2018 Free Agency Database - (Signed: WILLIAMS - McPhee - Scandrick - P-Rich) - (Lauvao, Bergstrom, Nsehke, Taylor, Z. Brown and Quick re-signed)

[NickyJ]

6 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

How can a person believe he's garbage, if they believe another NFL team, likely with better FO management, would be willing to make a sacrifice to get him ?

Because if a team like the Eagles are dumb enough give a known zero like Matt Jones a shot through FA, maybe someone else could be suckered with "Perine was only a rookie, he's got potential" line. It's daydreaming more than anything. Then again, we did trade a player who never played a single down for an entire year despite being fully healthy, so I guess it isn't completely impossible.

[Morneblade]

40 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

How can a person believe he's garbage, if they believe another NFL team, likely with better FO management, would be willing to make a sacrifice to get him ?

 

Because all you need is one person to be stupid. I mean, we DID draft him, right?

 

But to be blunt, I don't see that happening. I don't see another team that is that desperate.......yet. I think if anyone is interested (and I'm guessing it was be mild interest, at best) they are going to wait for us to cut him. All that "talk" I think was just fans being fans, no way we are getting anything for Perine. Not a 233 pound back that isn't fast, that doesn't run tough, and fumbles.

[carex]

 

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

Because all you need is one person to be stupid. I mean, we DID draft him, right?

 

But to be blunt, I don't see that happening. I don't see another team that is that desperate.......yet. I think if anyone is interested (and I'm guessing it was be mild interest, at best) they are going to wait for us to cut him. All that "talk" I think was just fans being fans, no way we are getting anything for Perine. Not a 233 pound back that isn't fast, that doesn't run tough, and fumbles.

 

he was a fourth round pick and not considered a reach, in fact NFL.co had a third round projection on him

[Morneblade]

1 hour ago, carex said:

 

 

he was a fourth round pick and not considered a reach, in fact NFL.co had a third round projection on him

 

Yeah, so?

And what has he done in the NFL, where it actually matters? Fumble, show a lack of power and a lack of vision? He wasn't expected to be fast, but he was expected to be able to be a total bruiser. He hasn't been. So what is he actually bringing to the table, that is going to have a NFL team TRADE for him?

Lots of guys look the part, but when it comes to the NFL, they are all show and no go. And if you get the moniker of a fumbler, you're not going to last long, even if you have some talent.

[OVCChairman]

8 hours ago, Morneblade said:

 

Yeah, so?

And what has he done in the NFL, where it actually matters? Fumble, show a lack of power and a lack of vision? He wasn't expected to be fast, but he was expected to be able to be a total bruiser. He hasn't been. So what is he actually bringing to the table, that is going to have a NFL team TRADE for him?

Lots of guys look the part, but when it comes to the NFL, they are all show and no go. And if you get the moniker of a fumbler, you're not going to last long, even if you have some talent.

 

 

I don't think this is a fair assessment.  He had a few fumble 'issues' in the preseason, but he seemed to tighten things up during the regular season.

 

For comparison sake:

 

Perine - 2 fumbles on 175 carries 

 

Gurley - 5 / 279 

McCoy - 3 / 287

Gore - 3 / 261

Freeman - 4 / 196

 

He fumbled week 3 vs Oakland, then didn't fumble again til week 16 vs Denver.  

 

As far as the lack of power and vision.. He definitely was not as GOOD as we had hoped to see, considering how good he was at Oklahoma.  He also was a rookie, running behind an of injured line, who was .5 yard better in the 2nd half than he was in the 1st half of the season.  

 

A small piece of Perine's game that is overlooked is 22 catches for 182 yards... that's an 8.3 avg.  That tells me he has vision in space, but he was running into a freaking wall every time he touched the ball.  He looked good in the preseason game as a runner... and YES I admit he fumbled the ball, he got bailed out on a technicality.  That fumble won't show up on the stat sheet, but it should.  Still, fumbles are going to happen, especially in the middle of the fray like that... I also don't think it's fair to think what we saw last year was his ceiling.  The idea that an RB drafted out of college is going to be everything he is in his first year is unfair.  I'm not saying he's going to kill it, or be the next big thing, but I do think he can develop and improve, and I think he's got enough talent to be a piece of the puzzle this year.  

