The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Hooper]

It's complicated in NY. Russini spoke to this.

 

If the G-Men take Maye and he struggles and they stink, that staff probably gets fired (or Daboll combusts from rage on the sidelines). And remember -- ownership loves Daniel Jones.

 

Whoever we draft, it's such a good situation for a young QB. The staff is going to get a couple years no matter what and will be all in on developing the QB. And Quinn and GMAP will make sure we have a good D. 

 

Going to NE would scare me. You have an owner who is letting his son meddle and nothing to speak of at all on offense. Maybe Brissett buys whoever they take a year on the sidelines, but that is so rare.

 

Also, the Vikings have put themselves in a dangerous situation. They look and are desperate for a QB and have let everybody know it. New England might be able to get an insane haul.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 23 by Hooper

[Conn]

20 minutes ago, Dan T. said:

 

No, it is exactly what I was saying.  Take all the 1st round quarterbacks taken.  The number that turn into franchise quarterbacks (hits) vs. those that don't (misses) is not "overwhelming."

 

That's a different point than your point that the chances of getting a franchise quarterback are better drafting high over drafting lower.

Did you forget that as part of your argument you posted about Trey Lance vs Brock Purdy and then said that “the league is littered with high round draft busts and low round successes at QB”. That’s the entire reason I’m comparing hit rate in the top-5 to hit rate in the late rounds. Because that was your argument, which is what I’ve been trying to dismantle because it’s extremely incorrect, and the numbers on a large scale are clear. You are much much much more likely to hit in the top-5 than in the late rounds. If you’ve agreed with that the entire time then I don’t know why you’d waste time making anecdotal arguments about Lance vs Purdy and mention how many late round QB successes the league sees (the reality is it’s very very few). It’s a percentages game, no one would be crazy enough to say that any of these top guys are can’t miss prospects. So what are you arguing exactly, and why bring up late round QB anomalies. 

[Warhead36]

If the Giants do end up with Maye, I hope the Pats fleece the heck out of them. Maye with no good supporting cast will fall apart. They already have no receivers and a crappy OL and if they have no picks to address that they will collapse.

[DiscoBob]

2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

If the Giants do end up with Maye, I hope the Pats fleece the heck out of them. Maye with no good supporting cast will fall apart. They already have no receivers and a crappy OL and if they have no picks to address that they will collapse.

 

That's the only way I don't absolutely hate that situation.... If they sell the farm for Maye..... like a historic WTF trade.... another Ricky Williams type of deal (multiplied because he's a QB)

 

 

Edited April 23 by DiscoBob

[The Consigliere]

33 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said:

 

This post is several hours old now and I agree with it. I've loved the Redskins since about '63-64, my dad and mom had season tickets until they moved to FedEx Stadium the first year. I've followed all of this time and like above the last decade has been a disaster. I moved to Texas after retirement to be near family and I will never root for the Cowboys. I was so so on the Texans, different league, and then last year they made some really smart moves. The small first pick went to Carolina and the Texans picked a prototype QB and made it to the playoffs. They already had some pieces, it seemed like the coaches used their personnel to their potential and not trying to make the players something they weren't. 

 

Now it's the Commanders time to make a wise pick for now AND the future, and that pick to me isn't Daniels. And it's basically his size that makes me feel that way. NFL defensive players are fast and big, much more than college players. They've had several years to fill out and get bigger and stronger. I feel that the OL hasn't been effectively addressed yet across the whole line of starters and depth. Poor Howell was flattened on almost every series several times. I compared it to the experience of Patrick Ramsey, another victim of a poor OL. Daniels is an effective smush waiting to happen. 

 

These rookies all need some development and we better have a great QB coach to assist with developing our QB. I think Daniels has this one glaring obstruction to longevity in the NFL. Just like I wouldn't want a small guy like Carolina took.

