever recall following just in general around the league. I remember him tearing us a new one when he was an eagle and was terrified at the prospect of playing him twice a year for 15 plus years. And it’s not like a griffin situation where he’s only had one flash in the pan season, he’s had one incredible season and multiple others where he was solid and respectable and one where he was poor and not himself. Logic would tell you the bad season is the outlier, but doesn’t seem that way.

 

If he were traded to the Steelers, the narrative isn’t the same. The negative coverage on this team is downright over the top and unnecessary at this point for a team that’s been largely mediocre outside of one season for the last 6 seasons. It’s sillieness, and I so badly want Wentz to shut everyone the hell up. And this entire team for that matter, just for once go win 10+ games and shut these people up. 

 

I do think no doubt some of this is about this team being the acquiring team.  But less popular FOs acquired players here and got lauded for those moves including trading for lesser QBs IMO.  Heck most lauded the Fitz signing for example.

 

So I do think a large part of it is the worshipping from the national media and the anayltics guys of Roseman and Ballard.  And maybe there is some odd outright dislike of Wentz even though I can't place why?

 

The weird thing about the Wentz hate is he's a pretty nice guy.  So its not like pounding on someone like Jay Cutler.

 

The one thing I feel bad about it is that Rivera from what the beat guys have suggested is under the gun this season because of the rebranding.  They wanted a PR boost for their off season to help sell fans.  Personally I liked the Wentz move and the draft.  I think their off season has been good.  But not only didn't they get a PR boost for the off season, most of the national media are crapping on it and seem to think we are going to take a step back.  I think they are dead wrong on that.  But will see.    

[Wyvern]

Setting aside what Washington gave up to acquire Wentz, I'm okay with trying him out him as the Commanders' QB in the 2022.  It's a bit of a Riverboat gamble, but I like the odds that Carson will pan out as a competent QB for what the team has been trying to do for the Rivera/Turner offense. I think we'll see more points generated on offense.

 

However, the team's wins loss record will depend on the performances of the offensive line to give Wentz time and a clean pocket, and also the defense to prevent opponents from cashing in on Washington's stalled drives and turnovers.

 

Wentz is the opposite of that "Captain Checkdown" syndrome we've been complaining about.  In the heat of the battle, Carson is looking for the bigger play, and sometimes it costs him.  So getting more time in the pocket will help him find that 'optimal' target.  (It will probably help if Turner occasionally dials up a pre-planned delayed check-down play, as defenses tend to perceive Wentz as always looking for the deep target, the longer the play runs.)

 

Also, It looks like Wentz plays better if the middle of his pocket holds up and lets him step up into the pocket using his 6'-5" to survey the field, or try breaking through the line to avoid the sack and get positive yards.  (That's why I'm worried about Roullier.)

 

Lastly, if the defense can step up and keep the pressure off of the offense to score bunches of points to keep up.... I think Wentz won't feel the urgency to carry everything on his back, when his number is dialed up.  I think he'll be able to restrain his 'I've got to make the big play" urges and let the RBs and short outlet passing do their thing.  

 

Wentz has the physical traits, the strength and talent, and the guts to be a great QB for this team.  The trick will be how to effectively harness his passion and create conditions where he can rely on not having to always have that big play, and instead opt for a patient approach.