[goskins10]

33 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

I don't think this is a fair assessment.  He had a few fumble 'issues' in the preseason, but he seemed to tighten things up during the regular season.

 

Edit

also don't think it's fair to think what we saw last year was his ceiling.  The idea that an RB drafted out of college is going to be everything he is in his first year is unfair.  I'm not saying he's going to kill it, or be the next big thing, but I do think he can develop and improve, and I think he's got enough talent to be a piece of the puzzle this year.  

 

It's interesting that fans at exactly the same time complain the coaches do not develop guys but then trash all over a guy that is not a pro-bowler his first season. 

 

Developing guys means sticking with them in early years when they are not as good as they can be. This coaching staff has developed players - something critical to building through the draft. They have not been given enough credit for that.

 

[Skinsinparadise]

I've been on lets give Perine a shot over Kelley train but I've been swayed off of that some in the last couple of days.  Galdi just said the dude was ranked 45th out of 47th RBS in DVOA last year.  I talked about this in the Guice thread but listening to a few reports over the weekend supposedly the coaches don't trust his ball security and pass protection -- he shows poor ball security supposedly in practice.  

 

But specifically Russell said from talking to his sources the reason why Jay favors Kelley is he trusts him to hold on to the ball and in pass protection versus Perine.  If so, hopefully Perine improves on those fronts in training camp because potential wise I like Perine over Kelley.  I also think rookies deserve a break from their first year and deserve another shot.

 

Personally, I got doubts on every RB on the roster sans Guice-Thompson and I am hoping there is a surprise RB cut from another team in camp.  I guess preseason now just got a little more interesting.  Feels now a little like the Beck-Rex camp competition years ago -- you don't know who prevails, its intriguing because its close while wondering if it matters who winds up the starter in the end because there is no really good option -- ironically the guy I have the least faith in is Kelley but apparently he's likely to be the starter.  I am more intrigued by Marshall and Bibbs. Some faith in Perine but if the coaches have doubts in him -- it makes me pause.

 

[Morneblade]

3 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

 

A small piece of Perine's game that is overlooked is 22 catches for 182 yards... that's an 8.3 avg.  That tells me he has vision in space, but he was running into a freaking wall every time he touched the ball.  He looked good in the preseason game as a runner... and YES I admit he fumbled the ball, he got bailed out on a technicality.  That fumble won't show up on the stat sheet, but it should.  Still, fumbles are going to happen, especially in the middle of the fray like that... I also don't think it's fair to think what we saw last year was his ceiling.  The idea that an RB drafted out of college is going to be everything he is in his first year is unfair.  I'm not saying he's going to kill it, or be the next big thing, but I do think he can develop and improve, and I think he's got enough talent to be a piece of the puzzle this year.  

 

Ok, let's just say for a moment, that he doesn't fumble.

 

RB is probably the easiest position transferring from college to the pros. In other words, as a pure runner, you usually don't get much better as you play in the NFL. It's usually the other parts of your game, receiving, running routes and pass pro, that develop. So, I don't buy the "development" on things such as "vision". You have it, or you don't.

 

I agree with our OL being a disaster due to injuries last year. I'll also add that I don't think it's a physical run blocking line either. However, none of those have anything to do with 2 things that Perine seems to lack.

 

Vision and power.

 

And he's supposed to be a power back. Even if he doesn't fumble, even if he shores up his pass pro and is a good receiver out of the backfield, a power back with no power and vision isn't worth much.