I would assume the decline started a long time ago, but maybe it's like me and it didn't I think the internet kept my attention on the redskins for an extra decade or 15 years because I suddenly just met redskins fans that were DC locals. Before the internet, it was just myself and a handful of friends that followed my older brother's example and picked the Redskins over the Niners in the bay area in the late 70's/early 80's. The decline to hellscape started in Petitbone's lone season of '93, it's really been horrible for 30 years, not 10, and the Snyder Sentence of '99-'23 is what people remember even though the six years preceeding Snyder were god awful too, just w/o horrendously evil ownership which at least took the edge off. Anyway, I managed to keep following my fandom via the internet, and travel to watch games at bay area sports bars for a decade beyond Gibbs I and high school graduation in '93, but something about what the USMNT gave me starting in 1999 (and as far back as 1989), and then what the Indians/Guardians did in baseball, and the Ovy Caps years, slowly took over fandom, expos didn't really because they were the leagues farm system, but when they moved to DC and landed back to back generational talents 15 years ago I was in on that too....all the while redskins seasons followed the familiar pattern, on average 3 to 4 of every 4 to 5 seasons were god awful, and we'd get a random playoff birth, never repeated in a following season ('99, '05, '07, '12, '15, '20), and so it continued to bleed off, the mishandling of RGIII's injury dealt a death blow, that I barely recovered from, then the McLoughan treatment and the unfolding Snyder isn't just an idiot and a bit of a ----, he's legit evil, pushed it beyond the pall, when they were total morons and drafted an edge rather than a QB in 2020, I officially tuned out. In fairness, since 1998, I've probably been Fantasy Football 60%, Redskins 30% general NFL 10%, and then once I discovered Dynasty Fantasy it became, Dynasty Fantasy 85-90%, Redskins 5% general 5%...so there's that too.

 

I have some faith restored with Snyder having been ejected, I know there's genuine hope now, the truth is, if Daniels is a bust, the team will be terrible and try again in two years, I get that, and I'm fine with it, but part of my problem is I feel this is self inflicted. I didn't feel like tampa getting a bust in Winston was self inflicted, he just didnt become what they hoped, same deal with Darnold and Baker in '18, same deal with Fields (to me) in '22, but when you miss like this, when to me, its obvious Maye is the long term better bet in terms of floor and ceiling, it feels like your the bears taking Trubisky over Watson and Mahomes, it feels like your the Jets taking Wilson over Fields, it feels like your the Giants taking Danny Nickels, rather than a top prospect who can actually succeed and waiting for QB until the much better '20 draft. When a miss seems obvious, like what Jets fans have been comedically experiencing for 40 years, it feels different than taking a guy like RGIII or Darnold and the guy just gets hurt or never pans out, but always had at least a lot of what you wanted, just didn't make it. This seems obvious: overage, didnt do it for five years, doesnt throw with anticipation, frail frame, weird personality and mom is a nut too....there are so many alarms being checked, pressure to sack ratio etc....and ignoring them all...it will be really hard to stomach him busting in a different way from what it would if you took Lawrence and he's just average, or Maye or Caleb Williams and they are just Andy Dalton's or whatever, I can live with those misses in that fashion, but not doing something stupid like taking a Zach Wilson, or in this case, a Daniels with THIS MANY CONCERNS, it feels crazy and extremely self-inflicted. Like Forbes busting and the pats stealing Gonzalez. Bad enough we didn't get Gonzalez, infinitely worse we were so freaking stupid we thought we made the right decision (like the Raiders taking Ruggs over Lamb). 

 

But I'll be ecstatic if I'm wrong, and I may be, nearly half of these guys bust lately, and more than half historically in recent decades, so maybe they hit, maybe they don't, and if Daniels busts in the way we think, it will likely be a spectacular implosion like RGIII that should gift us a top pick in '26 or '27. And then we can try again, but i'll be pissed and entirely focused on the USMNT and the WC at that point. 

