2019 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[mistertim]

5 minutes ago, dyst said:

Just asking but why are we so concerned that he is slow? Now if he can’t move in the pocket, thats a different story.

 

When I say he's slow I'm talking about his footwork and movement in the pocket. I think that's what most of the people who have criticized him for it on this board are talking about as well. 

[Anselmheifer]

I just got home from work. 

MCQUEEEEEEN! Your boy FURRRRL went at 4, and we got Haskins! High five to you! And, the Steelers traded up for Devin Bush, so we will get a pretty good assessment of his talent and can come back to it. If he fails with the Steelers, he didn't have what it takes. 

 

I'd really like for us to get that man a weapon. I'd love it if we traded back up and took Marquise Brown. 

[Idaho fan]

Any chance sweat drops to us in the 2nd?

[DWinzit]

Just now, Idaho fan said:

Any chance sweat drops to us in the 2nd?

Yes! But I think they are going to need to take a WR in the 2nd

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, ThomasRoane said:

 

That is EXACTLY the problem!  He doesn't move his feet well laterally.  He's a stiff.  He climbs the pocket but that's not enough.  You need to be able to slide as well.  He's a fat RG III in that respect.  At least he probably won't moonwalk backwards though.  But he's still gonna be a sack-dummy.

 

RG3 and Haskins are vastly different prospects overall BUT when I see Haskins footwork that's who I'm reminded of. Long strider on dropbacks, somewhat flat footed, not very quick.

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

When I say he's slow I'm talking about his footwork and movement in the pocket. I think that's what most of the people who have criticized him for it on this board are talking about as well. 

 

I’m  not sure his movement in the pocket is all that slow. He actually steps up fairly well. Leaves something to be desired when the interior pocket collapses. 

 

That scares me with or LG-C situation at the moment. 

 

Definitely needs to improve footwork.

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

Haskins reminds me of Alex Smith. But slower. He’s pretty safe. Their game isn’t a 1:1 translation, but I can see why the Skins would like him.

 

I think people believe I’m sold on this move. I’m not. I just don’t see it as a bad pick. As much as I’d like to stomp my fist on the table one way or the other, I don’t have any idea with Haskins. Sample size is way too small.

 

im impressed with his intangibles. He just has a lot to prove.

 

But that in no way makes this a bad pick

 

 

 

 

Haskins not being Jay's guy and was Dan's does not bother you or you just don't believe it's the case?

3 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

I just got home from work. 

MCQUEEEEEEN! Your boy FURRRRL went at 4, and we got Haskins! High five to you! And, the Steelers traded up for Devin Bush, so we will get a pretty good assessment of his talent and can come back to it. If he fails with the Steelers, he didn't have what it takes. 

 

I'd really like for us to get that man a weapon. I'd love it if we traded back up and took Marquise Brown. 

 

Hate the Haskins pick.  But I love your idea of trading up for Marquise. 

[mistertim]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

 

I’m  not sure his movement in the pocket is all that slow. He actually steps up fairly well. Leaves something to be desired when the interior pocket collapses. 

 

That scares me with or LG-C situation at the moment. 

 

Definitely needs to improve footwork.

 

I think it's just his footwork in general that's slow, and that causes his pocket movement to be a bit sluggish. Hopefully that's something that he can improve on but I think it could be disastrous if he's thrown to the wolves immediately.

[Anselmheifer]

15 minutes ago, Morrissey1972 said:

The worst pic of the night as far as I’m concerned and the fact that Haskins is a Snyder/Allen guy is only more infuriating. 

 

Who would want to coach for the organization? 

 

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Haskins not being Jay's guy and was Dan's does not bother you or you just don't believe it's the case?

 

Hate the Haskins pick.  But I love your idea of trading up for Marquise. 

Just for the record, I'm agnostic about the Haskins pick. I would have hated Jones. I was congratulating McQueen. We did need a QB, and he was super productive. 

[Skin'emAlive]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Haskins not being Jay's guy and was Dan's does not bother you or you just don't believe it's the case?

 

I dont believe that rumor. Also, Its not Jay's job to pick the players. I dont see how Jay who made Andy Dalton into a probowler in his rookie season would be upset with a guy who is arguably better coming out of college in every way.

[Going Commando]

2 minutes ago, mistertim said:

Like I said, Occam's razor. Tons of insiders were saying the same stuff. Smoke and fire. Same thing last year with Payne and that some guys liked James instead and Doug basically later confirmed it.

  

It's much more plausible, given common sense and our history, that Dan and Bruce wanted Haskins and basically forced the pick over Jay's head, that Jay was being honest when asked about Haskins, and that all the smoke around this whole thing means there is a fire than it is that all these guys were huddled up and were playing this super advanced strategic chess match that nobody else understood.  

 

I think that assuming this to be true doesn't actually follow Occam's razor because it assumes that

 

1 - The media are good and knowledgeable

2 - Jay is an idiot.