 

Honestly, I was pretty excited about this last year. But, in the games I saw, I was really disappointed at how little effort he showed in breaking tackles. Literally every back we have, including Chris Thompson, seem to work harder for yards after contact. Is it possible to light a fire and make him work a lot harder? I suppose. Maybe if the coaches get on him about it, and if he is told in no uncertain terms his job is on the line, it might work. But it's hard to change a mindset. And his seems just too laid back. He doesn't run angry, or with passion.

[OVCChairman]

8 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

Ok, let's just say for a moment, that he doesn't fumble.

 

RB is probably the easiest position transferring from college to the pros. In other words, as a pure runner, you usually don't get much better as you play in the NFL. It's usually the other parts of your game, receiving, running routes and pass pro, that develop. So, I don't buy the "development" on things such as "vision". You have it, or you don't.

 

I agree with our OL being a disaster due to injuries last year. I'll also add that I don't think it's a physical run blocking line either. However, none of those have anything to do with 2 things that Perine seems to lack.

 

Vision and power.

 

And he's supposed to be a power back. Even if he doesn't fumble, even if he shores up his pass pro and is a good receiver out of the backfield, a power back with no power and vision isn't worth much.

 

Honestly, I was pretty excited about this last year. But, in the games I saw, I was really disappointed at how little effort he showed in breaking tackles. Literally every back we have, including Chris Thompson, seem to work harder for yards after contact. Is it possible to light a fire and make him work a lot harder? I suppose. Maybe if the coaches get on him about it, and if he is told in no uncertain terms his job is on the line, it might work. But it's hard to change a mindset. And his seems just too laid back. He doesn't run angry, or with passion.

 

 

I'm not naive enough to think that he's going to be an elite level back..  I'm not even saying he's going to be a top 15 back in the league at the end of the year.  I think he's better than what people are saying about him.  I watched him in the preseason game, and he appeared to have better vision AND balance upon contact.  

 

Here is a little bit of what I saw vs NE. 

 

 

 

2:30.  Rob Kelley takes the handoff and IMMEDIATELY see's the interior is broken... Cuts hard right, then accelerates up-field.  Surprising even the announcers... he says "WOOH... whos that?!"

 

3:06.  Perine takes the handoff to the right.  BIG hole, cuts back behind a blocker, then takes off toward the sideline.  Stiff arms the DB, then finishes the run after a first down, taking on an LB.  

 

 

He had 2 GOOD games last year.  vs NO and vs NYG.  

 

I feel like our backs are better than they are getting credit for.  They're not game breakers.  They're not ever going to take over a game and absolutely dominate.  Those RBs are not easy to find, and we may have had one in Guice, but we have to wait another year to find out.  What they AREN'T is terrible.  I actually don't think we'd be better off with AP or Alf.  Alf made his hay under Shanny, and AP is still a free agent for a reason.  If our O-line can stay healthy enough, and Smith can be handed the ability to adjust at the line, I think we will see better output.  I think a lot of the playcalling last year was what held back the production numbers from the RBs because they were running into a stacked front.  If Smith has the freedom to hot route or audible in or out of a run play when necessary... It could be big.  

[Morneblade]

36 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

I feel like our backs are better than they are getting credit for.  They're not game breakers.  They're not ever going to take over a game and absolutely dominate.  Those RBs are not easy to find, and we may have had one in Guice, but we have to wait another year to find out.  What they AREN'T is terrible.  I actually don't think we'd be better off with AP or Alf.  Alf made his hay under Shanny, and AP is still a free agent for a reason.  If our O-line can stay healthy enough, and Smith can be handed the ability to adjust at the line, I think we will see better output.  I think a lot of the playcalling last year was what held back the production numbers from the RBs because they were running into a stacked front.  If Smith has the freedom to hot route or audible in or out of a run play when necessary... It could be big.  

 

 

I'm not sure why you think anyone would ''stack the front" with as bad as we have been running the ball, and the only real source or offense coming from the passing game the last few years. So, I'm gonna call BS on that. I still think Morris is better than what we have, but I don't think he's much better. If we stay healthy, regardless of anything else, it should be better. But will it be enough? I'm not so sure. Historically, Smith has had good defenses and good running games for nearly his entire career, and has been pretty average. I know a lot is basing his entire career off of 17', but I'm not. He's going to need a really solid defense, which we might have, and a really good running game, which we don't. Going off the last few years it's been bad. Moving forward, we can't expect it to take a jump, the one reason to think it might is gone for the season.

