The Official ES 2020 Free Agency Thread /Tracker... Kendall Fuller,OG Schweitzer, KP Louis, Thomas Davis, McKissic, TE Logan Thomas, OT Lucas, QB Kyle Allen (trd 5th Rd pick), RB P. Barber, LB Davis, Ronald Darby

[Anselmheifer]

42 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Feels like Hooper or bust.  I am not as concerned with overpaying a dude 2 million or so when its a major position of weakness with little other options on the table.  So i am not in the if its 11 million or so for Hooper than I am out crowd.

 

I actually hate more overpaying for mediocre players in FA.  Giving lets say 6 million a year to a dude who deserves 3 million.  That's been the Bruce Allen "special" as to approach to FA.    Maybe Tyler Eifert, but he seems always hurt.  Oddly enough Jason Witten might be the next best, his numbers were decent last year but he's an old, 1 year fix at best.  Ebron has the reputation of playing soft sometimes and not being the best blocker.

 

I am higher than most on some of the possibilities in the draft at TE.   FA feels like Hooper or bust.

 

I agree kind of. I also think the draft is a solid option for us. We don't have to be good this year. I think we are lining up to look very good in 2021. We could always double dip on TE in the draft. Grabbing Trautman in the 3rd and Albert O in the 4th for instance. I really like Albert O as along term prospect in our offense. 

[Koolblue13]

FA WR will be undervalued and the draft will be loaded.

 

FA TE will be very overvalued and the draft is empty. (Mostly sip)

 

@KDawg I do agree on Hentges, i guess I'm just putting more importance on the position. 

 

We have flipped opinions on TE and LB, which we're probably both correct in the middle. 

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

 

 

FA TE will be very overvalued and the draft is empty. (Mostly sip)

 

 

Nope, it's not mostly me.   😀     I've just spent probably more time on the position than anyone on the draft thread.  But just about every draft geek under the sun have their favorite TE's in the 3rd-5th round.  The lacking of headliners is what's making the broad generalization that its a bad class.  And it is a bad class as to headliners.  But the top guys IMO (and plenty of others) stack well to the 2nd tier group last year -- Dawson Knox, Oliver, K. Smith, etc.  

 

If you look at for example scout.com's grades of the TE's, the first tier guys from 2020 > beat last years 2nd tier guys. First tier guys as to this draft class, guys like Kmet and Trautman maybe Claypool, Albert O > rated higher than the 2nd tier group last year. Brugler among others have made similar points.  So I am not on an island on this. 

 

So if the idea is we are going to take a TE in the first or maybe even 2nd round.  no one is worth it arguably.  But the 3rd-5th round this year is just as good value in my opinion (and plenty of others) as those rounds were last year.    There are just no Hockenson, Fant, Irv Smith type of players - no A listers, which is weird but we'd be unlikely taking a TE in the first round anyway.  

 

Or simply put I'd take a Cole Kmet over name that FA target this season (sans Hooper and maybe Eifert).  I'd take about 7 of the Te's in this draft over Jeremy Sprinkle.

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

FA WR will be undervalued and the draft will be loaded.

 

FA TE will be very overvalued and the draft is empty. (Mostly sip)

 

@KDawg I do agree on Hentges, i guess I'm just putting more importance on the position. 

 

We have flipped opinions on TE and LB, which we're probably both correct in the middle. 

 

 

I don't know... do we?

 

I think Hentges can be good. I think Wilson can develop into... something. I think Sprinkle is fine as a 3 but not much else. I don't think our TE group is strong. I just don't see any good FA options aside from Hooper, who will command too much money.

 

Even looking at the draft, I tend to agree with SIP that the group is better than given credit... but... let's say Trautman is on the board at 3.02... Is he a better player than Akeem Davis Gaither? Michael Pittman, Jr.? Amik Robertson? Brandon Jones? Saahdiq Charles?

 

So say you draft him strictly on need. Well, LB/WR/CB/OT are needs as well. So you wouldn't draft him based on need in that situation. 

 

That's why I see a guy like Claypool, who can play TE or receiver, as a viable target.

 

Hentges/Claypool/Wilson/Sprinkle + McLaurin/Cooper (i'd target him)/Pittman, Jr./Harmon/Sims is an ideal receiving group. The benefit of Claypool is if you have three active tight ends, including him, you technically also have six active receivers with that group. 

 

Linebacker is a different animal altogether. Holcomb/Bostic/SDH can all maybe play a little bit. I don't necessarily disagree there. But remember, there are 2-3 linebackers on the field every defensive play. Most offensive plays feature 0-1 tight ends. Even Carolina, from what I've seen of them, average about 1 TE/play. They certainly can feature more than one, but on average, more backers play than TEs. 

 

And we don't have a backer that is an intimidating presence, which in addition to Young would be game changing.

