2021 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[DWinzit]

13 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Slater is the cleanest OL prospect from a technique standpoint.  His hand-work is excellent and it will translate to immediate competency in NFL pass pro.  And his lateral speed and agility is arguably the best in the entire class, it's an elite trait that compares favorably to any OL prospect that has come out in recent years.

 

You're right that his arm length will be a key measurement.  His bench is going to matter, and I think his height will be key too.  I suspect that he's going to measure a 603x, which is going to put him a lot lower on the boards of power running and vertical passing offense teams.  It could be a situation where west coast and ZBS heavy teams have him as like a top ten pick and other teams have him as like a second rounder because he's outside of their size norms for a tackle and isn't a good fit as a guard for a power blocking scheme. 

 

He is an excellent fit in our offense.  Basically a better version of Saahdiq Charles in every regard.  He would be a day one starter at LT for us IMO, and if we don't get a QB, then Slater is probably the most valuable pick we can make at 19.

I have found your OT breakdowns fascinating over the past month or so. I don't think I would have been paying attention much to Slater without all of your postings. 

[BayouBrave86]

On 1/15/2021 at 8:47 AM, KDawg said:

Hot take: I am doing my receiver watch. I started with Bateman and Chase.

 

I'm not sold that Chase is better than Bateman, let alone DeVanta. I'm not trying to take anything away from JaMarr. He is a deep threat, take the top off guy. He is also a killer slant and cross runner and if he catches the ball in space he's gone. But his route tree isn't all that diversified. He ran a lot of slants, ins, crossers and fades. Sure, he did some other stuff... But the vast majority of his production seemed to come from fade balls and in breaking routes. He also isn't all that precise on his breaks. He's going to get separation from people even in the NFL. He's very talented... But I am not sure he's as good as we (read: me) thought he was.

 

Gotta go through everyone and then watch him again. I just am not as wowed by him as I once was after watching a few of these other receivers...

Chase is Odell without the issues. 

[KDawg]

10 minutes ago, BayouBrave86 said:

Chase is Odell without the issues. 

I can see that.

[Skinsinparadise]

37 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I have found your OT breakdowns fascinating over the past month or so. I don't think I would have been paying attention much to Slater without all of your postings. 

 

Slater alas isn't a below the radar type.  If he's as well thought of by personnel guys the way he is by some draft geeks, he's unlikely dropping to 19.  He has received a ton of hype from draft geek types for months, some of which was posted here, including Jeremiah and another thinking he's better than Sewell.  Case in point, here's Draft Network's latest mock.  He goes #4 and ahead of Sewell. 

 

4.

 

Falcons

Rashawn Slater

OT, Northwestern

Okay, everybody calm down.

Here’s what I’ve got. I’ve got Daniel Jeremiah, who’s a great barometer for the league, ranking Slater above Penei Sewell. I’ve got Lance Zierlein, another league barometer, agreeing with him. I’ve got Matt Miller, who’s always well-sourced, saying multiple scouting directors and area scouts prefer Slater to Sewell. 

So I’m thinking there’s a good chance that Slater goes ahead of Sewell come draft day. That’s not how I have them stacked on my board—though I love both—but that could be how this goes.

The new Atlanta GM looks to be Terry Fontenot, who comes from the New Orleans tree. That Saints front office has drafted a trench player in the first round of five of their last six drafts—and in 2019, when they didn’t have a first-round pick, they took Erik McCoy in the second. Four of those trench picks have been offensive linemen, as New Orleans poured talent into a seemingly solid offensive line, and to their benefit—they have a top-three OL in the league.

Atlanta attacked OL heavily in the 2019 NFL Draft, bringing in Chris Lindstrom and Kaleb McGary with first-round picks. McGary hasn’t been great, Alex Mack is likely leaving in free agency, Jake Matthews can be improved upon, and left guard could still use a starter. Slater is a great fit for all of those issues: he has guard/tackle versatility, so he can fight for multiple jobs in camp, and is a high-quality run blocker in space for the Arthur Smith run-heavy approach.

 

 

 

 

[Going Commando]

40 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I have found your OT breakdowns fascinating over the past month or so. I don't think I would have been paying attention much to Slater without all of your postings. 

 

Thanks.  I'm going to go through the day one and two prospects one by one to get a feel for them, including guys I watched already like Leatherwood, Cosmi, Eichenberg, Darrisaw, and Brown.  To me it's likely that OT is our pick at 19 or 52 since the strength of the class intersects with need in the top 50.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Thanks.  I'm going to go through the day one and two prospects one by one to get a feel for them, including guys I watched already like Leatherwood, Cosmi, Eichenberg, Darrisaw, and Brown.  To me it's likely that OT is our pick at 19 or 52 since the strength of the class intersects with need in the top 50.