[bobandweave]

Perine was ranked 47th out of 47 qualifiers in DYAR 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/rb

 

And 45th out of the 47 qualifiers last season in DVOA. He was better then Doug Martin and Adrian Peterson that's it. The qualifier was that a RB had at least 100 rushes last season.

 

Perine before the Guice injury was absolute trash compared to the NFL's other starting RB's. This is why Doug Williams before the draft absolutely stated that RB needed to be improved and added to. Nothing about Perine or the company he keeps at this position is going to do better then the 28th ranked offensive unit without Guice this season.

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff

 

It's irresponsible that with 11 picks next draft they wouldn't be actively looking for more talent then they have now and think they can turn chicken poop into chicken salad with what they have. My concern is when other people realize that this became a lost season because of the lack of talent at the position its going to cost jobs for negligence. The answer is they have to add someone to this motley crue

 

 

 

 

[redskinss]

And Melvin Gordon is ranked 27th. 

Does that mean the chargers should be desperately seeking a replacement? 

[OVCChairman]

26 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

 

I'm not sure why you think anyone would ''stack the front" with as bad as we have been running the ball, and the only real source or offense coming from the passing game the last few years. So, I'm gonna call BS on that. I still think Morris is better than what we have, but I don't think he's much better. If we stay healthy, regardless of anything else, it should be better. But will it be enough? I'm not so sure. Historically, Smith has had good defenses and good running games for nearly his entire career, and has been pretty average. I know a lot is basing his entire career off of 17', but I'm not. He's going to need a really solid defense, which we might have, and a really good running game, which we don't. Going off the last few years it's been bad. Moving forward, we can't expect it to take a jump, the one reason to think it might is gone for the season.

 

I don't have the exact analytical stats, but I know 'the play' vs NO should have been audibled out of.  We ran weak side right when the defense was aligned to have us outnumbered.  That is an example of a play that if it's Smith, does he have the power and support from Gruden to make that playcall adjustment?  Even if he just tucks the ball and tries to make it himself, with the idea that Teo sells out on the RB hitting the hole.  

 

It's a game within the game that I've wondered about.. and I may be off base.  I don't remember many plays in the past where the play appeared to be changed at the line.  I don't even think I can quantify it by examples without going back and looking at EVERY play we ran last year and picking out which ones were better suited for a rushing front, or if maybe we ran a run play when a pass would have been more effective.  I hope we have that ability this year, because there were quite a few dead plays on the field.... and I think we left a lot of positive plays out there.  Kirk didn't strike fear into the hearts of the Defense either... so whether they 'stacked the box' or the Safeties and LBs were constantly coming down hill... it makes a difference.  If the FS and SS have no fear of whats behind them, they're looking forward at all times and they can sell run on 1st and 10... especially if we've called a running play almost every time we were in that situation.  Some of that falls on Jay, but a part of me hopes Smith can help to change that.  

[Koolblue13]

Really enjoying this RB thread. 

[Morneblade]

26 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

I don't have the exact analytical stats, but I know 'the play' vs NO should have been audibled out of.  We ran weak side right when the defense was aligned to have us outnumbered.  That is an example of a play that if it's Smith, does he have the power and support from Gruden to make that playcall adjustment?  Even if he just tucks the ball and tries to make it himself, with the idea that Teo sells out on the RB hitting the hole.  