 

People like to talk about San Francisco being transformed by Nick Bosa. And I agree, he had something to do with it. But, purely from a defensive point of view, Dre Greenlaw had a lot to do with their transformation. He shadowed Cook in the playoff game. 

 

Statistically he wasn't a world beater. Not great in coverage. But he was a good tackler and his athleticism allowed him to close lanes for some of the more athletic players.

 

I don't think Dre Greenlaw is some absolute stud linebacker. But I think he's better than any of our backers... right now, anyways. Holcomb can develop, for sure. Bostic is what he is. A nice depth guy that can come in and clean up. SDH is a total wild card who could be an absolute monster or a dud. Not sure yet.

 

The Skins need an intimidating presence at LB. Maybe it IS SDH or Holcomb. 

 

I think my point on both units has been fairly misunderstood. I don't hate our players at LB. I dislike that we are relying on quality depth players to fill in starting roles at a position that is required to have 2-3 on the field most of the time. 

[Skinsinparadise]

2 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

 

The Skins need an intimidating presence at LB. Maybe it IS SDH or Holcomb. 

 

I think my point on both units has been fairly misunderstood. I don't hate our players at LB. I dislike that we are relying on quality depth players to fill in starting roles at a position that is required to have 2-3 on the field most of the time. 

 

Rivera has highlighted MLB as a key position in his defense several times.  I wouldn't be surprised if that's a major target in FA or the draft. 

[skinzplay]

38 minutes ago, KDawg said:

The Skins need an intimidating presence at LB. Maybe it IS SDH or Holcomb. 

 

 

Your Honor, the plaintiff offers Exhibit A: Isaiah Simmons. And we rest our case.

[CommandB11]

46 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Rivera has highlighted MLB as a key position in his defense several times.  I wouldn't be surprised if that's a major target in FA or the draft. 

Could Luke Keuckly unretire for Ron in Washington? 

[HTTRDynasty]

 

[Conn]

30 minutes ago, panahoo said:

Could Luke Keuckly unretire for Ron in Washington? 

 

Even if he did, the Panthers own his rights. I'm not sure what his contract or their cap situation looks like, but I can't imagine they just let him go.

 

He doesn't seem like the type to unretire though. Like Luck, he retired because he's smart and has other goals. 

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Nope, it's not mostly me.   😀 

 lol That's what I meant. whoops. I wish I had your optimism.

56 minutes ago, skinzplay said:

 

Your Honor, the plaintiff offers Exhibit A: Isaiah Simmons. And we rest our case.

Don't encourage him.

[KDawg]

14 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

 

Don't encourage him.

 

I don't need encouragement to fawn over the Pterodactyl, sir.

 

Having said that, I don't pass on Young for him. Now... if Young were to get drafted by Cincy/Detroit at 1... Now I'm going after Simmons in a trade down.

[Koolblue13]

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

I don't need encouragement to fawn over the Pterodactyl, sir.

 

Having said that, I don't pass on Young for him. Now... if Young were to get drafted by Cincy/Detroit at 1... Now I'm going after Simmons in a trade down.

I think I still go Okudah ahead of Simmons and then look for AGD in the 3rd, but damn do I want Simmons almost as badly as you.

 

In recent years, my 2 biggest draft crushes were Fitz (FS) and OJ Howard (TE). Simmons might be the first LBer to be in there and it's a year we're able to draft the consensus best player, so that's pretty cool.

 

Remember somewhere around week 12 or 13 when steve was trying to prepare all of us to accept draft Thomas?

[Skin'emAlive]

Nah, I’d take Simmons over okudah for sure. But I can’t see him falling past NY. So I we trade down, we are likely to miss out on Simmons and Young. That’s a huge hit. Sure we could get a lot of depth and picks, but you are rarely the 2nd worst team in the league. Take the elite options before you.

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Skin'emAlive said:

Nah, I’d take Simmons over okudah for sure. But I can’t see him falling past NY. So I we trade down, we are likely to miss out on Simmons and Young. That’s a huge hit. Sure we could get a lot of depth and picks, but you are rarely the 2nd worst team in the league. Take the elite options before you.

 

I'd only trade down if Detroit moved up to 1 or Cincy did a Cincy thing and drafted Young. But I don't know if NY drafts Simmons. I think they'd go Okudah or Wirfs.

[carex]

I'm a bit suprised I haven't heard any Cincy/Giants trade rumors.  I mean next two teams after aren't really in the market for a QB so Cincy could trade back and even if someone traded up they would have either Burrow or Tua there for them

[PartyPosse]

12 minutes ago, carex said:

I'm a bit suprised I haven't heard any Cincy/Giants trade rumors.  I mean next two teams after aren't really in the market for a QB so Cincy could trade back and even if someone traded up they would have either Burrow or Tua there for them

If Young goes #1 then chances are QBs go 2 and 3

25 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

I'd only trade down if Detroit moved up to 1 or Cincy did a Cincy thing and drafted Young. But I don't know if NY drafts Simmons. I think they'd go Okudah or Wirfs.