 

I've just started watching these guys.  I'd say right now purely judging by mock drafts the dude that's all over the place is Cosmi. I see him in the top 10 in some, the teens, late 20s, early 2nd.  Eichenberg and Brown almost almost in the 2nd, sometimes 3rd.  I haven't watched Darrisaw yet, some hype him as a run blocking fiend, with big time tools, he seems to be any where from 10 to 24.

 

Not that it matters what the mock draft types think.  But interesting to me to see how wide of a range they seem to fall.  Last year most of the mocks had the tackles in more consistent spots albeit everyone had a different favorite it seemed. 

 

19.

Washington

Christian Darrisaw

OT, Virginia Tech

This is the steal of the draft as far as I’m concerned. Can I say that about my own mock draft? I mean, I made it.

Anyway, the Football Team won’t be able to get a quarterback of their own this late in the draft, which is their biggest need. As such, they must instead prepare the offense for that player—whenever they get him—by shoring up the offensive line and bolstering the receiving corps. The Football Team’s interior is well-managed so long as they sign Brandon Scherff in free agency, but left tackle remains a question mark. Geron Christian and Cornelius Lucas both have their arguments to hold the starting job, but neither is stronger than Darrisaw’s.

A devastating second-level blocker who is offensively smooth on the hoof despite playing around 315 pounds, Darrisaw has the mature game necessary to defend the blindside from Week 1. For a run-heavy approach like Washington’s, he’ll be a high-impact road-grader to boot.

 

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/2021-nfl-mock-draft-solak-1.0

 

[Going Commando]

15 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Slater alas isn't a below the radar type.  If he's as well thought of by personnel guys the way he is by some draft geeks, he's unlikely dropping to 19.  He has received a ton of hype from draft geek types for months, some of which was posted here, including Jeremiah and another thinking he's better than Sewell.  Case in point, here's Draft Network's latest mock.  He goes #4 and ahead of Sewell. 

 

Slater is clean and good, Sewell is dominant.  IMO thinking Slater is better than Sewell is missing the forest through the trees and would be like saying David Bakhtiari is better than Orlando Pace.  Slater is a really good prospect, but Sewell is something we legitimately have not seen for a long time at the OT position.  He is in the Joe Thomas/Pace class of prospects as a guy who seems to come along only once every ten to fifteen years.  That doesn't mean he'll end up being as good a player as they were as they panned out and reached their full potential in the NFL.  But it does mean he's a better prospect than Slater or basically any other OT prospect whose come out over the last thirteen years.  He has sheer, god-given gifts for football that allow him to play the game on easy mode and do things that other players simply can't.

 

I disagree with the take that Slater is a high quality run blocker.  He's competent, but laconic and limited.  He is fast and hits his landmarks on move blocks and looks good reaching and sealing, but he's a zone blocker.  You're not getting any power or drive from him in your run game.  Sewell and Darrisaw are what quality run blockers at the position really look like.  They are people movers who are the ones who will drive an end five to ten yards down the field or seal up the containment to create big old cutback lanes for your runner to bounce things wide.

[Going Commando]

11 hours ago, TheShredSkinz said:

I got a Tiki vibe with Khalil Herbert.

I like him too.  He plays hard and he plays smart.  I liked what I saw of him as a blocker too, demonstrates a real blue collar approach to the game.  He was not the most dynamic guy in the ACC, but he sees the field so well and he's tough and always seems to be doing something positive.  I could see him being a good special teamer too.  The conference was completely loaded with RB talent this year.

[KDawg]

I’ve watched a little of Slater now and everything on Sewell... Slater is not better than Sewell as a prospect. Once they’re in the pros who knows... But I’m willing to bet Sewell is the best tackle in this class by a wide margin. And last years. And the year before. 
 

Sewell is an absolute animal. 

[DWinzit]

1 hour ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

To me it's likely that OT is our pick at 19 or 52 since the strength of the class intersects with need in the top 50.

I am assuming before the draft a new starter at ILB, WR and QB will be on the roster, as well as at least one DB. OT options in aren't great in FA but there are a number in the draft and the team would try to take advantage in this depth by the second round. I like what I have seen in Darrisaw and would not be upset if his name were announced at 19.

29 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Slater is clean and good, Sewell is dominant.  IMO thinking Slater is better than Sewell is missing the forest through the trees and would be like saying David Bakhtiari is better than Orlando Pace.  Slater is a really good prospect, but Sewell is something we legitimately have not seen for a long time at the OT position.  He is in the Joe Thomas/Pace class of prospects as a guy who seems to come along only once every ten to fifteen years.  That doesn't mean he'll end up being as good a player as they were as they panned out and reached their full potential in the NFL.  But it does mean he's a better prospect than Slater or basically any other OT prospect whose come out over the last thirteen years.  He has sheer, god-given gifts for football that allow him to play the game on easy mode and do things that other players simply can't.