 

I do not think the media know anything.  I think they parrot poorly sourced BS from people with clear agendas to lie.  And I do not think that Jay is an idiot.  I think he is a rational, experienced coach who must certainly understand quite well how dire our QB situation was, and the necessity of finding one in the draft in order for him to have a chance at keeping his job.  I don't think he would say anything about a prospect that would hurt us strategically, and I do think he'd absolutely publicly talk down a prospect we were interested in, or in this case, a whole position in order to give us strategic advantage in the draft.  Thinking he's an unfit moron takes a bigger leap of faith than that.

[zCommander]

14 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

It's easier to not throw INTs when so many of your passes are short/underneath. 

 

Please don't compare him to Brady yet.  

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Haskins not being Jay's guy and was Dan's does not bother you or you just don't believe it's the case?

 

Both. Gruden is a dead man walking right now. If he keeps his job it’s because Haskins/Keenum pull through for him. He is Allen’s fall guy. I don’t want him making long term QB decisions while his job outlook is uncertain.

 

Being a guy Snyder likes... so what? I don’t mean that in a condescending way... but, even bad evaluators can get a few right. Snyder loved Portis. And Moss. Those worked out. 

 

Weve been missing on QBs for years. Snyder choice or otherwise. 

 

Lots of football guys like Haskins. Lots don’t. It’s a sample size problem. And it’s a bit nerve wrecking. 

 

Im not sure how much I trust the Skins FO in totality. So between them and Snyder it’s a toss up. There are some good individuals in the FO, but the collective think tank hasn’t impressed me. 

[FuriousD]

16 minutes ago, ThomasRoane said:

 

But the QB class in 2020 is so much deeper!  Everyone is pissed because the same idiot that has ruined this franchise (Snyder) hasn't figured out that he's a freakin moron when it comes to evaluating talent.  He interfered with QB decisions for every coach he's ever had.  Turner, Schottenheimer, Spurrier, Gibbs, Zorn (although that's not entirely fair), Shanahan, and now Gruden.  He can't help himself and that is why we are so pissed.  He will never, ever learn his lesson and the fan-base is screwed until the team is somehow rescued from his grasp. 

 

You're not dumb.  Haskins was a one year starter.  He can't slide in the pocket.  Doesn't move his feet well.  With the Redskins O-line? He will be a sack machine.  I'm talking John Beck style. He is slllloooowwww !  Play action will suck with him.  All he did was fake the dive off an RPO.  That was his playaction.  Don't want to see him get ran down by DT's on bootlegs but that's what will happen.  

Should have traded down for draft 2020 capitol. 

 

The head inmate is still running the asylum.

 Totally agree! 

 

Smart move would have been take the top O-linemen and wait for next year.  They could have enticed next years new HC with his own QB pick.  That's replaced now with the guarantee that any HC dumb enough to join this 3-ring circus will be saddled with a QB he didn't choose and owner/moron who can be counted on to meddle in **** he doesn't know anything about.  This team gets harder and harder to root for...

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, Skin'emAlive said:

 

I dont believe that rumor. Also, Its not Jay's job to pick the players. I dont see how Jay who made Andy Dalton into a probowler in his rookie season would be upset with a guy who is arguably better coming out of college in every way.

 

I feel like people who believe this was all some elaborate and brilliant smokescreen are ignoring history and are just hoping it isn't true. Because that would mean that Dan is indeed choosing QBs again. Which he never seems to truly be able to stop himself from doing. And that would mean this is a straight up bad pick. 

[kwitt]

6 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Haskins not being Jay's guy and was Dan's does not bother you or you just don't believe it's the case?

 

Hate the Haskins pick.  But I love your idea of trading up for Marquise. 

I don't love the idea of trading up for anyone.  This team has no business giving up draft capital for it's long long list of needs. 

[Skin'emAlive]

Just now, KDawg said:

 

Both. Gruden is a dead man walking right now. If he keeps his job it’s because Haskins/Keenum pull through for him. He is Allen’s fall guy. I don’t want him making long term QB decisions while his job outlook is uncertain.

 

No organization would ever do that, other than the Arizona Cardinals who foolishly bought into the McVay hype of going with a young coach and starting all over.

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

Im not sure how much I trust the Skins FO in totality. So between them and Snyder it’s a toss up. There are some good individuals in the FO, but the collective think tank hasn’t impressed me. 

 

OK so if you see Snyder being the same caliber of a talent evaluator as the others in the FO -- your position makes sense.  I don't see it that way.  But even if I did I don't like the drama potential backdrop of the HC being foisted a QB.  I don't think Jay is a rock star coach.  But Scot told me straight to my face that Jay is a really good evaluator.  And others have said the same.  But if I saw Dan neck and neck with Jay in that department then yeah none of this would bother me either I guess. 