Edited April 23 by The Consigliere

[Hooper]

More from that Athletic article --

 

Offensive Assistant 1: “Penix is third for me. He can already do all the pocket stuff. I just wish he had more juice. He’s more of a slow-burn guy. Get pissed off when you don’t throw one good in the workout. Get excited about something. … If he would’ve run a little more, he would definitely have been top-10. He and Caleb have the best anticipation. He doesn’t take sacks.”

On North Carolina’s Drake Maye

QB Coach 1: “I wouldn’t take him in the top 10. I just don’t know if he’s ready now to go take over now. He had one of the more impressive interviews I’ve done in years in the NFL. He was very impressive on the board, talking ball and the different systems he’s played in and the responsibilities he’s had.”

 

Scout 1: “He never really learned the proper footwork to be accurate. His arm talent is crazy. He has a lot of upside. But he misses layups. He’s just not a naturally accurate passer. I do think he’s wired right. He has to figure out some things. It’s hard to have a shooter and tell him his jump shot is broken and then rebuild it where you have to play him.”

Offensive Assistant 1: “His personality is terrific. His improvement on that pro day was really good, because his film isn’t. His feet are all over the place. He’s off-balance. Everything is a run-around play. At least at the pro day, you could see he had fixed a lot of stuff. It’s gonna be a little while for him.”

 

On Michigan’s J.J. McCarthy

Offensive Assistant 1: “He does have talent. People like his personality. He’s a lot like Maye. I think there’s a long way to go for him. On tape, he over-strides a lot. Everything is a flat, hard rocket-shot. You have to throw over guys and around guys and take something off. I do think he can do that, but I don’t think it’s his default. And when something is not your default, you really got to work on it to iron it in.”

Scout 2: “The most impressive thing he does is throw on the run. There is some good stuff on his tape, but it’s not like he was asked to make the throws Penix was making. I like him a lot, but I think he’s one of those you don’t want to have to rely on him this year.”

QB Coach 1: “J.J. is talented. He’s the youngest of all of ’em. He won and is a very competitive dude. Their style of play and what he was asked to do, you don’t get a lot of answers that show up much on tape.”

 

 

[clskinsfan]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

And said "I don't think anyone would confuse that"

Except of 70% of this board apparently.

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

McConkey in particular is the next Cooper Kupp.

He had some medical flags come up I think. So maybe he makes to 40?

[CapsSkins]

6 minutes ago, DiscoBob said:

 

That's the only way I don't absolutely hate that situation.... If they sell the farm for Maye..... like a historic WTF trade.... another Ricky Williams type of deal (multiplied because he's a QB)

 

 

It won’t be a Godfather trade IMO bc NE will only be moving back 3 spots.

[clskinsfan]

56 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

Daniels said the other night he has no idea how the Raiders could get him. I am sure he has a pretty good idea he is the pick at this point. 

[DiscoBob]

Just now, CapsSkins said:

It won’t be a Godfather trade IMO bc NE will only be moving back 3 spots.

 

No logic allowed, this is only OK if NE takes Mara to the cleaner.....

[Llevron]

I think its wild that some of you wont even wait for results or for games to be played. Just - if Daniels is drafted im basically done. Thats wild to me especially after JUST getting through all the Dan Snyder bull****. You would think there would be some hope. Not one final chance to do what you think. 

[seantaylor=god]

Chris Simms said he got a text message from someone he trusts who said Maye will not be the Commanders pick at 2.

 

The obvious person with close ties to both is Kyle Shannahan. Definitely possible GMAP told Shannahan this casually since SF is no threat in draft (or he knows from working with him he didn’t love Maye).

[SkinsFTW]

43 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

 in JD's case protecting his body from impact is a specific priority in my opinion. I trust if we're drafting him our f.o. knows this well and will move accordingly.

 

Apparently they are in the testing phase for one of these customized just for Daniels:

 

[seantaylor=god]

14 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

If the Giants do end up with Maye, I hope the Pats fleece the heck out of them. Maye with no good supporting cast will fall apart. They already have no receivers and a crappy OL and if they have no picks to address that they will collapse.

