Renegade7

Starting QB 2019???

Who should be the starting QB in 2019???  

401 members have voted

  1. 1. Who should be the starting QB in 2019???

    • Alex Smith
      28
    • Colt McCoy
      66
    • Trade for a Veteran
      8
    • Sign a Veteran
      29
    • First Round Pick (2019 draft class)
      65
    • Non-First Round Pick (2019 draft class)
      37
    • Too Early to Answer
      63
    • I don't know yet
      22
    • We're screwed (at least at QB for 2019)
      83


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20 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

My take here.  Jay and Bruce at Ohio State that clearly might mean something.  Maybe they do like Haskins.  Cooley and Sheehan won't be happy campers if so. 😀

 

The issue though is if they trade up to #3, they'd need to do it IMO on draft day because what would stop the NY Giants to then just trade up to #2 let alone Kyle I bet would get a kick out of showing up Dan. 

 

I see some trashing on twitter as to JLC for this rumor.  But I'll say two things in his defense.  Finlay has been saying for weeks they might trade up.  Doug who I don't think has a deceitful bone in his body has switched from weeks ago mocking the idea of trading up to doing a 180 and flat out saying trading up is on the table.

What would we have to give up to get to #3 though, SIP?

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7 minutes ago, RWJ said:

What would we have to give up to get to #3 though, SIP?

 

I know this was addressed to SIP, but I think that if we wanted to do the trade before the draft we'd have to get to #2 for Haskins unless we really wanted to bank on nobody else moving up to #1 or #2 and taking him. If we traded up to #3 there would be a chance of us getting leapfrogged by someone else. Might be a slim chance, but still possible. Then we'd be sitting with the #3 pick and no QB to take. That would be an epic fail.

 

That trade up would probably be super expensive. In 2012 we went from #6 to #2 and it cost us a 2013 and 2014 1st and a 2012 2nd. IMO Haskins is definitely not worth it. He's a good prospect in a weak QB class. He'd probably be a 2nd rounder in a strong class. 

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, RWJ said:

What would we have to give up to get to #3 though, SIP?

 

I'd presume a 2nd rounder and either next year's first or next years 2nd?  The odd thing about Bruce is for a dude that likes to haggle for every penny in contract negotiations -- he IMO is an easy mark when it comes to trades where he is too generous.

 

I've heard a couple of people talk about this recently which is the RG3 trade will likely never be replicated in that the Redskins gave too much up and no one expects another team to ever offer a ransom like that again.  We IMO overpaid for J. Brown, D. McNabb, Alex Smith.  I am actually scared what Bruce would be willing to give up to go to #3 because he always seems to be on the wrong end of these deals.  

 

Personally, I wouldn't trade up for anyone unless its cheap.  Going to #3 I doubt will be cheap.  The one thing I'll say in defense of Bruce is it could be that Dan puts the bug in his ear and tells him to go get such and such player and Bruce does whatever it takes to win the bidding war because he doesn't want to let Dan down.

12 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

That trade up would probably be super expensive. In 2012 we went from #6 to #2 and it cost us a 2013 and 2014 1st and a 2012 2nd. IMO Haskins is definitely not worth it. He's a good prospect in a weak QB class. He'd probably be a 2nd rounder in a strong class. 

 

I've heard in multiple podcasts from different draft geeks and reporters over the years -- don't look at what they gave up for RG3 as a template for future draft trades at least in terms of giving up three #1 picks let alone to just go up 4 spots.

 

The most aggressive run up I think would be the Rams going all the way to #1 from 15.  Not as bad as RG3 but close to it.  But they climbed a long way and went all the way to #1.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000652822/article/la-rams-trade-up-to-acquire-no-1-pick-from-titans

The terms are as follows: Tennessee gets: Rams' first-round pick (2016), two second-round picks (2016), a third-round pick (2016), a first-round pick (2017) and another third-round pick (2017).

Rams get: Titans' first-overall pick (2016), a fourth-round pick (2016) and a sixth-round pick (2016).

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

if anyone has some concerns the brain trust is on top of this one.  😀

 

Dan SteinbergVerified account @dcsportsbog
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D2HqQg7X0AAW4Kr.jpg

I was just coming here to post about this lol I'm watching NFL Live and Bruce Allen giving Dwayne Haskins the googly eyes eyes like he is on a first date on Prom Night..... I really don't want Haskins.......

Edited by JoeJacobyHOForRIOT

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Many of us, most especially me, need a 12 step program to wean us off this really bad habit.  

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44 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

Many of us, most especially me, need a 12 step program to wean us off this really bad habit.  

 

Dumping Brad Johnson for Jeff George

Wanting Brady Quinn but being talked out of it from their scouts

Overruling his personnel guys for Patrick Ramsey

3rd for Brunell

2nd and a 3rd for McNabb 

3 first rounders and a 2nd for RG3

Kirk contract

3rd and Fuller for Alex

 

Are you saying the odds are stacked against us as for their next move at QB?  😀

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33 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

I'll take Rosen from those scenarios. 