 

It's a game within the game that I've wondered about.. and I may be off base.  I don't remember many plays in the past where the play appeared to be changed at the line.  I don't even think I can quantify it by examples without going back and looking at EVERY play we ran last year and picking out which ones were better suited for a rushing front, or if maybe we ran a run play when a pass would have been more effective.  I hope we have that ability this year, because there were quite a few dead plays on the field.... and I think we left a lot of positive plays out there.  Kirk didn't strike fear into the hearts of the Defense either... so whether they 'stacked the box' or the Safeties and LBs were constantly coming down hill... it makes a difference.  If the FS and SS have no fear of whats behind them, they're looking forward at all times and they can sell run on 1st and 10... especially if we've called a running play almost every time we were in that situation.  Some of that falls on Jay, but a part of me hopes Smith can help to change that.  

 

This is the issue I have. Kirk, quite literally, was about the only thing the team had going for it. Absolutely no one respected our running game. And there was no reason they should have, you can't run with a beat up OL and RB's that are, at best lackluster, which is exactly what we had as the season went on of not changing the play. In fact, from what Gruden said, is that Kirk moved out of run plays into pass plays because he did not trust the running game. So, that kind throws your theory out. And then there was the lack of talent at WR last year. Crowder takes a step back, Doctson catches 44% of his targets, Pryor is a bust, Ryan Grant is a starting WR, Reed is hurt...................again. Sorry, but there isn't much here that is positive......except Kirk. He get's 4k passing with OL that are being signed off the street, and not much at WR. Yet, most people fail to realize it and blame everything on Kirk.

 

So no, I'm not buying this argument that Smith is just going to make things all better. When Smith has been effective, he's had a solid, balanced team. He's not going to come in and just make everyone better. He's not that guy. Kirk might not either, but I'll say this, he's gotten more out of less that Smith has. Smith does some things well. He's efficient and protect the ball. I'll even give him that he's a better leader than Kirk. But he's not going to put this team on his back and carry them.

[redskinss]

Yeah kirk definitely did a whole lot with no offensive line and no running game last year.

Hopefully Alex doesn't have to play from behind as much this year and carry the whole load with his arm. 

[OVCChairman]

12 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

In fact, from what Gruden said, is that Kirk moved out of run plays into pass plays because he did not trust the running game. So, that kind throws your theory out.n they should have, you can't run with a beat up OL and RB's that are, at best lackluster, which is exactly what we had as the season went on of not changing the play.

 

And then there was the lack of talent at WR last year. Crowder takes a step back, Doctson catches 44% of his targets, Pryor is a bust, Ryan Grant is a starting WR, Reed is hurt...................again. Sorry, but there isn't much here that is positive......except Kirk. He get's 4k passing with OL that are being signed off the street, and not much at WR. Yet, most people fail to realize it and blame everything on Kirk.

 

So no, I'm not buying this argument that Smith is just going to make things all better. When Smith has been effective, he's had a solid, balanced team. He's not going to come in and just make everyone better. He's not that guy. Kirk might not either, but I'll say this, he's gotten more out of less that Smith has. Smith does some things well. He's efficient and protect the ball. I'll even give him that he's a better leader than Kirk. But he's not going to put this team on his back and carry them.

 

 

If that's the case regarding changing INTO pass plays, then that's news to me and I was unaware.  Kirk was a positive, but with the weapons he had, and his ability, he did not stretch the field...  The secondary very rarely had to worry about anyone getting behind them.   When a defensive coordinator can walk into the meeting room and essentially say "draw a line 15 yards from the LOS and attack forward" then the run game is going to suffer.  

 

To our second point, as good as Kirk may have been with the offense and the lack of talent, the rest of the offense is going to feel that same effect.  If you want to give Kirk a ton of credit for overcoming these obstacles, then we need to acknowledge the effect those same obstacles may have had on the rest of the guys on the field.  Yes, tip your hat to Kirk that he was able to do what he did, but I also know I saw plays, BIG plays left on the field because of his apprehension to take certain risks. 