 

I disagree with the take that Slater is a high quality run blocker.  He's competent, but laconic and limited.  He is fast and hits his landmarks on move blocks and looks good reaching and sealing, but he's a zone blocker.  You're not getting any power or drive from him in your run game.  Sewell and Darrisaw are what quality run blockers at the position really look like.  They are people movers who are the ones who will drive an end five to ten yards down the field or seal up the containment to create big old cutback lanes for your runner to bounce things wide.

I rally had no idea how good Slater was and SIPs post shows I have missed it. I was figuring he would be a pick 19 option.

 

I enjoy when knowledgeable posters bang the drums for one or two specific players that should be available at our selections. I pay extra attention to them even if I do not agree in some circumstances. 

[glongest]

If we pick at 19 in the first round how did we get to 52 in the second round.  Somehow I missed that.

[KDawg]

4 minutes ago, glongest said:

If we pick at 19 in the first round how did we get to 52 in the second round.  Somehow I missed that.

We didn’t. We pick at 51.

[Going Commando]

13 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I am assuming before the draft a new starter at ILB, WR and QB will be on the roster, as well as at least one DB. OT options in aren't great in FA but there are a number in the draft and the team would try to take advantage in this depth by the second round. I like what I have seen in Darrisaw and would not be upset if his name were announced at 19.

I like Darrisaw too.  He's rough compared to Sewell and Slater, but he's got some significant gifts and upside.  Very good bend.  Good natural power.  Good size.  Fluid mover.  The hand technique is not so great and there are occasional issues with the sync between them and his feet.  And looks like conditioning might be an issue too because the effort to sustain wasn't always there.  I think he may have been playing through some injuries for much of this season, and that might explain some of the tentativeness.  I believe that most of the times where he gave up pressure were either from late hands on the DL allowing them to control the engagement, or just not holding the block and letting his feet stagnate.  Shows up in some of the balance issues he demonstrates on move blocks too.  It's a tricky projection to NFL passing offense though because he's not doing a lot of NFL type vertical setting.  That offense is so RPO heavy that it creates some confusion for the line.

 

If someone can teach him how to really hand fight and he gets more comfortable with traditional sets, then I think he can be a quality pass protector.  He has such a promising foundation of flexibility and power and fluidity that he can build upon.

 

Run blocking potential looks really, really good for our system.  His reach blocks were fantastic and just easy looking, felt like there were games where he made the reach every time it was called for him.  Zone blocks looked fantastic too.  Second level blocks are easy and patient and he's got good eyes for identifying his down field targets and he's nice and physical with those backers and DBs.  It wasn't a big part of his role or the VT offense, but he's got real potential as a drive blocker because of his good leverage.  And he shines in the screen game.  This screen he helped spring for a TD was one of my favorite plays of his:

 

 

He's fast and athletic and he stays after it.

 

I like him as a value choice at 19 too, maybe by a couple of draft slots.  Right now I would put him at #3 on the OT rankings behind #1 Sewell and #2 Slater.

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Slater is clean and good, Sewell is dominant.  IMO thinking Slater is better than Sewell is missing the forest through the trees and would be like saying David Bakhtiari is better than Orlando Pace.  Slater is a really good prospect, but Sewell is something we legitimately have not seen for a long time at the OT position.  He is in the Joe Thomas/Pace class of prospects as a guy who seems to come along only once every ten to fifteen years.  That doesn't mean he'll end up being as good a player as they were as they panned out and reached their full potential in the NFL.  But it does mean he's a better prospect than Slater or basically any other OT prospect whose come out over the last thirteen years.  He has sheer, god-given gifts for football that allow him to play the game on easy mode and do things that other players simply can't.

 

I disagree with the take that Slater is a high quality run blocker.  He's competent, but laconic and limited.  He is fast and hits his landmarks on move blocks and looks good reaching and sealing, but he's a zone blocker.  You're not getting any power or drive from him in your run game.  Sewell and Darrisaw are what quality run blockers at the position really look like.  They are people movers who are the ones who will drive an end five to ten yards down the field or seal up the containment to create big old cutback lanes for your runner to bounce things wide.

 

I agree, Sewell I've watched closely.  The dude can pass block like Trent or at least close to him and is a run blocker on par with Q. Nelson.

 

My point is if Slater's hype is anywhere near reality he might be a long shot to drop to 19.  But I don't know. 