 

Am not even a big Rosen guy, I actually think he could be a bust yet I'd take him over trading up because I don't want to burn multiple picks to trade up. 

 

This team has too many needs and there is no can't miss prospect at QB IMO.  I like Murray a lot and I think he can be a star.  However, I don't think the Cards trade their pick.  And Murray's durability makes him a question mark.  I've just started watching Haskins in the last couple of days, I haven't landed on an opinion yet but I've seen enough to be convinced he's not a sure thing.  I like Drew Lock more than most do but he still comes off to me as a potential bust. 

 

My only disclaimer to that point is if the FO is in love with any QB then go get that guy.  It's not easy to find a franchise QB.  So I am not among the subscribers of skip a QB until the supporting cast is in place.  IMO get a franchise QB when you can -- they are harder to find than any other position.  But do I trust this FO if they fell in love with a QB?  Don't think so.  I might trust Jay but am guessing its not his call.

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3 hours ago, RWJ said:

What would we have to give up to get to #3 though, SIP?

Our Number One plus Josh Norman and Jordan Reed. We get their Number one and three picks.

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4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Am not even a big Rosen guy, I actually think he could be a bust yet I'd take him over trading up because I don't want to burn multiple picks to trade up. 

 

This team has too many needs and there is no can't miss prospect at QB IMO.  I like Murray a lot and I think he can be a star.  However, I don't think the Cards trade their pick.  And Murray's durability makes him a question mark.  I've just started watching Haskins in the last couple of days, I haven't landed on an opinion yet but I've seen enough to be convinced he's not a sure thing.  I like Drew Lock more than most do but he still comes off to me as a potential bust. 

 

My only disclaimer to that point is if the FO is in love with any QB then go get that guy.  It's not easy to find a franchise QB.  So I am not among the subscribers of skip a QB until the supporting cast is in place.  IMO get a franchise QB when you can -- they are harder to find than any other position.  But do I trust this FO if they fell in love with a QB?  Don't think so.  I might trust Jay but am guessing its not his call.

Plus one. 

I would take Rosen because if he sucks, we could still chase Tua/Lawrence and have built our team up a little bit better by then. 

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3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

I've heard a couple of people talk about this recently which is the RG3 trade will likely never be replicated in that the Redskins gave too much up and no one expects another team to ever offer a ransom like that again.  We IMO overpaid for J. Brown, D. McNabb, Alex Smith.  I am actually scared what Bruce would be willing to give up to go to #3 because he always seems to be on the wrong end of these deals.  

Actually, the RGIII and Wentz trades were not all that dissimilar 

 

Browns get:
No. 8 (traded to TEN, OT Jack Conklin)
Third-round pick (traded to CAR, CB Daryl Worley)
Fourth-round pick (traded to OAK, QB Connor Cook)
First-round pick in '17
Second-round pick in '18

 

 the Rams received three first-round picks and a second rounder.

 

So, The Redskins swapped first rounders, gave away two additional first rounders and a second vs. The Eagles swapping first rounders giving away another first, second, third, and fourth round pick. Eagles trade was a little cheaper, but not all that much.

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Posted (edited)
38 minutes ago, Burgold said:

Actually, the RGIII and Wentz trades were not all that dissimilar 

 

Browns get:
No. 8 (traded to TEN, OT Jack Conklin)
Third-round pick (traded to CAR, CB Daryl Worley)
Fourth-round pick (traded to OAK, QB Connor Cook)
First-round pick in '17
Second-round pick in '18

 

 the Rams received three first-round picks and a second rounder.

 

So, The Redskins swapped first rounders, gave away two additional first rounders and a second vs. The Eagles swapping first rounders giving away another first, second, third, and fourth round pick. Eagles trade was a little cheaper, but not all that much.

 

Depends on how much you value first rounders compared to other picks.  The thing about the RG3 trade that some have said is unlikely to ever happen again is trading THREE first rounders.   Keep in mind, the 2012 pick was the 4th pick in the draft.  The 2013 pick they gave up was the 8th pick in the draft.  The 2014 pick ended up being the 2nd pick in the draft. 

 

1st rounders are highly valued for obvious reasons because your hit rate is better than later rounds.  That goes double for top 5, top 10 picks in the draft.    It's that third 1st rounder that some (and I agree with that) which makes that haul intense.     IMO a third and 4th isn't the equivalent of a 1st let alone what the last first ended up being which was the 2nd pick in the draft.   

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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2 hours ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

I was just coming here to post about this lol I'm watching NFL Live and Bruce Allen giving Dwayne Haskins the googly eyes eyes like he is on a first date on Prom Night..... I really don't want Haskins.......