 

I'm sorry I did not mean to make this another Kirk conversation, just more that I feel Alex has some savvy that could help our run game.  I don't expect either one of our backs to make a probowl.  I would not bet on either one of them even getting 1000 yards, but if they did it wouldn't shock me.  The offense took a step back with Guices' injury, I agree with that.  My point was I don't think that Perine / Kelley are AS BAD as people think they are.  I think we have good depth at RB, and we have 5 RBs on the roster that could make other teams.  They may not be 5 starters, but if we were to cut all 5 of our guys, they'd all get picked up... i'm sure of it.  That doesn't quantify to production, I know, but I don't think any of our guys are as bad as Matt Jones was either.  

[NoVaSkins21]

Alfred Morris about to get picked up by the 49ers.  Could've used him, but I guess he doesn't fit Gruden's scheme

[Morneblade]

2 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

If that's the case regarding changing INTO pass plays, then that's news to me and I was unaware.  Kirk was a positive, but with the weapons he had, and his ability, he did not stretch the field...  The secondary very rarely had to worry about anyone getting behind them.   When a defensive coordinator can walk into the meeting room and essentially say "draw a line 15 yards from the LOS and attack forward" then the run game is going to suffer.  

 

To our second point, as good as Kirk may have been with the offense and the lack of talent, the rest of the offense is going to feel that same effect.  If you want to give Kirk a ton of credit for overcoming these obstacles, then we need to acknowledge the effect those same obstacles may have had on the rest of the guys on the field.  Yes, tip your hat to Kirk that he was able to do what he did, but I also know I saw plays, BIG plays left on the field because of his apprehension to take certain risks. 

 

I'm sorry I did not mean to make this another Kirk conversation, just more that I feel Alex has some savvy that could help our run game.  I don't expect either one of our backs to make a probowl.  I would not bet on either one of them even getting 1000 yards, but if they did it wouldn't shock me.  The offense took a step back with Guices' injury, I agree with that.  My point was I don't think that Perine / Kelley are AS BAD as people think they are.  I think we have good depth at RB, and we have 5 RBs on the roster that could make other teams.  They may not be 5 starters, but if we were to cut all 5 of our guys, they'd all get picked up... i'm sure of it.  That doesn't quantify to production, I know, but I don't think any of our guys are as bad as Matt Jones was either.  

 

1. Ok, lets look at Kirk not stretching the field like he did in past years. Are you seriously going to try and go long a lot when:

A: Your OL is terrible and you don't have time

B: You don't have a receiver that can stretch the field, outside of your backup TE (Davis).

Yeah, you're not going to be able to go deep often when you don't have deep ball threats, and your OL is composed of guys you signed off the street.

 

And with all that, Kirk was 9th in YPA.

 

I'm sure that Jones would fit in here fine, he's big and more explosive than most of what he have. He just doesn't run with power and fumbles too much. But he's fast. I certainly don't think all of our backs would be picked up if they were cut. I'm not certain if any would be, unless a team looses a couple RB's. Honestly, they are all just "depth" guys".

[bobandweave]

The team needs to get creative and add some talent to the RB Depth. One way they could do that is to look at who is a free agent next season. If the team holding rights to these guys are not going to keep this player past this season then maybe they wouldn't mind moving one of these guys for a draft pick now:

 

Alex Collins
C.J. Anderson
Charles Sims
Jay Ajayi
Latavius Murray
Mark Ingram
Peyton Barber
Ty Montgomery

 

Or maybe they need to just grab a guy off the street and keep the picks? Those best of those guys are:

 

DeMarco Murray
Orleans Darkwa
Adrian Peterson
Jamaal Charles
 

Those vets would only cost money. Even if you think someone like Charles or Murray has little chance to be the guy they once were why not kick the tires and see? What harm would that do right now? 

 

Addressing problems properly is what the good teams do. The bad teams don't address needs and stay bad because they think they don't have a problem when they do.

 

The Redskins with the same bunch of RB names they have today were actually better a year ago with these same guys because that was before the Chris Thompson injury. Post injury we need to see him before claiming he is as good as he was before the injury. And that group of names a year ago was 28th in the league in team rushing DVOA. Post injury is there any reason to believe they will play better then they did last season? I don't think so. 