[sportjunkie07]

14 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I'm banging the table for Haskins.  I love the kid, and I think he's got a very rare and precocious skill set for his age and level of experience.  I believe he's a prodigy and that he runs his offense like an NFL quarterback--making accurate pre-snap reads, adjusting his protections, spreading the ball around, seeing the whole field and also knowing his timing and anticipating seams without having to see them first, manipulating coverages with eye fakes and pump fakes, taking what the defense gives him and keeping the chains moving, etc.  It's just really advanced and excellent stuff, and it's very unusual for a RS sophomore to be doing all of those things at a high level.  He doesn't make many mistakes--the video game completion percentage and TD-INT ratio attest to this--but when he does, they are stemming from normal issues that get worked out with experience and reps; rushing throws, reading zone blitzes, putting the right touch on the underneath stuff, etc.

This is why haskins has grown a bit on me over the last couple months. 

The skill set you mentioned is very rare for a qb with such limited experience and I highly value that skillset. He also has an above average arm. 

 

I think he'll have weight issues though. And he had great receivers and protection. 

 

With his limited playing time it is difficult to know what his talent level really is. A bit of a gamble but i think it was a good gamble as we desperately needed a qb for the future.

 

I hate the idea of drafting a qb toward the likely end of a coaches tenure though. 

 

I'm not estatic but I don't think it was a terrible pick and we didn't trade up. 

 

All things considering I'll give it a solid B. 

[Fresh8686]

Say what you want about haskins, but he has shown he has the tools and the work ethic to grow, while already taking on nfl level qb responsibilities. 

 

I think he’s got the best or most secure/consistent long term growth trajectory out of this whole qb class. 

 

Hes going to need protection though. 

[mistertim]

4 minutes ago, Skin'emAlive said:

 

No organization would ever do that, other than the Arizona Cardinals who foolishly bought into the McVay hype of going with a young coach and starting all over.

 

The Redskins would and they have in the past.

[KDawg]

4 minutes ago, FuriousD said:

 Totally agree! 

 

Smart move would have been take the top O-linemen and wait for next year.  They could have enticed next years new HC with his own QB pick.  That's replaced now with the guarantee that any HC dumb enough to join this 3-ring circus will be saddled with a QB he didn't choose and owner/moron who can be counted on to meddle in **** he doesn't know anything about.  This team gets harder and harder to root for...

 

Dont get me going on organizational philosophy. Ours stinks. 

 

But try to separate our overall philosophy with talent acquisition. 

 

Haskins has talent. He is also a largely unknown commodity. 

 

This entire situation should have been handled different. GM/HC/QB reset between this year and next, starting with GM and HC. 

 

DL is good, could use another pass rusher if BPA (which one was available who should have been BPA, and another who a bad rumor about his heart is effecting but he’s also a potential BPA) and OL who there were a few who are BPA range. 

 

But thats not how this played out.

[Going Commando]

11 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

I just got home from work. 

MCQUEEEEEEN! Your boy FURRRRL went at 4, and we got Haskins! High five to you! And, the Steelers traded up for Devin Bush, so we will get a pretty good assessment of his talent and can come back to it. If he fails with the Steelers, he didn't have what it takes.  

  

I'd really like for us to get that man a weapon. I'd love it if we traded back up and took Marquise Brown.  

 

Man I am so friggin pumped about this.  This has been an amazing draft.  We got my favorite pick in the first round last year too with Payne.  It's really done a lot to restore my faith in the franchise after the really demoralizing failures of the RGIII and Cousins situations.

 

Haskins is a bonafide prodigy.  I still can't believe our good fortune.  This is shades of DeShaun Watson falling to Houston in 2017, only we didn't have to trade up for him.

 

Re: Bush, I think Pittsburgh is one of his best landing spots.  You're right, if he doesn't work out there, then he just didn't have the instincts to succeed at the NFL level.  I'm curious about where they're going to play him though.  I felt he was a better fit for a 4-3 team.  I don't really like him in the A gaps.  I think he's a better fit at SAM.  Then you can blitz him more and use his ability to man cover tight ends to full effect, without having to worry about getting gashed on cut backs in your A and B gaps.  I just don't see a natural MIKE skillset in him.

[DWinzit]

Very happy Marquise Brown didn't end up in Philly

 

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

OK so if you see Snyder being the same caliber of a talent evaluator as the others in the FO -- your position makes sense.  I don't see it that way.  But even if I did I don't like the drama potential backdrop of the HC being foisted a QB.  I don't think Jay is a rock star coach.  But Scot told me straight to my face that Jay is a really good evaluator.  And others have said the same.  But if I saw Dan neck and neck with Jay in that department then yeah none of this would bother me either I guess. 

 

See my reply to FuriousD. As far as Gruden vs. Snyder go, I think Gruden is a better evaluator. It’s probably not close. But Gruden is a dead man walking as HC right now. He can’t be your decision maker because he knows his job is in perilous position. So the decision falls to the FO. Not sold on them collectively. At all.