That and their coach will be fired, so he will have to learn a new scheme next year.

[The Consigliere]

5 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

It won’t be a Godfather trade IMO bc NE will only be moving back 3 spots.

I think it will be pretty close to one because it's a tier break, for a lot of teams. Some teams probably have a big 3 or big 4, but if you want to move up for Maye and you're the giants, the bet is you have JJ in a separate tier because JJ has a 50/50 shot of just falling into your lap. 

[sinews]

3 minutes ago, seantaylor=god said:

Chris Simms said he got a text message from someone he trusts who said Maye will not be the Commanders pick at 2.

JJ still in play, lol. Dark horse coming through! 

[clskinsfan]

18 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

If the Giants do end up with Maye, I hope the Pats fleece the heck out of them. Maye with no good supporting cast will fall apart. They already have no receivers and a crappy OL and if they have no picks to address that they will collapse.

True. But they do have a very good defense which led the league in turnovers last season. Maye with shortened fields is a dangerous man. 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

8 minutes ago, seantaylor=god said:

Chris Simms said he got a text message from someone he trusts who said Maye will not be the Commanders pick at 2.

 

The obvious person with close ties to both is Kyle Shannahan. Definitely possible GMAP told Shannahan this casually since SF is no threat in draft (or he knows from working with him he didn’t love Maye).

Possible that our GM told the coach of the Niners who we are drafting? Do you guys say these things out loud before you type them? 😆

Edited April 23 by AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy

[kingdaddy]

1 hour ago, Idaho fan said:

Really Really like the fact that they are solid at staying put.  To me it means they are locked in and sold on their guy.  They are confident with the pick.  I think that player is Daniels and Im as excited as ever!  If it turns out to be Maye I'll also be all in.  Either way Im glad that they seem to be set at who they want. 

What if it's JJ?????

[ExoDus84]

Sigh. We're going to draft a 45 pound quarterback, aren't we?

 

It's week one. First and 10, JD runs an end around and sees Micah Parsons in the hole. Not to be deterred, JD lowers his shoulder with conviction and

 

 

 

 

[Dan T.]

23 minutes ago, Conn said:

Did you forget that as part of your argument you posted about Trey Lance vs Brock Purdy and then said that “the league is littered with high round draft busts and low round successes at QB”. That’s the entire reason I’m comparing hit rate in the top-5 to hit rate in the late rounds. Because that was your argument, which is what I’ve been trying to dismantle because it’s extremely incorrect, and the numbers on a large scale are clear. You are much much much more likely to hit in the top-5 than in the late rounds. If you’ve agreed with that the entire time then I don’t know why you’d waste time making anecdotal arguments about Lance vs Purdy and mention how many late round QB successes the league sees (the reality is it’s very very few). It’s a percentages game, no one would be crazy enough to say that any of these top guys are can’t miss prospects. So what are you arguing exactly, and why bring up late round QB anomalies. 

 

Jesus you're exhausting.

[clskinsfan]

14 minutes ago, Llevron said:

I think its wild that some of you wont even wait for results or for games to be played. Just - if Daniels is drafted im basically done. Thats wild to me especially after JUST getting through all the Dan Snyder bull****. You would think there would be some hope. Not one final chance to do what you think. 

I think for a lot of fans it is the RG3 factor. Peoples hearts were ripped from their chests by Ngata that day. 

[seantaylor=god]

3 minutes ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

Possible that our GM told the coach of the Niners who we are drafting? Do you guys say these things out loud before you type them? 😆

He worked with him for years. He was there with him. Whether he said it explicitly or he knows based on discussing QBs for YEARS with him, it’s not crazy.

 

It was a hypothetical anyway, I’m just speculating on the source.

[clskinsfan]

4 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

What if it's JJ?????

I will blow a gasket. But then get in line in a few days. He is the only one that would seriously make me question what the hell Peters saw before making the pick. 

[frontline205]

anyone post this yet lol.