 

Darkwa just had his best professional season in the NFL last year and is still only 26 years old right now. Making a reasonable trade with the Packers for one of the RBs they have - Jaamal Williams, Aaron Jones, TY Montgomery - to add something to this group makes sense. Hell even bringing in Demarco, Jaamal, and Adrian and signing the best one makes sense.

 

Doing nothing makes no sense and doesn't fit what this season is, a must win season for Jay, for Alex, for everyone. The stink that surrounds this team since they lost Guice has to be extinguished and quickly. This is not a team built for next year. IMO

 

[Mr.Will]

5 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

I'm not naive enough to think that he's going to be an elite level back..  I'm not even saying he's going to be a top 15 back in the league at the end of the year.  I think he's better than what people are saying about him.  I watched him in the preseason game, and he appeared to have better vision AND balance upon contact.  

 

Here is a little bit of what I saw vs NE. 

 

 

 

2:30.  Rob Kelley takes the handoff and IMMEDIATELY see's the interior is broken... Cuts hard right, then accelerates up-field.  Surprising even the announcers... he says "WOOH... whos that?!"

 

3:06.  Perine takes the handoff to the right.  BIG hole, cuts back behind a blocker, then takes off toward the sideline.  Stiff arms the DB, then finishes the run after a first down, taking on an LB.  

 

 

He had 2 GOOD games last year.  vs NO and vs NYG.  

 

I feel like our backs are better than they are getting credit for.  They're not game breakers.  They're not ever going to take over a game and absolutely dominate.  Those RBs are not easy to find, and we may have had one in Guice, but we have to wait another year to find out.  What they AREN'T is terrible.  I actually don't think we'd be better off with AP or Alf.  Alf made his hay under Shanny, and AP is still a free agent for a reason.  If our O-line can stay healthy enough, and Smith can be handed the ability to adjust at the line, I think we will see better output.  I think a lot of the playcalling last year was what held back the production numbers from the RBs because they were running into a stacked front.  If Smith has the freedom to hot route or audible in or out of a run play when necessary... It could be big.  

As I’ve been ready this thread I was about to make a post till I read yours..Nevermind,you nailed exactly what I was about to say(and even in better detail than I probably would have)-but you are spot on in regards to the RB situation as far as I’m concerned!!..

Top tier talent is hard to find,as to why most teams have a committee of guys on game day,but I think given the chance and the rest of our starting offense remain healthy to do their part..RK & SP are more than serviceable to keep us in games,given they have a chance to build off momentum a get game reps!!..as much as I’d like to see Morris back in a skins jersey again,I think we can still do some damage on the ground(as long as the rest of our guys remain healthy and play their positions!!!!!)

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, bobandweave said:

 

 

Or maybe they need to just grab a guy off the street and keep the picks? Those best of those guys are:

 

DeMarco Murray
Orleans Darkwa
Adrian Peterson
Jamaal Charles

 

Darkwa looked like Walter Payton in the last game against our defense. 7.7 YPA over 150 yards.  4.4 YPA for the season.  I'd take him.

 

What does Kelley have one 100 yard game in his whole career-college included?  And if you listen to the beat guys, Kelley is the slam dunk #1 RB now and the question left is who will the others be? 

 

It's to me another case in point for a team that doesn't believe much in FA to their own peril.  I've been on the train -- well before Jerry Brewer who said recently that this team is overcompensating from the Vinny years as to FA -- where the feeling it has to be one extreme versus another. 

 

But plenty of good teams use FAs -- and the running back position is actually a good one for FA because the crop of players typically aren't expensive compared to other positions.   Lions had a bad running game.  They sign Blount AND draft Kerryon Johnson.  The Titans have a young stud RB AND they sign Dion Lewis.  Running backs aren't that expensive in FA.  