I'm actually surprised the Giants aren't trying to trade down considering the depth at the position they most need. Picking before Miami, there will probably be a boatload of teams trying to jump into the top 4 and if they need an LT, with Willis, Thomas, Wirfs and Becton ripe for the picking, they could afford to drop back.

 

I'd be absolutely shocked if one of the top 4 picks WASN'T traded.

[Skinsinparadise]

Redskins interested in CB Byron Jones
Posted on March 4
PFN Insider Ben Allbright reports that the Redskins, Giants, and Raiders, among others, are interested in CB Byron Jones. However, he notes that the Eagles are the frontrunners at this time.

 

James Bradberry to Washington?

The Athletic’s Jourdan Rodrigue reports the Panthers won’t use the franchise tag on free agent James Bradberry. There are numerous reports that Bradberry would prefer to reunite with his former head coach in Washington. However, don’t count out the Jets, as PFN Insider Tony Pauline has reported that they have interest.

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-free-agency-tracker-news-rumors-predictions/

[carex]

4 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

If Young goes #1 then chances are QBs go 2 and 3

 

 

only if both us and Detroit trade

[PartyPosse]

23 minutes ago, carex said:

 

only if both us and Detroit trade

With Young gone i expect there to be bidding wars, especially with 5,6 and 7 all looking for QBs not to mention both us and Detroit may take one as well. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Keim podcast with Graziano on it.  Some points made.

 

A.  They like Haskins but not completely sold.  They won't rule out Tua but Keim-Graziano don't think its likely.  Look for a veteran QB to compete.  They probably let the market develop and see who is left standing after the bigger QBs are taken

 

B. He knows Trent asked for more than 20 million a year

 

C.  Trade value for Trent likely a 2nd rounder and change.  

 

D.  They love K. Drake, he'd be a top target but they believe Arizona keeps him

 

E.  LB, Holcomb plays will or Sam.  Hamilton inside.  Bostic?  

 

F.  They think the coaches there love the SF turnaround narrative and hope they can do the same here -- and that's part of their love for Chase Young

 

G. Haskins is acting in a way they like this off season, he's putting in the work, engaging more with teammates.  Improvement from last year.

 

H.  They believe that Chase Young is the best player in the draft.  Defenses coaches are excited about Young.

 

I.   there is a narrative out there that Haskins isn't going anywhere in part because Dan loves Haskins.

 

J.  Redskins think they can get a first for Trent.  Some insiders Keim talks to doesn't think that's right -- was told maybe a 2nd and third.

 

K.  Trent's high demands for a contract likely diminishes his trade value

 

L.  Alex is unlikely to play but Dan is unlikely to release him because Dan is close with Alex and Alex's wife is close with Dan's wife. They've spent a lot of time together, 

 

M.  Dan needs someone from the organization to hang out with before the games, after the game.  He needs a pal with Bruce and Larry Hess now gone.  There are some players he'd call to hang out with but that's not enough.  Alex serves as that pal.  (And Keim wasn't joking, wow 😀)

 

N.  Heard they got interest in Bradberry, Hooper, Drake, A. Cooper.  Some of the Alabama guys on the team have been trying to push Cooper to come here.  He thinks they are going to be aggressive on getting the players they like.   Bradberry likely around 15 million a year, Hooper around 11 million. 

 

 

[KDawg]

I'd love Cooper.

 

Love what I'm hearing RE: Haskins. Kid might just make it. Glad to hear (still a lot to prove, but sounds like things are going well).

 

I'll take a 2/3 for Trent. Seriously. Right now. This second. Now. 

 

I'd be okay with Hooper, but I don't think we're going to land him. Bradberry is probably going to happen, but I think he's too costly. But what I think doesn't matter. Drake I love. But Arizona is going to keep him. I love Derrick Henry, too, but Tenn is going to keep him and he wont be anywhere near worth what his cost is as far as % of cap. He's going to get paaaaaid. 

 

Alex Smith is a good buddy to have. 

[Skinsinparadise]

https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/03/04/mailbag-five-nfl-free-agency-shockers-futures-of-carr-brissett?utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=themmqb&__twitter_impression=true&__twitter_impression=true

 

interest in Tua, and much more.

ALBERT BREER

2 HOURS AGO

•  

From Chad (@ChadDvc4828): Biggest shocker of the FA period.. In your opinion...