[Going Commando]

Check out this rep from Eichenberg from the Pitt game:

 

 

He picks up the stunt and the blitz at the same time.  This kid is so good and I'm liking the potential value of him sitting there at #31 on TDN's big board.  To me that is buying really low on him.  He's the guy I'm kind of eyeing if we can trade back in the first round into the mid to late 20s, get him, and then use that capital to move up in the second round to get Etienne, or maybe Freirmuth.

 

But given the high draft value of the OT position, if there is one you like as a first rounder at your pick, probably best not to get too cute and try and wait on him.  It's like quarterback in that regard.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Warhead36]

It wouldn't shock me if Fields became this year's QB to freefall based on some of those poor late season performances.

[KDawg]

25 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

It wouldn't shock me if Fields became this year's QB to freefall based on some of those poor late season performances.

Those were more mid season... but if Fields WERE to fall I’d trade up to get him very quickly.

[Skinsinparadise]

PFF isn't the be all and end all but not bad for the WFT.  I was a freak for Chase and Chinn. I liked Winfield but didn't go to town for him.  I had no idea who Curl was until we drafted him. 

 

 

 

39 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

It wouldn't shock me if Fields became this year's QB to freefall based on some of those poor late season performances.

 

I'd be shocked, if he falls far.  Too many Qb needy teams this time.  It's not like 2018 where there was so little competition.  You can argue 10 teams or so are either looking for a new QB or potentially shopping for the Qb of the future. 

[KDawg]

I was high in Chase, loved Winfield. 
 

Chinn I was okay with. 
 

Curl I liked but not to this extent. Didn’t see that coming...

[CommanderDOOM]

3 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Check out this rep from Eichenberg... OT position..

 

 

Remember seeing R.Stanley do the same thing against LSU.

 

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

It wouldn't shock me if Fields became this year's QB to freefall based on some of those poor late season performances.

 

All he has to do is skip the combine. 

[Wildbunny]

 

[DWinzit]

5 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

I like Darrisaw too. 

 

5 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

If someone can teach him how to really hand fight and he gets more comfortable with traditional sets, then I think he can be a quality pass protector.  He has such a promising foundation of flexibility and power and fluidity that he can build upon.

If the season began today, would he be able to start at LT or does he need to be coached up on techniques first? I mean he is pretty loaded with talent.

 

 

5 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Check out this rep from Eichenberg from the Pitt game:

 

He picks up the stunt and the blitz at the same time.  This kid is so good and I'm liking the potential value of him sitting there at #31 on TDN's big board.  To me that is buying really low on him.  He's the guy I'm kind of eyeing if we can trade back in the first round into the mid to late 20s, get him, and then use that capital to move up in the second round to get Etienne, or maybe Freirmuth.

 

But given the high draft value of the OT position, if there is one you like as a first rounder at your pick, probably best not to get too cute and try and wait on him.  It's like quarterback in that regard.

I feel like Eichengerg isn't quite as talented as Darrisaw but he is more plug and play today. Same with Slater at least at G.

 

I would love to be able to get one of these guys and Freimuth (who I think would be a great fit with WTF.

 

I agree that with the equality of talent from the bottom of the first to the top of the second rounds is so even that if there is someone you want, you best take them and not get cute or you will miss them.

2 hours ago, KDawg said:

I was high in Chase, loved Winfield. 
 

Chinn I was okay with. 
 

Curl I liked but not to this extent. Didn’t see that coming...

OMG Winfield was one of favorites from last year

 

Tampas drafting Wirfs and Winfield was incredible...and you could see that last night.

 

Curl is still a shocker to me, what a find!

[Stefanskins]

On 1/17/2021 at 1:59 PM, KDawg said:

If I talked to some scouting pals and got them a few drinks and limbered up and they said, “the kid from Michigan is undraftable. Slow, noodle arm. Waste of a pick!”

 

Yes.

Lol yes...but it was 32 teams...5 timesish...crazy...Montana got drafted in the 3rd(?)...and I use to think that was crazy...Marino 27thish...Kirk cousins 3rd!!....3rd!!!

3 hours ago, KDawg said:

Those were more mid season... but if Fields WERE to fall I’d trade up to get him very quickly.

No OSU qbs...can’t trust em...worse track record than the Redskins...he did look great against Clemson...

[KDawg]

6 minutes ago, Stefanskins said:

Lol yes...but it was 32 teams...5 timesish...crazy...Montana got drafted in the 3rd(?)...and I use to think that was crazy...Marino 27thish...Kirk cousins 3rd!!....3rd!!!

No OSU qbs...can’t trust em...worse track record than the Redskins...he did look great against Clemson...

Easy to get a read on how multiple teams feel based on convos with people that know people, to be honest.

 

Discounting a QB due to the school they attended is really not a good move.