 

I do. He’s the QB in this draft who is the most pro ready and the best fit for a WCO. He’s a very similar QB to Rosen actually. Great film here of him breaking down his own film - impressive.

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Depends on how much you value first rounders compared to other picks.  The thing about the RG3 trade that some have said is unlikely to ever happen again is trading THREE first rounders.   Keep in mind, the 2012 pick was the 4th pick in the draft.  The 2013 pick being in the 8th pick in the draft.  The 2014 pick ended up being the 2nd pick in the draft. 

 

1st rounders are highly valued for obvious reason because your hit rate is better than later rounds.  That goes double for top 5, top 10 picks in the draft.    It's that third 1st rounder that some (and I agree with that) which makes that haul intense.     IMO a third and 4th isn't the equivalent of a 1st let alone what the last first ended up being which was the 2nd pick in the draft. 

Sure, but the three first rounders has always been a bit of a red herring. We swapped firsts and then added two more.

 

But I can see the argument that the extra first has much more value than a third and a fourth (unless you drafted as the Rams did) In any case, this is a ancient history. I do suspect one day we will see another crazy trade.  Whether it be the Ricky Williams trade, the Hershel Walker trade, the RGIII trade or the Wentz trade. At some point, a GM will go nuts. It might even be next year if people continue to think that Tua is Superman.

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23 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

I do. He’s the QB in this draft who is the most pro ready and the best fit for a WCO. He’s a very similar QB to Rosen actually. Great film here of him breaking down his own film - impressive.

 

 

Ohio State has produced a long list of successful NFL QB's said no one ever......  But i mean hey, he could be the first . If its between Haskins & Rosen though Im all about #7 .......Hell-no to Rosen, just no.

 

https://www.ranker.com/list/best-ohio-state-buckeyes-quarterbacks/ranker-college-football

 

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1 minute ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

Ohio State has produced a long list of successful NFL QB's said no one ever......  But i mean hey, he could be the first . If its between Haskins & Rosen though Im all about #7 .......Hell-no to Rosen, just no.

 

https://www.ranker.com/list/best-ohio-state-buckeyes-quarterbacks/ranker-college-football

 

 

I find arguments about how many successful NFL QBs a specific College has produced very unconvincing. Sometimes there can be something in a specific coach or system and their impact (good or bad) on a QBs development but even then - evaluate the individual QB not the program they come from.

 

i like Rosen as well for a WCO. So it’s likely we just don’t see QBs the same way.

5 minutes ago, Burgold said:

Sure, but the three first rounders has always been a bit of a red herring. We swapped firsts and then added two more.

 

For all that’s Holy let’s not start this ‘debate’ again.

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If Rosen is so good why are the Cardinals willing to trade him and take a chance on another guy?  I'm not saying a poor rookie season with a poor team is definitive since many rookie seasons are a struggle for 1st round picks since bad teams typically draft the top QBs but I don't recall other teams trading their former 1st round pick and drafting another QB.  Can anyone remember something comparable?

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2 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

If Rosen is so good why are the Cardinals willing to trade him and take a chance on another guy?  I'm not saying a poor rookie season with a poor team is definitive since many rookie seasons are a struggle for 1st round picks since bad teams typically draft the top QBs but I don't recall other teams trading their former 1st round pick and drafting another QB.  Can anyone remember something comparable?

 

A fair question. Because they are even more clueless and directionless than us is my answer.

 

Its probably close to unique that a QB gets drafted top 10 by a team with a first time HC and that HC and coaching staff is let go at the end of his rookie season as well. Now a new HC with a completely different offensive system comes in and if they are going to commit to him a different type of QB is needed (Something they should have thought about during the hiring process for the HC role). And so here we are.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

If Rosen is so good why are the Cardinals willing to trade him and take a chance on another guy?  I'm not saying a poor rookie season with a poor team is definitive since many rookie seasons are a struggle for 1st round picks since bad teams typically draft the top QBs but I don't recall other teams trading their former 1st round pick and drafting another QB.  Can anyone remember something comparable?

The only one that comes to mind is Steve Walsh from DAL To New Orleans in 1990, After JJ figured out Troy Aikman was his guy (Both Aikman & Walsh were 1st round picks). Didn't work out to well for the Saints. But even then its not the same as what Arizona is going to do, close though.

Edited by JoeJacobyHOForRIOT

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Just now, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

The only one that comes to mind is Steve Walsh from DAL To New Orleans in 1990, After JJ figured out Troy Aikman was his guy. Didn't work out to well for the Saints

The other one might be Phillip Rivers to the Chargers and Brees to the Saints.

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Burgold said:

The other one might be Phillip Rivers to the Chargers and Brees to the Saints.

Yeahhhh kinda. I mean New Orleans knew what they were getting  in Brees though, He was a 4 year man in SD and just starting to come into his own where as Rosen is a 1 year man just starting to well... Im not sure where he is going

Edited by JoeJacobyHOForRIOT

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