 

I was OK if they didn't go FA with RB if they went heavy elsewhere on other positions but they didn't do it.   I'd have taken a DT over a RB in FA but if the answer was none of the above, then go get a Crowell or someone.  The problem with the RB position is IMO the disparity between Guice and Kelley is huge.   In retrospect if they signed a FA like Crowell then I don't think so many (including me) would feel so bleak all of a sudden about the season.  It's not just about losing Guice but who's the next man up -- and to me none of those guys gets me jazzed unless Marshall ends up a find or Perine turns it around somehow. 

[Mr.Will]

5 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

I'm not naive enough to think that he's going to be an elite level back..  I'm not even saying he's going to be a top 15 back in the league at the end of the year.  I think he's better than what people are saying about him.  I watched him in the preseason game, and he appeared to have better vision AND balance upon contact.  

 

Here is a little bit of what I saw vs NE. 

 

 

 

2:30.  Rob Kelley takes the handoff and IMMEDIATELY see's the interior is broken... Cuts hard right, then accelerates up-field.  Surprising even the announcers... he says "WOOH... whos that?!"

 

3:06.  Perine takes the handoff to the right.  BIG hole, cuts back behind a blocker, then takes off toward the sideline.  Stiff arms the DB, then finishes the run after a first down, taking on an LB.  

 

 

He had 2 GOOD games last year.  vs NO and vs NYG.  

 

I feel like our backs are better than they are getting credit for.  They're not game breakers.  They're not ever going to take over a game and absolutely dominate.  Those RBs are not easy to find, and we may have had one in Guice, but we have to wait another year to find out.  What they AREN'T is terrible.  I actually don't think we'd be better off with AP or Alf.  Alf made his hay under Shanny, and AP is still a free agent for a reason.  If our O-line can stay healthy enough, and Smith can be handed the ability to adjust at the line, I think we will see better output.  I think a lot of the playcalling last year was what held back the production numbers from the RBs because they were running into a stacked front.  If Smith has the freedom to hot route or audible in or out of a run play when necessary... It could be big.  

As I’ve been ready this thread I was about to make a post till I read yours..Nevermind,you nailed exactly what I was about to say(and even in better detail than I probably would have)-but you are spot on in regards to the RB situation as far as I’m concerned!!..

Top tier talent is hard to find,as to why most teams have a committee of guys on game day,but I think given the chance and the rest of our starting offense remain healthy to do their part..RK & SP are more than serviceable to keep us in games,given they have a chance to build off momentum a get game reps!!..as much as I’d like to see Morris back in a skins jersey again,I think we can still do some damage on the ground(as long as the rest of our guys remain healthy and play their positions!!!!!)

[carex]

8 hours ago, bobandweave said:

Perine was ranked 47th out of 47 qualifiers in DYAR 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/rb

 

And 45th out of the 47 qualifiers last season in DVOA. He was better then Doug Martin and Adrian Peterson that's it. The qualifier was that a RB had at least 100 rushes last season.

 

Perine before the Guice injury was absolute trash compared to the NFL's other starting RB's. This is why Doug Williams before the draft absolutely stated that RB needed to be improved and added to. Nothing about Perine or the company he keeps at this position is going to do better then the 28th ranked offensive unit without Guice this season.

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff

 

It's irresponsible that with 11 picks next draft they wouldn't be actively looking for more talent then they have now and think they can turn chicken poop into chicken salad with what they have. My concern is when other people realize that this became a lost season because of the lack of talent at the position its going to cost jobs for negligence. The answer is they have to add someone to this motley crue

 

 

 

 

 

it's irresponsible to make claims about the 2019 draft when the 2018 season hasn't been played

[TheShredder]

They've got to get 1 yard more per carry and add about 5 more carries per game.  That's it.  A healthy line and continuity can deliver that 1 yard increase in the average over the course of a season.  It's not about rushing TD's, nor is it about 1,000 yard rushers.  It comes down to the consistent OL play.  If 4 out of the 5 Lineman are suiting up over a 16 game season they'll get what they need from the running game. Not worried about that because you can't do anything more now except go with what you've got.  Keeping a consistent OL group on the field is the key.