A few things, I think …

1) I think offensive linemen are going to get paid, because they always do. Look for Titans OT Jack Conklin, Patriots G Joe Thuney, Lions C/G Graham Glasgow, and Saints G Andrus Peat to be comfortably in the eight-figures-per category, with Redskins G Brandon Scherff likely back with his team on the franchise tag and Colts LT Anthony Castonzo on a big new deal with his. Andrew Whitworth will also make eight figures, at 38 years old. Kelvin Beachum and Bryan Bulaga are two more 30-somethings that could approach that. The bottom line is there just aren’t enough these guys to go around, so the good ones get compensated.

2) I think it’s possible that Cardinals RB Kenyan Drake scores a bigger deal than Chargers RB Melvin Gordon, which would’ve been an insane thought six months ago. Drake’s more versatile, and more of a 21st-century back than Gordon is.

3) I think Dallas’ Byron Jones could wind up becoming the highest-paid corner in league history by a healthy amount, on the same principle that has all those linemen getting paid—there just aren’t enough good cover men to go around. (He, of course, will be a very temporary record-holder, with Jalen Ramsey in a contract year.)

4) I think Steelers NT Javon Hargrave could get into the $14 million-per neighborhood. He was a really, really good player in Pittsburgh last year, and there’s a thought out there that he’d flourish in a scheme that sends him upfield more (having more time on passing downs, after being behind Stephon Tuitt and Cam Herward in Pittsburgh, should help too).

 

5) Rams LB Cory Littleton is the other guy who may make more than you think. He could get close to what Kwon Alexander did last year.

From Kevin Hudson2329 (@kevin25675538) What’s the chances Colts trade (Jacoby) Brissett for a better draft pick?

Brissett is due almost $16 million in cash in 2020, and seeing as how the market is flooded with veteran quarterbacks, it seems unlikely that Brissett has real trade value. Which means the Colts would have to really, really dislike him to deal him away, especially with as much cap space as they have. I don’t think they dislike him that much. I just think they’re looking for an upgrade.

Also, it helps having someone with Brissett’s knowledge of and background in Frank Reich’s offense, particularly if the Colts are drafting a quarterback high. Conversely, having him around as a depth piece would be good if Indy signs, say, Philip Rivers. So, yeah, keeping him around makes sense.

 

From bj (@awiggy000): Do you think the redskins would actually pick Tua?

I don’t think the Redskins will. I still think the most likely scenario has Washington taking Ohio State DE Chase Young with the second overall pick. In fact, some who know Ron Rivera well consider that a lock already. Me? I think it makes sense for the Redskins to examine all their options, while generating perception that they’re serious about taking a quarterback in that spot (even if they’re not). One, it’s an effective way to smoke out potential trade suitors who might be eyeing Tua Tagovailoa, and they’d see the absolute maximum they could get for their pick. Two, it should do a little something to light a fire under Dwayne Haskins as he acclimates to a new coaching staff. And three … Who knows? Maybe they’ll think Tagovailoa is just too good to pass on? At the very least, you want to know what you’re passing up. Add it up, and it’d almost be negligent if the Redskins didn’t do it this way.

[Skinsinparadise]

Cornering the market, to a point

The Giants are definitely looking to add a cornerback in free agency, according to NFL sources, but it does not appear that they're willing to make a big splash despite their abundance of salary cap space (about $75 million). The feeling I got was that if they are going to be tempted into spending big money, it'll be for a pass rusher or an offensive lineman. At corner, they want a veteran (at a bargain) who can guide their young players like DeAndre Baker and Sam Beal.

The lone exception might be James Bradberry, whom Gettleman drafted in the second round in Carolina in 2016. There is some interest there, according to a source, but the Giants are wary of his price. Several sources said the 27-year-old Bradberry and Dallas' 27-year-old Byron Jones could end up with deals worth more than $15 million per year.

By the way, the consensus is that both Jones and Bradberry will end up in the NFC East - Jones in Philly and Bradberry in Washington.

 

https://www.sny.tv/giants/news/giants-nfl-draft-and-free-agency-takeaways-from-sources-at-nfl-combine/312939780

[PartyPosse]

29 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Dan needs someone from the organization to hang out with before the games, after the game.  He needs a pal with Bruce and Larry Hess now gone.  There are some players he'd call to hang out with but that's not enough.  Alex serves as that pal.  (And Keim wasn't joking, wow 😀)

I'm actually ok with this as I think Alex is a smart guy who's been a team player for every team he's played on. He's seen his job as starter basically given away to rookies every time and he never complained.

[Skinsinparadise]

4 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

I'm actually ok with this as I think Alex is a smart guy who's been a team player for every team he's played on. He's seen his job as starter basically given away to rookies every time and he never complained.

 

I got no problem with Alex, too on that front.  I just think its weird that we got an owner who needs playmates at Redskins Park and on game day.  It's not the narrative you typically get about sports owners.